GERs Speed is outdated

[StrymULTRA]

From when letting a character hitting you when you wanted to just use your ability is an "anti-feat"? GER, as you said, wanted to **** with Diavolo, so it wasn't serious at start, and it blitzing Diavolo 2 times confirms that it was casual af in the Time Skip.

 

[BlackDarkness679]

So just cuz 1 "anti-feat" is around we just gonna throw away everything else?

I might as well say Dyspo hearing Hit vibrations, Anilaza hearing the others and along the statement of him surpassing sound and light in speed are good to downgrade the verse to supersonic, possibly FTL with this instead of the ratings they have

And imo, the way Effi argues and made these comments that are pure head canon, along the ignorance to the series saying otherwise then the comments is honestly double standards from the user, also none are legit either

 

[Chariot190]

Look, here's what we know.

No Stand or ability in JoJo can get one up against RTZ.

GER failed to react to Diavolo in time within the Epitaph vision, even if he's still hilariously fast.

GER was effected by time erase, initially, but RTZ wasn't, and GER only regained control after RTZ kicked in, allegedly.

GER's stats upscale him above every Stand, including the Infinite ones.

We know, from direct confirmation, that in some cases, a stat can refer to an ability itself, not the Stand, even if some stats do indeed refer to the Stand itself, even if other stats do indeed refer to the Stand itself within the same list.
Such as with Whitesnake.

So put simply.
We know something about GER scales to Infinite.
We know GER itself isn't infinite based on Epitaph.
We know that the thing that says something is infinite could also be about an aspect of an ability, not the Stand.
And we know know nothing can get one over RTZ and that RTZ could act when GER couldn't, allegedly.

That info suggest that RTZ is simply above GER and is the thing scaling to infinite because GER itself can't.

From when letting a character hitting you when you wanted to just use your ability is an "anti-feat"? GER, as you said, wanted to **** with Diavolo, so it wasn't serious at start, and it blitzing Diavolo 2 times confirms that it was casual af in the Time Skip.

Yeah, he wanted to **** with Diavolo, but GER kinda doesn't have any say on what a guaranteed future shown by Epitaph is, Efi brought that up awhile ago actually, GER may have wanted to **** with Diavolo, but he didn't control or have a say in Diavolo being shown him ripping out Giorno's heart, that was fate itself showing it and I doubt GER would have just let Diavolo gouge out Giorno to **** with him, given he kinda actively didnt allow that future to come to pass.
He can blitz someone beyond belief, that doesn't warrant an infinite rating by itself though, and the stats would actually imply infinite in conjunction with that, but due to the anti-feat, the best we can say is that GER is just ludicrously above him, not infinite and given we know sometimes a particular stat or few in a sheet can be about the ability instead, and we have direct confirmation by Araki that can even be the speed of the ability, that's what we're lead to believe, that RTZ is what's infinite.

Though, if you want to convince Efi that the Epitaph anti-feat doesnt hold weight, go ahead, because I'm gonna be honest, I don't particularly disagree with you, but this is an actual issue in play here.

 

[Chariot190]

So just cuz 1 "anti-feat" is around we just gonna throw away everything else?

I might as well say Dyspo hearing Hit vibrations, Anilaza hearing the others and along the statement of him surpassing sound and light in speed are good to downgrade the verse to supersonic, possibly FTL with this instead of the ratings they have

No, because the other information we have that suggests infinite doesnt actually absolutely refer to GER itself, or rather, GER's physical speed.
The only way this would be true is if we knew for a fact that it was GER scaling above the infinite in speed, but we don't, we simply arent given clarity on that, all we know is SOMETHING does, furthermore, we have actual evidence and showings that suggest if not outright show RTZ>GER.

So if the single thing that would confirm GER as infinite has a very real possibility of not actually talking about him, but rather the ability, and we know this can absolutely be the case based on actual confirmed examples. And we know RTZ is likely > GER to begin with based on showings. Then that anti-feat doesn't become a anti-feat, it's more like a limit and confirmation it's not him scaling.

