Hax Layer Evaluation Thread

[BrackishBrineBroth]

Btw, I know I was told to shut up, but IIRC Archie Sonic has like 100 layers for its top people, so the Sonic people should probably explain that.

Mainly @ShakeResounding, @omegabronic and @Maverick_Zero_X

Normal users can't ping people.

 

[Brogeefrong]

Btw, I know I was told to shut up, but IIRC Archie Sonic has like 100 layers for its top people, so the Sonic people should probably explain that.

Mainly @ShakeResounding, @omegabronic and @Maverick_Zero_X

for this stuff its mainly for chaos energy bs

 

[Expectro2000xxx]

Just recently saw this so gonna answer to @Everything12

So it looks like their is some relevant stuff, so their does seem to exist some layers, but some of it does look invalid, and some of it doesn't give explanation.

From what I understand your only problems/doubts are the green text stuff you wrote right? If that's the case gonna answer:

Does this include feats of things that would resist?

About evolution magic, yes, for example by using it someone can upgrade their resistance to a hax that would affect them, after all the point of evolution magic is to upgrade abilities to a higher tier.

Relevance?

To point that even while severely weakened Laus spirit magic overcome apostleified spirit magic.

Adding Conceptual doesnt change anything

By itself no, but in this case this conceptual enhancement (which specifically strengthened his soul) is something that upgrade a character in general, like an hax that would previously kill someone now don't do much after get said stuff, the point of the linked scan was to show that.

 

[Brogeefrong]

Copy pasted what i got told for layered hax

• A single Power Ring can block out & negate the Iron Queen's Technology/Corruption/Mind hax
• However When the Iron Queen boosted her capabilities with 2 Power Rings, she could control Monkey Khan despite him wearing his Power Ring crown which should grant him protection, meaning that the potency of 2 Power Rings > Resistance granted by 1
• The exact amount of Power Rings needed to nearly overcome a Pre-Harmony Chaos Emerald is unknown but enough to cover the Death Egg
• Enerjak was brough forth by 11 Chaos Emeralds, then Master Mogul absorbs the energy of Enerjak + his own Chaos Emerald, gets Master Mogul to 12 Chaos Emerald then eventually 14 when he integrates a further 2 into himself, commenting how the limitless power of 14 Emerald would dwarf that of 12
• This is further boosted to an unfathomable level with the commencement of the Great Harmony where every Chaos Emerald in the universe was gathered, sealed into the Zone of Silence and eventually reshaped into an even greater set of seven by Feist, of which there were at bare minimum hundreds of thousands of them in the galaxy alone.

 

[omegabronic]

well, i guess Time Power from Dragon Ball Heroes could be looked into, currently the page uses these scans to claim that Less time power/time energy = more layers for the Time Power, with the wording for both being as follows:

1st scan = Time Power's power & abilities' potency is parallel with the amount of Time Energy users have in them, the bigger the Time Power's energy is, the stronger Time Power's abilities and resistances become.

2nd scan = Time Power can nullify the powers & abilities of comparable or weaker Time Power

 

[TheGodOfICE777]

It’s layered for sure, but we’ve been figuring out how many layers. I don’t know what the point of that was since we don’t have an established number of layers yet. Though if I need to explain anything you can ask.

 

[deonment]

Ergenverse has it so that every higher level of cultivation (of which there are 9 levels per realm on average), grants greater potency and resistance than those below, completely negating the latter.

