Elden Ring Speed CRT

[Chritin]

Credit to Chariot for coming up with this idea and helping to build on it. (Also I accidentally posted this in a Sandbox before instead and have no clue how to delete it, so I'm reposting it in the proper forum)

Basically, we see During Astel's boss fight that Astel is able to summon portals that connect to space and bring down Meteoroids. This is even corroborated by the spell "Meteorites of Astel" which is the same exact attack that Astel used in his boss fight. The point here is by summoning Meteoroids from voids in space, makes dodging them a lot more impressive.

There are multiple sources that describe meteoroids as being able to move from 42 km/s all the way up to 71-72 km/s. Considering the fact these meteoroids come from voids (virtually pure vacuums), I think it is more likely they are moving at the higher-end speed of 71-72 km/s, but either way, this would make at least the late-game Elden Ring characters Massively Hypersonic.

Sources:

Meteor

A meteor is a streak of light in the sky caused by a meteoroid passing through Earth's atmosphere.

education.nationalgeographic.org

Meteor and meteoroid - Space Rocks, Fireballs, Trails

Meteor and meteoroid - Space Rocks, Fireballs, Trails: On any clear night beyond the bright lights of cities, one can see with the naked eye several meteors per hour. Meteors can last for a small fraction of a second up to several seconds. Quite often, as the glowing meteoroid streaks through...

www.britannica.com

Meteoroid - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

Ngl you didn't really need to make a CRT but rather just post in the profiles thread.

 

[Chariot190]

Ngl you didn't really need to make a CRT but rather just post in the profiles thread.

w̵e̵ ̵d̵i̵d̵ ̵t̵h̵a̵t̵ ̵f̵o̵u̵r̵ ̵t̵i̵m̵e̵s̵ ̵t̵h̵o̵

 

[Chritin]

Ngl you didn't really need to make a CRT but rather just post in the profiles thread.

Sorry, I'm still new to the forums so I just assumed this section would be good for it. Plus, it is a CR so It does still fit

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

If I hadn't said it before, I agree to this.

Radahn's gravity thing should be FTL smh

 

[Chritin]

If I hadn't said it before, I agree to this.

Radahn's gravity thing should be FTL smh

I've had the same idea but don't think it would fly by most people's standards.

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

I've had the same idea but don't think it would fly by most people's standards.

It's worth the shot smh, don't be scared, everyone on the wiki has proposed the wildest shit one time or another

 

[Chariot190]

Obviously I agree, looking at the speed of meteoroids in a vacuum, almost everything from some NASA shit to just random articles listed of speeds that are within low MHS, so yeah, anything Astel or above should be MHS be default.
Coincidentally, it lines up with the previous boss being HH so there's even a bit of actual progression.

 

[Mr. Bambu]

In-atmosphere meteors are 11,000 m/s, btw. That much is site standard.

 

[Chritin]

In-atmosphere meteors are 11,000 m/s, btw. That much is site standard.

We aren't talking about in-atmosphere meteors though. The only argument I can see to classify these meteoroids as in-atmosphere meteors would be to say they slow down once they enter the portal and come into the boss room, but even then that minor speed decrease would be borderline negligible considering it takes regular meteoroid minutes of traveling against air resistance to slow down. Basically, meteoroids from space instantly entering our atmosphere and traveling very little distance would not get a significant speed decrease like normal meteors

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

Also I feel we can calc the Tarnished dodging these meteors.

 

[Mr. Bambu]

We aren't talking about in-atmosphere meteors though. The only argument I can see to classify these meteoroids as in-atmosphere meteors would be to say they slow down once they enter the portal and come into the boss room, but even then that minor speed decrease would be borderline negligible considering it takes regular meteoroid minutes of traveling against air resistance to slow down. Basically, meteoroids from space instantly entering our atmosphere and traveling very little distance would not get a significant speed decrease like normal meteors

Last I checked, Elden Ring takes place within an atmosphere. We have this exact same situation with the Living Failures from Bloodborne- opening portals, shooting meteors at the player. That is currently taken at 11 km/s.

