Jujutsu Kaisen Discussion Page #1

[YukaSama4]

Spoiler

GOJO HAS WON THE TITLE OF THE STRONGEST IN HISTORY

Hope Gege doesnt twist Gojo's win in the next chapter

 

[YukaSama4]

I woke up 1to2 hours after and he deleted all the pages so I had to get the leaks from a YouTube live reaction but it really feels annoying hearing the screams and everything

 

[eibwen]

He needs to merge Red and Blue. Do you think Sukuna would sit arround and let merge? Currently Both had tired so it's normal for Gojo to use long ranged attacks.

so what if sukuna doesnt sit around? he can barely do anything against gojo anyway

 

[Giannysmag]

I woke up 1to2 hours after and he deleted all the pages so I had to get the leaks from a YouTube live reaction but it really feels annoying hearing the screams and everything

The leaks are also in the jjk discord

 

[eibwen]

Spoiler

GOJO HAS WON THE TITLE OF THE STRONGEST IN HISTORY

Hope Gege doesnt twist Gojo's win in the next chapter

i mean, if gege actually have the intention to do so then he should've done it in this chapter, by making gojo nuking both of them but sukuna can have maho tanks for him

 

[YukaSama4]

Aside from this, both the editor, and Kusakabe confirm that Gojo has won, yet Sukuna fans want Gege to come in an interview right now and say Gojo has won or otherwise Gojo didn't.
I think its possible that Sukuna might come back or someone will intervene or Sukuna getting the last finger or basically any plot twist happening in the next chapter that will remove Gojo out of the equation later, however the result of the battle of the strongest is already engraved in Shinjuku with the damage Gojo's final hollow purple has done, he has won.

 

[Giannysmag]

I am curtain that Kenjaku is gonna do something next chapter. Bro's been missing for 10+ chaps, he is plotting something devious

Spoiler

Anyhow now that the fight is technically over i have some thoughts.
Overall it was great, second favourite fight behind Mahito Vs Yuji/ Todo, but i thought it was pretty disapointing that Gojo didn't so off any new techniques. Gege really baited us with ending narration about an "unlimited hollow technique" only for it to be purple. Same thing with Sukuna not showing his "Shrine". Also the fact that Gojo's shirt never ripped even against Malevolent Shrine was complete bs. GEGE GIVE ME OILED UP SHIRTLESS GOJO, YOU DAMN ONE EYED CAT

 

[EldemadeDityjon]

so what if sukuna doesnt sit around? he can barely do anything against gojo anyway

What you saying has nothing to do with what I said

 

[EldemadeDityjon]

I can see some people still coping about Sukuna using Megumi CT. LMAO both challenged each other on what they had. Sukuna never signed a contract for fighting Gojo without Megumi powers. Also Sukuna own Yorozu gift so that's his own power now. Even Gojo never said anything about Sukuna using Megumi CT as a cheat. They would scale to whatever version they had come with preparation.

Toji , Maki and Yuta uses cursed tools still that's considered as their own powers / things. So I hope people stop coping and accept whatever happens next chapter.

Well if Sukuna uses Uraume help or Kenjaku help to make an comeback next chapter that means Sukuna admitted he can't fight Gojo one on one. So his that's his lose.

Currently According to Kusakabe Gojo won because Mahogara is gone so can't bypass infinity and DA can't be used to fight H2H because of low RCT.

 

[YukaSama4]

Spoiler

I think people are misunderstanding the shrine point, they got it from Yorozu's fight and its stated in the same fight that its related to slashing, also I'm sure in the raws of the previous chapters Gojo referrered to Sukuna's slashes by Mizushi which basically means Shrine but viz kept changing it to malevolent shrine.
We know that Sukuna has the fire arrow or open technique, but arguing that he never used his CT is really a weak stance imo, he might have different appliancations or so but he was definitely using his CT in this fight, he has a killer move that he's saving but in exchange Gege gave him the TS which is a broken ability, a counter to the limitless.

As for Gojo yeah it's disappointing but even though he didn't use anything other than the same moves, with the exception of his barrier technique mastery, he showed that he can use his abilities better than any six eyes limitless user in history.

