Dragon Talisman High-1A And 0 upgrade

[Antvasima]

Okay. By my experience, Qawsedf234 is usually very reliable regarding higher tier evaluations at least. Elizhaa has been very helpful in the past, but I am not certain about his competence regarding this particular area.

 

[Muchacho_mrm]

Don't be rude. I continuously have a massive number of wiki, forum, and real life tasks to handle and keep track of, and this thread has been handled in small occasional snippets for a prolonged period of time.

Why would you assume that. Everyone has some idea of how much work you do for the wiki.

 

[Gasper]

i thought elizhaa was a she

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

Okay. By my experience, Qawsedf234 is usually very reliable regarding higher tier evaluations at least. Elizhaa has been very helpful in the past, but I am not certain about his competence regarding this particular area.

Elizhaa is listed among the knowledgeable members for tiers 1 and above, and has helped in the past to resolve manners in such discussions. This is my main reasoning to trust their judgement.

 

[Antvasima]

Why would you assume that. Everyone has some idea of how much work you do for the wiki.

The lmao comment. Also, I have much more demanding real life tasks than I used to nowadays.

 

[Antvasima]

Elizhaa is listed among the knowledgeable members for tiers 1 and above, and has helped in the past to resolve manners in such discussions. This is my main reasoning to trust their judgement.

Okay. I have not noticed Elizhaa being very active for the past year or so though, and he seems to have been too lenient in his higher tier evaluations at times, if I remember correctly. He has helped out a lot in the past though.

 

[Muchacho_mrm]

Which staff members have accepted what here exactly? I do not remember anymore.

LephyrTheRevanchist pretty much explains. Also I will link their input with their names:

• Elizhaa
• PrinceofPein
• Qawsedf234
• Rakih_Elyan

Planck69 is neutral.

The lmao comment. Also, I have much more demanding real life tasks than I used to nowadays.

I saw the post I was expecting after a refresh and found it amusing. Nothing more. If you find that offensive, then I apologize.

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

Okay. I have not noticed Elizhaa being very active for the past year or so though, and he seems to have been too lenient in their higher tier evaluations at times, if I remember correctly. He has helped out a lot in the past though.

These past weeks I've been staff I've seen them participating semi regularly.

Nevertheless, if you feel we should get even more knowledgeable members involved, I would prefer this being done on a new thread. The OP already is quite disorganized, and its content would benefit more being put on a blog.

Would you be willing to create such a blog, @Rabbit2002 , and this thread remade as a staff thread later on?

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

LephyrTheRevanchist pretty much explains. Also I will link their input with their names:

• Elizhaa
• PrinceofPein
• Qawsedf234
• Rakih_Elyan

Planck69 is neutral.


I saw the post I was expecting after a refresh and found it amusing. Nothing more. If you find that offensive, then I apologize.

Pain nor Rakih are staff, to be noted. Which is why I didn't include them.

 

[Antvasima]

Well, Pain is knowledgeable in this area, and Rakih may be as well, but I do not remember much about their expertise.

 

[Unqver]

So, regarding Dragon Talisman, we need to open a new thread？

 

[Antvasima]

I personally think that this one is fine to keep, if all that is needed is to evaluate the first post in it.

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

I don't mind finishing in this very thread. Just a slight concern that because of it being all over the place, it turns other staff off from commenting.

 

[Antvasima]

Well, they apparently only need to evaluate the first post here and nothing else.

 

[Setsuna_tenma]

bump

 

[Planck69]

Reading through this (cause might as well), I'm in agreement with Elizhaa's judgement on the tiering.

 

[Antvasima]

Okay. So which staff and knowledgeable members here think that which statistics should be applied?

@Qawsedf234 @Elizhaa @LephyrTheRevanchist @Ultima_Reality @Planck69 @Ovy7 @PrinceofPein

 

[Ovy7]

Agree with Elizhaa and Qawsedf234, the High 1-B to 1-A seems fine. Dunno about the High 1-A with the Apophatic theology tho.

 

[Delta333]

The amount of agreements is beyond the necessity at this point.

 

[PrinceofPein]

I agree with Elizha for the tiers, 1-A looks okay, it might become low 1-A, due to the current revision going on

 

[Unqver]

So, have any conclusions about Dragon Talisman now?

 

[Setsuna_tenma]

bump

 

[Antvasima]

Agree with Elizhaa and Qawsedf234, the High 1-B to 1-A seems fine. Dunno about the High 1-A with the Apophatic theology tho.

Okay. The former can probably be applied now then.

 

[Antvasima]

I agree with Elizha for the tiers, 1-A looks okay, it might become low 1-A, due to the current revision going on

This is also a relevant issue though, so maybe we should wait a bit.

