Dragon Ball Super Anime - Zeno and Zamasu Ability

[LuffyRuffy46307]

In the Brazilian translation it is said that Zamasu becoming the concept of justice and order



Tradução: And it is trying to become the very concept of justice and order.

Well here it is also quoted being order and justice too



Here it is literally said that he became an idea




It was said that Zamasu affected the factory of existence as well.



Japanese translation for anyone who wants to translate to see if it's right



I want to propose type 8 immortality for Zamasu, because he has become the concept of order and justice, as long as he doesn't erase the entire multiverse and the concept he is tied to, he will continue to exist.

And also a small update on Zeno's profile, being erasing existence at a conceptual level

@Deus900
@XSOULOFCIDERX
@BluudyManikin777
@Insuficiência de tinta
@Chapéu de Palha Arslan
@O Elemento Kirbies
@Laxus Dreyar
@DiscoDancerGG
@O mais rápido vivo50
@CuddleFox
@Rez
@Gabs22 Gamer
@FluffyCreatureZ
@Viethai96
@Vizer04
@Cmoon12
@Gilad Hyperstar
@Quantu
@Arnoldstone18
@Frenagem
@O Lendário Vin

 

[AwkguyDB]

Following

 

[Thelastmlg]

We shouldn't use the brazillian dub above the original.

Second on was rejected, from what i recall is because it does not make it explicit he is turning into those ideas but rather becoming the universe and exerting his beliefs by killing the mortals.

The translation you linked says

"The combined Zamasu was torn apart by Trunks, but his spirit soared into the sky and enveloped the entire Earth." Where is "idea" there?

I do agree that he could have type 8 for meeging with it all but idk how we deal with it

 

[Vietthai96]

1. You can't tag people
2. Don't use other dub, but this situation is kinda unique so i will come back later
3. Your japanese translation have some error which i will return later to address since i'm the one to upgrade IZ to Possibly AE1 back then, i need to work now, bruhh

 

[Aachintya31]

Highly this agree

 

[SummerBlue]

The DBS Blu-ray disk art book scan your using is already in his profile. It's why he has Abstract Existence type 1 and has nothing to do with the concept of Order and Justice.

"Zamasu deliberately cast aside his divine body and gained his infinite form specifically to ensure he can propagate his insane view of order and justice by merging with the fabric of existence"

Nothing about this supports Zamasu becoming the concept of Order and Justice. Dragon ball as a series does not ever touch concept manipulation so you need a lot of proof for this to pass.

Zamasu became the "order and justice" of the universe as a result of becoming the universe itself, he did not become the concept of Order and Justice that's something else entirely. He didn't suddenly become the first conceptual god in dragon ball and warp the morality of the universe into his belief. The order and justice of the universe is not the same as the actual concept of Order and Justice.

Disagree

 

[Hasty12345]

Wouldn’t he need feats of regenerating for type 8 immortality?

 

[Aachintya31]

Wouldn’t he need feats of regenerating for type 8 immortality?

No, he only reliance on something.

 

[Hasty12345]

No, he only reliance on something.

Maybe I’m confused, what is he reliant on?

 

[SummerBlue]

Maybe I’m confused, what is he reliant on?

His will from what I remember

 

[Aachintya31]

Maybe I’m confused, what is he reliant on?

Order and justice (basically Law and Order) that manifests the universe.

 

[Hasty12345]

Order and justice (basically Law and Order) that manifests the universe.

then I hard disagree on type 8 immortality

 

[Vietthai96]

Order and justice (basically Law and Order) that manifests the universe.

What the hell, no, that not, he can't be both AE1 and AE2 at the same time, that contradict each other, also he don't have any feat or statement suggesting Immortality type 8 to begin with so..............................

This scan is translated wrong. the original Japanese is:

トランクスに切り裂かれた合体ザマスだったが、その念は空へと舞い上がり地球全体を包み込んだ

which mean this:

The Combined Zamasu was torn apart by Trunks, but his Ideas soared into the sky and enveloped the entire earth.

Japanese use the word 念, which mean Ideas, Concepts. This perfectly fit with Brazilian translation stated IZ became a concept, or in English Dub where Gowasu stated about IZ:

his being remains. It seems he's embraced this new ethereal state. No longer confined by his divine vessel, he may be trying to become part of the very fabric of the cosmos. His own twisted idea of justice and order made manifest.