I understand the sentiment, but that's a false analogy in this situation, because we don't know for a fact if GER is above them itself, only that something is, and when there's evidence to say that something else isn't him, then that's not a anti-feat, it's just confirmation.

But as said, if you can convince Efi of the opposite here, then I'd be willing to agree to a decent extent.

 

[Rikimarox2]

My mind is having a really bad headache here, so bear with me if it seems like I'm having a seizure or smth.

I honestly don't really know how to feel about the whole KC ******* GER in his vision. It seems to refer that he was a bit faster, but isn't that contradictory? Since in the beginning, while KC was in the middle of throwing a punch at GE, GER was able to break out of his shell, heal Giorno, probably jack off a bit, and then appear behind diavolo floating, all without Diavolo noticing.

Even if he wasn't Infinite speed, he's still ludicrously fast. Much, much faster than KC. So, to say that KC was able to donut GER in his vision feels a bit wrong with me since GER was casually blitzing the living **** out of him before, and I don't see anything stopping him from just reacting Diavolo's attack or smth, especially since GER was messing with Diavolo the whole time. So, the vision could just be a big fat **** you from GER.

 

[Damage3245]

Even if he wasn't Infinite speed, he's still ludicrously fast. Much, much faster than KC. So, to say that KC was able to donut GER in his vision feels a bit wrong with me since GER was casually blitzing the living **** out of him before, and I don't see anything stopping him from just reacting Diavolo's attack or smth, especially since GER was messing with Diavolo the whole time. So, the vision could just be a big fat **** you from GER.

GER doesn't have the power to create illusions / fake precognition as far as we know.

 

[StrymULTRA]

Look, here's what we know.

No Stand or ability in JoJo can get one up against RTZ.

GER failed to react to Diavolo in time within the Epitaph vision, even if he's still hilariously fast.

GER was effected by time erase, initially, but RTZ wasn't, and GER only regained control after RTZ kicked in, allegedly.

GER's stats upscale him above every Stand, including the Infinite ones.

We know, from direct confirmation, that in some cases, a stat can refer to an ability itself, not the Stand, even if some stats do indeed refer to the Stand itself.
Such as with Whitesnake.

So put simply.
We know something about GER scales to Infinite.
We know GER itself isn't infinite based on Epitaph.
We know that the thing that says something is infinite could also be about an aspect of an ability, not the Stand.
And we know know nothing can get one over RTZ and that RTZ could act when GER couldn't, allegedly.

That info suggest that RTZ is simply above GER and is the thing scaling to infinite because GER itself can't.

Already debunked from GER blizting Diavolo 2 times, you're blantantly ignoring that part.

Yeah, he wanted to **** with Diavolo, but GER kinda doesn't have any say on what a guaranteed future shown by Epitaph is, Efi brought that up awhile ago actually, GER may have wanted to **** with Diavolo, but he didn't control or have a say in Diavolo being shown him ripping out Giorno's heart, that was fate itself showing it and I doubt GER would have just let Diavolo gouge out Giorno to **** with him, given he kinda actively didnt allow that future to come to pass.

Is not the first time when characters could oppose the fate manipulated from the opponents, look at Thoth or BtZ, GER simply did that too, also is not the first time from when Diavolo's predictions were turned being different from the actual events due of the actions taken after seeing them.

He can blitz someone beyond belief, that doesn't warrant an infinite rating by itself though, and the stats would actually imply infinite in conjunction with that, but due to the anti-feat, the best we can say is that GER is just ludicrously above him, not infinite and given we know sometimes a particular stat or few in a sheet can be about the ability instead, and we have direct confirmation by Araki that can even be the speed of the ability, that's what we're lead to believe, that RTZ is what's infinite.

Blitzing someone is a supporting feat tbh, nothing else.