Sorry man.

 

[Chariot190]

In-atmosphere meteors are 11,000 m/s, btw. That much is site standard.

Yes, in-atmosphere, though I'm pretty sure we use 17,000mps for in-atmosphere average but regardless.

Idk if you're just pointing it out for future reference or saying Astel's would just be that, but the point here is that Astel's wouldn't be the average speed of meteorites but rather the speed of meteoroids in a vacuum, space, as they're directly portaled from space onto the enemy, they don't actually go through the whole re-entry thing, the speed that should be used would be how fast those things move, on average, in the vacuum of space, preferably deep space but couldn't find much on that.

Last I checked, Elden Ring takes place within an atmosphere. We have this exact same situation with the Living Failures from Bloodborne- opening portals, shooting meteors at the player. That is currently taken at 11 km/s.

Uh, that just means they should be revised too? Also wrong verse lad, this is Elden Ring, not Bloodborne. Also you're kinda just being disingenuous, if you open a portal to the middle of space to pluck a MHS rock from it, without actually manipulating its speed or trajectory or doling anything that would chance its velocity, well the MHS rock is MHS still.

Also I feel we can calc the Tarnished dodging these meteors.

We should probably calc Tarnished dodging the bat screeches from start of the game just in case we need a speed for the very early game dudes, I have some footage of it saved somewhere, idk if it's sufficient for a calc though.

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

Chariot and Chritin make more sense to me.

 

[Mr. Bambu]

it's always disingenous when I do it, don'tcha know, it's simply part of my being

Bro, I'm aware of what verse I am talking about. This is why, if you squint incredibly hard, you can see that I said it was a similar situation to Bloodborne, rather than Bloodborne. You might further notice I mentioned Elden Ring.

Moving on. I am citing site standard. A precedent with zero difference to this one, that was the ruling. It is quite literally no different. So, we would use the precedent in most cases. That was the purpose of my post, had you been inclined to read the words that were not "Bloodborne".

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

We should probably calc Tarnished dodging the bat screeches from start of the game just in case we need a speed for the very early game dudes, I have some footage of it saved somewhere, idk if it's sufficient for a calc though.

I feel it's better to have a calc for these things.

 

[Mr. Bambu]

Aye, do calc that. I will eval it after if ya send it my way.

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

I feel it's better to have a calc for these things.

Considering you can dodge the Sonic Blasts at Point Blank Range, I'm sure it's somewhere in the Supersonic Range.

 

[Chariot190]

Bro, I'm aware of what verse I am talking about. This is why, if you squint incredibly hard, you can see that I said it was a similar situation to Bloodborne, rather than Bloodborne. You might further notice I mentioned Elden Ring.

Yes, except the similar situation is also wrong, if you what you said is true, that's just trying to apply a faulty situation onto this situation, two wrongs don't make a right. But still, Bloodborne ain't Elden Ring, keep it relevant otherwise we may as well bring everything into this and I don't see that ending well.

Moving on. I am citing site standard. A precedent with zero difference to this one, that was the ruling. It is quite literally no different. So, we would use the precedent in most cases. That was the purpose of my post, had you been inclined to read the words that were not "Bloodborne".

Yeah a site standard, for something this isn't? You know that right? We're not talking about in-atmosphere meteorites, we're talking about vacuum of space meteoroids, they are not the same thing, so whatever standard you think applies, doesn't, because there is no such standard, they're simply objectively different things. So, as I said prior, what are you trying to say exactly? Nothing you said even applies, and at best is a false equivalence, but in reality your example is just wrong too, if it's truly a similar situation then we can look into that at a later date as well.

 

[Chariot190]

If someone wants to calc it that's all well and good too, better to have a more precise value than not to.

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

Do you happen to have footage of both Chariot? I'll try request someone to calc it. I'd ask Qawsedf but I think his brain might collapse if I ask him to calc another Elden Ring thing

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

Do you happen to have footage of both Chariot? I'll try request someone to calc it. I'd ask Qawsedf but I think his brain might collapse if I ask him to calc another Elden Ring thing

Qawsed really put in the work, that's for sure.

