Epic Battle Fantasy: Disrupted Dimensional Order To Be Downgraded

[Psychomaster35]

Yeah, looks like someone here disrupted order here...

Currently, everyone in EBF5 scales to Low 1-C through the party being able to fight the Devourer who views the entire world as a simulation. As much as this would scale to the Devourer (And to an extent, the Player) due to both of them existing outside of the EBF multiverse and viewing it as fiction, the issue arises over the fact that the party fought the Devourer inside the simulation. Basically, when the Devourer fought the party, it went inside of the very simulation it made in order to fight them, thus causing its own dimensionality to equal its simulation. It's pretty much like how a 3-D human goes inside their computer causing their own dimensionality to become the level of data, thereby making them weaker. That being said, there is no reason for the Party (And everyone else scaling to the party to an extent) to scale to the outside-simulation Devourer.

Furthermore, when the Devourer eventually left to go to the Player's higher dimension, there is no evidence that the Player actually sees the outside-universe Devourer as fiction in terms of being qualitatively superior. That being said, its keys should be like this:

Key: Inside its simulation | Outside its simulation/In the Player's dimension

So what will be the new ratings, you ask? Simple. The Devourer inside its simulation is strong enough to nuke the entire cosmology of EBF, which contains at least 2 universes (The main world and Snowflake's universe). Given that the party can fight the in-simulation Devourer, their new rating should be 2-C scaling to 2 universes.

As a little bonus to make up for the downgrade, the Devourer's lifting strength and speed outside of the simulation should be Immeasurable over the fact that it exists outside of the EBF multiverse that it views as a simulation, thereby making it qualitatively superior.

 

[Livinmeme]

Sad...But I agree (also why does the party have plot manip?)

 

[Psychomaster35]

also why does the party have plot manip?

That would be me. The party is passively controlled by the Player who disrupts the Devourer's own plot manipulation.

 

[Deidalius]

@Ikelaggan You also like EBF, thoughts?

RN I am leaning to agree with OP, but I want to hear counterarguments

 

[James_Plays_4_Games]

So what will be the new ratings, you ask? Simple. The Devourer inside its simulation is strong enough to nuke the entire cosmology of EBF, which contains at least 2 universes (The main world and Snowflake's universe). Given that the party can fight the in-simulation Devourer, their new rating should be 2-C scaling to 2 universes.

It looks like the Devourer split the Earth and then magically pulled the two parts back together. Despite this, the Devourer seems like the kind of character to be canonically portrayed as having tier 2 power. Is there a reason for why the feat looks like it's only on a planetary scale despite the dialogue? Details surrounding a feat are very important. I'm not familiar with this series, but your revision proposal looks otherwise sound to me.

 

[Deidalius]

BTW, Does Devourer resetting the timeline multiple times amount to anything higher than 2-C?

 

[Psychomaster35]

@Ikelaggan You also like EBF, thoughts?

RN I am leaning to agree with OP, but I want to hear counterarguments

You can't ping others as a regular member, but I'll ping 'm for you.

@Ikelaggan

Is there a reason for why the feat looks like it's only on a planetary scale despite the dialogue?

Watch the video I linked. It straight up states that it's going to reset the simulation, AKA the universe it made.

BTW, Does Devourer resetting the timeline multiple times amount to anything higher than 2-C?

No, it's just a repeat of the same attack over and over. It's not getting any stronger than that.

 

[James_Plays_4_Games]

Watch the video I linked. It straight up states that it's going to reset the simulation, AKA the universe it made.

I was referring to the video linked in what I wrote. What is stated and what is shown are two different things for some reason, and I'm curious about why that is.

Edit: I mean, in what I wrote, I was referring to what you had linked.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

Looks reasonable

 

[Ikelaggan]

Ironically I'm okay with being in the line of agreement with the OP since this AP change won't disrupt the balance of the player cast having a low 1-C Smurf passive assistance from the player outside EBF. Also Devourer gaining immeasurable speed is sort of a good trade off.

 

[Ikelaggan]

But my big question is "will the Devourer gain actual HDE" with this change?

 

[Psychomaster35]

But my big question is "will the Devourer gain actual HDE" with this change?

I mean, given that the Devourer is from another multiverse and that the world of EBF it made is viewed as a simulation to it, it should get Higher Dimensional Existence especially with the fact that it can reach the Player's dimension since the Player also sees the entirety of EBF as fiction.

 

[Ailamiona]

Agree with the downgrades. No reason they should've scaled to outside-of-verse Devourer, especially considering that they get nuked by the Devourer summon as well

 

[Deidalius]

I agree with OP.

