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[GRAND FINALS] Venefica's Tier 7 Tourney: Asuna vs Leaf Girl (REMATCH)

Oh, and whilst we're talking about the will drain, if it's like some activateable on-command ability that leaf girl possesses, like most skills in bakuhatsu, if asuna finds out that's how she's healing so much (Which i think is possible thanks to her Battle IQ feats listed on her profile) and asuna turns it off, wouldn't that make leaf girl susceptible to being killed?

It'd be a temporary window of opportunity and asuna could possibly miss it, sure, but there's nothing stopping her from taking it again after the negate cooldowns. It would be especially bad without Type 2 immortality for leaf girl, which would make it easier for asuna to win via kill if that works.
 
Oh, and whilst we're talking about the will drain, if it's like some activateable on-command ability that leaf girl possesses, like most skills in bakuhatsu, if asuna finds out that's how she's healing so much (Which i think is possible thanks to her Battle IQ feats listed on her profile) and asuna turns it off, wouldn't that make leaf girl susceptible to being killed?
Even if Asuna negates will draining, she'd still have to break through multiple layers of LG smartphone's barriers.
 
Every hit with Hell's Rain multiplies the power of all of Leaf Girl's attacks by 1.5x, and with how packed the bullets are and how many Leaf Girl can dish out in such a short period of time, one mistake could mean Asuna's death.
Well, i believe it's the same as the previous thread. If asuna's danger sense tells her she can't dodge due to there apparantly being exponentially small gaps, she'll just riftway out of it and out of the range of the attack, simple as that.
Just because they're "commonly associated" doesn't mean they're the same thing, especially not in this case, where with how Leaf Girl's will draining works and Asuna's feats of resistance to madness seem quite different.
How so? The will drain looks like exactly what it's described as, draining the opponents "Will to fight" which is exactly what the dark forest could do.
Well considering Ambush Anchor's effects increase at an exponential rate and don't stop until Leaf Girl intentionally hits Asuna, which Leaf Girl supposedly can't do in this scenario, wouldn't that just result in both being flung into space never to be seen again?
If that happened, asuna could quickly riftway back to the ground, so leaf girl would be stuck and asuna would win in that case, lol

Asuna can also use another riftway if mirrored spacetime didn't work, so there's that as well
 
Even if Asuna negates will draining, she'd still have to break through multiple layers of LG smartphone's barriers.
Yeah, but Leaf girl couldn't just defend forever. she'd have to come out eventually, defending forever is against VS thread rules, since it's basically fleeing. Even if she doesn't have to, asuna could still harm her, since nothing is said about the forcefields blocking gravity itself, for example. Asuna could crush leaf girl potentially, or just bounce her around inside her own barrier layers to deal damage that way, and leaf girl would be forced to drop the barriers to avoid death, opening her up for asuna's good 'ol danmaku and TK of her own.

The barriers have only been shown to block things like magical or physical attacks, not literal gravity interacting with itself and whatevers inside it, which would be leaf girl. All asuna would have to do is interact with the space-time between the barriers if she wants to use gravity magic to get around it. So even if leaf girl can escape from Asuna’s other attacks, it’ll wind up being useless if she intends to stay alive without her healing in play. There’s probably a few more ways not mentioned Asuna could use to get around the barriers even without negate, given her Genius Battle IQ, too. 👀
 
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Le Epic (Scene 1)

(Cue: Will Of The Drill )

A certain green-skinned woman is seen wandering through an empty, ruined city, as a bleak, dark colour fills the sky above, looking as if she is waiting for something. Suddenly, she stops in her tracks, as she looks up to see a portal in the air, as a young mage enters into the destroyed landscape, floating in the air with a cocky grin on her face.

Leaf Girl: "Hey, i didn't even get to you show you my true form last time i saw you, a**hole!"

Asuna: "Well, Look who's talking! A leaf person can't even beat me to save their life, let alone their brother! Go figure."

The two of them speak to each other as if they've met before, which they have. Long story short, there is plenty of unsolved beef between these two grand finalists of this strange tournament many had found themselves in, and had unfortunately lost their lives. However, leaf girl was lucky enough to win what could only be described as a gulag, and now she was fuming for payback, especially after that comment from the tomboy mage.