 

[Chariot190]

You aren't wrong Riki, on that GER>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>King Crimson, but that doesn't inherently discredit the Epitaph, mostly because when King Crimson attacks, he's resuming the exact moment he makes contact, you can still be extremely fast, even several dozen times faster, hell, possibly even faster, that may not be guarantee that you can say, stop a bullet the moment it breaks your skin before it goes through you even if you could normally outpace and deflect numerous at once. Distance matters and so does the surprise factor, in this case, it seems to have just been barely enough.

Which, sadly, puts a wrench in saying that GER itself is the thing scaling above infinite, but fortunately, on the other hand, we know that RTZ itself isnt prone to that anti-feat (hell, it actually stopped that very blow itself before it could inflict any damage). Like I'm gonna be real, I don't actually agree with the Epitaph sequence being an absolute discredit, but it's also undeniable that there's reason to think it does even if I don't, in regards to this I'm playing Devil's advocate, I'm trying to actually be reasonable here to both parties and trying to get a good accurate solution that's at the very least not really subject to differing opinions and works regardless of interpretation.

Already debunked from GER blizting Diavolo 2 times, you're blantantly ignoring that part.

I didn't ignore it? Im the person who brought those scenes up and even gather scans of them, including guide scans and the japanese scans. It's not that I'm ignoring it, it's just that doesn't instantly invalidate the rest.

Is not the first time when characters could oppose the fate manipulated from the opponents, look at Thoth or BtZ, GER simply did that too, also is not the first time from when Diavolo's predictions were turned being different from the actual events due of the actions taken after seeing them.

Not the issue, in fact Im under the belief GER and Giorno at the end of Part 5 should have a resistance to fate actually. but that's not important, what's important is that GER, while far, far, faster then King Crimson, wasn't fast enough by itself to defend Giorno in the vision that never came to pass,
Also Thoth was never wrong, it was just some monkey's paw genie bullshit, it was always right, it just wasn't right in the way you'd think at first. And BTD's fate always occurred, it didn't care about the details, only the critical parts like if something was supposed to die. Epitaph is a case where the vision is meant to be absolute with no divergence.

Blitzing someone is a supporting feat tbh, nothing else.

It is a supporting feat, but only when there's reason to believe the end result that it supports is 100% legit, and in this situation, it isn't, or, at least, untill you can disprove the Epitaph sequence as a whole and get everyone to agree on it, though tbh I doubt that's gonna happen otherwise I'd have continued doing so, there's an issue in play there, it sucks and I don't like it either but it's a thing and on the opposite end the only saving grace that could discredit that isn't an inherent absolute to GER itself so like...

 

[BlackDarkness679]

Effi only arguments to when i defended GER was saying no, no, no and ignoring the series saying otherwise, excuse me but thats not debunking or convincing GER isnt infinite, nor to take seriously if thats how you try to oppose something in a debate

He isnt affected by time erase, nothing suggests RTZ on its own can activate, he needs to be unaffected too

Epitaph predictions have some fate manipulation thing to them, like how he killed most of the characters by abusing the visions and using time erase to make it happen without anyone seeing it till it was too late, so i doubt KC punching Giorno was cuz of him being fast enough, it was cuz fate from the vision was meant to be in his favor regardless, it failed only cuz RTZ denied it

 

[Chariot190]

Effi only arguments to when i defended GER was saying no, no, no and ignoring the series saying otherwise, excuse me but thats not debunking or convincing GER isnt infinite, nor to take seriously if thats how you try to oppose something in a debate

I'm not going to argue otherwise there with you on that, but to be fair, the Epitaph thing is the singular huge wrench in this, and sadly, there's some actual reason why the opposition may think as such. I don't agree with Efi's other points, I stand by you on that, hell, I dont even really agree with Efi on the Epitaph thing, but I cant the very least see why it's an issue and it kinda is unfortunately. Made even worse as the single saving grace that could discredit this entirely, may just be talking about RTZ instead and not GER.

