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Helltaker Discussion Thread

Would this warrant something?
steamdescrip.png

It's from the official steam page. It seems implied that the Demons and The Helltaker survive despite hellfire constantly filling their lungs. I assume they mean smoke, but it could also just straight up be fire. To be able to survive with smoke and crap filling your lungs, I imagine you need some kind of resistance or ability.
 
It said that in the official website aswell. If we take this literally, everybody would get some type heat resistance. BUT this might've been used as figure of speech, for example "this person has his heart on fire" when talking their determination or strong emotions.
 
It could be, I believed it to be true since they're in hell and it's usually believed within religion to have hell fire and stuff. Figured it'd be hard to breath down in those conditions. I thought when they said that, they were just saying his lungs burned from inhaling the smoke of hellfire as opposed to literally having fire in his lungs. And I'm unsure if being able to breathe with smoke in lungs would warrant heat resistance. But more like limited self sustenance?
 
MrKerf said:
Yeah, found it afterwards. Updated my blog here. Just for a bit.
Using the steam description is the same as using manga cover image. Not reliable imo.
Click to expand...
But the game description is merely telling you what the game is about and gives you a basic synopsis about what it is about.

It's like using the description of a story on the back of a book. It's a reliable short synopsis of what the game is about. In this case, the synopsis is even by the author of the game. It seems unlikely that he'd describe his own game inaccurately.

Also some nice catches in your blog.
 
Oh, and for what it's worth, The Helltaker should have precognition. Whether it should be called "Analytical Prediction" on the profile or not I'll leave up to you guys, though from the looks of it, flat out precognition works.

We see during the Judgement fight that The Helltaker can see where the chains will appear in advance and move out of the way of the attack beforehand:


I haven't looked back into the Subject 67 boss fight, but I imagine he has something similar. Though can't confirm.

Edit: Yep, called it. Subject 67 can see small streaks of where the laser will appear beforehand, and move out of the way to avoid it.
 
Good job on calc. I suppose game description is debatable enough to be either possibly or CRTed for vote on the subject.

Hmm. Precognition is a bit iffy in my opinion. We were never explained how both chains and lasers behave. For lasers, it can be a... homing system of some kind for example. Or game mechanic. I don't think there are enough info for us on it.
 
MrKerf said:
Hmm. Precognition is a bit iffy in my opinion. We were never explained how both chains and lasers behave. For lasers, it can be a... homing system of some kind for example. Or game mechanic. I don't think there are enough info for us on it.
Click to expand...
They can't be homing because they also appear wherever the character isn't standing. If it were homing, they'd only appear where he was standing. They're only there to show the player where the attack will be a little bit later. Which from the perspective of The Helltaker would be precognition. Albeit basic precognition. It being game mechanics doesn't completely mean its inclusion can be ignored. I mean, look at Sonic's profile, for example, he's got a lot of hax for game power-ups and mechanics that have never shown up once in an actual cutscene of the sort. With Helltaker being a short game with few cutscenes at all. I think we'd have to at least acknowledge it as a "likely" ability.
 
Well, an actual CRT for that would be better I suppose. Sonic, for example, has his own pile of game mechanics.

Possibly/likely... Eh, sure.

Actually, now that I think about it, even with... What's that thing called? Aim dodging? Maybe Subject 667 can have some higher reaction speed/speed, if these lasers are actually lasers.
 
MrKerf said:
Well, an actual CRT for that would be better I suppose. Sonic, for example, has his own pile of game mechanics.

Possibly/likely... Eh, sure.
Click to expand...
Oh yea, it'd have to be in a CRT. One can't add powers without a general consensus from the community. A likely seems fair.

MrKerf said:
Actually, now that I think about it, even with... What's that thing called? Aim dodging? Maybe Subject 667 can have some higher reaction speed/speed, if these lasers are actually lasers.
Click to expand...
If it were aim-dodging the feat wouldn't be impressive anymore since that would mean the character moved before the weapon even fired since you know it would fire in a tiny bit of time. Like if you stood in front of a minigun, and saw it starting to spin and warm up for a few seconds, you'd move out of the way to avoid being shot. He'd have to dodge the laser after it was fired for it to be impressive. Which given it travels in one frame likely isn't possible.

