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Maou Gakuin Source/ Root Type 1 Concept: Round 2

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God900 said:
But what if it's the case?
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Guideline for handling disagreement between staff members during content revision threads:
  • If a disagreement arises between staff members during the evaluation of a content revision thread, it is important to seek the input and guidance of additional staff members in order to reach a fair and unbiased decision. This may involve seeking the opinion of higher-ranked staff members, or consulting with staff members who possess specific expertise or knowledge related to the revision in question. The final decision on the approval of a content revision should be based on a thorough and unbiased evaluation of the suggested changes and their impact on a verse.
  • It is important to remember that all staff members, regardless of their rank, have a responsibility to act in the best interests of each verse by prioritizing accuracy and quality above personal preferences or biases. Staff members should strive to approach the evaluation of content revision threads with an open mind and a willingness to consider the perspectives of others.
  • Ultimately, the final decision regarding the approval of a content revision should be based on a thorough and unbiased evaluation of the suggested changes and their impact on each verse, rather than on the rank or status of the staff members involved.
  • Although the evaluation of each staff member carries equal weight, the final decision regarding the approval of a content revision may be influenced by other factors such as the expertise and knowledge of the staff members involved, the complexity and controversy of the revision, and the popularity or prominence of the affected series verse. In terms of decision-making authority, bureaucrats are given the highest consideration, followed by administrators, and then thread moderators.
  • Additionally, it is worth mentioning that Bureaucrats primarily have a lot of authority when it comes to major wiki policy changes, rather than regular content revision threads. Their authority in this regard may be restricted to specific areas.
 
ImmortalDread said:
Guideline for handling disagreement between staff members during content revision threads:
  • If a disagreement arises between staff members during the evaluation of a content revision thread, it is important to seek the input and guidance of additional staff members in order to reach a fair and unbiased decision. This may involve seeking the opinion of higher-ranked staff members, or consulting with staff members who possess specific expertise or knowledge related to the revision in question. The final decision on the approval of a content revision should be based on a thorough and unbiased evaluation of the suggested changes and their impact on a verse.
  • It is important to remember that all staff members, regardless of their rank, have a responsibility to act in the best interests of each verse by prioritizing accuracy and quality above personal preferences or biases. Staff members should strive to approach the evaluation of content revision threads with an open mind and a willingness to consider the perspectives of others.
  • Ultimately, the final decision regarding the approval of a content revision should be based on a thorough and unbiased evaluation of the suggested changes and their impact on each verse, rather than on the rank or status of the staff members involved.
  • Although the evaluation of each staff member carries equal weight, the final decision regarding the approval of a content revision may be influenced by other factors such as the expertise and knowledge of the staff members involved, the complexity and controversy of the revision, and the popularity or prominence of the affected series verse. In terms of decision-making authority, bureaucrats are given the highest consideration, followed by administrators, and then thread moderators.
  • Additionally, it is worth mentioning that Bureaucrats primarily have a lot of authority when it comes to major wiki policy changes, rather than regular content revision threads. Their authority in this regard may be restricted to specific areas.
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Exactly, pretty much
 
There is no exactly, it is between two staff members disagreements. So the only way, you solve this is to seek a new additional staff member to the discussion.
Either way, I am still asking myself what exactly they disagreed? That source is not firedew?
 
ImmortalDread said:
Either way, I am still asking myself what exactly they disagreed? That source is not firedew?
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They are saying fire dew≠ source but ducking when scans for anti feats or Statement are asked. Seriously I am kinda disappointed in their judgement atleast prove what they say. Lmao. Will wait for Elizha and Dereck to comment at this point
 
Eh? @Theglassman12 based on what you disagree with this fact in the verse? I even asked today the translator to confirm the information, and he said yes?

It is like disagreeing that Anos is the strongest character in verse, while he is, and it is proven in the verse.
 
@ImmortalDread The Fire Dew explanation makes it completely different from the source of the individual when it's something else it's governing, not the lives, just the earth.

@God900 How about you prove it instead of throwing around false accusations? Because labeling people as biased isn't going to help you win people over.
 
I literally posted two keywords of volume 10 part 1 and volume 11, which says exactly against what you are trying to express. It is actually equivalent to the source of mortal world, truly the same source that everyone have in the verse.

You are required to send anti-feat for this that is presented in the verse. Not sure, why should I take your word against the author's words?
 