And lastly, Japanese contexts is very clear: He is trying to become justice and order itself

Anyway this is a quick response, time to go back to work

 

[Quasar002]

Following

 

[Irineu]

following

 

[SummerBlue]

What the hell, no, that not, he can't be both AE1 and AE2 at the same time, that contradict each other, also he don't have any feat or statement suggesting Immortality type 8 to begin with so..............................



This scan is translated wrong. the original Japanese is:

which mean this:

Japanese use the word 念, which mean Ideas, Concepts. This perfectly fit with Brazilian translation stated IZ became a concept, or in English Dub where Gowasu stated about IZ:


And lastly, Japanese contexts is very clear: He is trying to become justice and order itself

Anyway this is a quick response, time to go back to work

Correct me if wrong but 念 just means idea; thought; to read; to consider; to long for. 概 means General; Approximate. 概念 = Concept.

 

[Vietthai96]

Correct me if wrong but 念 just means idea; thought; to read; to consider; to long for. 概 means General; Approximate. 概念 = Concept.

They have the same meaning, 念 just have slightly broader meaning. However both of it refering to something abstract, also 念 sometime can be used to refering to concept, depend on contexts

Edit: also Ideas and Concept is not really that different from each other even in English term

 

[Aachintya31]

What the hell, no, that not, he can't be both AE1 and AE2 at the same time, that contradict each other, also he don't have any feat or statement suggesting Immortality type 8 to begin with so..............................

Well then it's fine I suppose. Immortality has a clause that it shouldn't be clashing with similar ability which is suppose in this case is AË1

 

[SummerBlue]

They have the same meaning, 念 just have slightly broader meaning. However both of it refering to something abstract, also 念 sometime can be used to refering to concept, depend on contexts

Edit: also Ideas and Concept is not really that different from each other even in English term

I'm still very skeptical. Doesn't the site have a mod for these things?

 

[Reiner04]

In the Brazilian translation it is said that Zamasu becoming the concept of justice and order

Doesn't mean much when original japanese version and english sub itself doesn't state this.

Here it is literally said that he became an idea

Doesn't stated.

Japanese translation for anyone who wants to translate to see if it's right

I did, it doesn't state that

concept of order and justice

No.

 

[Thelastmlg]

Also just checked the brazillian dub and he says that "he is trying to become justice and order itself", no "concept" mention

 

[Vietthai96]

Also just checked the brazillian dub and he says that "he is trying to become justice and order itself", no "concept" mention

Actually, the sub in the OP is Portuguese

 

[Reiner04]

Also just checked the brazillian dub and he says that "he is trying to become justice and order itself", no "concept" mention

I checked it and it does says concept "eestá tentando se tornar o próprio conceito de justiça e ordem".

 

[Reiner04]

Actually, the sub in the OP is Portuguese

Language of brazil.

 

[Quantu]

He already has possibly AE Type 1, there's no evidence of him manipulating any concepts. At best you would just change his AE to Justice and Order.

 

[Thelastmlg]

Just to make it clear, there is Portuguese from brazil and portugal, he said it was the brazillian one, which i checked and it says "está tentando se tornar a propia ordem e justiça" or "order and justice themselves"

So we might be confusing the portuguese here

 

[Vietthai96]

Just to make it clear, there is Portuguese from brazil and portugal, he said it was the brazillian one, which i checked and it says "está tentando se tornar a propia ordem e justiça" or "order and justice themselves"

So we might be confusing the portuguese here

The sub in the picture use Conceito, which is Portugal word of Concept or Ideas

He already has possibly AE Type 1, there's no evidence of him manipulating any concepts. At best you would just change his AE to Justice and Order.