Leaf Girl: "SAY WHAT?!" She shouts, as a slight hint of a dark aura begins to form around her, indicating some sort of higher power...

Asuna: "You heard me! Everyone's fighting to survive right now, and it's just us two. It wouldn't be fun if you weren't at full strength. So show me your so-called 'true form'! I dare you!" Asuna calls out, almost taunting the leaf girl. The latter clenches their fists.

Leaf Girl: "Alright, Fine! You asked for it!"

FIGHT!

(Cue: )

Leaf girl proceeded to launch a flurry of demonic energy balls towards asuna, their numbers easily being in the hundreds. Asuna is alerted of the attack through her sheer instinct, and she leaps back, flipping several times in the air to avoid the rapid attacks.

Asuna: [💭"Looks like this'll be harder than last time, this girl could probably give shizu a run for her money!"💭] Asuna then retaliates with one of her typical skills, [Million streaks], as hundreds of lightning bolts shoot out of her staff, as it glows a bright, blue aura.

Leaf girl swiftly countered with one of her barriers, all of the lightning bolts stopping dead in their tracks, as they impact a seemingly invisible wall, the only evidence of it being there being the purple color the barrier briefly turns into on impact, before swiftly fading back into transparency.

Leaf Girl: "Geez, You're slower than my brother, slowpoke!" She shouts, before unleashing the same attack, which asuna manages to dodge once more, as her expression turns to one of focus, but still with a hint of arrogance.

Asuna: "You're one to talk!" Asuna activates [Turbocharge], increasing her speed rapidly, as asuna speeds off behind a few of the wrecked buildings, as she uses air magic to lift them into the air, before they are blasted straight towards leaf girl at a high speed.

 
Le Epic (Scene 1)

(Cue: Will Of The Drill )

A certain green-skinned woman is seen wandering through an empty, ruined city, as a bleak, dark colour fills the sky above, looking as if she is waiting for something. Suddenly, she stops in her tracks, as she looks up to see a portal in the air, as a young mage enters into the destroyed landscape, floating in the air with a cocky grin on her face.

Leaf Girl: "Hey, i didn't even get to you show you my true form last time i saw you, a**hole!"

Asuna: "Well, Look who's talking! A leaf person can't even beat me to save their life, let alone their brother! Go figure."

The two of them speak to each other as if they've met before, which they have. Long story short, there is plenty of unsolved beef between these two grand finalists of this strange tournament many had found themselves in, and had unfortunately lost their lives. However, leaf girl was lucky enough to win what could only be described as a gulag, and now she was fuming for payback, especially after that comment from the tomboy mage.

Leaf Girl: "SAY WHAT?!" She shouts, as a slight hint of a dark aura begins to form around her, indicating some sort of higher power...

Asuna: "You heard me! Everyone's fighting to survive right now, and it's just us two. It wouldn't be fun if you weren't at full strength. So show me your so-called 'true form'! I dare you!" Asuna calls out, almost taunting the leaf girl. The latter clenches their fists.

Leaf Girl: "Alright, Fine! You asked for it!"

FIGHT!

(Cue: )

Leaf girl proceeded to launch a flurry of demonic energy balls towards asuna, their numbers easily being in the hundreds. Asuna is alerted of the attack through her sheer instinct, and she leaps back, flipping several times in the air to avoid the rapid attacks.

Asuna: [💭"Looks like this'll be harder than last time, this girl could probably give shizu a run for her money!"💭] Asuna then retaliates with one of her typical skills, [Million streaks], as hundreds of lightning bolts shoot out of her staff, as it glows a bright, blue aura.

Leaf girl swiftly countered with one of her barriers, all of the lightning bolts stopping dead in their tracks, as they impact a seemingly invisible wall, the only evidence of it being there being the purple color the barrier briefly turns into on impact, before swiftly fading back into transparency.

