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Massive MCU revision

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Spinosaurus75DinosaurFan said:
Can the Kree stuff be applied? Seems pretty unanimous+Matthew agrees.
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Yes.
 
My only problem with the Kree scaling is the above average ones. What feat do they have to scale to Asgardians? Being above average of 9-As shouldn't mean you jump to High 7-C.
 
Spinosaurus75DinosaurFan said:
The reason people find it hard to accept 8-A Cap is because they think he isn't that strong. But like the only valid anti-feat is struggling pull a helicopter, and that is already PIS, or else he wouldn't be 9-A or even Wall level+.

It's not just Iron Man Cap fought, he matched Ultron, held his own against Loki, fought Corvus Glaive, Spider-Man also blocked an attack by Cull Obsidian, and Cap, Bucky and Spidey all took hits from Cap's vibranium shield.
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everything you mentioned in the second paragraph is with him using his shield. he did not match ultron, he was getting treated like an underdog and damaged him only with aid of vibranium shield. same with loki, he did no damage to him and got overpowered until iron man came along. he never fought corvus glaive, it was black widow who injured him.

fighting some who is <insert tier> does not automatically mean you scale to them unless you actually hurt or make them bleed. mark 6 iron man also fought and harm thor (even making him say "uh") before being amped, and mark 45 contributed into damaging vibranium ultron along with vision and thor. and yet these armors are not 7-a.
 
Blitzedaken said:
he never fought corvus glaive
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Hmm.

Blocked the spear shaft, punched him to the ground a short distance away, held him off in a contest of strength on the spear, punched the spear off Corvus' hand. Granted, Cap was wearing vibranium vambrace, but it still shows them being roughly comparable, if Corvus is a tad physically superior.

I will concede that Cap got thrashed by Loki, barely held against Iron Man with Bucky's help and only damaged Spidey via massive skill gap and the latter getting a face full of vibranium.
 
Gemmysaur said:
Blocked the spear shaft, punched him to the ground a short distance away, held him off in a contest of strength on the spear, punched the spear off Corvus' hand. Granted, Cap was wearing vibranium vambrace, but it still shows them being roughly comparable, if Corvus is a tad physically superior.
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agreed. well, vibranium vambrace are not his standard gear? what i mean't is he never technically striked and punched corvus using only his pure hands.
 
Alright, so seems like people are still unsure on what tier Cap should be, while Profile's need to be made Graviton, Quake, Lash and Deathlok, dang that's a lot XD, Graviton, Quake and Lash appear to be High 7-C, while Deathlok would only be High 7-C with Weapons like Iron Man (Pre IW and without Hulkbuster) seems to be, whatever tier Steve turns out to be will likely be where Peterson (Deathlok's real name) is physically but to a noticeable lesser extent, while Future Graviton and Daisy with her powers would be High 6-B due to Future Graviton causing the 12.8 Earthquake, Robbie Reyes will also likely be High 7-C instead of Unknown like he currently is while he will still be 7-A as the Ghost Rider
 
I always felt like that's Tony speaking in relative skill terms considering that Cap was already dominating the fight no matter what Spidey did.
 
I'd say that the bullets in the MCU have significantly higher AP than our own. It's common in fiction, as seen when handgun bullets in countless movies penetrate walls with utter ease (Glocks, BTW) whereas in real life they struggle to penetrate a cinder block.
 
I mean, they do penetrate body armor out of the fly and all.

The better feats might be hidden somewhere.
 
Steve is definitely above Peter in terms of Skill, that's likely what Tony was referring to, but seems to me that Peter holds the advantage in physical strength due to catching Bucky's Metal Arm and moving it Casually like its nothing and calling the Arm Cool

While Steve couldn't break the hold Metal Arm had on his Throat both in Winter Soldier and Civil War, then when Bucky's Knife went through the Van that was behind Steve, he used his Metal Arm to move across it and Steve wasn't slowing it down even when using both of his Arms, Steve also felt the need to Block the Metal Arm with his Shield and Dodge it, then when he was hit by it, he was blown back a few feet
 
Imo the airport fight shows that Cap is comparable with spidey in strength. Heck you can even argue that Spidey had advantage of position.
 
Speaking of Cap's strength, has there been any personal feats from him that matches Deathlok's bulldozer rush?
 
