Golden Experience requiem fate manipulation

[ZillertheBucko]

I've been thinking about GER for a while now, and I've noticed some things about his scene that may or may not be important
1. GER's return to zero ability was able to change diavolo's guaranteed to occur future, even though the prediction should have been able to account for return to zero stopping DIavolo's attack against him. Shouldn't this be taken into consideration in his profile? GER may have something related to fate or precognition.
2. GER's death loop returns diavolo's death to 0, yet he ends up going to a new death every time. If it was being reverted then shouldn't Diavolo stop dying? The fact that he hasn't could possibly mean that GER is using another ability or that there is more to his main ability than what people say? There are also strange mechanics to the death loop that might be overlooked, such as the fact that he was able to make Diavolo unable to move in the 2nd one, or that he was able to control things such as the dog barking, and presumably he is preventing Diavolo from being able to summon king crimson (Diavolo is unaware of how he will die, which means that he can't use epitaph, and if he could he probably would have use king crimson to fight off the knife attacker guy or stop the car from running him over). At the very least, I believe there's no way that the infinite death loop is purely the work of "returning to zero"
3. GER states that Diavolo is "seeing the actions created by his movements" but that he will never reach them, which should be implying that the entire time erase scene never happened, and is just something GER showed Diavolo. This might also be supported by the fact that Diavolo also showed Bruno his future self during their fight scene (unknown if this is relevant or not)
I'd like to hear people's opinions on all of this, since I think it is all very interesting personally
also I'm new to this so sorry if I may have used wrong terms somehwere

 

[ZillertheBucko]

I really hope I don't sound insane on my first thread lmao

 

[Thelastmlg]

1. Is already on causality manipulation, I remember it being brought before, pretty sure causality manip covers this wince he is messing with events.

2. Still causality manip, he is returning diavolo's death to zero, then placing him on a new one, it is basically a bonus of it's abilities.

3. Well no, it definitely happened, ger simple nullified the entire event, if this was true it's ability would be perception manipulation instead of causality manip

 

[ZillertheBucko]

1. Is already on causality manipulation, I remember it being brought before, pretty sure causality manip covers this wince he is messing with events.

2. Still causality manip, he is returning diavolo's death to zero, then placing him on a new one, it is basically a bonus of it's abilities.

3. Well no, it definitely happened, ger simple nullified the entire event, if this was true it's ability would be perception manipulation instead of causality manip

1. I thought fate and causality manipulation were different? but maybe you're right
2. well you still admitted that he is placing him in a new one, which doesn't disprove my point
3. well why not both? After all, Diavolo did the same thing to Bruno but that doesn't mean he can't erase and skip time

 

[Bernkastelll]

1. I thought fate and causality manipulation were different? but maybe you're right

They are pretty similar but not the same, Fate manip usually is changing the future, while causality manip is like, changing/affecting/rejecting events from the past, leading in new futures

 

[ZillertheBucko]

They are pretty similar but not the same, Fate manip usually is changing the future, while causality manip is like, changing/affecting/rejecting events from the past, leading in new futures

so causality manipulation is automatically above precognition? I never new this, interesting

 

[Bernkastelll]

so causality manipulation is automatically above precognition? I never new this, interesting

No, wdym?

 

[ZillertheBucko]

No, wdym?

Oh sorry, I misunderstood
GER was able to deny diavolo's precognition so I was wondering if that's considered fate manipulation or still causality manipulation

 

[ZillertheBucko]

Uhhhhhh bump?

 

[ZillertheBucko]

bupm

 

[ZillertheBucko]

b u m p

 

[Tarang123]

They are pretty similar but not the same, Fate manip usually is changing the future, while causality manip is like, changing/affecting/rejecting events from the past, leading in new futures

Causality manip is manipulating the bonds between cause and effect

 

[Bernkastelll]

Causality manip is manipulating the bonds between cause and effect

Yeah I know, I was just giving some of the most commons examples in fiction, changing events to lead in new futures

 

[Chariot190]

1. GER's return to zero ability was able to change diavolo's guaranteed to occur future, even though the prediction should have been able to account for return to zero stopping DIavolo's attack against him. Shouldn't this be taken into consideration in his profile? GER may have something related to fate or precognition.

