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So yeah, we can use that then. And maybe use Prime's as a supporting feat.
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Green lantern (hal Jordan) CRT.
- Thread starter Teezar
- Start date
- Status
Oliver_de_jesus
He/Him- 24,724
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Hal attacked prime by surprise and Prime dominates him quickly, Post-crisis and Golden Superman saved Hal from being nearly killed, I don't think that qualifies as hal=<prime but rather Hal <<<<< prime
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Yeah but he still made him hurt in the second panel. Look at the construct in that panel. And HAL still survived a punch from him. And angry one at that too.
Unless he can reduce his power levels at will, similarly to Captain Atom, it wouldn't make sense for a 4-B character to survive a hit like that.
Which is why I believe he should get a downgrade or we use this as a supporting feat and use the Allen one instead
Unless he can reduce his power levels at will, similarly to Captain Atom, it wouldn't make sense for a 4-B character to survive a hit like that.
Which is why I believe he should get a downgrade or we use this as a supporting feat and use the Allen one instead
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Also iirc, in Ion #4 and #5, Hal was able to fight a guy who could fight with Ion Kyle Rayner.
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What key and what feats are you guys talking about for 2-C right now? We need to get organized and work on one at a time.
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"Varied up to 4B normally, 2C at peak". Right now we are using his feat from Blackest Night against Black Lantern Spectre. And discussing whether to use the Superboy Prime feat from Sinestro Corps War or not.
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Superboy-Prime in Sinestro Corps War only scales with Ion bonded with Sodam Yat, way above the Guardians and the Anti-Monitor.
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And the wiki treats that arc Prime and Ion as 2C so...
Which is why I said we need to downgrade both in that case. Or change the justification for Ion. I remember bringing up this issue twice on the old forum but it never got applied.
Which is why I said we need to downgrade both in that case. Or change the justification for Ion. I remember bringing up this issue twice on the old forum but it never got applied.
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What's the scaling chain being proposed?
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It’s not really a scaling chain, because nobody would scale to Hal’s 2-C key. But basically the feats in favor of it would be:
- Hal defeating Krona
- Taking a punch from Superboy-Prime and then harming him
- Fighting and harming Black Lantern Spectre (Crispus Allen).
And there’s possibly more feats.
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As described on Hal's profile, Krona's durability didn't scale to the entities.
We shouldn't scale Hal to Superboy from 1 punch when lower tier characters were drawing blood from Superboy earlier in the event.
We shouldn't scale Hal to Superboy from 1 punch when lower tier characters were drawing blood from Superboy earlier in the event.
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Wait why tho
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Also I just remembered something kinda important. The GLs didn’t get retconned from COIE lol. In Green Lantern Corps #215, Hal directly references the Crisis, and in another issue they reference Hal’s resignation from the Corps, which was a Pre-Crisis event.
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The entities were not bonded inside his body like how Ion or Parallax did with Hal and Kyle.
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- Thread starter
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I thought ion was?
Can't we use the hal vs parallax sinestro for the post flashpoint key?
And can I bring hal jordan vs parallax barry Allen?
It's been long I read the spectre own maybe confluctor can bring that one.
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If you read the comic, you will see that the entities are on chain leashes.
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Yeah that's our main feat for 2C HAL ATM. Looking for others tho.
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Firestorm makes sense to me. Thank you for helping out.
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Honestly, I agree with not using the War of the Lanterns story. From what I vaguely remember, a lot of feats were dubious.
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Even setting the Krona stuff aside, we do still have Hal squaring up with Black Lantern Crispus Allen, who (without a Black Lantern ring) scales to the emotional entities individually. And him harming and taking a blow from Superboy-Prime, who also scales to one of the emotional entities, as supporting evidence.
Plus Green Lanterns not being completely retconned by COIE and still referencing events that happened Pre-Crisis.
Plus Green Lanterns not being completely retconned by COIE and still referencing events that happened Pre-Crisis.
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Definitely agree with this
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Rereading the comic the Black Lantern Spectre fights, he doesn't scale to the regular lanterns.
- Green Lantern Vol 4 #50, March 2010
- Hal escapes (Crispus Allen) Black Lantern Spectre's grasp and knocks out Black Lantern Spectre’s jaw to no effect. Several lanterns attack him to no real effect either.
- It is stated that the Spectre's power eclipses everyone and the Guardians.
- The Spectre is scared of Parallax, and the Lanterns needed the entity to fight back.
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Thank you for helping out Firestorm. This seems reliable to me.
