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Ichiban Ushiro no Daimaou CRT

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Dark... if we use devils advocate and say your argument sounds valid, the reasoning for tier 0 is pretty bad as even IF shes infinite transcendence above akuto that doesnt grant her tier 0 as tier 0 is above high 1-A the same manner high 1-A transcends 1-A. Then again I'm using devils advocate as I dont see and texts that suggests shes even that impressive above akuto
 
@Dark

Upgrade Afterlife Akuto to High 1-A then, also while you're at it, mind giving me the statement that says it trascends the hierarchy ?
 
@dark can you post some scans? The thread is literally without justification and even if we use the justifications on the profile TLOI doesn't qualify for T0
 
@Overlord775

Above, there are quotes that the Creator views its world as fiction and the creatures of this world are equal concepts before ther Creator. And this is what the Gods are for Akuto and Akuto himself for TLOI.

@Ionliosite

I don't know what kind of debunk there was, but perhaps confusion is associated with the fact that there are 2 types of Akuto in the Afterlife.

The first ones are his version from the stories where he fought with the gods, who were similar to himself.

This was similar to further universes being born within him. The props used naturally extended beyond him.

In other words, even the extra-universal Gods became possibilities in the story.

As a result, all stories fell into chaos.

Akuto fought with those extra-universal Gods a few times.

Sometimes he won.

A story was created in which Akuto attended an academy in an unnamed alternate world. He was dominated by Fujiko and he struggled to help her take over the world. It ended with Fujiko's world domination never coming to fruition and the two of them never even kissing. He finished testing that possibility.

Sometimes the extra-universal Gods won.

And the second Akuto is the one that is in the world of TLOI. He is the creator of all this. Even the gods are for him exactly the same fiction as everything else.

"No, you wouldn't have." Akuto smiled too. "But we stand on the same stage. We're probably the only ones who haven't become a concept."

"A concept?"

"You can't understand someone's personality just by looking at them, but now I can truly experience them. Even if other people's reactions are mechanical in nature, we have no way of determining it. What resides within me right now may be the countless personalities of all existing people."

"If a different object with the same name is placed in a box that only the individual can open, can conversation still be achieved?" asked Hiroshi. "If a foreign language dictionary has a sample greeting section and you communicate using that, can you still call it a conversation?"

Akuto looked amused.

"Yes. It definitely isn't like you to respond like that."

"While here, I am a synthesis of the concept of Brave," explained Hiroshi with a grin.

"I see. So a concept is a concept."

"I do understand what you're saying, though. The only ones given an incarnation in the Law of Identity's world are you and me. Wouldn't incarnation be the best term for being equal concepts before the creator? So in your world, the people inside are equally given an incarnation."

"I may be the creator here, but I don't feel like a God. What I can feel is that stories are binding us. Even when I create worlds, I am only free in which story I choose and to what degree I take that story. In the end, I want to destroy that and escape this world."

And just like any other characters (like Juunko and Marine) they can be summoned to him by wish.

Akuto thought on Bouichirou's words for a while and then suddenly spoke.

"I'll summon the extra-universal Gods."

Even Bouichirou looked surprised at that.

"Can you do that?"

"They should have been made a part of the story, too. I'm not sure how much we can understand each other since we don't share a story, but it should still be possible."

As soon as he said it, a black figure appeared in the chair. Everyone there could tell it were there.

"I feel like I only came to understand myself once I saw the outside," agreed Akuto. "But when you get down to it, even the extra-universal Gods are fictional. They merely cannot distinguish between God, mankind, and ghost. Only once you inform the higher being and create an enclosure within a single universe can you make a clear distinction between the three. That allows you to understand who it is you are inside."

Akuto thought about Bouichirou's analysis.

"Okay. That means I need to think about how to respond to that higher being," said Akuto. "I don't just want to save the beings inside me. I want to save all the beings inside the Law of Identity's universe. I want to free them from the stories. That is my wish."

High 1-A is this second Akuto. The TLOI world incarnation Akuto. Not the one who fought with the gods in stories. I hope someone appears here who knows at least something about this verse to comment.

And now I'm retiring, good luck.
 
The qoutes you are using as the justification for High 1-A are the ones that are already being used for 1-A. So, there really isn't anything implying TLOI is above the High 1-As in the same way she's above the 1-As.
 
Didn't you say that the extra-universal Gods/Archetypes are 1-A? I just add TLOI World Akuto above their hierarchy. And abowe those Akutos who who fought with them.
 
In any case, if we have no problems with 1-A Extra-Universal gods, then I have nothing more to say. If there is a problem with them, then let someone else solve it. Maybe DontTalkDT will help here.

Anyway, I wash hands. Good luck again.
 
Those who say the void body is high 1-A are those who speak in the opinion of others, such people hardly read verse. Void body is just the first state for organisms to evolve into the next cycle of the universe. It was mentioned by Yamato from vol 3.


an easy-to-understand cosmology that people take so much time, complicated cosmologies like Umineko, Mondaiji, ES, CM, SH, don't know how long to discuss.
 
So is there any actual argument as to why The Law of Idendity is considered to transcend the Anti-Universe "by infinite levels of transcendence"?
 
Ionliosite said:
So is there any actual argument as to why The Law of Idendity is considered to transcend the Anti-Universe "by infinite levels of transcendence"?
Click to expand...
To be tier 0 is much greater than that.
 
Well, yeah, but even then, I haven't been showed absolutely any evidence she has such transcendence over the Anti-Universe.
 
Do we even have enough approval? Dark doesn't support it but didn't show TLOI transcending the Anti-Universe by infinite levels either, Matt only came here to mock a few people and the left which shows he isn't taking this seriously, and DT hasn't answered.
 
You should preferably ask Matthew and DontTalkDT to comment here again first. You can tell them that I would appreciate their help.
 
None of them want to support her tier, no proofs no explanation page, no scans, she should get downgraded from her tier.
 
DontTalkDT has not replied, and Matthew is busy with another thread. I would prefer to wait a bit longer.
 
No, DT hasn't said a single word. I'll contact him again, but at this point it seems unlikely he'll answer.
 
DT answered on his wall, and this is what he has to say:

"Like my profile says I'm not really available right now. Haven't been for the past month really.

I'm neither very familiar with the exact border of the tiering system nor with TLOI current reasoning, so I have no strong opinion one way or another right now. Just do what is otherwise agreed to be best for now."

... So, now what?
 
My opinion, proceed as intended and if they want to change something later, well, they can make a CRT to change her tier or do other stuff.
 
I suppose that we should proceed then, yes. If Matthew and DontTalkDT object, they can create a CRT later.
 
Would you be willing to handle it Ionliosite?
 
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