• More powerful cultivators can completely negate lesser cultivators control of their own spiritual energy[184].
• Those with higher cultivation cannot be sensed by those with lower cultivation[181].
• The difference in cultivation realms increases with progress, as shown by how the difference between Nascent Soul and Deva Realm cultivators is larger than the difference between Core Formation and Nascent Soul cultivators[263].
• When one breaks through in their cultivation realm, they grow not only in power but in Life level as well[264], an all-around growth in quality.
• A higher cultivation can completely negate the powers of a lower cultivation level, even if the difference is as low as being partially in the higher realm[265].
• Enhancing one's Nascent Soul, equivalent to growth in that specific realm, gives it resistance against the natural qi of heaven and earth's damaging nature and can be done multiple times over[152].
• Upon entering Gold Core, Bai is utterly unaffected by magic spells and formations that come near him, causing them to completely collapse upon contact[92].
• Cultivators with a higher Cultivation Base, even within the same sub-realm are capable of completely negating the abilities of lower cultivators just by bringing it to bear[16]. In this specific instance, Bai was at the 7th level of Qi Condensation and his opponent, the 9th level. Despite being physically superior to the latter due to external factors, his powers were nullified.
• The Ji Realm is invincible in whatever cultivation realm the user is in[44], allowing one to be the number one cultivator below the next realm[45], where it is useless.

As can also be seen with Divine Sense, which is a manifestation of one's cultivation and soul;

• Divine Sense can overcome abilities and techniques that previously resisted a lower cultivation variant of itself[171].
• Divine Sense is capable of discerning the exact cultivation level and power of those it scans[172].
• Divine Sense can be used to nullify the abilities of lesser cultivators completely[173]. Additionally, one can use Divine Sense to erase lesser levels of Divine Sense and nullify any effect they may have had on an object or person[174].
• One's cultivation casts a great pressure on lower-level cultivators, such that even continuously looking at the latter would cause them to be destroyed in body and soul[175].

inb4 you get more attention on this than you do the GoW post

 

[Robo432343]

bruh what about touhou project

 

[omegabronic]

It’s layered for sure, but we’ve been figuring out how many layers. I don’t know what the point of that was since we don’t have an established number of layers yet. Though if I need to explain anything you can ask.

the standards are stricter now, so the current justifications for it should be looken into to see if the stricter standards make it still layered based on the logic presented there, specifically the "more Time Power/Time Energy = More Layers" part

 

[TheGodOfICE777]

the standards are stricter now, so the current justifications for it should be looken into to see if the stricter standards make it still layered based on the logic presented there, specifically the "more Time Power/Time Energy = More Layers" part

Yes, it’s established and stated that weaker time power doesn’t work on higher time power, as stated and shown by the interaction with Aeos and Chronoa in those scans. Also, there’s showings of weaker time power not working on stronger time power. I guess a similar example would be like how Haki works. Since there’s a mixture of statements + showings.

 

[Robo432343]

Nurarihyon-No-Mago Layering Explanation

The fundamental battle which Yokai have against each other is the battle of "overpowering/seizing the other Yokai's fear" as without their opponent "fearing" them their abilities become completely ineffective and their innate resistances are easily bypass. So the action of gaining "layers" is...

vsbattles.fandom.com

this hax layer blog needs evaluation

 

[Mad_Dog_of_Fujiwara]

holy shit this is too much for me to handle at once, i'll do these one at a time when i get the opportunity

 

[KingNanaya]

holy shit this is too much for me to handle at once, i'll do these one at a time when i get the opportunity

take your time

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

holy shit this is too much for me to handle at once, i'll do these one at a time when i get the opportunity

what did you expect by making this a general revision

 

[Shmooply]

-Lobotomy Corporation/Project Moon

Might explain later if I'm feeling silly :3

 

[Mad_Dog_of_Fujiwara]

what did you expect by making this a general revision

To be completely honest, I was expecting the same amount of activity as the type 5 acausality thread. Which, in hindsight, was pretty goddamn stupid of me.

 

[Robo432343]

The Spirit of Eternity Sword-Hax Scaling and Penetrate

vsbattles.fandom.com

this hax layer blog needs evaluation NOW

 

[Planck69]

To be completely honest, I was expecting the same amount of activity as the type 5 acausality thread. Which, in hindsight, was pretty goddamn stupid of me.

A lot more people care about hax layers than a power that 90% of the time belongs to a handful of god tiers in all honesty.