 

[Topaz404]

Yeah, i am kinda leaning to OP as well, because while i think Low 1-C party is funny, yeah, it doesnt have much reasoning.
There does pose the question, though. The Glitch dimension where you fight the Glitch should be its own universe, no? Or is it not qualified to?

Also, might there be anything to gain the party something higher then MFTL speeds? I dont remember it clearly, but didnt one of the party members mention the Gigalith was slowly eating away at the timeline?

 

[Livinmeme]

Yeah, i am kinda leaning to OP as well, because while i think Low 1-C party is funny, yeah, it doesnt have much reasoning.
There does pose the question, though. The Glitch dimension where you fight the Glitch should be its own universe, no? Or is it not qualified to?

Also, might there be anything to gain the party something higher then MFTL speeds? I dont remember it clearly, but didnt one of the party members mention the Gigalith was slowly eating away at the timeline?

Existing in a void doesn't give you immensurable anymore, thanks DC for that I guess...

 

[Topaz404]

Damn you DC!
I guess theyre stuck in that speed range, unless something comes up for potential Infinite (doubt)

Anyways
Glitch World
Wouldnt that be a dimension as well, even though its really one "room" within the game? Just something i wanted to ask about

 

[Psychomaster35]

Anyways
Glitch World
Wouldnt that be a dimension as well, even though its really one "room" within the game? Just something i wanted to ask about

There aren’t really any statements of it (And the other 4 glitch areas) being universes

 

[Topaz404]

Yeah, thats fair. But honestly, im here to agree. Downgrades suck, but it makes after all
I mean they have Plot Manip still, sooooo it doesnt hurt that much lol

 

[Ikelaggan]

The plot manipulation stuff for the players is gonna make them smurfed at the end of the day.

 

[ProudLearner]

I agree with the OP.

 

[Dereck03]

OP seems fine.

 

[Theglassman12]

looks fine I guess, not the most knowledgeable on the games so.

 

[StrymULTRA]

The Devourer inside its simulation is strong enough to nuke the entire cosmology of EBF

Is this a scan for these?

• Low Complex Multiverse level (Managed to reach the player's higher dimension and close the game if summoned by party)
• Higher-Dimensional Manipulation (Was able to reach into and manipulate parts of the player's higher dimension)

Both are scanless, and worst of all, the scan doesn't exactly say that it reaches said higher dimension, nor mentions a higher dimension at all. Kinda bad for something that's the basis of a whole verse's tiering.

 

[Ikelaggan]

Is this a scan for these?

• Low Complex Multiverse level (Managed to reach the player's higher dimension and close the game if summoned by party)
• Higher-Dimensional Manipulation (Was able to reach into and manipulate parts of the player's higher dimension)

Both are scanless, and worst of all, the scan doesn't exactly say that it reaches said higher dimension, nor mentions a higher dimension at all. Kinda bad for something that's the basis of a whole verse's tiering.

I hate that those are scanless but somehow the easiest to find when you search for it.

 

[Psychomaster35]

Is this a scan for these?

• Low Complex Multiverse level (Managed to reach the player's higher dimension and close the game if summoned by party)
• Higher-Dimensional Manipulation (Was able to reach into and manipulate parts of the player's higher dimension)

Both are scanless, and worst of all, the scan doesn't exactly say that it reaches said higher dimension, nor mentions a higher dimension at all. Kinda bad for something that's the basis of a whole verse's tiering.

Here

 

[StrymULTRA]

Already saw.

Timestamp is later than I wanted to, but I've noticed that it's around 44:17.

Anyway, Low 1-C for him seems iffy. While I don't doubt the Player's realm is 5D, the Devourer's thing seems vague, as he only talked about how he went outside the game world through affecting our PC and hiding in the cosmic background radiation, that's basically space itself. It would be weird if he meant that he's now a literal omnipresent being across the Player's universe, but feels more him just becoming more "real" through becoming data outside the game and that would eventually return there while "hiding" outside of the game world through lurking in the PC, as he still says that is data after all.

Plus, if he planned to just nuke everything, why he didn't do that in this supposed higher form? He should be even stronger due to him having some superiority over the game, no?

Aka I don't think the Low 1-C key should even exist. That would be just Immortality 9 due to its true self being data that exist outside the game world and that needs a physical form to interact with it. Range idk... I suppose it'd be something like "Planetary with regular attacks (His energy wave sliced through Earth), Low Multiversal with resets, Unknown but far higher for his data form".