Nothing except maybe precog res or some sort of fate res.
Which I'm not inherently against, JoJoveller states that even if Epitaph predicts it, it won't come to pass against GER. Plus the whole sleeping slaves thing.

2. GER's death loop returns diavolo's death to 0, yet he ends up going to a new death every time. If it was being reverted then shouldn't Diavolo stop dying?

Not quite, Diavolo's death was set to 0, so every time he dies, he never actually dies and is returned to being fine, this is permanent, as such, Diavolo will never die, only experience death, for all eternity.

The fact that he hasn't could possibly mean that GER is using another ability or that there is more to his main ability than what people say?

Nope, it's been stated enough times in multiple sources that this is entirely due to RTZ, it's not some other ability, but merely another application of the same one.

There are also strange mechanics to the death loop that might be overlooked, such as the fact that he was able to make Diavolo unable to move in the 2nd one, or that he was able to control things such as the dog barking, and presumably he is preventing Diavolo from being able to summon king crimson (Diavolo is unaware of how he will die, which means that he can't use epitaph, and if he could he probably would have use king crimson to fight off the knife attacker guy or stop the car from running him over).

Diavolo not being able to move is notable, but that's more a byproduct of that specific death (I think DW001 was doing something about that) but rather than a specific power. GER didn't control the dog barking, zero evidence on that, it was probably literally just a normal dog. And the last point is actually true, that could be due to, as you said, or are implying, that King Crimson is unable to be summoned, but alternatively, another possibility is that King Crimson is simply "dead" if that makes any sense. We see when GER pummels it that it's all but destroyed, and we know due to JoJoveller that the pummel is what killed Diavolo, meaning, that we know for a fact they died there, it's very likely that Diavolo's death being set to 0 didn't include his Stand, at the very least Epitaph was long gone, as we see GER punch it clean off on panel and it falls off.

At the very least, I believe there's no way that the infinite death loop is purely the work of "returning to zero"

It is purely the work of RTZ, blatantly so, it's just RTZ has some versatility going for it beyond what most think.

GER states that Diavolo is "seeing the actions created by his movements" but that he will never reach them, which should be implying that the entire time erase scene never happened, and is just something GER showed Diavolo.

No? GER is talking about Diavlo's abilities that allow him to see the future actions of those caught in time skip but said predictions within Epitaph and time skip won't come to pass, GER even specifies he's talking about Diavolo's ability when he says that (he straight up says "your abilities" to Diavolo). This is super straightforward, GER is straight up talking about Diavolo's power that just lets him do literally that. The scene happened, Diavolo took action, the time skip occurred, Epitaph was used, it simply just got RTZ'd after the fact.

This might also be supported by the fact that Diavolo also showed Bruno his future self during their fight scene (unknown if this is relevant or not)

Completely disconnected topic and scene that has zero relation to the above sequence. That could be due to a few things, but we don't know which one in particular due to it never being confirmed atop of it being vague as to what's truly happening.

 

[ZillertheBucko]

Not quite, Diavolo's death was set to 0, so every time he dies, he never actually dies and is returned to being fine, this is permanent, as such, Diavolo will never die, only experience death, for all eternity.

so in other words does this mean that the reverted actions are guaranteed to happen again? This does raise a bit more confusion though, such as the fact that he dies in different ways and different times every time
I'd like to hear what you have to say about what return to zero actually does with the death loop

Diavolo not being able to move is notable, but that's more a byproduct of that specific death (I think DW001 was doing something about that) but rather than a specific power. GER didn't control the dog barking, zero evidence on that, it was probably literally just a normal dog. And the last point is actually true, that could be due to, as you said, or are implying, that King Crimson is unable to be summoned, but alternatively, another possibility is that King Crimson is simply "dead" if that makes any sense. We see when GER pummels it that it's all but destroyed, and we know due to JoJoveller that the pummel is what killed Diavolo, meaning, that we know for a fact they died there, it's very likely that Diavolo's death being set to 0 didn't include his Stand, at the very least Epitaph was long gone, as we see GER punch it clean off on panel and it falls off.

