Koizilla Avatar

[ByAsura]

Tui and La are spirits that represent the ocean and moon, respectively. This is literal, since the moon disappeared when Tui was killed by Zhao. Aang absorbed La and became the physical embodiment of the ocean's wrath. So I'm proposing that we give Aang High 6-A as Koizilla.

However, I'd also say that 5-C is possible as well. While La doesn't represent the moon, it's stated that the death of either one of them would be enough to throw off the world's balance, and they're in an eternal push and pull against each other to maintain said balance.

• YUE: Our strength comes from the spirit of the moon. Our life comes from the spirit of the ocean. They work together to keep balance.

So, High 6-A, possibly 5-C Koizilla.

According to some people from the last thread, Raava and Vaatu should be superior to Tui and La. But I have yet to see any hard evidence beyond word of mouth, so we can discuss that here.

Edit: I forgot to mention, but we're also removing this as a stabilization anti-feat since this is literal proof that they're directly linked.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

Seems legit.

 

[Dalesean027]

Also I'd like to their physical forms being so weak compared to anything else doesn't create any problems since that's kinda the point after they gave up their spiritual forms and gained mortality but yeah we can discuss

 

[Maverick_Zero_X]

This seems alright.

 

[BrackishBrineBroth]

For evidence of Raava and Vaatu being superior or at least equal to Tui and La:

• A passing spirit calls them the all-powerful spirits
• Raava says that he will annihilate the human and spirit worlds, later clarifying that he will cover the world in darkness
• Whichever wins harmonic convergence defines the world with their concept

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

Yeah, it was basically common knowledge that Vaatu and Raava are officially the two most powerful spirits in the Avatar universe as they're basically the two entities who's conflict decides the fate of both the physical world and spirit world.

 

[ByAsura]

I that case, wouldn't the Avatar state itself be 5-C since Wan and Korra fought Vaatu?

 

[Dalesean027]

Wan fought a buffed Vaatu at that

 

[SilentLyfe]

Question. Wouldn’t it be 5-C, higher with the Avatar State? Since if I recall it calls upon the energy, skills, and knowledge abilities of every past Avatar? So by Aangs time it would be much stronger than with Wan?

 

[ByAsura]

I think that was from BTS stuff, and Korra retconned the **** out of it.

Edit: It was from the Extras.

Also, it wouldn't be higher, just at least in that scenario.

 

[ByAsura]

I found one other quote from Rise of Kyoshi, but that doesn't say power, just skill.

• Jianzhu’s sharp ears intercepted her question. “It’s a tool,” he said. “And a defense mechanism. A higher state of being designed to empower the current Avatar with the skills and knowledge of all the past ones. It allows for the summoning of vast cosmic energies and nearly impossible feats of bending.”

 

[Excellence616]

Make sense

 

[DemonicDude]

Is there actual calc for this or will it be baseline High 6-A

 

[BrackishBrineBroth]

I that case, wouldn't the Avatar state itself be 5-C since Wan and Korra fought Vaatu?

No, because Raava and Vaatu's powers fluctuate depending on how strong the other is. As this post pointed out, the avatars prior to Korra have technically been working with a weakened version of Raava. After Korra won harmonic convergence and re-fused with Raava, she should have Raava's full power available to her.

 

[ByAsura]

Your statements show that they were both still considered all-powerful without being at full power during harmonic convergence, and they're able to fight equally with each other in all the scenes where they do fight.

So they'd still be 5-C regardless, unless I'm misremembering something.

 

[AnonymousBlank]

Wouldn’t that mean that AS is still 5-C? At least for Wan and Korra since they combined with a weakened Raava and still beat up Vaatu.

 

[Damage3245]

Why would Korra and Vaatu scale to this exactly?

The koi fish don't actually have 5-C stats even if they're connected to the Moon. So even if Raava and Vaatu are more powerful, that wouldn't mean their own physical stats scale, right?

 

[BrackishBrineBroth]

Your statements show that they were both still considered all-powerful without being at full power during harmonic convergence, and they're able to fight equally with each other in all the scenes where they do fight.

So they'd still be 5-C regardless, unless I'm misremembering something.

The power difference between them is pretty marginal until they reach their full power during harmonic convergence. I've got a scan but I'm at work right now so I'll have to post it later

 

[ByAsura]

If anything that supports my point.