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It clearly did have an effect, he knocked his entire jaw off. A more accurate description would be that it didn’t hurt Spectre, which would only be stamina/endurance/pain tolerance in this situation (because duh, he’s a zombie) since Hal is very clearly overcoming his durability.
It doesn’t say it eclipses everyone, it just says that it eclipses the Guardians (and Hal scales above them). Also characters can still scale to things stronger than them.
Once again, your wording here isn’t entirely reflective of what the scan actually says. Hal doesn’t say they need Parallax just to fight Spectre, they need Parallax to defeat him.
There’s nothing that really prevents Hal from scaling here.
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- Thread starter
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Let's not forget this also.
And I agree with lordtracer
And I agree with lordtracer
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After rereading the next issue, there is more context on the Black Lantern Spectre situation.
- Green Lantern Vol 4 #51, April 2010
- According to Parallax Hal, the Black Lantern ring is hiding the true Spectre.
- The True Spectre lies beneath the undead construct made by the ring.
- The Spectre is imprisoned by the mutated and maligned carcass of Crispus Allen.
- Crispus Allen is the cause of all the trouble. His body was taken by the Black Ring, so The Spectre had no mortal conduit for his power.
- Just as the True Spectre is underneath the corpse, so is the Black Ring the true source of his imprisonment.
- When the connection to the black ring is severed, the True Spectre comes back to use Crispus Allen’s body.
- The Black Spectre everyone was fighting before was not using any power from the Spectre.
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- Thread starter
- #152
This actually shows the black lantern spectre could feel pain when hal stroke it, plus.
Hal jordan easily scales to parallax hal based on their previous encounters (but not zero hour parallax)
• Green lantern #160 (1990).
° hal Jordan is able to go toe to toe
With parallax hal jordan.
° This same parallax hal jordan is stated to have almost infinite
Power.
Despite this it was also believed the black lantern spectre was actually spectre himself by the guardians, and it was still stated that that form nearly eclipse's their own power while believing it was the spectre .So it's safe to say the form is almost comparable to the spectre which hal jordan damaged on several occasions.
•plus parallax was easily damaging the spectre, which we all believe hal jordan scales too.
shit didn't work.
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Thank you for helping out. You make good sense as usual.
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Okay, I just read the issue and this is not stated anywhere, so I’m gonna need to see some evidence to support that.
Also in that same issue, BL Spectre was able to withstand attacks from Parallax, so still 2-C durability.
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As I said before, it's stated by Parallax Hall that the Black Lantern they are fighting is a masquerade. It's a shell, a facade, hiding the True Spectre. The Spectre is imprisoned by the mutated and maligned carcass of Crispus Allen. Just as the True Spectre is underneath the corpse, so is the Black Ring the true source of his imprisonment.
I don't follow your proposed scaling chain. Black Lantern Crispus Allen's body was damaged by both the regular lanterns and Parallax Hal. Being damaged by Parallax Hal doesn't mean the Black Lantern Body Construct is 2-C.
I don't follow your proposed scaling chain. Black Lantern Crispus Allen's body was damaged by both the regular lanterns and Parallax Hal. Being damaged by Parallax Hal doesn't mean the Black Lantern Body Construct is 2-C.
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Unless I missed something, there’s no indication that BL Spectre is taking damage from Parallax’s attack in the scan I gave. There’s also here, where BL Spectre doesn’t take any damage from being hit by Parallax’s construct.
Also the statement where they say Spectre’s power - “You know first hand the power The Spectre contains” - eclipses the Guardians as well as Hal’s statement - “Because we need the one thing that might be able to beat The Spectre” - meaning Parallax, would imply that the Black Lantern Spectre is on a similar level of power to the original. If it was drastically weaker, both of these statements wouldn’t make any sense.
Also the statement where they say Spectre’s power - “You know first hand the power The Spectre contains” - eclipses the Guardians as well as Hal’s statement - “Because we need the one thing that might be able to beat The Spectre” - meaning Parallax, would imply that the Black Lantern Spectre is on a similar level of power to the original. If it was drastically weaker, both of these statements wouldn’t make any sense.
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I don't really seems to remember this, if you can remind me with scans cause I only remember hal jordan and parallax to have cause major damage to the black lantern spectre.
Plus almost all green lantern stories hal jordan scales to all parallax host even himself as parallax and hal jordan has damaged and killed krona who tanked a universal or multiversal big bang in pre-crisis and we know krona isn't retconned.
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