yeah....what does "DW001" mean again? sorry
also king crimson dying would kinda completely contradict the rules we have about jojo (minus chariot requiem) since one being alive should result in the other coming back too. This also is supported by Bruno still having his stand after he definitely had died, even if GER would have reset Diavolo's death and not King Crimson's, he would come back anyways since stands are always attached to the spirit or soul or whatever. Even Kira still has his stand after he dies at the end of part 4, I think Diavolo being the exception is a bit odd personally

No? GER is talking about Diavlo's abilities that allow him to see the future actions of those caught in time skip but said predictions within Epitaph and time skip won't come to pass, GER even specifies he's talking about Diavolo's ability when he says that (he straight up says "your abilities" to Diavolo). This is super straightforward, GER is straight up talking about Diavolo's power that just lets him do literally that. The scene happened, Diavolo took action, the time skip occurred, Epitaph was used, it simply just got RTZ'd after the fact.

"What you are seeing is indeed the truth" "You're seeing the movements created by your abilities"
the problem with this is the fact that at this time Diavolo is not using precog, he is simply looking around the time erase scene and looking at GER
and then of course he says that he will never arrive at set truth, which is showing that he would never actually erase time, and thus it is still entirely possible to make the argument that GER has more than just the ability to undo actions

 

[Nullflowerblush]

it's very likely that Diavolo's death being set to 0 didn't include his Stand, at the very least Epitaph was long gone

or his will was being reset to zero

 

[ZillertheBucko]

or his will was being reset to zero

****

 

[ZillertheBucko]

ok well to be fair, Diavolo clearly has the will to find out how he's going to die next (when he is panicking during the 4th death), yet doesn't use Epitaph at that moment
so..yeah

 

[Chariot190]

so in other words does this mean that the reverted actions are guaranteed to happen again? This does raise a bit more confusion though, such as the fact that he dies in different ways and different times every time
I'd like to hear what you have to say about what return to zero actually does with the death loop

Not inherently, the exact opposite really, they'll never come to pass, the events leading up to it might happen again, but when the actual action/event that got RTZ'd would happen again, it won't, it'll just go back to square one, which is essentially what's happening in the death loop for example, the act of dying keeps happening but the act of death itself is what got RTZ'd so him dying and staying dead won't happen.
And I wouldn't word it that way, that makes it seem like the Death Loop and RTZ are two different things when in actuality, we know the Death Loop is simply RTZ itself, but simply used upon a death, making it so it'll never come to pass. Death Loop and RTZ aren't two different abilities, it's still just RTZ.

yeah....what does "DW001" mean again? sorry

It's fine, just another user who has some ability additions in store for the likes of GER and a few random other things.

also king crimson dying would kinda completely contradict the rules we have about jojo (minus chariot requiem) since one being alive should result in the other coming back too.

Yes, but also no. That only really applies for standard fair, how would that work for RTZ and Death Loop? Who knows, but it very clearly isn't how it works normally, especially, as said, we straight up see King Crimson get dismantled and killed, and we know he was killed as JoJoveller confirms the pummel killed him.
Given the wacky interaction Diavolo is already going through that's already breaking numerous established conventions, Diavolo being RTZ'd back to life to experience death again but not his Stand would very well be in the realm of what's possible under GER's influence.

But of course, this is just speculation, to be honest, we do not know. It could be several things, it could be King Crimson is dead, it could be he's being prevented from summon him, it could be will, it could be Diavolo is simply dumb as shit and for some reason simply didn't even though that's against his character, hell it could unironically be something as contrived as "lol fate", etc. We do not know for sure why, so we can't really draw any conclusions from it.

This also is supported by Bruno still having his stand after he definitely had died, even if GER would have reset Diavolo's death and not King Crimson's, he would come back anyways since stands are always attached to the spirit or soul or whatever.