 

[Setsuna_tenma]

This is also a relevant issue though, so maybe we should wait a bit.

we can just do the change when the staff ctr gets concluded instead of stalling this thread even more

 

[Muchacho_mrm]

This is also a relevant issue though, so maybe we should wait a bit.

Maybe but it would still require the 2 people spearheading that revision to comment here. Also I and other users as well as Qawsedf234 don't think it is relevant to this thread.

 

[Antvasima]

Okay. So which tier would this revision land on? High 1-B, Low 1-A, or 1-A? There seemed to be some staff and knowledgeable member disagreements in this regard.

 

[Muchacho_mrm]

Okay. So which tier would this revision land on? High 1-B, Low 1-A, or 1-A? There seemed to be some staff and knowledgeable member disagreements in this regard.

None of the knowledgeable members listed for Low 1-A to 0 on the wiki have disagreed. The only staff comments remotely negative in relation this thread was whether or not to allow the verse on the site and that was mostly cleared up (Not counting Phoenks). Also Zaratthustra didn't give a staff evaluation of the thread but their post should somewhat be in your mind.

 

[Antvasima]

So which of the tiers that I mentioned will be used here then?

Also, I only recall Zaratthustra somehow equating me strongly disliking tyrants, slavers, and psychopaths, especially in combination, with being some kind of indiscriminate racist or bigot, which doesn't make any logical sense, and he never apologised for it.

 

[Muchacho_mrm]

OP proposes High 1-A to tier 0 upgrade and Elizhaa agrees with OP.

Alright.
I have no major issues with the OP.
I guess this thread needs more staff input.

Qawsedf234 agree up to High 1-A while they aren't sure about tier 0.

The only vaguely questionable thing might be Tier 0, but everything up to that point looks like it fits.

Rakih_Elyan agrees with OP.

I agree with the OP bruh

PrinceofPein agrees with Elizhaa. I am unsure if they agree with Elizhaa entirely due to the latter part of their post.

I agree with Elizha for the tiers, 1-A looks okay, it might become low 1-A, due to the current revision going on

Ovy7 Agrees with Elizhaa Qawsedf234 but they clarify that they don't know about High 1-A.

Agree with Elizhaa and Qawsedf234, the High 1-B to 1-A seems fine. Dunno about the High 1-A with the Apophatic theology tho.

LephyrTheRevanchist agrees with 1-A and I feel like anything above that (in terms of agreements) should be asked of them to clarify.

Elizhaa agrees with a solid 1-A rating, Qawsedf also agrees with the OP and I trust Elizhaa's judgement.

Planck69 agrees with Elizhaa. They seem to full agree.

Reading through this (cause might as well), I'm in agreement with Elizhaa's judgement on the tiering.

 

[Antvasima]

Hmm. I would prefer a greater consensus regarding which tiering that should be used here.

@Elizhaa @Qawsedf234 @Planck69 @LephyrTheRevanchist @PrinceofPein @Ovy7 @Rakih_Elyan

Are you willing to try to reach an agreement regarding the tiering here please?

 

[Rakih_Elyan]

Hi Guys

The quote function in the thread is cutting some of the scans.

Can you repost it, but with only spoiler function, so I can create a cosmology page.

 

[Qawsedf234]

Are you willing to try to reach an agreement regarding the tiering here please?

If we're making 1-A into Low 1-A then the Tier 0 stuff just becomes At least High 1-A afaik.

 

[PrinceofPein]

I did not agree with tier 0 or High 1-A.
I only agreed to the 1-A rating
I will give a proper reply to the OP afterall.

 

[Antvasima]

Thank you for helping out.

 

[PrinceofPein]

I have to say reading through the OP once again, I got the Suggverse feels. I was neutral to allowing it before but now I have to say we should not allow it, it is pure powerscaling and filled with flowery and inflated langauges which makes it hard to even say which to take serious or not

If we are going to allow it though, here is why they should not qualify for anything higher than 1-A, the whole High 1-B and gigaverse shenaningans is okay.
First, fix the spoiler tabs in the OP, some of them are a mess and I had to do the translations myself since I cannot access the translated scans below the chinese quotes

White Teen (1-A: infinite lifespan and transcendend the very concepts of size, Space and time below Annulleverse).