Anyways its the best fight in the series so far imo, I just wanted more environmental damage because honestly, a fight that was far less hyped than this one, Yuki vs Kenjaku, almost lead to the destruction of the world if it wasn't for Tengen's barriers.

 

[YukaSama4]

On a side note we have finally seen Gojo using his teleportation/compressing space ability, he speed blitzed Mahoraga and nuked the final boss room with HP

 

[Giannysmag]

Could HP blowing up the city be calced, or is it invaled because void manip?

 

[EldemadeDityjon]

Anyways its the best fight in the series so far imo, I just wanted more environmental damage because honestly, a fight that was far less hyped than this one, Yuki vs Kenjaku, almost lead to the destruction of the world if it wasn't for Tengen's barriers.

Hakari vs Kashimo fight Clears any JJK fights .
Also Second best fight would be Ryu vs Yuta vs Uro
Just my opinion though. Current fight seemed like Gege wanted to Display different usage of Sorcerery and I like it but still not on my first. Also About Yuki vs Kenjaku I think it's too small. Yuji and Todo vs Mahito was better overall than that.

Speaking About Yuki looks like her Black hole is still biggest feat in the series so far

 

[EldemadeDityjon]

Could HP blowing up the city be calced, or is it invaled because void manip?

Unlike Yuki Black hole which had force I don't think HP works same way. So Don't know if it can be calculated. This doesn't seemed like sucks anything in or out just looks like erases stuff.

 

[YukaSama4]

Lmao

 

[Shey]

He said it was fluctuating right after he performed an attack, and he was checking himself out. He noticed only when he performed an attack. Right after he then clarified the body is dropping cursed energy output when he’s attacking his allies. To say that his CE was dropping when he wasn’t attacking is what’s really disingenuous here because Sukuna literally clarified it’s when he attacks does the body drop cursed energy.

He notes it is fluctuating while he's not doing anything,our boat.
He doesn't speak in a past sense that's solid evidence that it's passive

It’s also used for cursed techniques and the two don’t necessarily correlate with one another. Your CE output could drop for your techniques but not for your physics so if you’re gonna make the claim his physicals was dropped then you need to provide evidence as such. Because the only clarification we got was that his CT output was the one that was being dropped.

There's no reason one would happen without the other and they do correlate with each other, this is the basis of Jujutsu, flowing CE and either using it to attack physically or flowing it into a technique.

We literally can see the blood on the corner of his lip. It’d be really w to say that it isn’t blood when we can literally see it with our own two eyes.

There was no blood ever left on his face throughout that fight what are you saying, at best he had a single bruise on his face

These are not mutually exclusive. We can see it’s blood in cases like Yuji punching Sukuna because we can see the make and blood it left behind on his face.

There was no blood left on his face, what are you talking about.

Hell those “big, solid streaks” of blood can even be shown in the fight against Sukuna.

Where's the Blood though?
Did you miss the part where Gege ALWAYS depicts blood as solid black

He literally say him walking up to him and noticed something was off right away. That’s not “a while” if it’s being done right in the very same instance. That’s just a blatantly wrong thing to say.

It is "A while" Yuji walked meters to get him and only at after getting punched did he fully comprehend his situation

Sure seems like you’re implying Sukuna’s output was being dropped before he started to slash Yuji right here. Otherwise you would’ve said there was no drop. Not that one just wasn’t being noticed.

3 pages what are you talking about. There was a double spread showing Yuji was getting slashed and the very next panels we see Sukuna noticing something being off.

A double spread is 2 pages, and the page after he notices something is off but doesn't get what's happening exactly only until the very last panel of the last page does he conclude his Output dropped.

Yeah the proof is in the statements. CE performs the functions of cursed techniques, so his CE output dropping means his CT output is dropping. No mention of physicals needed since this can just be in reference to his CT’s output. Megumi restricting his access to CE can just be in reference to his CT, like Sukuna says, and not his Physcal reinforcement, which is never said. You trying to conflate them doesn’t change that fact.

You're asking for more Redundancy, if CE usage is hampered all its function follows suit

Also all Sukuna says when Maki shows up is “I shouldn’t have any trouble killing the kid.” That’s it.