 

[Celestial_Pegasus]

The Spirit of Eternity Sword-Hax Scaling and Penetrate

vsbattles.fandom.com

this hax layer blog needs evaluation NOW

Would think nobody would pay attention to my obscure VN verse, seriously only proposed for like a layer or 2 there.

Reminds I still need to work on this verse, but will have to wait a while.

 

[LordGinSama]

Times like this that I'm grateful that I'm not big on verses that rely on layers.

I'm also a lazy bastard.

 

[Eseseso]

Times like this that I'm grateful that I'm not big on verses that rely on layers.

Same.

I'm also a lazy bastard.

Same.

 

[Deidalius]

Shouldn't multiple people be in charge of revising how many layers the hax of verses have? I feel like it's a job for more than one person.

 

[LordGinSama]

Shouldn't multiple people be in charge of revising how many layers the hax of verses have? I feel like it's a job for more than one person.

Fujiwara isn't handling all of them herself. I wouldn't expect any user to handle that single handedly, hence the thread.

 

[Deidalius]

Fujiwara isn't handling all of them herself. I wouldn't expect any user to handle that single handedly, hence the thread.

The others must be asleep, I haven't seen them or I haven't noticed them.

 

[LordGinSama]

The others must be asleep, I haven't seen them or I haven't noticed them.

There's been plenty of people posting justification for their verses, along with several users including staff trying to evaluate each of them, not just Fujiwara.

 

[Robo432343]

Oryx, the Taken King

Oryx, born Aurash and formerly known as Auryx (meaning "Long Thought"), is the God-King of the Hive and Taken. Being born as a mere Krill princess, she along with her sisters narrowly escaped a conspiracy set up by their mentor that resulted in the death of their father and subsumation of the...

vsbattles.fandom.com

this guys countless layered stuff needs to be evaluated

 

[AbaddonTheDisappointment]

Oryx, the Taken King

Oryx, born Aurash and formerly known as Auryx (meaning "Long Thought"), is the God-King of the Hive and Taken. Being born as a mere Krill princess, she along with her sisters narrowly escaped a conspiracy set up by their mentor that resulted in the death of their father and subsumation of the...

vsbattles.fandom.com

this guys countless layered stuff needs to be evaluated

IIRC Destiny layers is based on Hive essentially farming the sword logic killing each other to make their abilities stronger than they were before. I don't have any sources so I'll just call our resident Destiny expert:

@WHYNAUT

 

[Planck69]

The Spirit of Eternity Sword-Hax Scaling and Penetrate

vsbattles.fandom.com

this hax layer blog needs evaluation NOW

It looks good to use.

 

[CloverDragon03]

Just coming in here to provide a friendly reminder that ultimately, the decision of whether or not the hax layers for these verses stays is a decision that falls to our evaluating staff

 

[Remus1998]

Copy pasted what i got told for layered hax

• A single Power Ring can block out & negate the Iron Queen's Technology/Corruption/Mind hax
• However When the Iron Queen boosted her capabilities with 2 Power Rings, she could control Monkey Khan despite him wearing his Power Ring crown which should grant him protection, meaning that the potency of 2 Power Rings > Resistance granted by 1
• The exact amount of Power Rings needed to nearly overcome a Pre-Harmony Chaos Emerald is unknown but enough to cover the Death Egg
• Enerjak was brough forth by 11 Chaos Emeralds, then Master Mogul absorbs the energy of Enerjak + his own Chaos Emerald, gets Master Mogul to 12 Chaos Emerald then eventually 14 when he integrates a further 2 into himself, commenting how the limitless power of 14 Emerald would dwarf that of 12
• This is further boosted to an unfathomable level with the commencement of the Great Harmony where every Chaos Emerald in the universe was gathered, sealed into the Zone of Silence and eventually reshaped into an even greater set of seven by Feist, of which there were at bare minimum hundreds of thousands of them in the galaxy alone.