Qawsedf234 said:
No. His best solo feats max at Class 5
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The best thing I can think of is him managing to resist Spidey restraining him but that is unquantifiable as he breaks out by doing a spin trick that catches Spidey off-guard.
 
The best thing I can think of is him managing to resist Spidey restraining him but that is unquantifiable as he breaks out by doing a spin trick that catches Spidey off-guard.

Which shows that they are roughly comparable in strength.
 
Qawsedf234 said:
No. His best solo feats max at Class 5
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I"m pretty sure Cap has pushed the bulldozer before as well, or else they wouldn't be able to compare his time to Deathlok's.

Moreover he also lifted a steel beam off Winter Soldier, but the calc was rejected because the perspective is hard to pixel scale.
 
Qa+ No, I meant, that IM is not the sort of dude that constantly get hit in the battles, he flies around and someone barely touch him, here he was getting touched no consensually by everyone.

Spino+ Is not just the Helicopter feat.

Watch the MCU from IM 1 to Infinity War, and one can easily see that Tony consistently perform feats that Cap has struggle with; He takes point black explotions with no issue, flight at hypersonic speeds, lift cars, slice thick metal like butter, destroy floors of thick concrete with pure weight, and ignite the soil from just landing, between others.

Cap cant take a grenade without his shield, his punches doesnt send fying his enemies like IM does, he only could damage Ultron with his shield while Tony blow him up with a few shots.

What IM is to Cap is what Thor is to IM in term of showings.
 
Ignoring whether we should scale Cap to Iron Man, the helicopter feat is still PIS.

Iron Man and Cap are the same in terms of combat speed and reactions (at least we rate them s). Cars are just a tonne or more, even worse than the helicopter feat, while Captain America pushed a bulldozer and lifted a huge metal beam. He only sliced metal with weaponry. And you don't have to damage someone to scale, Captain America physically fought Ultron. We're talking about physical strength, so weaponry doesn't matter. Iron Man only defeated Ultron with the missile.

Thor was weakened by dark magic when fighting Iron Man, and Iron Man was over 400% charged.
 
Spinosaurus75DinosaurFan said:
Ignoring whether we should scale Cap to Iron Man, the helicopter feat is still PIS.

Iron Man and Cap are the same in terms of combat speed and reactions (at least we rate them s). Cars are just a tonne or more, even worse than the helicopter feat, while Captain America pushed a bulldozer and lifted a huge metal beam. He only sliced metal with weaponry. And you don't have to damage someone to scale, Captain America physically fought Ultron. We're talking about physical strength, so weaponry doesn't matter. Iron Man only defeated Ultron with the missile.

Thor was weakened by dark magic when fighting Iron Man, and Iron Man was over 400% charged.
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so star lord, nebula, drax, spider man are high 6-b because they fought thanos?

to top things off, scarlet witch should not be high 6-b at all as she just pushed back thanos which counts as a stagger, and the latter shows no signs of pain.
 
Because they did completely nothing to Thanos except annoy him while Cap physically held back Ultron and Iron Man, plus FRIDAY outright said Iron Man can't beat Cap hand-to-hand?

For Scarlet Witch she was matching Thanos's strength as he was unable to push forward, meaning they are physically equal.
 
Stop with the Helicopter feat being pis, Cap is consistenly below IM through the whole MCU, he being even able to push back Tony is an outlier because is way above his own showings, period.

Iron Man physical strength scales to most of his weaponry, he can damage people that normally tanks his range attacks, he managed to push back Whiplash with punches while his Mini Guns didnt even flick him, he rammed Iron Monger from a building to a street while his Unibeam just made him fall.

No the point, Im refering that Iron Man makes Cap look like a weakling the same way Thor makes Iron Man look like a weakling.
 
The helicopter feat is already PIS, as it is completely far lower than our current ratings and would make Cap high-end 9-C to low-end 9-B. People only claim it is an outlier because people feel like Cap isn't that strong, yet he has more feats fighting 8-A characters than his high-end 9-B/9-A feats.

Iron Man didn't make Cap look like a weakling in their fight, FRIDAY outright said he can't beat him hand-to-hand.
 