Actually, I'd forego Bruno from that, as he was dead, but hadn't died, if that makes any sense to you. You know what I mean probably. He's a very blatant anomaly and outlier due to GE's weird pseudo necromatic powers and Bruno's own super natural will.

Even Kira still has his stand after he dies at the end of part 4, I think Diavolo being the exception is a bit odd personally

Yeah see, this example is ok though, this one is a fair one. You are right here, Kira did keep his Stand after death, but that's not quite what happened to Diavolo, Diavolo didn't stay dead, he was brought back to life to experience death over and over again, was King Crimson as well? Well as said above, we don't actually know, but if I HAD to pick, I'd probably go with that as that's the most conservative option. Though I want to point out that Kira actually did lose Killer Queen after The Hands tore it apart and took Kira away as Kira lacks Killer Queen in Deadman Questions, a follow up on Kira after Part 4, where he's an amnesiac ghost assassin for hire.

Though I do want to point out, Araki has stated that Stands fade upon the death of the user, ceasing to exist. And we do see this happen several times as well.
So while your Kira example is indeed legit, it isn't always the case like that, it's been stated and shown that sometimes Stands do indeed fade and stop existing after death (hell it's why BIG had low-godly there for awhile).

So really, it's more case by case if anything due to Araki's widely inconsistent nature.

"What you are seeing is indeed the truth" "You're seeing the movements created by your abilities" the problem with this is the fact that at this time Diavolo is not using precog, he is simply looking around the time erase scene and looking at GER

First off, that isn't what GER says. His exact wording is.

"Yes, what you see is indeed 'Reality''. Your ability indeed sees the actions we will perform, however -"
GER is very, very, clearly talking about Diavolo's abilities being able to see the actions of others.
And Diavolo actually was using Epitaph to see what would happen, he checked Epitaph to see if he was gonna win, seen that it predicted his victory, and then he goes into attack, which then prompts everything to reverse, Diavolo goes wtf, and GER starts talking. GER could easily be talking about Epitaph still as that was more or less the last thing Diavolo did besides start a punch.

But, even if for some reason that wasn't the case.
It'd still apply to Time Skip.
Time Skip shows the actions of those caught within it as forecasted trails of their ongoing and future actions.
When you see those weird after-images of say, for example, Bruno, moving in time skip, that's forecasted images of what's going to happen, happened and is happening simultaneously.


"I can forecast the trails left by your movements, the trails of your future actions". (This is reiterated in two different guides as well).
So do note, even if he's only using Time Skip and not Epitaph, while Time Skip is up, he is still able to see the actions of those yet to happen from his and the word's perspective, it's just hyper focused to the timeframe he deleted only, and not beyond it. Which is why, presumably, he checks Epitaph against GER, to see if his hit is gonna land AFTER time resumes (as he can't actually land the blow in time skip, as JoJoveller states Diavolo can't actually attack in time skip, he has to time his attacks so they land just as time resumes).

None the less, GER straight up states he's referring to Diavolo's abilities, not his own RTZ ability so no matter how you slice it, it's on Diavolo's end, not GER's.

and then of course he says that he will never arrive at set truth, which is showing that he would never actually erase time, and thus it is still entirely possible to make the argument that GER has more than just the ability to undo actions

GER straight up says what Diavolo is seeing is indeed happening lad, that it is indeed reality, but he won't ever reach reality, because he's getting RTZ'd.
Did Diavolo erase time? Yes. Did that sequence actually happen? Yes (Especially when guides state things like GER effected Diavolo's time skip and shit, kinda confirming it did indeed happen and wasn't just Diavolo tripping really hard). But, the catch is, GER can make it so it never happened, the event occurred, it was just RTZ'd making it so it didn't happen, albeit after the fact it did. If that makes any sense to you at least.