The term "source" is a concept that is used interchangeable. If the source of the Earth is classified as CM type 1 which is accepted, then it must be equivalent to the source of an individual if they have the same nature and properties if author stated to. The author clearly defines "source" in verse, and it is not appropriate to deviate from that definition because it is used in different objects. Interestingly enough, I need to take your judgement as the lore of the verse while it contradicts.

It is interesting to note that the argument about names in Touha is similar to this one, where one party argued that names are actual names while the other opposing party believed they are equivalent to concepts. However, there seems to be a lack of actual refutation to the opposing argument in this case.

The thread will be reopened because it was closed prematurely before someone had a chance to respond.
 
@ImmortalDread And there's clearly a distinction between one source and the other in the series given how everyone has their own unique source and it's not shared among everyone like how the concept of death is shared among all life in the world. Again this just sounds like something for the fire dew at best, not something that makes them one and the same with other folks' individual source, because if that's true then nuking someone's source would also affect the reality they're in, and last time I checked destroying their source means only they just die.

Also why are you telling me to reopen this thread? It wasn't even closed in the first place.
 
Theglassman12 said:
@ImmortalDread And there's clearly a distinction between one source and the other in the series given how everyone has their own unique source and it's not shared among everyone like how the concept of death is shared among all life in the world. Again this just sounds like something for the fire dew at best, not something that makes them one and the same with other folks' individual source, because if that's true then nuking someone's source would also affect the reality they're in, and last time I checked destroying their source means only they just die.
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I used the same argument in that thread you disagreed, glass, like choose a stance.
Theglassman12 said:
Also why are you telling me to reopen this thread? It wasn't even closed in the first place.
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lol..?
 
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ImmortalDread said:
I used the same argument in that thread you disagreed, glass.
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That's not even problem actually scan literally states destruction of Source does decreases world magic power of the world. And we know it's refering to Fire dew that's the only magic power of the world which has been stated so far in the series. Glass doesn't want to agree with MG thread I guess.
　Misha kept her mouth shut for a moment and looked down.

　Then she uttered a cutting voice.

"The total amount of potential magic in this world is constantly decreasing."

　"Hmmm. The total amount, huh?"

"The sum of the power of all things that have magic power, including demons, humans, magic tools, magic swords, and holy swords?"

Misha nodded quietly, "Magic power does not circulate completely. Some of it spills over and eventually disappears."

　If the total amount of magical power in the world continues to decrease, it is reasonable to assume that there are lives that cannot be reincarnated or transmigrated.

　There will be lives like my father, Celis Voldigoad, who lost his magical power.

　And if there is no more magic power to lose, the root itself will eventually disappear.
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Chapter 418
 
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Theglassman12 said:
Oh yeah, I’m biased because I’m being skeptical of your obscure light/web novel verse.
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There's a limit to being skeptical
Theglassman12 said:
Not the person who keeps labeling others as wrong or idiots or telling them to get the f#ck out of the thread because they’re too blind according to them.
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Never called anyone an idiot, i admit to calling you blind and telling you to gtfo
Theglassman12 said:
Grow up and accept how things work here.
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Way ahead of you
Theglassman12 said:
People are going to ask questions on the arguments, or find them very iffy, so you trying to label them as biased is not going to help your argument whatsoever.
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I understand that perfectly but even when evidence was presented that blatantly portrayed something as red, you were still maintaining your stance that it's blue.
I apologize for my attitude. Got caught up in some stuff IRL, almost devolved into a fight and I ended up transferring my aggression here, I'm sorry.
 
@ImmortalDread can you quote which same arguments you’re talking about?

@Tatsumi504 and there’s a limit to throwing accusations at me.

If you’re telling me to gtfo you’re basically not even arguing anymore.

It’s fine, if you can’t control your emotions due to IRL situations then you should take a break, because this isn’t going to help if you lash out at anyone.
 
Theglassman12 said:
because if that's true then nuking someone's source would also affect the reality they're in, and last time I checked destroying their source means only they just die.
Click to expand...
It does just there's still fire dew either way. The total amount continues to reduce and the smaller it gets, the weaker reality gets and once it falls below an unspecified point, that reality gets destroyed. Each individual Life has a miniscule effect on reality. This is potency or scale which still doesn't disprove the current claim.
In a world without the blessing of the Lord God, there is no consistency of order, and the fire dew overflows outside. The destination is the end of the world.
Click to expand...
Theglassman12 said:
If you’re telling me to gtfo you’re basically not even arguing anymore.