Leaf Girl: "Geez, You're slower than my brother, slowpoke!" She shouts, before unleashing the same attack, which asuna manages to dodge once more, as her expression turns to one of focus, but still with a hint of arrogance.

Asuna: "You're one to talk!" Asuna activates [Turbocharge], increasing her speed rapidly, as asuna speeds off behind a few of the wrecked buildings, as she uses air magic to lift them into the air, before they are blasted straight towards leaf girl at a high speed.


Errmmmm I don't see my guys cameoing 🤓
 
Well, i believe it's the same as the previous thread. If asuna's danger sense tells her she can't dodge due to there apparantly being exponentially small gaps, she'll just riftway out of it and out of the range of the attack, simple as that.
Getting out of range would make it easier for Leaf to block or dodge anything Asuna throws at her.
How so? The will drain looks like exactly what it's described as, draining the opponents "Will to fight" which is exactly what the dark forest could do.
That's not what you said. You said the forest was only instilling insanity in those who entered it. The "draining will" thing you mentioned seems like just the man losing hope on his own, not an effect the forest has.
Yeah, but Leaf girl couldn't just defend forever. she'd have to come out eventually, defending forever is against VS thread rules, since it's basically fleeing. Even if she doesn't have to, asuna could still harm her, since nothing is said about the forcefields blocking gravity itself, for example. Asuna could crush leaf girl potentially, or just bounce her around inside her own barrier layers to deal damage that way, and leaf girl would be forced to drop the barriers to avoid death, opening her up for asuna's good 'ol danmaku and TK of her own.
She'd be defending while constantly attacking. She still has the intent of winning the fight. That shouldn't be against the rules, or characters like Sundowner wouldn't be allowed on here. Leaf Girl's Class T is 44x higher than Asuna's, so gravity and TK shouldn't have any effect, and therefore, throwing Leaf at her own barriers shouldn't either.
 
That's not what you said. You said the forest was only instilling insanity in those who entered it. The "draining will" thing you mentioned seems like just the man losing hope on his own, not an effect the forest has.
I agree with this, I don't think there's a way to twist it around to resist the will drain. Willpower is a huge part of Asuna's arsenal. If the forest drained will and Asuna resisted that, it would have been very clear on her profile long before the tourney started. It seems like a glaring weakness Leaf Girl will be taking advantage of.
 
With that said, I'm going to unveil this now: my next tourney shall be a "Country Class" tourney! Specifics still being finalized, but expect the general tiers to be 6-B and/or High 6-B, possibly allowing Low 6-B as well. Like this tourney, the rules will be susceptible to changes but rules for hax will be a little less strict due to higher tiers being involved. However, time for the actual battle.
Also I'm excited for this. I have some pretty fair 6-Bs I'd like to use. They're not anything special.
 
I agree with this, I don't think there's a way to twist it around to resist the will drain. Willpower is a huge part of Asuna's arsenal. If the forest drained will and Asuna resisted that, it would have been very clear on her profile long before the tourney started. It seems like a glaring weakness Leaf Girl will be taking advantage of.
That's not what you said. You said the forest was only instilling insanity in those who entered it. The "draining will" thing you mentioned seems like just the man losing hope on his own, not an effect the forest has.
Well, yeah, but they do have a similair end effect. Both of them make you lose the will to fight, and Both of them make you give up, don’t they? Asuna can’t outright prevent it, but I just don’t think it’d be effective, like the case was with Cinner. It wasn’t a magical effect, yeah, but they both still induce a similair thing to their victims. That doesn’t mean Asuna can’t resist it just because the source wasn’t magical.

It was agreed upon earlier that since Cinner could resist a fear aura (Which was described as empathic manipulation, but it could also translate as resistance to fear too, which was what I was getting at when I mentioned that empathic manipulation is often a subset of mental abilities) which Asuna also does similarly here and other times before. Why is it that we are ignoring empathic manipulation is literally associated with mind manipulation in ‘many cases’ like it literally says on it’s page?🗿 lol
She'd be defending while constantly attacking. She still has the intent of winning the fight. That shouldn't be against the rules, or characters like Sundowner wouldn't be allowed on here. Leaf Girl's Class T is 44x higher than Asuna's, so gravity and TK shouldn't have any effect, and therefore, throwing Leaf at her own barriers shouldn't either.
Asuna is Class E 🗿
Getting out of range would make it easier for Leaf to block or dodge anything Asuna throws at her.
And there’s where the good ‘ol Riftways would come in. Asuna can send her attacks through Riftways and straight to leaf girl, like she did in her brief fight against Chidori in chapter 6, which would make dodging much harder, since Asuna could throw them straight to her, and at random and unpredictable angles.
 