 

[Chariot190]

I have footage of bat, but it's on a hard drive because I needed MGS space, I unfortunately, can't really get to it till tomorrow night? But a bit of waiting never really killed anyone.

For Astel though, no idea if I have a clip of dodging it, never really thought of doing that tbh in a way that'd even be calcable. It'd probably also be beneficial to calc dodging it with quick step or something and I know 100% I do not have a clip of that.

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

For Astel though, no idea if I have a clip of dodging it, never really thought of doing that tbh in a way that'd even be calcable. It'd probably also be beneficial to calc dodging it with quick step or something and I know 100% I do not have a clip of that.

youtube probably has something. Plus it's not like the Bat case as you definitely can't dodge the meteors at point blank

 

[Chritin]

I have footage of bat, but it's on a hard drive because I needed MGS space, I unfortunately, can't really get to it till tomorrow night? But a bit of waiting never really killed anyone.

For Astel though, no idea if I have a clip of dodging it, never really thought of doing that tbh in a way that'd even be calcable. It'd probably also be beneficial to calc dodging it with quick step or something and I know 100% I do not have a clip of that.

There might be some footage we can calculate off of, but considering the fact that it can be dodged anywhere from the edge of the arena to right under Astel, I think it is safer to just say that the Tarnished and Post-Astel bosses would scale to the 42-72 km/s

 

[Chritin]

Also, side comment, but could we scale Radahn and Pre-Astel bosses to this? I mean after Ranni's Questline (which is after you kill Astel) you can fight Blaidd, who really shouldn't have any change between him fighting radahn outside of being feral. So assuming he has the same speed in each battle, then Radahn would have a similar speed as well right? The only thing I can think of to counter-argue this is that it isn't inherent that after defeating Astel you fight Blaidd.

 

[Chariot190]

youtube probably has something. Plus it's not like the Bat case as you definitely can't dodge the meteors at point blank

You can do anything with a little bit of panic rolling

But oh, now that I think about it, I don't think I can get footage of Astel, but maybe the second Astel in a cave I grab a clip of? I haven't killed him on the alt account, not today, but maybe late tomorrow I can try?

 

[Mr. Bambu]

Yeah a site standard, for something this isn't? You know that right? We're not talking about in-atmosphere meteorites, we're talking about vacuum of space meteoroids, they are not the same thing, so whatever standard you think applies, doesn't, because there is no such standard, they're simply objectively different things. So, as I said prior, what are you trying to say exactly? Nothing you said even applies, and at best is a false equivalence, but in reality your example is just wrong too, if it's truly a similar situation then we can look into that at a later date as well.

Chariot, the number of times you have personally weaved back and forth from being completely reasonable to a spiteful little man is actually insane to me. I wish you were all good days because I have nothing but respect for said days.

Chariot, this is quite literally the exact. Same. Situation. A portal opens to space and pulls in meteors. In the other identical situation, we rated it at 11 km/s. So no, if you read my words, again, this is the exact same situation.

Feel free to take a look for yourself.

This has already devolved into a toxic shitfest, because I am the one that pointed it out, rather than someone else. Cheerio.

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

Ok so I couldn't find one for Naturborn, but I found one for Stars of Darkness. This one should work just fine as it's literally the same move. Though I should note the angle is kind of wonky

 

[Chritin]

Chariot, the number of times you have personally weaved back and forth from being completely reasonable to a spiteful little man is actually insane to me. I wish you were all good days because I have nothing but respect for said days.

Chariot, this is quite literally the exact. Same. Situation. A portal opens to space and pulls in meteors. In the other identical situation, we rated it at 11 km/s. So no, if you read my words, again, this is the exact same situation.

Feel free to take a look for yourself.

This has already devolved into a toxic shitfest, because I am the one that pointed it out, rather than someone else. Cheerio.