Spinosaurus75DinosaurFan said:
The helicopter feat is already PIS, as it is completely far lower than our current ratings and would make Cap high-end 9-C to low-end 9-B.
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Scaling Cap to a AoS character when he doesn't have a single lifting strength feat on that level is also a bad idea though. I think his and the other Super Soldier's lifting strength should be downgraded to their on screen showings. Same with Spider-Man.
 
Spinosaurus75DinosaurFan said:
Because they did completely nothing to Thanos except annoy him while Cap physically held back Ultron and Iron Man, plus FRIDAY outright said Iron Man can't beat Cap hand-to-hand?

For Scarlet Witch she was matching Thanos's strength as he was unable to push forward, meaning they are physically equal.
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when did cap held ultron back? more like just a stagger.

in a mark 46 armor that is consistenly depicted as weak. also two words: "civil war" is regared as inconsistent as proven in comics.

thanos did definitely pushed forward and overpowered her as shown in the film. when she started to blast him, he was not moving and standing still and only pushed forward when he was getting blasted with no damage. this is also lifting strength not ap, similar to how doctor strange clones was pinning thanos down. i was planning to make a downgrade for her long time ago.
 
Class 50 is supported by Captain America pushing a bulldozer (he 99% pushed it before in order to compare his record to DEathlok's), lifting a huge metal girder, Spider-Man lifting a jet bridge and part of a fallen building, and on and on.

AP and lifting strength is not directly related.
 
Class 50 is supported by Captain America pushing a bulldozer (he 99% pushed it before in order to compare his record to DEathlok's)

The feat in question is far above every single one of his film strength showings and depictions. There's even a note in the MCU page to not scale people from the films to the other mediums.

lifting a huge metal girder

That's not a Class 50 feat

Spider-Man lifting a jet bridge and part of a fallen building

Are either of these Class 50 feats? Because the entire building section that fell on him was only 188 tons and he lifted a much smaller amount than that.
 
The film and TV series are the same universe.

It is given a few assumptions. If it is a steel beam with 8*1*0.5 dimensions it would weigh around 31.4 tonnes.

118 tons is Class K, though I agree he did not lift all. A jet bridge is 27 tonnes.
 
Spinosaurus75DinosaurFan said:
The film and TV series are the same universe.
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As stated on the page itself

"Note: Take caution when scaling characters from the movies to the ones from the TV shows and vice-versa as the movies barely acknowledge the TV shows themselves."

The feat in question was not only preformed off screen but it is magnitudes better than every single one of Captain America's other strength feats.

It is given a few assumptions.

That is not a good metric of measurement. Alfred Pennyworth is 1-A if given enough assumptions.

A jet bridge is 27 tonnes.

If the section he lifted is that then sure he can keep the rating. But Cap and the other SS shouldn't be that high.
 
Also, why Corvus Claive has a 9A Tier? He getting stagged by Cap is just textbook of inconsistency that follows Cap to whatever fight with a higher Tier character.
 
Newendigo said:
Also, why Corvus Claive has a 9A Tier? He getting stagged by Cap is just textbook of inconsistency that follows Cap to whatever fight with a higher Tier character.
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When said "inconsistency" >>> Cap's high-end 9-B and 9-A feats.
 
Yes, because Cap is not gonna have a single handly fight with 8A character, much less with High 7C or a freaking 7A.

This go from ridicolous highballing to obvious wank, gotta be honest.
 
Cap's 9-C feats: Sending people flying, prying open steel doors, falling from high heights, ripping wood

Cap's 9-B feats: Bending metal, slamming walls, pushing bulldozer, kicking truck, fighting Ultron Sentries

Cap's high-end 9-B and 9-A feats: Survived being super-accelerated punched by Quicksilver, scaling to Spider-Man's feats, destroying pillar

Cap's showings against stronger characters: Holding his own against Loki, matching Ultron, matching Iron Man, holding his own against Corvus Glaive, confident about fighting Iron Man in the first Avengers movie, surviving his own shield

Unquantifiable: Staggering Thanos and blocking an attack

But sure, it's more consistent for him to be Tier 9 because "lol, outlier".

I'm not suggesting High 7-C nor 7-A in anyway.
 
The fact that you even take into account him blocking Thanos attack already makes me really doutbful (More than what I was a few minutes) from now on.
 
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