Alright

But Sukuna’s speed is wavering like you say. So it should be a significant issue if Yuji and Maki are continuously assaulting him. But no drop or fluctuation in speed is ever shown on Sukuna’s part. Only ever in reference to his CT.

So what if he’s not hitting him continuously. He still should notice himself being slower, he should notice his hits doing less damage. But this is never the case. He keeps up with Maki and Yuji just fine, even when Maki “speeds things up.” Even though Sukuna should have a hard time speeding things up if his speed is fluctuating like you say.

And he never has any issues keeping up with Maki from then on despite again his power and speed should be fluctuating when he’s attacking Megumi’s friends.

https://img.spoilerhat.com/img/?url=https://cdn.****************.com/file/CDN-M-A-N/jjk_womb7_215_013.png

If his physicals are fluctuating like you say, then he should have a much harder time keeping up if that’s the case. But no fluctuation shown here.

Speed won't be a problem if Sukuna is faster than them still.
Assuming he would have a harder time keeping up just because his stats are dropping is assuming he was relative to them in speed at his Maximum to begin with.
And in like the beginning of the fight Maki was able to comfortably swap hands with him and knock him away, then after saying she's going to speed, Sukuna uses one hand each to parry both Maki and Yuji simultaneously and casually, if that's not evidence I don't know what is

You’re solely trying to have the manga strictly conform to your personal views in favor of your argument when that doesn’t need to be the case at all.

Nothing says Sukuna needs to continuously attack to notice his CE fluctuating. That’s just you trying to make it be that way for your argument to work.

But it’s not redundant to mention his CT despite the use of cursed energy covering a cursed techniques strength as well?

I believe I should be the one saying that to you since you’re the one trying to make the claim spot particles can never be blood in the manga.

Nope. He says when I attack meaning when he doesn’t, his CE output isn’t being dropped.

They're not my personal views that's literally just how it works CE flows to activate a CT and the amount of CE put into it determines the power the CT
To drop CT Output means to directly drop the amount of Cursed Energy used to activate it.
And that's exactly what Megumi has been doing.

Nope he talks about CT output, not overall output. We know this because Sukuna specifically mentions his CT output being the one weakened and no fluctuation is ever shown in his physical moves against Yuji and Maki. Meanwhile Sukuna will go out of his way to attack the ground with bus CT just so he could land a physical punch on Maki. It’s his CT output, not his overall CE output.

In this very instance he’s literally saying because his cursed technique’s output is being dropped when he attacks his allies, he used his CT on the ground. Him deciding to go for the ground and punch Maki shows him viewing his physicals as the superior move than his CT because he literally mentions his CT being weakened and so decides to punch Maki in the face instead.

You’d have to ignore the entire context of this scene to make the argument you’re making.

He earlier specifically mentioned CE Output further saying CT Output doesn't mean only his CT is affected, CE Output can be separate from CT Output as it isn't strictly just for running into CT, stating attacking causes a strong rejection isn't a problem as he's expanding upon the full situation.
Sukuna doesn't always use his CT to attack when he can, it doesn't prove that he thinks his physical blows are more effective .

It absolutely proves his CE wasn’t being dropped. That along with all the other instances of him keeping up with Maki despite his speed allegedly fluctuating all throughout the fights

He demonstrably performs different against in all 3 instances they swap hands, from Maki briefly outdoing him to Sukuna casually taking on her with one arm to them doing their Saitama vs Garou rip-off clash.
Clear showing of fluctuations

 

[YukaSama4]

Why does it matter if Yuji made Sukuna bleed or not anyways? As long as his output was fluctuating, his durability and strength is lower.

 

[Shey]

Aside from this, both the editor, and Kusakabe confirm that Gojo has won, yet Sukuna fans want Gege to come in an interview right now and say Gojo has won or otherwise Gojo didn't.
I think its possible that Sukuna might come back or someone will intervene or Sukuna getting the last finger or basically any plot twist happening in the next chapter that will remove Gojo out of the equation later, however the result of the battle of the strongest is already engraved in Shinjuku with the damage Gojo's final hollow purple has done, he has won.