He isnt affected by time erase, nothing suggests RTZ on its own can activate, he needs to be unaffected too

Nothing suggests RTZ is manual either, we dont know, we're never told, personally I think it's both and it can act without GER's consent but GER can use it willing if he wants. But We don't actually have enough concrete info to come to a true conclusion with that. But saying he needs to be unaffected is conjecture, it's whatever we're shown or told, and I guess people think GER was intially effected by the time erase before RTZ kicked in so like, well take it up with them, not me, Im not the person you gotta convince here/

Epitaph predictions have some fate manipulation thing to them, like how he killed most of the characters by abusing the visions and using time erase to make it happen without anyone stopping or seeing it till it was too late, so i doubt KC punching Giorno was cuz of him being fast enough, it was cuz fate from the vision was meant to be in his favor regardless, it failed only cuz RTZ denied it

I actually agree with this for the most part, in fact, you are 100% right, that's actually true, but then there's still the issue of the actual punch itself from Epitaph happening outside of time skip, not within it like with Trish and Narancia and that one throwaway line Diavolo says right after imply he was just barely fast enough in those circumstances (And yes, I checked the japanese scans, that line is still there). Which still has the issue be kept in play.

 

[Rikimarox2]

Well, regardless if RtZ or GER itself is infinite, they'd still at the very least be much higher than normal infinite speed right? Since they are faster than MiH and N. B.I.G.

 

[Chariot190]

Well, regardless if RtZ or GER itself is infinite, they'd still at the very least be much higher than normal infinite speed right? Since they are faster than MiH and N. B.I.G.

I guess? However that works. Dont ask me how that's supposed to work though, I don't deal with weird ass interactions like that usually, I know it's a thing and there's multiple types of infinity as weird as that sounds but the specifics? Idk.
I just know there's scaling to MIH/BIG at peak speed and then neither could ever do jack shit in any situation against RTZ.

 

[StrymULTRA]

Nothing suggests RTZ is manual either, we dont know, we're never told, personally I think it's both and it can act without GER's consent but GER can use it willing if he wants. But We don't actually have enough concrete info to come to a true conclusion with that. But saying he needs to be unaffected is conjecture, it's whatever we're shown or told, and I guess people think GER was intially effected by the time erase before RTZ kicked in so like, well take it up with them, not me, Im not the person you gotta convince here/

Fine I guess, I'll wait Efi

 

[BlackDarkness679]

Thats just Diavolo thinking he was faster, literally all the time he tries to defend or attack he gets blitzed and cant react, he needed aim dodge only for a beam fired by GER, more precisely he saw a hole in the hand and already put his hand in advance, didnt even see the beam in the vision, thats like Polnareff case saying he cant react yet that is proven false several times, feats > statements in this case

And again its some fate manipulation involved in this, nothing to do with speed, fate doesnt care of such things, it just happens cuz it says so, the ability is what changed the fate

 

[Zel97]

GER doesn't have the power to create illusions / fake precognition as far as we know.

GER or RTZ can mess with precog though, given it was shown that even after KC got rtz'd epitath's perfect vision was malfunctioning by showing the same false future where he won instead of a future where he got pummeled. I believe there was a thread made for this not too long ago so we can discuss there once done with this.

Just wanted to clear that up

 

[Chariot190]

Thats just Diavolo thinking he was faster, literally all the time he tries to defend or attack he gets blitzed and cant react, he needed aim dodge only for a beam fired by GER, more precisely he saw a hole in the hand and already put his hand in advance, didnt even see the beam in the vision, thats like Polnareff case saying he cant react yet that is proven false several times, feats > statements in this case