^ Gravity magic for example would also be basically instant, since Asuna would be interacting with it from a distance too, so even if the riftway tactic doesn’t work, Asuna would still have a way to catch leaf girl off guard.
 
Well, yeah, but they do have a similair end effect. Both of them make you lose the will to fight, and Both of them make you give up, don’t they? Asuna can’t outright prevent it, but I just don’t think it’d be effective, like the case was with Cinner. It wasn’t a magical effect, yeah, but they both still induce a similair thing to their victims. That doesn’t mean Asuna can’t resist it just because the source wasn’t magical.

It was agreed upon earlier that since Cinner could resist a fear aura (Which was described as empathic manipulation, but it could also translate as resistance to fear too, which was what I was getting at when I mentioned that empathic manipulation is often a subset of mental abilities) which Asuna also does similarly here and other times before. Why is it that we are ignoring empathic manipulation is literally associated with mind manipulation in ‘many cases’ like it literally says on it’s page?🗿 lol
Rinser’s aura wasn’t fear, it was distinctly inferiority. Others didn’t necessarily think of him as a threat, but they felt beneath him and didn’t feel they could really fight back against someone on his level because of the presence he exudes. There are characters like Kaint and Nite who specifically have a fear aura which is different in verse. Insanity is completely different from just being plain unwilling to fight, it affects mental wellness as a whole rather than emotions. They’re associated because they are similar on the surface, not in their use because making someone go insane and making someone scared seem very different to me even if technically both affect the mind.
 
Rinser’s aura wasn’t fear, it was distinctly inferiority. Others didn’t necessarily think of him as a threat, but they felt beneath him and didn’t feel they could really fight back against someone on his level because of the presence he exudes. There are characters like Kaint and Nite who specifically have a fear aura which is different in verse. Insanity is completely different from just being plain unwilling to fight, it affects mental wellness as a whole rather than just emotions. They’re associated because they are similar on the surface, not really in their use because making someone go insane and making someone scared seem very different to me even if technically both affect the mind.
Affecting mental wellness… also affects willpower, shouldn’t it? Remember when I said that guy Asuna & shizu encountered couldn’t use magic to heal himself because of his mental state? That was because he had no more willpower left, since it’s a whole part of using magic. I don’t think it gets more clear than that.

Sure, it just makes people go insane, but judging by leaf girls’ description on her empathic manipulation, it’s very vague, since it just says ‘Can drain someone’s will to fight’ which would be a subset of what the dark forest is doing to it’s victims. And, plus, how else would you affect willpower itself other than affecting the mind, something that Asuna can evidently resist? 👀

As for the unwillingness to fight, they also literally said they would rather die than see Kedron again, cause, y’know, they were scared s**tless and had lost the will to fight him at that point bro got shanked 5 seconds later. So there’s still somewhat of a similarity there. (End effect)
 
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And so, the tourney which first opened up on February 24th has finally reached it's ultimate match, the Grand Finals, on May the 5th. It's been 71 days, and it's been an amazing time all the way through! The tourney has been a great success with only a little but of drama involved (hopefully we minimize this next time).
Its been an amazing ride, you balanced the tourney so much that seemingly every second match resulted inconclusive or especially tightly advanced 👀 As a moderator you did well
F-LIKzqbgAE1W8B.jpg
Hits hard when you remember the context of this scene
 
Affecting mental wellness… also affects willpower, shouldn’t it? Remember when I said that guy Asuna & shizu encountered couldn’t use magic to heal himself because of his mental state? That was because he had no more willpower left, since it’s a whole part of using magic. I don’t think it gets more clear than that.