Though, GER does have more abilities than that, RTZ isn't even just the ability to undo actions, it has versatility, it's less the ability to undo actions as it is the ability to invalidate something or make that something nothing (Which has been worded by Araki as the ability to turn anything/everything to nothing). Which is what we see, he made Time Skip never happen, he made Diavolo's death never happen, he (seemingly) made that brutal damage Gio took vanish.

I mean I get what you're saying, and I don't disagree, GER does have more abilities than just "undo", but said abilities are a byproduct of his single ability, RTZ, it's one ability but used in multiple ways, much like Crazy Diamond's restoration or the Soft & Wet's ability, it's only a single ability that has "one" specific attribute, but said attribute is malleable and diverse enough to be able to do many things

ok well to be fair, Diavolo clearly has the will to find out how he's going to die next (when he is panicking during the 4th death), yet doesn't use Epitaph at that moment

Could be will, could be death, could be RTZ'ing the manifestation of the Stand, could be many things, we don't know so we can't say for sure anything much

tldr, you ain't wrong in the GER has some extra abilities, but they're all just a product of a single, greater, ability.

 

[ZillertheBucko]

Not inherently, the exact opposite really, they'll never come to pass, the events leading up to it might happen again, but when the actual action/event that got RTZ'd would happen again, it won't, it'll just go back to square one, which is essentially what's happening in the death loop for example, the act of dying keeps happening but the act of death itself is what got RTZ'd so him dying and staying dead won't happen.
And I wouldn't word it that way, that makes it seem like the Death Loop and RTZ are two different things when in actuality, we know the Death Loop is simply RTZ itself, but simply used upon a death, making it so it'll never come to pass. Death Loop and RTZ aren't two different abilities, it's still just RTZ.



It's fine, just another user who has some ability additions in store for the likes of GER and a few random other things.



Yes, but also no. That only really applies for standard fair, how would that work for RTZ and Death Loop? Who knows, but it very clearly isn't how it works normally, especially, as said, we straight up see King Crimson get dismantled and killed, and we know he was killed as JoJoveller confirms the pummel killed him.
Given the wacky interaction Diavolo is already going through that's already breaking numerous established conventions, Diavolo being RTZ'd back to life to experience death again but not his Stand would very well be in the realm of what's possible under GER's influence.

But of course, this is just speculation, to be honest, we do not know. It could be several things, it could be King Crimson is dead, it could be he's being prevented from summon him, it could be will, it could be Diavolo is simply dumb as shit and for some reason simply didn't even though that's against his character, hell it could unironically be something as contrived as "lol fate", etc. We do not know for sure why, so we can't really draw any conclusions from it.



Actually, I'd forego Bruno from that, as he was dead, but hadn't died, if that makes any sense to you. You know what I mean probably. He's a very blatant anomaly and outlier due to GE's weird pseudo necromatic powers and Bruno's own super natural will.



Yeah see, this example is ok though, this one is a fair one. You are right here, Kira did keep his Stand after death, but that's not quite what happened to Diavolo, Diavolo didn't stay dead, he was brought back to life to experience death over and over again, was King Crimson as well? Well as said above, we don't actually know, but if I HAD to pick, I'd probably go with that as that's the most conservative option. Though I want to point out that Kira actually did lose Killer Queen after The Hands tore it apart and took Kira away as Kira lacks Killer Queen in Deadman Questions, a follow up on Kira after Part 4, where he's an amnesiac ghost assassin for hire.

Though I do want to point out, Araki has stated that Stands fade upon the death of the user, ceasing to exist. And we do see this happen several times as well.
So while your Kira example is indeed legit, it isn't always the case like that, it's been stated and shown that sometimes Stands do indeed fade and stop existing after death (hell it's why BIG had low-godly there for awhile).

So really, it's more case by case if anything due to Araki's widely inconsistent nature.



First off, that isn't what GER says. His exact wording is.

"Yes, what you see is indeed 'Reality''. Your ability indeed sees the actions we will perform, however -"
GER is very, very, clearly talking about Diavolo's abilities being able to see the actions of others.
And Diavolo actually was using Epitaph to see what would happen, he checked Epitaph to see if he was gonna win, seen that it predicted his victory, and then he goes into attack, whcih then prompts everything to reverse, Diavolo goes wtf, and GER starts talking. GER could easily be talking about Epitaph still as that was more or less the less thing Diavolo did besides start a punch.