Another problem would be getting it accepted as a real laser. The only evidence we have of it is that it comes from a source of technology. But that's it. Not enough sadly. Maybe if it reflected off a mirror we could possibly make an argument.
 
LaserPrecision said:
Oh yea, it'd have to be in a CRT. One can't add powers without a general consensus from the community.
Click to expand...
I think uncontroversial ones were fine to apply, at least some time ago. It's been a while though.

For laser, if there are statements of it being the laser, either in game or by developer, it would probably be half of the work.
KatanaZero is a reference I'm using. Very similar showings of lasers.
 
MrKerf said:
For laser, if there are statements of it being the laser, either in game or by developer, it would probably be half of the work.
KatanaZero is a reference I'm using. Very similar showings of lasers.
Click to expand...
We'd of course then need to prove said lasers are lightspeed. It's pretty common in fiction for lasers to be slower than light. But for what it's worth, it seems like Subject 67 avoids mortar fire (That is likely faster than IRL mortars' given the amount of distance it covers in a few frames). Technically you get a warning marker on the ground, but you only get the warning marker after it's been fired. So we'd just need to calculate the time it'd take to hit the ground from where it was and how far Subject 67 moved in that time.
 
I've heavily improved Judgement's sandbox. How's it look? All I've got to do is add some links to some of the justifications and add references to statements that aren't directly from the game. Such as the smoke manipulation resistance which is sourced from the steam page. The art books don't really need reference links since they can also be found in the game and they can be very easily found without any digging (Merely googling the character will give you several results from the artbook). It's also a rather short simple artbook so there wouldn't be much to link to.
 
Was going to ask for a while, is there an indication that Beelzebub spreads diseases, and not just the effect of the Abyss?
 
MrKerf said:
Was going to ask for a while, is there an indication that Beelzebub spreads diseases, and not just the effect of the Abyss?
Click to expand...
I considered that, but it never added up. In the void, almost nothing exists, not the concept of sight, nor the concept of death, so I'm unsure why the void would afflict Helltaker with that ailment. To top it off, he's only inflicted with every disease after he touched Beelzebub. It just seems hinted at that Beelzebub caused it given the context of the scene.
 
Made a mockup of Azazel's profile. Revised a fair amount. I didn't feel the real profile separated Loremaster from Azazel good enough, so I made them their own Keys. Sure, the same character, but it's after a time skip, and she's quite literally changed what species she is. While I don't think she gained her genius intellect as Loremaster thus why I kept in the Azazel Key, I think the prep came in after Loremaster as that's when she started getting resources from hell and began experimenting to create weapons and living beings and whatnot. I initially considered giving Azazel mostly unknown statistics since she doesn't really do much in the game, but I find it hard to believe she's beneath The Helltaker or anything like that. But I wouldn't scale her to Loremaster which is her after becoming a demon and receiving a cybernetic upgrade.
 
Veloxt1r0kore said:
When the CRT comes out?
Click to expand...
I'll see if I can get it out by like tomorrow. Want to get all my calculations and stuff accepted first. That way I don't have to worry about waiting for CGM evaluation during the thread. It could come out today if they respond fast enough. I plan to upgrade pretty much every character in the verse to at least Small Building level while the stronger characters get to be Building level. So it's a pretty big change in addition to all the formatting and whatnot.
 
Sure took a while, but I've started to apply the CRT to the profiles. Every profile except for Azazel has been updated (As she needs a large rework compared to the rest). So if you want to make match-ups for the verse, now's the time to do so. In the meantime, I'm gonna work on refining the profiles I need to add to the verse and reworking Azazel's profile. Which means The Helltaker, Lucifer, Beelzebub, and Cerberus are fine to use as I've already applied their edits.
 
On a minor note, should the loss on The Helltaker's profile be requested to be deleted given he received a fairly large upgrade, not only jumping a tier, but higher lifting strength, and more abilities and resistances?
 
Sure took a while, but I've added Judgement's page. The one I was personally most excited for (Judgement is best girl, though Justice is up there too. I'll die on that hill). I'm sure they'll be fun to use in match-ups. Next is Subject 67 and Loremaster's mech (As they need their profiles to be made first for Azazel's to make sense once I basically completely change their profile)
 
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