It’s fine, if you can’t control your emotions due to IRL situations then you should take a break, because this isn’t going to help if you lash out at anyone.
Click to expand...
I apologize again. I've calmed down now though I'll probably still take a break.
 
@Theglassman12

I regret to inform you that it is too late, as I am currently in the process of preparing myself to depart for the student's residence.

Fuji employed this precise argument to establish that names correspond to CM type 1, on the grounds that "names of gods" technically denotes concepts, although within the given context it conveys the meaning of "names" in a literal sense. Likewise, in this instance, the source of the earth or a person may be regarded as identical if their attributes and properties are equivalent.

Based on your agreement with Fuji's position, it seems probable that you share a similar perspective in this case.

Furthermore, I no longer intend to contend that the source is not the same as the fire-few, as the translator has confirmed the accuracy of this assertion within the verse.

While you are free to disagree with the thread, doing so is akin to disputing the fact that a tree is green.

As such, I have summoned additional members of the staff to review this matter.
 
ImmortalDread said:
@Theglassman12

I regret to inform you that it is too late, as I am currently in the process of preparing myself to depart for the student's residence.

Fuji employed this precise argument to establish that names correspond to CM type 1, on the grounds that "names of gods" technically denotes concepts, although within the given context it conveys the meaning of "names" in a literal sense. Likewise, in this instance, the source of the earth or a person may be regarded as identical if their attributes and properties are equivalent.

Based on your agreement with Fuji's position, it seems probable that you share a similar perspective in this case.

Furthermore, I no longer intend to contend that the source is not the same as the fire-few, as the translator has confirmed the accuracy of this assertion within the verse.

While you are free to disagree with the thread, doing so is akin to disputing the fact that a tree is green.

As such, I have summoned additional members of the staff to review this matter.
Click to expand...
Touhou is completely different in the sense that it very directly confirms that the names humans give things are the same as the names that govern gods. The same cannot be said for an individual's source and the source of the earth/fire dew.

Quit it with this false equivalency bullshit. I have no stakes here but I don't like people using my verse as proof of their arguments when they've already proven they know very little about the verse in question.
 
No one is saying source is not fire dew, at least not to my knowledge and I hope not. The term were used interchangeably. The first mention of fire dew liken it to the term source for human. What Planck and Glass are saying to my knowledge is that, the application is different.
One governs humans and another governs orders. So saying they were called the same name is naming fallacy and frankly not flying with me or them if I may say.
We know fire dew is the source of the world that governs orders in the world, and we know source or fire dews of humans governs them and them alone.
I saw an interesting quote from the one @Tatsumi504 said I should check, Fire dew is the collection of sources in a world, he said something about destruction when it is reduced but I have not seen enough to come to that conclusion. Which does not mean potency in any way but rather verse mechanics, fire dew which is the combination of all sources in the world governs orders in the verse. but a claimed source and ordinary one source of an individual person governs a single person.
 
I hate double standards but it's Ok as long as staff allows it I guess. Guess no one will know who is doing this double standards arguments
 
PrinceofPein said:
No one is saying source is not fire dew, at least not to my knowledge and I hope not. The term were used interchangeably. The first mention of fire dew liken it to the term source for human. What Planck and Glass are saying to my knowledge is that, the application is different.
One governs humans and another governs orders. So saying they were called the same name is naming fallacy and frankly not flying with me or them if I may say.
We know fire dew is the source of the world that governs orders in the world, and we know source or fire dews of humans governs them and them alone.
I saw an interesting quote from the one @Tatsumi504 said I should check, Fire dew is the collection of sources in a world, he said something about destruction when it is reduced but I have not seen enough to come to that conclusion. Which does not mean potency in any way but rather verse mechanics, fire dew which is the combination of all sources in the world governs orders in the verse. but a claimed source and ordinary one source of an individual person governs a single person.
Click to expand...
It's not name fallacy when it comes to other verses

Great sources only governs individual existence? Then tell me why amount of worlds magic power was affecting when sources were gotten affected. You should know to maintain order magic power is required which is fire dew.
　Misha kept her mouth shut for a moment and looked down.

　Then she uttered a cutting voice.

"The total amount of potential magic in this world is constantly decreasing."

　"Hmmm. The total amount, huh?"

"The sum of the power of all things that have magic power, including demons, humans, magic tools, magic swords, and holy swords?"

Misha nodded quietly, "Magic power does not circulate completely. Some of it spills over and eventually disappears."

　If the total amount of magical power in the world continues to decrease, it is reasonable to assume that there are lives that cannot be reincarnated or transmigrated.