But, even if for some reason that wasn't the case.
It'd still apply to Time Skip.
Time Skip shows the actions of those caught within it as forecasted trails of their ongoing and future actions.
When you see those weird after-images of say, for example, Bruno, moving in time skip, that's forecasted images of what's going to happen, happened and is happening simultaneously.


"I can forecast the trails left by your movements, the trails of your future actions". (This is reiterated in two different guides as well).
So do note, even if he's only using Time Skip and not Epitaph, while Time Skip is up, he is still able to see the actions of those yet to happen from his and the word's perspective, it's just hyper focused to the timeframe he deleted only, and not beyond it. Which is why, presumably, he checks Epitaph against GER, to see if his hit is gonna land AFTER time resumes (as he can't actually land the blow in time skip, as JoJoveller states Diavolo can't actually attack in time skip, he has to time his attacks so they land just as time resumes).

None the less, GER straight up states he's referring to Diavolo's abilities, not his own RTZ ability so no matter how you slice it, it's on Diavolo's end, not GER's.



GER straight up says what Diavolo is seeing is indeed happening lad, that it is indeed reality, but he won't ever reach reality, because he's getting RTZ'd.
Did Diavolo erase time? Yes. Did that sequence actually happen? Yes (Especially when guides state things like GER effected Diavolo's time skip and shit, kinda confirming it did indeed happen and wasn't just Diavolo tripping really hard). But, the catch is, GER can make it so it never happened, the event occurred, it was just RTZ'd making it so it didn't happen, albeit after the fact it did. If that makes any sense to you at least.

Though, GER does have more abilities than that, RTZ isn't even just the ability to undo actions, it has versatility, it's less the ability to undo actions as it is the ability to invalidate something or make that something nothing (Which has been worded by Araki as the ability to turn anything/everything to nothing). Which is what we see, he made Time Skip never happen, he made Diavolo's death never happen, he (seemingly) made that brutal damage Gio took vanish.

I mean I get what you're saying, and I don't disagree, GER does have more abilities than just "undo", but said abilities are a byproduct of his single ability, RTZ, it's one ability but used in multiple ways, much like Crazy Diamond's restoration or the Soft & Wet's ability, it's only a single ability that has "one" specific attribute, but said attribute is malleable and diverse enough to be able to do many things



Could be will, could be death, could be RTZ'ing the manifestation of the Stand, could be many things, we don't know so we can't say for sure anything much

tldr, you ain't wrong in the GER has some extra abilities, but they're all just a product of a single, greater, ability.

ok, this does admittedly clear up a lot of stuff
but at the same time GER is so complicated....I might just step away from GER related things for a while

 

[DRW001]

Your questions have already been answered so I won't talk about them, but to answer your title, yes, you can definitely argue that GER has extra abilities that aren't listed on his profile currently, but some/most of them are derived from his main ability.

Resistance to fate manipulation is one, like chariot said, JoJoveller states that even if Epitaph predicts Giorno and GER's death, it won't ever come to pass. The sleeping slaves arc talks about how 'fate is a sleeping slave' and that Giorno set it free. In interviews, Araki also states that challenging and overcoming fate was his biggest theme throughout part 5. Also, in part 6, Giorno was literally fated to be drawn to Pucci, since he's a son of Dio. And yet, he just wasn't.

For what it's worth as well, Weiß Schwarz (Japanese card game) did a collaboration with the golden wind anime and for Giorno's final cards, he's referred to as being 'chosen by fate' in both of them. This is just supplementary evidence at best though.

The BFR that happens during the death loop is another one. If it was purely causality manip that was used on Diavolo's death, then he would've suffered the same death over and over again. We clearly see that doesn't happen. We also see that each of his deaths happen in a different place as well as a different time (one took place like 72 hours forward in time, others have day and night cycles). Even if you want to say this is limited to the death loop, clear BFR was showcased there.