Well, it was a good run, at a certain point it felt like the outcome wouldn't even be close but still had faith.
If I don't get my plottwist Copium I will move on to

Why does it matter if Yuji made Sukuna bleed or not anyways? As long as his output was fluctuating, his durability and strength is lower.

Because this guy doesn't think that Reduced CE Output affected those things

 

[YukaSama4]

Because this guy doesn't think that Reduced CE Output affected those thing

That's contradicted though.
CE output is directly indicated to affect physical reinforcements.
It's the reason Hakari wasn't affected by Kashimo's energy trait

 

[StorytellingDemonKing]

So, I don't really keep up with the scaling on the wiki, but will the High 7-A ratings stay, or will the characters be upgraded/downgraded?

 

[EldemadeDityjon]

So, I don't really keep up with the scaling on the wiki, but will the High 7-A ratings stay, or will the characters be upgraded/downgraded?

Gets downgrade for most of the characters

 

[StorytellingDemonKing]

Gets downgrade for most of the characters

"Most" so are there any characters that will keep it?

 

[Maitreya12]

He notes it is fluctuating while he's not doing anything,our boat.
He doesn't speak in a past sense that's solid evidence that it's passive

You’re again ignoring the context of this scene. He says it’s fluctuating right after he just used his CT on Yuji. That’s in the present. So he’s checking himself out. The fact that he then later says “when I’m attacking his allies” is when his CE output drops, proves it’s not passive.

There's no reason one would happen without the other and they do correlate with each other, this is the basis of Jujutsu, flowing CE and either using it to attack physically or flowing it into a technique.

And Megumi is restricting the CE flowing into his CT, reducing his output. That’s what Sukuna says and makes no indication his physicals were affected at all. So no there is reason one happens without the other and it’s the fact that it’s literally stated to only happen to his CT.

There was no blood ever left on his face throughout that fight what are you saying, at best he had a single bruise on his face

We can literally see that blood on the corner of his lip. See that mark under Sukuna’s bruise?

There was no blood left on his face, what are you talking about.

See, corner of his lip having blood and in the very next page we see that small amount of blood was left behind right next to his lip.

We can see it clear as can be it’s blood.

Where's the Blood though?
Did you miss the part where Gege ALWAYS depicts blood as solid black

Did you happen to miss the solid black parts in that image?? There’s noticeably larger blots of blood in that image of Maki and Yuji than the “small dots” you were mentioning earlier.

It is "A while" Yuji walked meters to get him and only at after getting punched did he fully comprehend his situation

Meters? Sukuna noticed something was off the second Yuji started marching forward through all his slashes and Sukuna understood the situation before he was punched by Yuji.

A double spread is 2 pages, and the page after he notices something is off but doesn't get what's happening exactly only until the very last panel of the last page does he conclude his Output dropped.

Yeah 2 pages but all in one instance. You’re trying to come across as “3 pages” as if it’s some long amount of time, but the double spread of Yuji getting slashed is all one instance. It’s all one moment. It’s 2 pages occupying one moment. The minute Sukuna sees Yuji marching forward, he notices something is off. And it only takes him a thought to come to conclusion of why this is happening.

So it wouldn’t be “a while” like you’re claiming.

You're asking for more Redundancy, if CE usage is hampered all its function follows suit

Nope, Megumi can just be able to restrict the flow of CE whenever Sukuna tries to use his CT, but is unable to restrict his flow of CE when Sukuna is just moving around freely.

Hence the “when I attack his friends is when this body drops cursed energy” part of Sukuna’s statement which is consistent with what Sukuna does in the fight itself.

Speed won't be a problem if Sukuna is faster than them still.
Assuming he would have a harder time keeping up just because his stats are dropping is assuming he was relative to them in speed at his Maximum to begin with.

But he hasn’t shown that he was much faster than then. And no going by your logic there should be instances where Sukuna can’t keep up with them at all since his CE is fluctuating so heavily. In fact, Sukuna should be unable to speed up himself on command like he’s shown doing since Megumi’s fluctuations should be having an impact on his ability to willingly speed up his body like that.