The whole point IS that pulling meteors from space means they are moving faster. They are not identical things as things moving in vacuums are much faster than things moving through matter (like the atmosphere). This is due to forces like friction air resistance or really any resistance from all matter. The argument you are making is like saying that a bullet shot in the water has the same speed as a bullet shot in the air. The friction and the resistance in the water cause it to move slower (without getting to deep into the shape of the object or hydrodynamics). We both get there is a site precedent, but that doesn't apply simply because it is a similar object, they are in two completely different states of movement due to the environment they are moving in.

 

[Chariot190]

Also, side comment, but could we scale Radahn and Pre-Astel bosses to this? I mean after Ranni's Questline (which is after you kill Astel) you can fight Blaidd, who really shouldn't have any change between him fighting radahn outside of being feral. So assuming he has the same speed in each battle, then Radahn would have a similar speed as well right? The only thing I can think of to counter-argue this is that it isn't inherent that after defeating Astel you fight Blaidd.

Blaidd scaling is wack, for everything, tbh let's just save anything Blaidd related till after we figure out where his ass scales in the first place.

Chariot, the number of times you have personally weaved back and forth from being completely reasonable to a spiteful little man is actually insane to me. I wish you were all good days because I have nothing but respect for said days.

Ngl, I think that's just a personal issue, I'm not gonna say I come off kind or nice, I can definitely be a bit of an asshole even if unintentionally, but spiteful? Nah, ngl I do think some of the shit you've said is a bit sus but nothing against you, that's just how it is here, it'd be a miracle if anything could actually be universally agreed on.

Chariot, this is quite literally the exact. Same. Situation. A portal opens to space and pulls in meteors. In the other identical situation, we rated it at 11 km/s. So no, if you read my words, again, this is the exact same situation.

Yeah, and I'm saying that other situation is wrong? Two wrongs don't make a right? I'm completely willing to take a look at that in the future, was gonna do some Bloodborne calcs in the off future anyway given that Vicar Amelia calc is kinda, to be blunt, not at all how it works, and there's a few good feats here and there, off the top of my head wanted to calc the Trolls throwing boulders for LS among other things. If it's wrong, then let's fix it, let's not make this wrong too.

Feel free to take a look for yourself.

I have played Bloodborne yes.

This has already devolved into a toxic shitfest, because I am the one that pointed it out, rather than someone else. Cheerio.

?????????
What? It's pretty chill still?

 

[Chritin]

Ok so I couldn't find one for Naturborn, but I found one for Stars of Darkness. This one should work just fine as it's literally the same move. Though I should note the angle is kind of wonk

I may take a look tomorrow, but like I said it might not be needed when they can pretty much be dodged from anywhere in the arena.

 

[Chritin]

Blaidd scaling is wack, for everything, tbh let's just save anything Blaidd related till after we figure out where his ass scales in the first place.

Fair enough. He is one of the... weirder characters to be honest.

 

[Mr. Bambu]

The whole point IS that pulling meteors from space means they are moving faster. They are not identical things as things moving in vacuums are much faster than things moving through matter (like the atmosphere). This is due to forces like friction air resistance or really any resistance from all matter. The argument you are making is like saying that a bullet shot in the water has the same speed as a bullet shot in the air. The friction and the resistance in the water cause it to move slower (without getting to deep into the shape of the object or hydrodynamics). We both get there is a site precedent, but that doesn't apply simply because it is a similar object, they are in two completely different states of movement due to the environment they are moving in.

The whole point I'm making is that both parties are doing the same thing. They were both in a vacuum, and then not. I'm not even saying that my point is right, but you guys just literally will not understand that. I am simply pointing out site precedent.

I know what air resistance is. If you read what I said, you would literally already know this. ****'s sake.

 

[Mr. Bambu]

Ngl, I think that's just a personal issue, I'm not gonna say I come off kind or nice, I can definitely be a bit of an asshole even if unintentionally, but spiteful? Nah, ngl I do think some of the shit you've said is a bit sus but nothing against you, that's just how it is here, it'd be a miracle if anything could actually be universally agreed on.

