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Massive MCU revision

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I'm neutral on the whole Cap thing, as long as Cap doesn't get upgraded to High 7-C or 7-A I'm good, i don't care if he stays 9-A or even gets upgraded to "Possibly" 8-A, that way he would be the same tier as his Comic Counterpart
 
I think his lifting strength should be downgraded. Or at least changed to something like "Class 10, possibly Class 50" rather than just Class 50.
 
Spino+ It should not even be mentioned.

Also, if you dont want him to be High 7C or 7A, then why you listed him holding his own against Loki and Corvus? To prove that he is well positioned in 8A tier?

I doutb that he would have enough knowledge of the Armors full capabilities from just seeing videos.

Also, you know that making Cap 8A would also scale to other unwanted characters?

Red Skull, Spider-Ma, Winter Soldier, Black Panther, Quicksilver, Vulture, Erik Killmonger, Crossbones. All those would become 8A, which is utter trash in my opinion.
 
>Tanked blasts by Ultron

>Physically fought Ultron

>Threw Ultron into a concrete pillar

>Shoved by Ultron into a train

>Lol, Ultron is far stronger than Cap.
 
Newendigo said:
Spino+ It should not even be mentioned.

Also, if you dont want him to be High 7C or 7A, then why you listed him holding his own against Loki and Corvus? To prove that he is well positioned in 8A tier?

I doutb that he would have enough knowledge of the Armors full capabilities from just seeing videos.

Also, you know that making Cap 8A would also scale to other unwanted characters?

Red Skull, Spider-Ma, Winter Soldier, Black Panther, Quicksilver, Vulture, Erik Killmonger, Crossbones. All those would become 8A, which is utter trash in my opinion.
Click to expand...
As he was able to hold his own against Loki, albeit barely? Loki is clearly significantly stronger though.

"It is trash" is not an argument at all, and just proves people are unwilling to accept 8-A Cap because it feels too high.
 
The MCU clearly doesn't portray the strength difference between Cap-level characters and Iron Man-level characters as a thousand times-gap.
 
I'm pretty sure Iron Man destroys Cap in almost every fight in the comics.

And you as you said, at times only, not consistently.
 
Cap got put flat down on his ass everytime Bucky decked him with his metal arm on him and Spiderman caught that same arm while barely trying and you have the audacity to say Spiderman and Captain America belong in the same tier?

Before I forget too, Cap was fighting against Iron Man in a very enclosed space, and Iron Man did NOT want to hurt Captain America at all.

I also saw the Loki vs Captain America fight, and Captain America landed shots on Loki that would puncture any normal human's ribcage and Loki took it like a champ, not even flinching when Cap got that hit in.

The only reason you think Captain is as good as he is is because of the large amount of skill he possesses. It's genuinely the only reason he can hang with them. But any of them could easily kill him in an open field and if they weren't ******* around with him.
 
As their fight clearly shows that Cap and Spidey are roughly comparable? Not to mention Bucky was not trying to kill Peter unlike against Cap, nor was he expecting a kid to be so strong
 
Taking advantage of the fact that you are doing a revision, I wanted to propose that Peter's base durability should be upgraded too, since he was able to withstand hits from Shocker's Gauntlet, which was stronger than the one Crossbones used to hurt and send Cap flying.
 
Cap's high-end 9-B and 9-A feats: Survived being super-accelerated punched by Quicksilver, scaling to Spider-Man's feats, destroying pillar
He completely tanked Pietro's punch, not simply survived, because he was completely fine afterwards when Pietro got pulled by Mjolnir into a stack of boxes.

Cap's showings against stronger characters: Holding his own against Loki, matching Ultron, matching Iron Man, holding his own against Corvus Glaive, confident about fighting Iron Man in the first Avengers movie, surviving his own shield

  • Got thrashed by Loki who he could only budge a bit at best with his roundhouse kick.
  • Cannot meaningfully do anything to Ultron beyond delay, and only did any damage with a shield to the chest propelled by a roundhouse kick.
  • Held his own against Corvus whose main shtick is being just a tad above him in strength, and has a weapon that pierces vibranium. Beyond that, none much else.
  • Held his own against Iron Man but blatantly cannot do any damage without his shield. He was also confident about fighting Iron Man because? I don't think he's ever seen the guy fight up close and personal, only knowing a semblance of what the latter can do physically (not particularly skilled at that) and what weapons he's got, at best.
  • Survived his own shield doing what? Did he take the sharp end?
Unquantifiable: Staggering Thanos and blocking an attack

His punches nudged Thanos the same way a normal human can nudge a car, not doing any damage at all. He also blocked Thanos reaching for him with an open hand, not even an actual attack.
 
Ok

  • Loki is High 7-C
  • He tanked Ultron's blasts, threw him into a concrete pillar, physically fought, attempted to strangle each other (Cap trying to choke a robot lol), and Ultron knocked Cap into a train
  • So you think Corvus should be downgrade?
  • I'm talking about physical strength yeah, Cap was matching Iron Man and FRIDAY outright said Tony can't beat him hand-to-hand.
  • Wait what humans can nudge cars? Show me a video of that.
 
Therefir said:
Taking advantage of the fact that you are doing a revision, I wanted to propose that Peter's base durability should be upgraded too, since he was able to withstand hits from Shocker's Gauntlet, which was stronger than the one Crossbones used to hurt and send Cap flying.
Click to expand...
That just makes having a key for the Homemade suit useless.