You're not wrong.
Nobody is saying that GER wouldnt ******* fold King Crimson in a fight (I mean, he quite literally does), at minimum GER is like a bullet and King Crimson is a normal man, or like Batman to a normal thug, like, yeah of course GER would blitz his ass, and he does so, twice, and he effectively does 3 blitzes even. But, just because you're way, way faster then something doesn't mean you're untouchable in a situation where the soonest you can react is when it's already physically touching you while going max speed while you were previously "not conscious" (In the vision I mean, obviously he became conscious in the time where the vision never happened) while from behind, and also as a surprise attack. And even in that situation King Crimson barely won that out, he needed to be basically already touching his target and have a **** ton of advantages in play for him to basically barely compare. there's reason to think his blitzes doesnt instantly invalidate Epitaph's vision. Of course, I already said I dont actually agree with this, but you gotta be fair here, there is reason to think the "anti-feat" has backing and the saving grace may not apply.

And again its some fate manipulation involved in this, nothing to do with speed, fate doesnt care of such things, it just happens cuz it says so, the ability is what changed the fate

That was actually my exact argument early on but some people don't agree on that and I'm unsure if they're truly wrong to think so, this may be a case of interpretation. And if it is, then I can't say something subjective is objectively false. But at the very least, we still know RTZ>GER itself and something is infinite and speed stats can and have referred to ability so either way.

 

[Chariot190]

GER or RTZ can mess with precog though, given it was shown that even after KC got rtz'd epitath's perfect vision was malfunctioning by showing the same false future where he won instead of a future where he got pummeled. I believe there was a thread made for this not too long ago so we can discuss there once done with this.

Just wanted to clear that up

Tbh, I think GER should resist fate actually, I think I even mentioned this to you before and a few other people, but that's a topic for another thread, if there is a thread we can maybe take a look at that later.

Not to long ago.

I do recall a thread but, I'm pretty sure it was around the same time I joined the wiki (And that thread became a shitfest too, such is the life of GER).

 

[Zel97]

Tbh, I think GER should resist fate actually, I think I even mentioned this to you before and a few other people, but that's a topic for another thread, if there is a thread we can maybe take a look at that later.

Res to Fate manip sounds ok too.

I do recall a thread but, I'm pretty sure it was around the same time I joined the wiki (And that thread became a shitfest too, such is the life of GER).

Oh... no.. not that one. I remember i was really new in that thread. Was refering to a thread a few weeks ago

But anyway, we should stop it here. Best if we finish this up asap, everyone's tired in 1 way or another of this thread already i feel like...

 

[StrymULTRA]

Tbh having Infinite Speed in base + Fate Hax Res fits waaaaaaaaaaay more than just having RtZ with Infinite speed due to how casual GER was with Diavolo

 

[Chariot190]

Tbh having Infinite Speed in base + Fate Hax Res fits waaaaaaaaaaay more than just having RtZ with Infinite speed due to how casual GER was with Diavolo

Maybe, though, you do realize that if GER had fate hax resistance, that actually supports King Crimson tagging and him not being infinite rather then it discrediting the Epitaph scene right? It's one or the other in regards to Epitaph, it can't be both.
Also something being casual doesn't equal infinite speed, it's not that simple.

 

[Zel97]

We can discuss ger's new abilities after this thread if need be. Looks like we're close to conclusion already. Anymore uncertainty or disagreement or are we done here?

 

[StrymULTRA]

Maybe, though, you do realize that if GER had fate hax resistance, that actually supports King Crimson tagging and him not being infinite rather then it discrediting the Epitaph scene right?

It actually does, since GER was resistant to Fate Hax, and thus can freerly oppose Epitaph's predictions.

Also something being casual doesn't equal infinite speed, it's not that simple.

I never stated so, is a supportive feat.

We can discuss ger's new abilities after this thread if need be. Looks like we're close to conclusion already. Anymore uncertainty or disagreement or are we done here?

This is the thread to discuss how GER dealt to KC's ability.

 

[Damage3245]

I'm pretty sure the conclusion at the moment is:

"At least MFTL physically, Infinite with RTZ".

 

[Chariot190]

We can discuss ger's new abilities after this thread if need be. Looks like we're close to conclusion already. Anymore uncertainty or disagreement or are we done here?