Sure, it just makes people go insane, but judging by leaf girls’ description on her empathic manipulation, it’s very vague, since it just says ‘Can drain someone’s will to fight’ which would be a subset of what the dark forest is doing to it’s victims. And, plus, how else would you affect willpower itself other than affecting the mind, something that Asuna can evidently resist? 👀

As for the unwillingness to fight, they also literally said they would rather die than see Kedron again, cause, y’know, they were scared s**tless and had lost the will to fight him at that point bro got shanked 5 seconds later. So there’s still somewhat of a similarity there. (End effect)
In a way but that’s more a side effect than actual empathetic manipulation. The man didn’t have the will to heal himself, but that seems more like his mind being broken than his willpower being directly affected. And him being scared is a natural side effect of being driven insane instead of something supernatural.

What I got from the description on LG’s profile is that she can directly take willpower without having to go through someone’s mind like how Giga Drain directly steals health. It seems like Venefica and Leo also disagree with empathetic manipulation being the ability, so I think the forest feat should just be marked as resistance to madness and Leaf Girl should be able to use her draining. Asuna will be able to last with her supernatural willpower, but it’ll still be going down.
 
In a way but that’s more a side effect than actual empathetic manipulation. The man didn’t have the will to heal himself, but that seems more like his mind being broken than his willpower being directly affected. And him being scared is a natural side affect of being driven insane instead of something supernatural.
Yes, but in a very clear way, it does sort of “drain” willpower, even if it isn’t the same as the drain. If your mind is broken, then so is your willpower, which Asuna resists.
What I got from the description on LG’s profile is that she can directly take willpower without having to go through someone’s mind like how Giga Drain directly steals health. It seems like Venefica and Leo also disagree with empathetic manipulation being the ability, so I think the forest feat should just be marked as resistance to madness and Leaf Girl should be able to use her draining. Asuna will be able to last with her supernatural willpower, but it’ll still be going down.
I see. If that’s really the case, then Asuna still has plenty of ways to defend against it as I’ve mentioned earlier.

Negate should definitely work on that if it becomes a big problem for Asuna or she wants to stop leaf girls’ healing to go for a kill, or she can stay outside leaf girls’ range and deal with her effectively from a distance by throwing her attacks through riftways, and sending them in leaf girls’ face at random and unpredictable angles. Which would in turn mean will drain is ineffective thanks to Asuna being able to attack her extremely well from outside her range.
 
Yes, but in a very clear way, it does sort of “drain” willpower, even if it isn’t the same as the drain. If your mind is broken, then so is your willpower, which Asuna resists.

I see. If that’s really the case, then Asuna still has plenty of ways to defend against it as I’ve mentioned earlier.

Negate should definitely work on that if it becomes a big problem for Asuna or she wants to stop leaf girls’ healing to go for a kill, or she can stay outside leaf girls’ range and deal with her effectively from a distance by throwing her attacks through riftways, and sending them in leaf girls’ face at random and unpredictable angles. Which would in turn mean will drain is ineffective thanks to Asuna being able to attack her extremely well from outside her range.
This is like Maka and Soul. Soul has Madness because he can instill it on others and Empathetic because he stopped Giriko being willing to defend himself. They are similar but both have different applications. The other defenses seem fair but resistance no.
 
This is like Maka and Soul. Soul has Madness because he can instill it on others and Empathetic because he stopped Giriko being willing to defend himself. They are similar but both have different applications. The other defenses seem fair but resistance no.
In this case it kinda goes deeper than that, because empathic manip is messing with willpower, which can easily be interpreted as mind manip in turn, especially when the empathic manip page literally says the two are usually linked and/or very similar 👀 so I don’t really agree with that, but you are obviously within your right.

But Since it works like a giga drain apparantly, Asuna would still have plenty of ways to avoid it even if for whatever reason she can’t resist it as I’ve mentioned above ^ so I don’t think it’ll be something that will get leaf girl the win. If anything, it’ll work in asuna’s favour, because it means she’ll realise she just has to take advantage of leaf girls’ poor range even faster.