And in like the beginning of the fight Maki was able to comfortably swap hands with him and knock him away, then after saying she's going to speed, Sukuna uses one hand each to parry both Maki and Yuji simultaneously and casually, if that's not evidence I don't know what is

You ignored the part where he immediately gets caught by them in the next panels. They’re still comfortably swapping hands, so no that’s not evidence lol. If anything, Sukuna being able to speed himself up on command, proves his physicals aren’t being affected by the fluctuation. If anything, he should be getting slower due to the drop in CE, so the fact that he can increase his speed on command proves he has control over the CE output of his Physcial body.

They're not my personal views that's literally just how it works CE flows to activate a CT and the amount of CE put into it determines the power the CT
To drop CT Output means to directly drop the amount of Cursed Energy used to activate it.
And that's exactly what Megumi has been doing.

So he’s dropping the amount of CE when Sukuna activates his CT? Ok now prove he’s dropping the flow of CE when he’s just doing things like punching and moving himself around.

Because one doesn’t necessarily lead to the other. Megumi can just be dropping the flow of CE whenever Sukuna tries to activate his CT, but can’t drop the flow of CE whenever Sukuna’s just moving around like normal.

He earlier specifically mentioned CE Output further saying CT Output doesn't mean only his CT is affected, CE Output can be separate from CT Output as it isn't strictly just for running into CT, stating attacking causes a strong rejection isn't a problem as he's expanding upon the full situation.

Nope, in this instance it does. Megumi has only demonstrated he’s able to interrupt the flow of CE into Sukuna’s CT, but he never showed the ability to interrupt Sukuna’s flow of cursed energy into his body. Sukuna stating his curses technique’s output is what gets reduced when he attacks his friends proves that’s the case.

Hence why he attacked the ground with his CT, but punched Maki in the face.

Sukuna doesn't always use his CT to attack when he can, it doesn't prove that he thinks his physical blows are more effective .

In this instance it does. Again, you’re avoiding the context here. In this instance, Sukuna wants to use his CT to attack, but he can’t because whenever he tries to, his CT’s cursed energy output gets reduced by Megumi. So, he attacks the ground instead with his CT and punches Maki in the face.

So he would avoid getting his CE output dropped. That’s the reason he attacked the ground with his CT, so his output wouldn’t be dropped which allowed him to land a punch on Maki. Meaning him physically attacking Maki like he did doesn’t impact his CE output, but him using his CT on Maki for example, would.

He demonstrably performs different against in all 3 instances they swap hands, from Maki briefly outdoing him to Sukuna casually taking on her with one arm to them doing their Saitama vs Garou rip-off clash.
Clear showing of fluctuations

That’s not clear fluctuations at all lmao. Maki briefly knocking Sukuna to the side when she has the help of Yuji isn’t a fluctuation on Sukuna’s part. If that was the case, then Maki and Yuji would be doing more damage and Sukuna wouldn’t be able to speed up his body on command line he’s able to do. Because the fluctuation would surely impact that.

They’re all swapping hands on each other with Maki and Yuji consistently showing that them working together can land blows on Sukuna while Sukuna has to avoid his output being dropped by attacking the ground with his CT and punching Maki in the face. Clearly showing only his CT is being affected by the fluctuation.

 

[PowerToScale]

So what's the argument with Maki and Yuji?

 

[StorytellingDemonKing]

Spoiler

 

[YukaSama4]

So what's the argument with Maki and Yuji?

Do they scale to 15F Sukuna or not

 

[EldemadeDityjon]

"Most" so are there any characters that will keep it?

Idk May be God tiers Sukuna and Gojo might Keep it. 15F Sukuna has 7B feat. If there is some multipliers for additional 5F they might

Also Gojo earth calculation has some tier 7 Calculation. So Possibly 2 of them keeps it.

 

[PowerToScale]

Do they scale to 15F Sukuna or not

ah I see. Personally no, although its a bit difficult to pin point exactly how much. Based on given information they've be roughly 10%, maybe a bit more.