There's also an argument to made for GER having soul manipulation but it's quite lengthy so I won't talk about it here. I will hopefully make a CRT for it in the future though. (I just haven't done it yet due to IRL shit + me being lazy)

 

[ZillertheBucko]

coming back to this, there's still a major issue that bugs me about GER
basically from what I understand, it is agreed that he makes it so that an action in the future will "never occur"
DRW seemed to have most of it down perfectly, but there is still the big issue of "the events leading up to it may happen again"
but that still is sorta completely contradictory from what I can tell, for some reasons. First of all, the death loop's point is that each death has completely different events leading up to the deaths, and it's not like the deaths are necessarily similar in any way
of course, the 1st 2 deaths were somewhat connected, and they do have him being stabbed both times
but the third one involves him being hit by a car, everything about it seems to be unrelated. And then there's the idea that the events leading up to it don't repeat, which means GER would have to be using another ability to make Diavolo continue dying in new ways like that
you could argue that well, maybe the thing he resets just happens again in a more symbolic way, and it doesn't matter how as long as he still "dies" in the end
but there are still more issues
when he first uses return to zero on time erase, completely different things happen
the first time, Diavolo ends up being reset back to his starting point after skipping time and attempting to punch Giorno but when the next thing occurs, Diavolo simply gets pummeled into the river by GER. These clearly are not even remotely close events.
and then, maybe you could say that GER can choose whether the event repeats or not, but still, there's more problems
According to you, Jojoveller states that GER's rush KILLED diavolo. If the action would never happen because of GER not allowing it to pass, then Diavolo shouldn't have died there....or shouldn't have died again? I'm gonna skip past this part, because I'm starting to confuse myself a lot but maybe that could have made some kind of sense later to whoever reads this
anyways, here's my explanation
1. GER does indeed have the return to zero, but that main ability also includes fate manipulation or precognition nullification as an ability, since it was able to ignore the king crimson's prediction entirely
2. King Crimson's time erasure was nullified, which could translate into some counter to acausality, but it's not really clear to me if return to zero activated during or immediately after time erasure ended, so it might not be plausible
3. I do believe GER has fate manipulation, and I also believe that is what allows the death loop to happen. To sum it up, this is pointed to by the fact that the death repeats in many different ways, circumstances, and Diavolo seems to have absolutely no way to stop the deaths from happening (regardless of the stuff stated earlier, this alone is at least some form of fate hax) and also the earlier example of GER being able to beat precog of course.
4. if this turns out to be a load of bullshit though, at the very least GER has BFR, precog resistance, causality manipulation, and some degree of control over Diavolo's body and actions during the death loop
(I currently don't think this is bullshit tho)



anyways bump

 

[ZillertheBucko]

also as for soul manipulation, I assume it has something to do with the actions of other people in the death loop who help kill diavolo repeatedly

 

[ZillertheBucko]

Bump

 

[ZillertheBucko]

bump

 

[ZillertheBucko]

bupm

 

[ZillertheBucko]

bump

 

[ZillertheBucko]

bump

 

[ZillertheBucko]

bump

 

[ZillertheBucko]

Bump

 

[ZillertheBucko]

bump

 

[ZillertheBucko]

Bump

 

[ZillertheBucko]

bump

 

[ZillertheBucko]

bump

 

[Eficiente]

Why is this still openned? GER doesn't have Fate Manip.

 

[ZillertheBucko]

Why is this still openned? GER doesn't have Fate Manip.

well there's still questions to be answered about it, so closing it now would be kinda dumb

 

[ZillertheBucko]

but mainly because nobody really acknowledged my last message so

 

[Tarang123]

well there's still questions to be answered about it, so closing it now would be kinda dumb

You can put the question in questions and answers

 

[ZillertheBucko]

You can put the question in questions and answers

ok well less of a question and more of somewhat an assertion, really
anyways the point is, the thread isn't done and there's no reason the thread should be closed

 

[ZillertheBucko]

Bump