Asuna can also use negate to cut off it’s effects before it can do anything significant, and Asuna will more than likely deduce that’s how leaf girl is healing herself, and she’ll know that negate will give her a big opening to end leaf girl.

And as established in the previous thread, Asuna still has quite a few ways around leaf girls’ danmaku, such as sending her own attacks through a riftway straight to leaf girl from behind, using riftways to send leaf girls’ own dura neg attacks back at her, using gravity magic and TK to throw leaf girl off, etc.
 
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I think we could also use another point thing to put this match into perspective, and i also won't be online the whole day too, so... You know the drill.

Who has what advantages?!?!?!?!?! (Taking this out of venefica's book huehue):

AP: Asuna (4.5x AP advantage)
Speed: Asuna (Speed is equalised, but asuna has speed amps, though leaf girl is used to speed disadvantages)
Durability: Asuna (Scaling to AP)
LS: Asuna (Class E > Class T)
IQ: Leaf Girl (obviously)
Battle IQ: Asuna (Better rating, + More & Better Feats)
Agility: Both (Asuna has more feats, but leaf girl can keep up with those faster than herself)

Experience: Leaf Girl (Has likely been through similar things as asuna for longer.)
Abilities: Asuna (Larger quantity)
Hax: Asuna (Both have their fair share of hax, but asuna has everything leaf girl has plus more, except for dura neg.)
Offense: Asuna (Both can use deadly combinations in this environment, though asuna has ways to prevent an offensive from leaf girl whilst continuing her own.)
Defense: Both (Both have great defensive abilities.)
Stamina: Both (Both have immense stamina feats)
Endurance: Asuna (More pain tolerance feats)
Skill: Both (Asuna has more feats, but leaf girl has more experience.)
Healing: Both (Both have instant regen, though leaf girl relies on an ability asuna could likely disable)
Range: Asuna (Hundreds of kilometers > kilometers)
Prediction: Asuna (Precognition > Analytical prediction)

Asuna: 16
Leaf Girl: 7


I obviously don't think this should be a game decider, as some of these advantages mean more than others, but make of this what you will...

Also, scene 2 hopefully should come today! 👍
 
I think we could also use another point thing to put this match into perspective, and i also won't be online the whole day too, so... You know the drill.

Who has what advantages?!?!?!?!?! (Taking this out of venefica's book huehue):

AP: Asuna (4.5x AP advantage)
Speed: Asuna (Speed is equalised, but asuna has speed amps, though leaf girl is used to speed disadvantages)
Durability: Asuna (Scaling to AP)
LS: Asuna (Class E > Class T)
IQ: Leaf Girl (obviously)
Battle IQ: Asuna (Better rating, + More & Better Feats)
Agility: Both (Asuna has more feats, but leaf girl can keep up with those faster than herself)

Experience: Leaf Girl (Has likely been through similar things as asuna for longer.)
Abilities: Asuna (Larger quantity)
Hax: Asuna (Both have their fair share of hax, but asuna has everything leaf girl has plus more, except for dura neg.)
Offense: Asuna (Both can use deadly combinations in this environment, though asuna has ways to prevent an offensive from leaf girl whilst continuing her own.)
Defense: Both (Both have great defensive abilities.)
Stamina: Both (Both have immense stamina feats)
Endurance: Asuna (More pain tolerance feats)
Skill: Both (Asuna has more feats, but leaf girl has more experience.)
Healing: Both (Both have instant regen, though leaf girl relies on an ability asuna could likely disable)
Range: Asuna (Hundreds of kilometers > kilometers)
Prediction: Asuna (Precognition > Analytical prediction)

Asuna: 16
Leaf Girl: 7


I obviously don't think this should be a game decider, as some of these advantages mean more than others, but make of this what you will...

Also, scene 2 hopefully should come today! 👍
STOP USING THIS METHOJSMSKSJSNDJEJSUXKFHYZDYHWG6YUFHRHDOFLGMENDKCIENDHD GRAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHYHHUYHHHHH
 
Also, if anything is proven to be innacurate, i'll change the points around (y)
 
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