Why not just make one base key for Spider-Man, since Stark's base suit only makes the webbing stronger and adds some techy features? Not like it enhances his physical strength or anything.
 
Spinosaurus75DinosaurFan said:
  • Loki is High 7-C
Click to expand...
You mentioned Cap was holding his own, which he did not. He got ineffective hits in, and got flung away with a side swipe.

  • He tanked Ultron's blasts, threw him into a concrete pillar, physically fought, attempted to strangle each other (Cap trying to choke a robot lol), and Ultron knocked Cap into a train
  • He took a push from Ultron's TK-ish thing that threw him and smashed a windshield inward.
  • Took finger beams to the chest.
  • He got choked until Widow gave him his shield back, and even then, looking at Ultron's hand, it's not even locked in as hard as it should be. I mean, his hand was moving around Cap's neck like there's space between them, when Cap was looking towards Widow.
  • Finger beams to the chest again.
  • A punch to the helm.
That's pretty much all he tanked, and he took it very well. Admittedly, Ultron's weapons are crap. That said, Cap's feat with zero shield use and large wind up (e.g. roundhouse kicks) is his throwing Ultron at a pillar. Beyond that, he did zero damage without the shield. Conclusion: Ultron is above Cap, but not too far above. Imo, it's more a "lower tier+" vs "somewhere low on the next tier" type of thing.

  • So you think Corvus should be downgrade?
He hasn't shown any physical stuff beyond being stronger than Cap, and his spear being that good. Remove the likely perhaps? Maybe just add, "likely higher" or something.

  • I'm talking about physical strength yeah, Cap was matching Iron Man and FRIDAY outright said Tony can't beat him hand-to-hand.
Cap was outdoing Iron Man in combat, but he wasn't doing damage at all. Think of it as a pro featherweight boxer doing the dempsey roll on an unarmed knight with full plate armor. Iron Man may not beat him hand to hand, but that's imo, because he can't even land a damn hit.

  • Wait what humans can nudge cars? Show me a video of that.
Walk to the back of a parked car, push it. It'll move, but it'll snap back into place. That's pretty much how much Cap did against Thanos.
 
KLOL506 said:
Also, I think we should have a non-armor key for Tony. He has some pretty cool feats on his own.
Click to expand...
I suppose we can make an Iron Man 3 key based on when he infiltrates Killian's place. That'll give him decent enough hax to justify a key
 
Zark2099 said:
KLOL506 said:
Also, I think we should have a non-armor key for Tony. He has some pretty cool feats on his own.
Click to expand...
I suppose we can make an Iron Man 3 key based on when he infiltrates Killian's place. That'll give him decent enough hax to justify a key
Click to expand...
He also tanked getting tossed through a skyscraper window by Loki
 
I probably won't be able to help with the AoS profiles since I lack good internet connection and a computer. I'm on the mobile version.
 
Who knows how strong Kree rocket boosters are? We have no point of reference beyond just comparing them to nukes.
 
I suppose we can make an Iron Man 3 key based on when he infiltrates Killian's place. That'll give him decent enough hax to justify a key

He also tanked getting tossed through a skyscraper window by Loki

And briefly fight Winter Soldier too in Civil War, though he got rekt.
 
Gemmysaur said:
You mentioned Cap was holding his own, which he did not. He got ineffective hits in, and got flung away with a side swipe.
Click to expand...
The fact he was able to slightly stagger him was impressive enough, as Loki is High 7-C.

Conclusion: Ultron is above Cap, but not too far above. Imo, it's more a "lower tier+" vs "somewhere low on the next tier" type of thing.

I agree with that. Cap shouldn't be thousands of times weaker.

He hasn't shown any physical stuff beyond being stronger than Cap, and his spear being that good. Remove the likely perhaps? Maybe just add, "likely higher" or something.

I always thought 7-A Corvus was iffy, but Matthew thinks Corvus being matched by Cap is PIS.

Cap was outdoing Iron Man in combat, but he wasn't doing damage at all. Think of it as a pro featherweight boxer doing the dempsey roll on an unarmed knight with full plate armor. Iron Man may not beat him hand to hand, but that's imo, because he can't even land a damn hit.

So you're saying that Cap was blitzing Iron Man? Also, skill only gets you so far. When the knight hits the boxer he knocks him out. And especially when Iron Man is thousands of times stronger he would have instantly murdered Cap on the spot.
 
Nah, I don't think Korath and Drax should be of that level.

And yeah, Thanos could have well been holding back, maybe he never lost a fight in his life and won 'em handily in that state so that's why he might have been surprised. I mean, he knew that without Thor there'd be nothing to stop him.
 
Also, Hawkeye outpaced an explosion in the Endgame trailer, so he'd have Supersonic to Hypersonic running speed (Since I have no idea how fast normal explosions are generally, but grenades hit Mach 10).
 
KLOL506 said:
Also, Hawkeye outpaced an explosion in the Endgame trailer,
Click to expand...
Outrunning explosions is such a common action movie trope that it shouldn't be used to scale anyone. Unless we want to recursively upgrade people like John McClane to mach 5.

Also note that explosions rapidly decelerate after exploding. They don't keep a consistent hyper-sonic speed over distances.
 
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