Me: Cites a site precedent
Chariot: idk man that seems like bullshit on your part

sick

 

[Chariot190]

The whole point I'm making is that both parties are doing the same thing. They were both in a vacuum, and then not. I'm not even saying that my point is right, but you guys just literally will not understand that. I am simply pointing out site precedent.

I know what air resistance is. If you read what I said, you would literally already know this. ****'s sake.

That isn't a site precedence? That's just a single example of something in a similar situation being falsely labeled as something else?
I'd understand if on the calc or meteorite feat page it says "yeah comets, meteoroids, orbital velocity asteroids and more are to be treated like they're in-atmosphere meteorites during re-entry regardless of the circumstances", but it don't, it just says meteorites, in reference to those in atmosphere, are such and such a speed on average we use as a basis.
They aren't the same thing, and just because an older thing was labeled as that, doesn't mean we should here if we know for a fact that these things have innately different speeds, two wrongs don't make a right.

I did read what you said, i just don't agree with you is all, if you know this though, why you even arguing it? You would know it's wrong, if it's because this other verse that isn't Elden Ring does it, we can just fix that too, I already said Im willing to go through it in the future? I'm not even the only one who wants too so there'd be help involved.

Me: Cites a site precedent
Chariot: idk man that seems like bullshit on your part

Seems like a strawman ngl, also I didn't say it was bullshit, I said it was disingenuous to argue that this is something it isn't, though I also made sure to say that under the notion you were arguing they should be treated identically and if you were just saying it for future reference, that is fine, I said as much.
Also not a site precedent, it's not a site wide anything, honestly, if I dig through the Bloodborne threads I'm positive this little discrepancy between how things work was never actually brought up. It was probably labeled as 11kmps, not because of any standard, but rather it just being mistakenly treated as re-entry meteorites by accident.

 

[Chritin]

The whole point I'm making is that both parties are doing the same thing. They were both in a vacuum, and then not. I'm not even saying that my point is right, but you guys just literally will not understand that. I am simply pointing out site precedent.

I know what air resistance is. If you read what I said, you would literally already know this. ****'s sake.

I brought this up before. Unlike in Atmosphere meteors, the meteoroid isn't falling from space and becoming a meteor. When an object like a meteoroid normally enters the atmosphere from space, it doesn't immediately decelerate from 72km/s to 11/kms. The friction and air resistance gradually decelerate the object over the dozens of minutes it takes to come from the top of the atmosphere to the earth's surface.

In the case of the Meteoroids being teleported in though, it doesn't have those minutes to decelerate. While there could be an argument that they would be slower than the 42-72km/s speed of void meteoroids based on the fact they travel through the air for a few seconds (which doesn't completely make sense since there isn't any significant deceleration we can see when they are flying at the player), there is no argument to say that upon coming into contact with the atmosphere they just instantly slow down thousands of mph.

Basically what I'm saying is that the 11km/s value accounts for meteors that HAVE BEEN traveling outside of a vacuum for a prolonged time, while the meteoroids made by Astel would be closer to the 42-72km/s due to the fact they HAVE NOT BEEN traveling outside of a vacuum for a prolonged time, and even saying they a slightly slower is a minimum.

 

[Mr. Bambu]

my brain melts at the fact that you keep saying the same thing, when it is irrelevant to what I posted originally

The site precedent is 11 km/s for summoned meteors. I'm leaving this godforsaken thread.

 

[Chritin]

my brain melts at the fact that you keep saying the same thing, when it is irrelevant to what I posted originally

The site precedent is 11 km/s for summoned meteors. I'm leaving this godforsaken thread.

Look man, there is no need to be rude. I have no beef with you.

Besides that, why not just counter why our claims are wrong besides that? If our claims are logical and make sense in the real world, yet go against what information the site uses, then why not change the site to fit a more logical and correct conclusion? On the other hand, if our claims are illogical and don't make sense in the real world, then explain why. You have done neither of these things and continued to restate your initial claim, so our point still stands as a logical argument.

 

[Chritin]

Also, I would like to mention for the sake of the feat, that Astel's attack comes from numerous angles and points.