 

[YukaSama4]

I think its been noticed but I think its interesting
Gojo used incantations for both blue and red, elevating them to 120% output, he then merged them, which should lead to a 120% purple but he went on to recite another incantation for purple, which will boost it to 120% of previous potency so it will be around 140% output.
Or maybe I'm just mistaken and it's just 120% output purple

 

[YukaSama4]

Also purple speed is insane, it was forming up above in the sky, Gojo was standing next to Sukuna and Mahoraga and non of the 3 managed to react and escape it.

 

[JnSteHar002]

Also purple speed is insane, it was forming up above in the sky, Gojo was standing next to Sukuna and Mahoraga and non of the 3 managed to react and escape it.

Spoiler

I remember a statement of Purple being around light speed

 

[SunDaGamer]

Gojo's power increasing after 2 Black Flashes kinda implies the 120% potential boost stacks, even if it is temporary after someone experiences their first Black Flash

 

[Giannysmag]

Spoiler

I remember a statement of Purple being around light speed

It's never stated but it is an arguament i've seen. Has to do with purple being an imaginary mass which has to do tacions which are faster than light and a bunch of fun quantum physics stuff

 

[Maitreya12]

Gojo's power increasing after 2 Black Flashes kinda implies the 120% potential boost stacks, even if it is temporary after someone experiences their first Black Flash

This makes Black Flash so deadly bruh.

Imagine you’re at 100%, and you hit a black flash. Now that attack you just hit was multiplied to the power of 2.5. Insane.

Now you’re at 120%, and let’s say you manage to hit a black flash again. Fantastic, now you’ve just multiplied your 120% blow to the power of 2.5. Unstoppable.

And now according to this, since the black flash boost now stacks up, you’re at damn near 150% now.

And if you somehow manage to hit another black flash then it’s just game over for your opponent my god.

 

[SunDaGamer]

It's never stated but it is an arguament i've seen. Has to do with purple being an imaginary mass which has to do tacions which are faster than light and a bunch of fun quantum physics stuff

Hollow Purple is Virtual Mass, I don't think the Void Manipulation or Imaginary Mass speculation holds up anymore

Gojo's Hollow Purple: Imaginary Mass or Virtual Mass

So I've finally shaken off the lazyness to do this. So Gojo's Hollow Purple was always thought to be able to negate durability and erase matter due to being described as an "imaginary mass" however, the tcb translator notes in chapter 205 states that Hollow Purple actually uses the same kanji...

onelastforum.com

 

[EldemadeDityjon]

This makes Black Flash so deadly bruh.

Imagine you’re at 100%, and you hit a black flash. Now that attack you just hit was multiplied to the power of 2.5. Insane.

Now you’re at 120%, and let’s say you manage to hit a black flash again. Fantastic, now you’ve just multiplied your 120% blow to the power of 2.5. Unstoppable.

And now according to this, since the black flash boost now stacks up, you’re at damn near 150% now.

And if you somehow manage to hit another black flash then it’s just game over for your opponent my god.

Come to think of it can't we use this and make some upgrades for Shibuya arc Yuji ?
Dude was spamming Black flash left and right

 

[SunDaGamer]

Something I was thinking of was proposing Yuji got x1.2 stronger after every Black Flash, he's equal to Nanami during Shibuya and fired 6 Black Flashes between the Goodwill Event and Death Painting Arcs, 1.2^6 = 2.985984. Assuming Yuji's striking strength was equal to 120% Nanami, that'd make Vs Mahito Arc Yuji equal to 40.2% Nanami.
There is grounds for this like Gojo noting Yuji got far stronger towards to end of the Hanami fight post-5 Black Flashes and Choso describing post-Shibuya Yuji as a Demon God after he fired 3 Black Flashes against Mahito then he goes onto fight Higuruma, who's on the level of a Grade 1 Sorcerer, without using Cursed Energy which indicates Culling Game Yuji is past Nanami's level so him being equal to 207.4% Nanami isn't really far fetched.

 

[YukaSama4]

We need a narrator for the next jjk seasons

 

[JnSteHar002]

We need a narrator for the next jjk seasons

Yes, we do

 

[YukaSama4]

Also btw, Gojo, Nanami and Yuji now share the highest record for blackflash