 

[Ikelaggan]

Plus, if he planned to just nuke everything, why he didn't do that in this supposed higher form? He should be even stronger due to him having some superiority over the game, no?

The reason he doesn't Auto nuke the verse is because the player outside the game is disrupting the control over the system and with how the players plot manipulation works even if he has a huge power difference it wouldn't matter if he won cause the player will just keep playing the game and continue the cycle which has happened technically multiple times when he mentions this is the fifth time he's ran the simulation.

 

[LordGriffin1000]

The downgrade/changes seem fine enough.

 

[StrymULTRA]

The reason he doesn't Auto nuke the verse is because the player outside the game is disrupting the control over the system and with how the players plot manipulation works even if he has a huge power difference it wouldn't matter if he won cause the player will just keep playing the game and continue the cycle which has happened technically multiple times when he mentions this is the fifth time he's ran the simulation.

Ok, my problem though it's that he explicitly said that he'll come back once he gets a physical form and that for now he'll lurk in the PC.

This doesn't exactly sound Low 1-C anyway.

 

[Ikelaggan]

Ok, my problem though it's that he explicitly said that he'll come back once he gets a physical form and that for now he'll lurk in the PC.

This doesn't exactly sound Low 1-C anyway.

But the OP goes over how the Devourer views the world as a simulation and how the Qualitative superiorty differences between the two didn't really change both even before entering the simulation and after going out.

 

[StrymULTRA]

But the OP goes over how the Devourer views the world as a simulation and how the Qualitative superiorty differences between the two didn't really change both even before entering the simulation and after going out.

If you talk about this, it seems more about him being aware of the universe being merely a simulation like Monika. In fact he even reffers to the Player's world as "your higher dimension", implying it wasn't exactly his home world.

This is technically QS, but it's fucky because it's hinted he lurks in the PC rather than him literally entering in the Player's world, which isn't exactly the same case as basically any other example for R>F where the characters are completely outside the device that holds the fictional world.

 

[Deidalius]

Devourer low 1-C removal incoming? :0

 

[Ikelaggan]

If you talk about this, it seems more about him being aware of the universe being merely a simulation like Monika. In fact he even reffers to the Player's world as "your higher dimension", implying it wasn't exactly his home world.

Except this is a false equivalence since the Devourer isn't adjacent to the EBF multiverse to begin with and has the monoliths as a defense system that summons him into said multiverse. Which I wouldn't even consider the Devourer to even have R<F if he was already native to the reality he's veiwing as fiction to begin with.

 

[StrymULTRA]

Except this is a false equivalence since the Devourer isn't adjacent to the EBF multiverse to begin with and has the monoliths as a defense system that summons him into said multiverse. Which I wouldn't even consider the Devourer to even have R<F if he was already native to the reality he's veiwing as fiction to begin with.

Still, I find it pretty weird to give Tier 1 for something that isn't exactly outside the thing that contains the fictional world. Would a sentient book that holds a Tier 2 cosmology within itself be still Low 1-C for example?

 

[Ikelaggan]

Still, I find it pretty weird to give Tier 1 for something that isn't exactly outside the thing that contains the fictional world. Would a sentient book that holds a Tier 2 cosmology within itself be still Low 1-C for example?

If the book is just a container for that cosmology and not a writer or manipulator that can change the contents inside that book then probably no.

 

[StrymULTRA]

If the book is just a container for that cosmology and not a writer or manipulator that can change the contents inside that book then probably no.

That was my problem, aye. And the Book analogy is bad because in this case it'd be the hardware, while the Devourer here is just a sentient file outside of the program but still in the pc.

Which makes his superiority kinda questionable.

 

[Ikelaggan]

That was my problem, aye. And the Book analogy is bad because in this case it'd be the hardware, while the Devourer here is just a sentient file outside of the game world.

Which makes his superiority kinda questionable.

I agree the book analogy is bad, that's because if the Devourer was just some data that just exists outside the game something the opposite of the glitch boss who only has a very limited range of what it can manipulate inside the game despite being apart of the game's code while the Devourer is able to manipulate the laws, fate, and plot while outside the game to a much greater degree. Which I'd only find the superiority questionable if he only just had the statements that eluded R>F with no feats to support it like ajimu in Medaka box.

 

[Livinmeme]

This is technically QS, but it's fucky because it's hinted he lurks in the PC rather than him literally entering in the Player's world, which isn't exactly the same case as basically any other example for R>F where the characters are completely outside the device that holds the fictional world.

No? That still would be 5-D

 

[Deidalius]

Wouldn't being inside a PC and being inside a simulation be the same thing? Both are code and electricity