It seems like Efi is gonna need to stand her ground on the epitaph thing first.

I know what I'm advocating for, even if I don't like it, it's the best solution and adheres to every issue while still remaining accurate to the best extent we can get it without venturing into assumptions and the like. But I guess that's no exactly so simple.

 

[Zel97]

"At least MFTL physically, Infinite with RTZ".

I feel like we should add

"Likely higher physically"

Since well, GER blitzed KC twice. The blitz was so horrible KC was basically frozen in comparison to GER. KC is one of the fastest stand in the series.

 

[Chariot190]

It actually does, since GER was resistant to Fate Hax, and thus can freerly oppose Epitaph's predictions.

Wrong, GER only managed to resist the prediction through the use of RTZ, the prediction was still seemingly going to happen regardless of what GER before RTZ came into effect, in fact, RTZ activated the while King Crimson was tossing the blow that was meant to gouge out his heart, which means two things, either GER was absolutely fated to be dealt that blow and that it may not be fair to say the scene means he's truly a certain speed as fate could have just ****** him, or GER wasn't bound by fate and the single argument that I can think that opposes everything about this is moot, because the Epitaph fate manip didnt effect him, meaning, GER simply was just not fast enough to defend in that situation.
It's one or the other, he can't both have base infinite but also resist fate, as both effect this scene and effects what actually happened.

I never stated so, is a supportive feat.

It's only supportive if the thing it's supporting aint suspect.

This is the thread to discuss how GER dealt to KC's ability.

But is it really. Him having some resistances or not don't effect the speed of anything.

 

[Chariot190]

I feel like we should add

"Likely higher physically"

Since well, GER blitzed KC twice. The blitz was so horrible KC was basically frozen in comparison to GER. KC is one of the fastest stand in the series.

I'm assuming Damage just typed it quickly, everyone in this thread agreed upon, even Efi, that a likely higher is fair and warranted.
Also yeah, pretty sure King Crimson is top 3 fastest non infinite speed stands, hell, he may even be second or tied with it.

 

[manu_zarri]

I'm pretty sure the conclusion at the moment is:

"At least MFTL physically, Infinite with RTZ".

I say "At Least MFTL, Likely Higher, Infinite with RtZ"

The Likely Higher is for the argument that Chariot said before

 

[Zel97]

Seems correct enough. If there's no more disagreement then we can close this

 

[StrymULTRA]

Wrong, GER only managed to resist the prediction through the use of RTZ, the prediction was still seemingly going to happen regardless of what GER before RTZ came into effect, which means two things, either GER was absolutely fated to be dealt that blow, or GER wasn't bound by fate and the single argument that I can think that opposes everything about this is moot, because the Epitaph fate manip didnt effect him, meaning, GER simply was just not fast enough to defend in that situation.

The last part is an headcanon, GER perfectly was able to, but, as you said, he was casual asf, he just wanted to **** with Diavolo, and just used the ability to mess with him, nothing else.

 

[Chariot190]

Seems correct enough. If there's no more disagreement then we can close this

Strym and Darkness still have some disagreements, like, as much as I would ******* love to finish this shit and get back to dying and take a break, I wanna be fair here.

 

[Damage3245]

The last part is an headcanon, GER perfectly was able to, but, as you said, he was casual asf, he just wanted to **** with Diavolo, and just used the ability to mess with him, nothing else.

Your own post seems like headcanon to me.

 

[StrymULTRA]

Your own post seems like headcanon to me.

How Giorno dealed with opponents is an headcanon now? Look at Melone, Cioccolata or Ghiaccio, he always wanted to make them suffer in the end of the fight, and Diavolo was the same, Giorno was like a cat torturing the mouse before finishing it for good.

 

[Chariot190]

The last part is an headcanon, GER perfectly was able to, but, as you said, he was casual asf, he just wanted to **** with Diavolo, and just used the ability to mess with him, nothing else.