The standards are stricter now so I don't know about the last 3 points but the first 2 should qualify, it's even stated that Monkey Khan Ring Crown grants protection from mind control, which is then pierced by the Iron Queen abilities

 

[CloverDragon03]

Also I know Xenoblade's layered Intangibility was brought up before. Admittedly I'm not the most knowledgeable on that, so I can't really say much on that matter

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

Good thing I'm better than you fodder staff.

I can solo any modern-day staff member with this pfp

Solo this comment deletion, punk

 

[Eseseso]

Copy pasted what i got told for layered hax

• A single Power Ring can block out & negate the Iron Queen's Technology/Corruption/Mind hax
• However When the Iron Queen boosted her capabilities with 2 Power Rings, she could control Monkey Khan despite him wearing his Power Ring crown which should grant him protection, meaning that the potency of 2 Power Rings > Resistance granted by 1
• The exact amount of Power Rings needed to nearly overcome a Pre-Harmony Chaos Emerald is unknown but enough to cover the Death Egg
• Enerjak was brough forth by 11 Chaos Emeralds, then Master Mogul absorbs the energy of Enerjak + his own Chaos Emerald, gets Master Mogul to 12 Chaos Emerald then eventually 14 when he integrates a further 2 into himself, commenting how the limitless power of 14 Emerald would dwarf that of 12
• This is further boosted to an unfathomable level with the commencement of the Great Harmony where every Chaos Emerald in the universe was gathered, sealed into the Zone of Silence and eventually reshaped into an even greater set of seven by Feist, of which there were at bare minimum hundreds of thousands of them in the galaxy alone.

This all seems to make sense.
Jesus, Archie Sonic has a lot of layers.

 

[Rikimarox2]

******* Sheikh Aizen. That pic is top tier.

Anyways, I assume if there are stages to power in a series, and we are shown instances of characters bypassing or resisting abilities of lower characters time and time again, and it is mentioned it is because of their higher stage, would that be enough to assume layers with the current layers standards?

 

[Remus1998]

it's even stated that Monkey Khan Ring Crown grants protection from mind control, which is then pierced by the Iron Queen abilities

Here it is

 

[LordGinSama]

Solo this comment deletion, punk

I came back from Fandom deletion, your red name powers have no effect on me fool.

Slayer of green names LordGinSama.


But on a more serious note, obviously we won't be able to evaluate all verses that utilize layers so this should be mainly targeting primary verses and pages with the most views. With how many pages we have of characters, evaluating all of them is essentially impossible so I feel like simply adding a rule about how layers work is the easiest solution. From there supporters can evaluate them from that point.

 

[KLOL506]

I personally think this thread shouldn't have lumped in multiple verses at once here, should've just gone verse-by-verse. Hax layers aren't as niche as something like say, Acausality Type 5.

 

[Huesito88]

I personally think this thread shouldn't have lumped in multiple verses at once here, should've just gone verse-by-verse. Hax layers aren't as niche as something like say, Acausality Type 5.

/\This

 

[Bobsican]

@Bobsican Not really, this seems to be more of a mechanic of the card system than any layers, especially when both characters can be affected by any numbered cards to begin with so no established resistance is there.

As brought up in the original thread, characters can resist this whole stuff even with the highest possible number regardless of cards, with the game even mentioning that, and the characters can be affected with the same sort of abilities in later games, thus upscaling further in layers (in retrospective it'd be 28 hax layers and just 27 resistance layers).

 

[WHYNAUT]

IIRC Destiny layers is based on Hive essentially farming the sword logic killing each other to make their abilities stronger than they were before. I don't have any sources so I'll just call our resident Destiny expert:

@WHYNAUT

Why do you do this to me?

It's actually paracausal power in general. Sword Logic is just the easiest example.

I'll get back to this at some later point.
How 'official' is this thread actually? I don't want to write a large post, justifying layers for nothing. No offense to Fujiwara.