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Delight in slightly exaggerated stats and fallacious application of the lack of clear settled limitation (Akabane vs Caine)

Anyway assuming it gets changed to Akabane vs Caine anytime soon...

What does caine do to Akabane saying "I win" or logic-ing him?
 
Well, Law Manipulation isn't anything new, in fact, Caine's powers scale to Lilith's who's words become Law, so, he can just do the same thing.

Caine has passive Mind hax:

https://imgur.com/w9znaty

Or Caine could just reprogram him:

https://imgur.com/gJ0WR0N

Also, Caine can literally Duplicate himself, Endlessly:

https://imgur.com/Q7eVkNS

And Caine already knows the Outcome of the Fight too:

https://imgur.com/g8uq0yc

Caine can Seal Akabane into the Second Dimension:

https://imgur.com/EdfdFNa

In WoD, beings don't survive being downgraded to the Second Dimension, it's an automatic kill.

Caine has Plot Manipulation and can enforce a Jungian Archetype on Akabane, making him inept.

And Caine has the Seven-Fold Curse protecting him from any damage.

As well, Caine has passive Fate Manip to make sure all things goes in his favour and has "Plot Device" which allows him to pull any ability he wants out of thin air and make them up on the fly.
 
Then Caine also has the Disblief scaling, which is Passive Concept manip, passive EE, Passive Power Null, which would be able to neg Akabane's attempts to use his Hax.
 
Firephoenixearl said:
Anyway assuming it gets changed to Akabane vs Caine anytime soon...
What does caine do to Akabane saying "I win" or logic-ing him?
Click to expand...
via having his own version of divine providance
 
Welp disbelief vs disbelief. They aren't passives in the literal sense.

Nothing you mentioned is a win condition vs Akabane btw. And having your words become law won't help vs "i win".
 
Also, Lilith's Law Manip didn't work on Caine, and she commands Demons to do her bidding, and who are bound by her laws, Akabane's Law isn't going to work on Caine.
 
I also outlined merely Incap victory.

Caine has many more abilities to end the fight in a Total Victory.
 
Udlmaster said:
Also, Lilith's Law Manip didn't work on Caine, and she commands Demons to do her bidding, and who are bound by her laws, Akabane's Law isn't going to work on Caine.
Click to expand...
That wasn't on his profile.
 
It is on his profile, it states that at the end of the resistances section: "and all his abilities"

And all of this works on an 8-D scale, Akabane saying "I win" is getting NLFed by 8-D hax.
 
Also, disblief in WoD is passive, it works on a huge area and affects places the Marauders have yet to be, there's even a statement that the Marauder's disblief affects all of Creation.

Also, rationality is something they already transcend, they've gone to places that transcends rationality itself.

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/517554428090384394/524513938663014410/unknown.png

Here's Caine's Plot Device:

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/517554428090384394/523821376130514946/unknown.png
 
Not passive, as i said. Only certain beliefs are taken as fully passive. Akabane has the same thing (seriously the same exact thing). Though only his law, death, null and modification , partially fate are taken as passive.

And again none of those are win conditions vs akabane (this is likely gonna end in inconclusive). How does caine deal with:

(passive) P null, P mod, fate manip

(active) Negation, fate manip, info manip

?
 
He resists Power Null from much stronger beings, Resists much much much stronger Fate Manip that works on a 8-D/11-D beings.

Active, what Negation? Fate Manip, see above, Information Manip is negged by his resistances like other abilities.

Akabane has nothing against Caine's 8-D hax.

Any of Caine's hax bypasses Akabane's resistances and one shots.
 
Udlmaster said:
Information Manip is negged by his resistances like other abilities.
Akabane has nothing against Caine's 8-D hax.

Any of Caine's hax bypasses Akabane's resistances and one shots.
Click to expand...
He resists info manip?

He doesn't resist power modification.

Negation is basically a nullification not to powers but to other traits such as immortality (even type 8), regen, other stats etc. Apparently he doesn't resist.

Sure 1 shots, akabane's immortality makes this fairly hard though.
 
Sigh, you youngsters have too many wishes. Too lazy to edit, this thread is still oficially Akabane vs Caine.
 
>He resists info manip?

Yes, from Storytellers.

>He doesn't resist power modification.

And Akabane doesn't have the chance too either.

>Negation is basically a nullification not to powers but to other traits such as immortality (even type 8), regen, other stats etc. Apparently he doesn't resist.

Caine's Mid-Godly is stronger than even High-Godly regen according to Wok. You'll have to prove that Akabane has done anything near that.

>Sure 1 shots, akabane's immortality makes this fairly hard though.

And it doesn't matter, Akabane isn't able to affect Caine in anyway.