　There will be lives like my father, Celis Voldigoad, who lost his magical power.

　And if there is no more magic power to lose, the root itself will eventually disappear.
Click to expand...
 
Mad_Dog_of_Fujiwara said:
Touhou is completely different in the sense that it very directly confirms that the names humans give things are the same as the names that govern gods. The same cannot be said for an individual's source and the source of the earth/fire dew.
Click to expand...
The fact those names don't even govern reality makes my argument perfectly fine here.
Mad_Dog_of_Fujiwara said:
Quit it with this false equivalency bullshit. I have no stakes here but I don't like people using my verse as proof of their arguments when they've already proven they know very little about the verse in question.
Click to expand...
If you have no stakes here, slightly unfollow the thread. The matter of fact that the discussion is not even finished and got closed quickly make it quite suspicious, it was not even 1 day. Also, it is not your verse, since you don't own it. It's public verse.
 
Also name fallacy really? I literally said that in touha verse when she used names of gods = concepts but yet the same who disagrees here, agreed there.

Like as much as I hate using whataboutsam arguments but it is tiring that those who agree with the same mechanics disagrees with this one.
 
Mad_Dog_of_Fujiwara said:
If you hate it so much, then downgrade it.

Oh wait.
Click to expand...
Oh wait, I am requesting re-opening it since you rushed into closing it. Hell, even my friends DMed me and said that's ******* hilarious that's they were sleeping and did not get chance to respond.

Hate? So you were downgrading MG for hate as well? Got it.

Wonder why the rush
 
ImmortalDread said:
Oh wait, I am requesting re-opening it since you rushed into closing it. Hell, even my friends DMed me and said that's ******* hilarious that's they were sleeping and did not get chance to respond.

Wonder why the rush
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Sure, go right ahead. I'm pretty confident in my 4 staff disagreements against your 1 staff agreement 💀
 
I know i promised not to bother you again so you can choose to ignore this.
PrinceofPein said:
No one is saying source is not fire dew, at least not to my knowledge and I hope not. The term were used interchangeably.
Click to expand...
Oh glad that's cleared up
PrinceofPein said:
The first mention of fire dew liken it to the term source for human. What Planck and Glass are saying to my knowledge is that, the application is different.
One governs humans and another governs orders
Click to expand...
There is no difference in their application. The source is and has always been fire dew. It governs/influences Order which governs reality and also governs an individual existence.
PrinceofPein said:
We know fire dew is the source of the world that governs orders in the world, and we know source or fire dews of humans governs them and them alone.
Click to expand...
There is no distinction between the two. The World itself doesn't have a source (source in the sense of an individual concept of it's own). The total amount of Fire Dew is what sustains the World.

All Fire Dew is the same and it is what governs Order. On earth (the world of mortals), Fire Dew exists as the source (if you're alive) and for those who are dead, they are Fire Dew in the world of the gods. Being alive doesn't remove the influence of your source/ Fire Dew on the Total amount in the world.
PrinceofPein said:
I saw an interesting quote from the one @Tatsumi504 said I should check, Fire dew is the collection of sources in a world, he said something about destruction when it is reduced but I have not seen enough to come to that conclusion.
Click to expand...
Now we're finally starting to see the big picture.
Take the total amount of Fire Dew/Source as nonrenewable energy. This energy is what sustains the world.
Take the brightness of a light bulb as an indicator for the worlds integrity (not in the sense of personality but as stability). Whenever any amount of Fire Dew/ source (using both interchangeably) is destroyed, consumed, leaked out of the world, the light bulb dims. The amount lost is what determines by how much the brightness of the light bulb dims.
Now when this energy falls below a certain level, the light bulb completely goes off indicating the complete loss of integrity and complete destruction of the world.
PrinceofPein said:
Which does not mean potency in any way but rather verse mechanics, fire dew which is the combination of all sources in the world governs orders in the verse. but a claimed source and ordinary one source of an individual person governs a single person.
Click to expand...
Verse mechanics? Probably but is it still about potency or scale? Yes, why? Because each individual fire dew/ claimed source, as you put it, still influences the stability of reality to a certain extent. Not completely destroying reality by destroying an individual one doesn't mean it's influence is zero, it's still there, just miniscule or unnoticeable.

Another analogy will be thousands of pillars that support a massive structure. Will the loss of one pillar cause the entire structure to crumble? No because there's still thousands more supporting it, does it mean the loss of one pillar doesn't compromise the structures integrity? Obviously no too.
 
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