Yes, the only thing which can update is remove the Possibly and update his justification, he could potentially have Possibly CM2 hax from Gowasu word, but well, he die too fast

 

[Thelastmlg]

Yes, so is not brazillian portuguese, is portugal's, though the subs do sound like brazillian to me, so either he confused the country/language or the subs are not matching the dub and this is brazil, not portugal

 

[LuffyRuffy46307]

Yes, so is not brazillian portuguese, is portugal's, though the subs do sound like brazillian to me, so either he confused the country/language or the subs are not matching the dub and this is brazil, not portugal

The subtitles are in Portuguese (Brazil)

Here's a snippet from the episode

 

[LuffyRuffy46307]

I want to suggest that you take this "possibly AE Type 1"

Which puts it as an AE like, without that possibly, because the anime already guarantees such a thing, also a type 8 immortality at least or just a conceptual manipulation capped

 

[LuffyRuffy46307]

O sub na imagem usa Conceito, que é a palavra portuguesa de Conceito ou Ideias

Sim, a única coisa que pode atualizar é remover Possivelmente e atualizar sua justificativa, ele poderia ter Possivelmente CM2 hax da palavra Gowasu, mas bem, ele morreu muito rápido

I agree with that, but would type 8 immortality be possible?

What it means CM2 hax?

 

[Thelastmlg]

we are not gonna use it regardless because the japanese text is what primary matters, besides, as i said, those are just subs, not even the dub says it

 

[Reiner04]

Anyway, I've said what I'd to, not to mention that "concept" word alone doesn't mean anything if it's just that exist, "order" is even if stated to be concept will not qualify as it's a nominal concept not the platonic one's which as per our standards aren't qualified given that justice is along the lines as well it came with them as well.

Aside from that, no concepts has not been mentioned even in primary texts and their English sub.

 

[Quasar002]

I agree with that, but would type 8 immortality be possible?

What it means CM2 hax?

conceptual manipulation type 2

 

[LuffyRuffy46307]

conceptual manipulation type 2

I agree

 

[Quantu]

There's no evidence for Immortality Type 8

 

[Vietthai96]

Immortality 8 is a big no

CM2 is only at best possibly rating, but again it is not really solid so i'm fine with no CM

Right now the only thing is remove the Possibly of his AE1 and update the justification

Anyway, I've said what I'd to, not to mention that "concept" word alone doesn't mean anything if it's just that exist, "order" is even if stated to be concept will not qualify as it's a nominal concept not the platonic one's which as per our standards aren't qualified given that justice is along the lines as well it came with them as well.

Aside from that, no concepts has not been mentioned even in primary texts and their English sub.

I swear, tell that to other verses that have conceptual manip because of a single word concept being mentioned, or have no word at all, seriously i hate this bullshit double standards, many other verses get Conceptual hax left and right without ever mentioning concept or have a single word concept being mentioned, yet when it come to Dragon Ball people either arguing it is not literal or it is flowery, hyperbole language

 

[Reiner04]

Immortality 8 is a big no

CM2 is only at best possibly rating, but again it is not really solid so i'm fine with no CM

Right now the only thing is remove the Possibly of his AE1 and update the justification


I swear, tell that to other verses that have conceptual manip because of a single word concept being mentioned, or have no word at all, seriously i hate this bullshit double standards, many other verses get Conceptual hax left and right without ever mentioning concept or have a single word concept being mentioned, yet when it come to Dragon Ball people either arguing it is not literal or it is flowery, hyperbole language

It's my first time dealing with conceptual manipulation on this site, so I wasn't aware that unspoken standards for this aren't as strict as has been mentioned. If other versus has got it wth just concept being mentioned and whatsoover then dragonBall shouldn't be different. I apologise.

 

[Vietthai96]

Anyway, i'm fine with no Concept hax for Zamasu, since the guy have no feat because he got erased too fast, but his AE1 is blatant, as i already explained in this comment

https://vsbattles.com/threads/small-addition-for-zeno-and-zamasu.144050/post-5190346

 

[LuffyRuffy46307]

Immortality 8 is a big no

CM2 is only at best possibly rating, but again it is not really solid so i'm fine with no CM

Right now the only thing is remove the Possibly of his AE1 and update the justification


I swear, tell that to other verses that have conceptual manip because of a single word concept being mentioned, or have no word at all, seriously i hate this bullshit double standards, many other verses get Conceptual hax left and right without ever mentioning concept or have a single word concept being mentioned, yet when it come to Dragon Ball people either arguing it is not literal or it is flowery, hyperbole language

I agree with what you said, could you add?