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Dragon Ball Super Anime - Zeno and Zamasu Ability

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Toby020 said:
@Firestorm808
@Antvasima
@DarkDragonMedeus
@Maverick_Zero_X
@AKM sama
Click to expand...
wallcover.jpg
 
SummerBlue said:
The DBS Blu-ray disk art book scan your using is already in his profile. It's why he has Abstract Existence type 1 and has nothing to do with the concept of Order and Justice.

"Zamasu deliberately cast aside his divine body and gained his infinite form specifically to ensure he can propagate his insane view of order and justice by merging with the fabric of existence"

Nothing about this supports Zamasu becoming the concept of Order and Justice. Dragon ball as a series does not ever touch concept manipulation so you need a lot of proof for this to pass.

Zamasu became the "order and justice" of the universe as a result of becoming the universe itself, he did not become the concept of Order and Justice that's something else entirely. He didn't suddenly become the first conceptual god in dragon ball and warp the morality of the universe into his belief. The order and justice of the universe is not the same as the actual concept of Order and Justice.

Disagree
Click to expand...
This point seems to make sense.
 
Toby020 said:
In the Brazilian translation it is said that Zamasu becoming the concept of justice and order



Tradução: And it is trying to become the very concept of justice and order.

Well here it is also quoted being order and justice too



Here it is literally said that he became an idea




It was said that Zamasu affected the factory of existence as well.



Japanese translation for anyone who wants to translate to see if it's right



I want to propose type 8 immortality for Zamasu, because he has become the concept of order and justice, as long as he doesn't erase the entire multiverse and the concept he is tied to, he will continue to exist.

And also a small update on Zeno's profile, being erasing existence at a conceptual level

@Deus900
@XSOULOFCIDERX
@BluudyManikin777
@Insuficiência de tinta
@Chapéu de Palha Arslan
@O Elemento Kirbies
@Laxus Dreyar
@DiscoDancerGG
@O mais rápido vivo50
@CuddleFox
@Rez
@Gabs22 Gamer
@FluffyCreatureZ
@Viethai96
@Vizer04
@Cmoon12
@Gilad Hyperstar
@Quantu
@Arnoldstone18
@Frenagem
@O Lendário Vin
Click to expand...

abstract existence type 1,to affect such people you have to affect the very abstraction itself.
Click to expand...
so what you're saying is zamasu is the very definition and abstraction of justice and order huh
looks like a flowery language
like buu saying he is the embodiment of pure evil,all of this is taking out of context
zamasu isn't even abstrac existence type 2, as he doesn't seem to represent any abstraction in anyway
abstraction could mean, concept,information.
yes there's no "information" in dragon ball super series especially on a fundamental level neither is zamasu the very conceptual display of justice is like saying killing him is killing the very "concept of justice"- which makes no sense
so reconsider this
 
SummerBlue said:
The DBS Blu-ray disk art book scan your using is already in his profile. It's why he has Abstract Existence type 1 and has nothing to do with the concept of Order and Justice.

"Zamasu deliberately cast aside his divine body and gained his infinite form specifically to ensure he can propagate his insane view of order and justice by merging with the fabric of existence"

Nothing about this supports Zamasu becoming the concept of Order and Justice. Dragon ball as a series does not ever touch concept manipulation so you need a lot of proof for this to pass.

Zamasu became the "order and justice" of the universe as a result of becoming the universe itself, he did not become the concept of Order and Justice that's something else entirely. He didn't suddenly become the first conceptual god in dragon ball and warp the morality of the universe into his belief. The order and justice of the universe is not the same as the actual concept of Order and Justice.

Disagree
Click to expand...
not gonna lie....
this doesn't really seem like abstract existence type 1,but well your arguments seem plausible,I'm neutral then.
 
If the kanji is correct, this would be the translation:

正義と秩序そのものとなろうとしているのだ
It's about to become justice and order itself
 
godofice said:
Pretty sure he becomes will itself as a reason for his abstraction which is shown and stated in the toei timeline and an art book
Click to expand...
Zamasu being a Will is stated in Toei Timeline, translated by Herm, a will is already abstract. Artbook however directly stated he become Ideas itself via the raw japanese, it is explained in my comment. Gowasu also stated him became Order and Justice itself, which clearly refering him become something abstract (Justice and Order is abstraction), it is also in line with him being a non-physical existence (cast aside his body, remain, divine vessel, etc...) which support him being abstract.

And while most of the time we don't use other dub or translations, but in this situation, all those translation into other language such as the one in OP all pointed at the same thing which is Infinite Zamasu being abstract being, order and justice itself, thus heavily support the validity of the AE1 rating

Lastly, while we can't really backscale game verse to canon/anime verse, game verse itself also directly stated the same thing. So i think, there is no doubt about Infinite Zamasu being AE1
 
SummerBlue said:
The DBS Blu-ray disk art book scan your using is already in his profile. It's why he has Abstract Existence type 1 and has nothing to do with the concept of Order and Justice.

"Zamasu deliberately cast aside his divine body and gained his infinite form specifically to ensure he can propagate his insane view of order and justice by merging with the fabric of existence"

Nothing about this supports Zamasu becoming the concept of Order and Justice. Dragon ball as a series does not ever touch concept manipulation so you need a lot of proof for this to pass.

Zamasu became the "order and justice" of the universe as a result of becoming the universe itself, he did not become the concept of Order and Justice that's something else entirely. He didn't suddenly become the first conceptual god in dragon ball and warp the morality of the universe into his belief. The order and justice of the universe is not the same as the actual concept of Order and Justice.

Disagree
Click to expand...
Like Firestorm808, I also think that the above post seems to make sense. Are you all absolutely certain that the talk about conceptual existence was intended to be taken absolutely literally, rather than as symbolic flowery speech? Conceptual entities do not seem to fit with the Dragon Ball setting.
 
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