Dude, that's literally what we see happen. How is something we outright see in the process of happening headcanon?
Did King Crimson throw a punch at Giorno?
Was that punch the same punch that in the vision, we see gouge out his heart?
Was GER not doing absolutely anything to defend himself or Giorno?
Did Diavolo claim the dude to the extreme circumstances he was just barely faster on the draw.
Was the only reason we know that prevented that vision from coming to pass due to RTZ kicking in right before the punch landed?

If all of those are true, and we say that GER does resist fate, then the excuse of him being bound to fate to have that play out is void and null now, it's just him not being able to defend Giorno in time, because ******* around or not, he obviously didnt want Giorno to get his heart ripped out and that's what was seemingly about to happen before RTZ kicked in before King Crimson could finish that blow.
His ability doesn't have the capability to show fake visions and the like so...

 

[Damage3245]

How Giorno dealed with opponents is an headcanon now? Look at Melone, Cioccolata or Ghiaccio, he always wanted to make them suffer in the end of the fight, and Diavolo was the same, Giorno was like a cat torturing the mouse before finishing it for good.

Giorno's past experience and fighting style is irrelevant. He's not even aware of RTZ, so he can't be using it to mess with Diavolo like that.

 

[BlackDarkness679]

None on all stats should be for physicals, cant be talking of RTZ, attack power and precision dont fit RTZ at all

Even in non canon GER is the only one standing up to MIH, ASB and JJ novel and not cuz of the ability

 

[Chariot190]

How Giorno dealed with opponents is an headcanon now? Look at Melone, Cioccolata or Ghiaccio, he always wanted to make them suffer in the end of the fight, and Diavolo was the same, Giorno was like a cat torturing the mouse before finishing it for good.

Yes, GER did indeed **** with Diavolo, he made him suffer, he even went out of his way twice to shit talk him and to call him out. And gave him a poetic end that's the pinnacle of suffering and vengeance to prove a point.
But ******* with Diavolo doesnt mean "Im going to let this dude punch out my user's heart which I demonstrably prove is a thing i do not want to happen panels later". And he cant control what Epitaph shows Diavolo so, that's out of GER's control.

 

[StrymULTRA]

Giorno's past experience and fighting style is irrelevant. He's not even aware of RTZ, so he can't be using it to mess with Diavolo like that.

The whole GER speech already explains why GER didn't react before, is because he wanted to show how Diavolo's actions were a Truth that will never be reached, he'd killed Diavolo if he wanted to, but he didn't because of the reasons I said.

 

[StrymULTRA]

But ******* with Diavolo doesnt mean "Im going to let this dude punch out my user's heart which I demonstrably prove is a thing i do not want to happen panels later". And he cant control what Epitaph shows Diavolo so, that's out of GER's control.

It does tbh, GER wanted to show to Diavolo how his actions will never happen, nothing else, the whole speech done after the RtZ activation proves it.

 

[Chariot190]

None on all stats should be for physicals, cant be talking of RTZ, attack power and such dont fit RTZ at all

Even in non canon GER is the only one standing up to MIH, ASB and JJ novel and not cuz of the ability

"Should" isnt an argument, especially when we know, for an absolute FACT that isn't the case and something that needs top be true. Yes, Attack power doesnt fit RTZ at all, and the same guide explains why GER's attack is so high, and? I explained above, multiple times, in great detail, it doesnt matter, at all.
I can even post the scan of Araki himself saying that the speed of Stand can and has referred to a Stand's ability's speed. And that's without getting into the fact that GER's Permeance stat is also clearly about RTZ along with the range of it.
Plus RTZ demonstrably being > GER, at least to a degree.
Like ngl, as long as the Epitaph sequence exists, base infinite is flawed, and if it didnt exist, it'd be a 50/50 coin toss at best.

In ASB GER is able to do so because of his ability so like.
And JJ Giorno is getting a profile later.