 

[BrackishBrineBroth]

Never mind. I was gonna link a video of Unavaatu one-shotting everyone but remembered that Korra wasn't in the avatar state at the time.

I agree with the Koizilla proposals and the Vaatu and Raava scaling.

 

[BrackishBrineBroth]

Here's a proposed list of abilities that Koizilla should have.

• Superhuman characteristics
• Large size type 2
• Water manipulation
• Ice manipulation
• Regeneration (It can sink into the ocean and come back out, using the water to reform itself)
• Immortality types 3 and 4
• Elemental intangibility (It’s body is made entirely of water and light, save for Aang himself)
• Inorganic physiology type 1
• Battlefield removal and Soul Manipulation, via being able to drag people to the Fog of Lost Souls

 

[BrackishBrineBroth]

Bump.

The koi fish don't actually have 5-C stats even if they're connected to the Moon. So even if Raava and Vaatu are more powerful, that wouldn't mean their own physical stats scale, right?

Because Tui controls the moon and is stated to be the first waterbender, who controls the tides of the world. And after Yue dies and becomes the moon spirit, it's shown that she IS the moon. "The Awakening" shows that Yue sees everything down below through the moon because she knows where Aang is, and in the Escape from the Spirit World game, she comes out from the moon's light.

 

[AnonymousBlank]

But why does that make Tui 5-C? Being the moon doesn’t give you moon busting capabilities. Controlling the tides of the world on the other hand actually is feat of power which scales to both of them.

 

[BrackishBrineBroth]

But why does that make Tui 5-C? Being the moon doesn’t give you moon busting capabilities. Controlling the tides of the world on the other hand actually is feat of power which scales to both of them.

She controls the movement of the moon much in the same way that Koizilla could control the ocean. Meaning that if she really wanted to, she could smash into the planet. The moon also exists in the spirit world which, for all we've seen of it, isn't really a planet but a plane where distance and gravity is really wonky sometimes.

 

[ByAsura]

It's not just being the moon. There was no moon originally, and it disappears with her presence. It's a stabilization feat and counts towards AP by the rules of the wiki.

Also, the fact that the moon pushes and pulls against the entire mass of the oceans suggests it has the same gravitational force and GBE (which is substantiated by the extras all-but saying they're the same).

 

[KLOL506]

I see no issues with the proposals at hand. Though a full-on 5-C is more preferable IMHO.

 

[SilentLyfe]

It's not just being the moon. There was no moon originally, and it disappears with her presence. It's a stabilization feat and counts towards AP by the rules of the wiki.

The page lists it as an unviable example though. So would need to be removed if this is accepted.

 

[ByAsura]

The page is wrong and I'm planning on removing that.

Edit: I'm just realising I forgot to put this in the OP.

It says 'Moon Spirit (Avatar: The Last Airbender) for the moon's existence being unaffiliated with Tui's death', when the moon disappears and unravels a balance, as we've shown throughout the thread.

 

[BrackishBrineBroth]

We've got four mods' approval; five if we count op. Tier 5 avatar at last, baybee.

 

[ByAsura]

I guess it should be fine to apply. I'll give a few hours for any objections.

 

[SilentLyfe]

Are we good to apply now?

 

[ByAsura]

Ok, I'll start applying to changes.

If there's any objections, now's the last chance to air them.

 

[ByAsura]

I've made the changes.

The grammar isn't the best though.

 

[ByAsura]

Immortality types 3 and 4

I'm not sure about those. Aang's corporeal body didn't get hit, just the water.

 

[Arceus0x]

does the 5-C scale to Aang's Koizilla form only or does it also scale to Avatar state?

 

[ByAsura]

It scales to the Avatar state due to Raava and Wan being > Tui and La.

This makes sense because Aang implies he's not really more powerful.

 

[SilentLyfe]

I've made the changes.

The grammar isn't the best though.

There are 5 keys on Aangs profile but the tiers only have four.

 

[ByAsura]

Fixed

 

[Arceus0x]

It scales to the Avatar state due to Raava and Wan being > Tui and La.

This makes sense because Aang implies he's not really more powerful.

so it scales to Aang but the evidence you say supports it says he's not more powerful? I am kinda confused here

 

[Ped2018]

Yeah, didn't get that