And Caine can just Break Akabane's mind with 1 Spell.

Or just BFR him to the Supernal, where he's absorbed and Erased.
 
Power mod is passive, based on beliefs.

Hmm he has nulled type 8, type 7 and 5 before, idk if i can argue it to be better or worse than mid godly or low godly, as i have no idea how they work potency wise. Im fine with dropping this, not knowledgable enough on the subject. Though negating other stuff is still possible.

Sure, if akabane can't affect cain (he can with power mod, but let's just go with this), but cain can't do anything either it's inconclusive.

Won't work.

Won't work.
 
>Power mod is passive, based on beliefs.

Already negated by Caine's beliefs. Caine cannot be power nulled by the Marauders, who can power null the Mage's 8-D hax.

>Sure, if akabane can't affect cain (he can with power mod, but let's just go with this), but cain can't do anything either it's inconclusive.

Actually, Caine can, Caine can Negate his Regen then Conceptually erase him.

>Won't work.

8-D Hax NLFs his resistances.
 
Power modification, not nullification, so no. Moot point.

Not exactly, Akabane's type 8 and 9 is extremely hard to deal with. It's independand on how hard you null or erase him, it's based on creating clones everytime one dies or is incapacitated. There are few ways to put it down really, as he can constatly keep on making new clones.

Don't mean resistances, read above, his type 8 and 9.
 
>Power modification, not nullification, so no. Moot point.

I know, however, it is Nullified by Caine's Disbelief.

>Type 8 and 9

Conceptual Erasure on a Platonic level deals with every existing clone, no matter where it is.

And if he's BFRed into the Supernal, all versions of him, Past, Present and Future are absorbed and Erased, as the Supernal is Omnipresent across All of Time and Space.
 
That's not how it's applied, that's like me saying Akabane is invincible to anything because he passively disbelieves he can be affected by it. You don't apply a disbelief on a power to all other powers, unless cain has shown he doesn't believe his powers can be modified.

Not exactly, they are not "past present and future". The akabane that is fighting is nothing more than pure information (a clone). If one dies or gets incapped, information is used to create another "akabane clone". They aren't temporal based clones based on the real one, they are actual new bodies who are exactly like the old Akabane.
 
If you are conceptually erased, you are reduced to something less than data, and you've still not countered an Incap victory for Caine.

Considering Akabane cannot Modify Caine's abilities due to his Ring forcing Akabane to not want too.

Akabane is a testing dummy until Caine kills him, or until then, BFR's him into the Supernal, or at least Mind Breaks him beyond all ideals.

Also, can Akabane affect beings who are Transdual?

Also, Caine and Plot Manip Akabane out of Reality.

Caine's Passive Fate Manip makes sure everything goes in his favour, so Power Mod isn't going to be happening as it's not something that would go in his favour.
 
You don't get what im saying. He won't regen, another one will take his place. He ain't comming back from 1-C conceptual erasure, sure, another one can take his place just fine though.

Imagine this: U and me are 2 different people who just happen to have the same memories and apparence. If you are erased completely you won't come back sure, it doesn't mean i can't come and continue the fight in your stead.

It's not the data that comes back or regens, it's data that creates more clones (like the one that was just erased).

You would have to somehow deal with that to deal with Akabane's type 8 and 9 (Ban Midou stomped akabane yet couldn't take care of his immortalities, which is why i say that if ban takes the spot so does akabane and vice versa).

Same thing for incap btw, mind breaking 1 akabane won't stop a clone from just being there.
 
Okay, if you're reduced to less than a Concept, you don't have Information, as even in WoD, nothingness isn't total erasure, the reduction to "simply isn't" is total erasure.

If Caine throws Akabane into the Void in WoD, he's destroyed on more levels than his Type 8 can give him.

Information is still connected to the Platonic concept of yourself, as the Platonic concept of Yourself is the perfect version of himself, to which all "data "and "Information" comes from.

Any information of yourself comes from the Platonic concept, as all other versions are just participating in "Akabane"ness.

And any variation of Akabane, including the Clones are all apart of the Platonic concept of "Akabane".

As for Type 9, Caine has the Range to kill True Akabane no matter where he is.
 
In WoD to have been totally erased you don't have a Pressence, having information is to have a presence.
 
Wait, i just checked his range. If that's true then yes he takes care of type 8 and 9 (his type 9 is what's causing the clones) (concept erasure doesn't deal with it just to make sure, as it's not regen, there is a concept of akabane, but that akabane is not the clone, i mean the clone doesn't have the concept of akabane, his true self does, but anyway).

What is the justification for Caine's complex multiversal range?
 
It's stated that Mages have Unlimited range, and that they're spells can reach even the Supernal.
 
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