We do not grant 1-A for transcend the concept of size, space and time. it is still low 1-A based on the context, which is due to transcending a High 1-B structure

So transcendent that it literally cannot be expressed in words, names and completely beyond their understanding and imagination, unintelligible, unspeakable, unpredictable, unintelligible, unexplainable, unknowable, unobservable, unresearchable.
Any characteristic that is attached to them, they are neither characteristic nor non-characteristic

this is inflated in all honesty and not apophatic
but let us look closely at the scans

Just as Gu Chensha spoke, there were pieces of unintelligible, unspeakable, unpredictable, unpredictable, unintelligible, unexplainable, unknowable, unobservable, unresearchable things on the top of his head.
This thing has never happened in the world.
It is neither material nor energy, nor immaterial, nor non-energy, nor mind, nor non-mind. No one can understand what this power is, nor can anyone see what this power is.
Even with the cultivation bases of Wen Hong, Zhuge Ya, Lou Baiyue and others, they couldn't understand what this thing was at all, they seemed to have become stupid.
However, this force soon enveloped them and formed a large cocoon on their bodies.
This big cocoon presents a color that has never been seen in the world. It can even be said that it is not called a color, neither a color nor a non-color.
In short, in the multiverse, even the most advanced creatures, such as Mr. Wuwu, cannot understand what kind of existence this is. It is not that they cannot reach this state, but they cannot imagine and understand that this kind of power is beyond their way of thinking.
What is scary is not the realm that cannot be reached through hard cultivation.
The scary thing is that you can't even imagine the existence of this state, and you can't understand it.
The realm that Gu Chensha is now urging to display is this realm.
This is still one-tenth of the realm of "non-being without immortality"

inability to understand something does not mean it is apophatic. it can be due to a differnet level of existence or power level

After all people have achieved the Wulong mental method, everyone, regardless of their superiority or inferiority, will use their spiritual power to strengthen the human world, then Gu Chensha will truly achieve the tenth level of immortality "non-being without immortality".
At that time, he is all living beings, all non-living beings is him and he is all non-living beings, all that is corporeal is him and all that is noncorporeal is him, all that is non-tangible and all that is non-intangible are also him, he is existence and nonexistence and, he is neither existence nor nonexistence.
This realm is "non-being without immortality"

This does not mean anything tiering wise

Suddenly, a rune rose out of that great formation, a rune that seemed like a Dao word, changed, and seemed like a kill word, changed again, a birth word, and changed again, a destruction word. In a flash, it changed trillions of times, and each time it changed, it was a cosmic truth that could derive from everything.
This rune is the original rune. Existence and non existence, Emptiness and non-emptiness, universe and non-universe, corporeal and incorporeal and non-corporeal and non-incorporeal, all appear from this character.
Zhou Qin got suddenly shocked after seeing this character.
"How could it be? How could it be? This is the meaning of annulled null immortality that I can't understand. You can even understand it." Zhou Qin's face finally changed.
When he saw this character, he already knew that Qin Guang's understanding of annulled null immortality was actually above his own. That is to say, Qin Guang wasn't just an arrogant man who had obtained a fortuitous encounter. In fact, his cultivation realm was higher than his own, which he could not bear. - Chapter 1129

This also, it is just difference in power levels when you remove the inflated languages
So this can all boil down to a single transcendence and adding the whole thing together still will not be anything aside "At least Low 1-A"

The early 10-deathless realm and up got 1-A due to being apophatic the lower realm of High 1-B/Low 1-A; but with the context of 1-A, being apophatic to tier 1-A, would its High 1-A
Gu Chensha and similar could have gotten High 1-A due to being outside the framework of (deathless) realms, but now, being outside the framework of High 1-A would be tier 0.
From early reply:

• The High-1A I'm talking about is about DT, MC (Gu Chensa) somehow supersedes the whole framework of the concept of "realm" including infinite Deathless levels, it's basically like what Muchacho suggested earlier except Nullverse/Baseline 10th Deathless as 1-A and everything below as 2-A

There are no arguments here aside being outside the frame work of deathless, which would be 1-A.

That said, my OG vote is that the verse should not be allowed since it is just too cringe in powerscaling terms, but if it is allowed that is my thoughts on it

 

[BestMGQScalerEver]

I have to say reading through the OP once again, I got the Suggverse feels. I was neutral to allowing it before but now I have to say we should not allow it, it is pure powerscaling and filled with flowery and inflated langauges which makes it hard to even say which to take serious or not

Here we go again... Power fantasy and esoteric writing does NOT make something a powerscaling verse. This point is irrelevant and has been debated already.

 

[Planck69]

Powerscaling verse
Literally just heavy-handed Buddhist excerpts

Whatever, man. Just add his vote and let's move on.

 

[Setsuna_tenma]

bump

 

[Antvasima]

Well, this verse has been allowed, but we need to figure out the most reliable tiering for it.