Death Battle REMATCH | Madara vs Aizen

[ReaperAndBlues]

Also what is Madara's answer to Aizen being Mahoraga on steroids? He would evolve to gain resistances to anything he does.

 

[Robo432343]

if madara starts with infinite tsukuyomi he might survive

 

[Arcker123]

Ok now how does anything in that first paragraph prove attacks can't be absorbed? If uyru never tried to absorb anything then where is the feat of actual resistance?

First off, You're shifting the burden. You've still provided no argument as to why they don't carry over. Secondly, I did provide an argument:

No, it's a high spiritual density attack. No reason the resistance doesn't apply

I was just debunking your counter, because you misinterpreted the scene.

Sir the same way we never seen madaras limbo use jutsu we've never seen aizen cloak an attack with a invisible spell and fire it off. Limbo are stated to be= to the user

Read TBTP. We do see Aizen use that Kido as a method of hiding multiple times (against shinji first, then to escape Tessai). This isn't a debunk to anything I argued.

Aizen has at least used the kido multiple times in canon, more than I can say for limbo using any jutsu.

Did kisuke not seal aizen? Where exactly is his pre tybw sealing resistance coming from

What about "some sealing working doesn't invalidate a resistance or prove Madara can do it" is so hard to grasp? You talk about hax layering, yet don't understand how it's applied to anything beyond Genjutsu.

Besides, this just ignores the context of the Hogyoku allowing Aizen to get sealed due to his wish of losing. Aizens even implied to be there of his own volition at the end of the manga.

But seeing as I'm the only madara supporter here we can just discuss wincons lmao. I think infinite tsukyomi or izanami win the fight, what are your aizen win cons?

Aizen evolves resistances to anything Madara does and just one taps.

You've given absolutely no explanation as to why Izanami does anything. I think your argument as to why IT works is a baseless headcanon and is far better and more readily explained by GOATMAN's soul claim. Occam was a bitch.

genjutsu that was used on a edo tensei worked InfT has a CLEAR reason as to why the edo hokage weren't targeted

You haven't proven this at all. The only difference between orochimaru and the edo tensei is that the edo tensei are already dead souls given bodies. Aizen is similarly a dead soul, so it's reasonable to doubt it ever working.

edo tensei. Shinigami still age, fatigue etc and basically function like humans

Doesn't mean they aren't souls that can't be equalized to Edo Tensei. They're not living being

 

[Arcker123]

if madara starts with infinite tsukuyomi he might survive

Aizen would shunpo up to him and stop him from trying.

 

[ReaperAndBlues]

Aizen would shunpo up to him and stop him from trying.

Aizen's gonna stop him from doing it by mogging him with the Soul King's jawline and telling him that shit won't work

 

[Arcker123]

Aizen adapts gg

 

[GOATMAN1232000]

A scan of the IT turning its victims into white zetsu? Yes not all genjutsu work the same but every single genjutsu that was used on a edo tensei worked InfT has a CLEAR reason as to why the edo hokage weren't targeted
He's "dead" in name but he isn't a immortal zombie with its soul trapped in another vessel like a edo tensei. Shinigami still age, fatigue etc and basically function like humans

No, a scan saying that the reason why IT did not work on Edo Tensei is because they were in a Zetsu body.

Where is the clear reason? I've reread the chapter to make sure, but I couldn't find it.

All I'm hearing is Aizen in a gigai would be immune to IT, since Aizen is an immortal soul.

 

[Arcker123]

His argument seems to be that they Resisted it because they were dead souls in edo tensei, rather than alive souls in zetsu bodies.

How this isn't completely ad hoc is beyond me though.

 

[Raiden_Azno]

Madara respectfully

 

[KillerNerd007]

I realized that we were able to have a Naruto vs Bleach matchup not that long ago. As it stands, Soul Crush is currently baseline and can be resisted by baseline resistance, so this matchup is possible (until Bleach gets its layers approved).

Standard Battle Assumptions

Speed equalized

5-C Versions

Aizen has the Hogyoku but First Fusion; all other Fusions are restricted

Battle takes place on Fourth Great Ninja War battlefield

Madara scales to 88.74 Exatons
Aizen scales to 99.78 Exatons

Dual Rinnegan+Rinne Sharingan Juudara vs First Fusion Aizen

Who wins and why?

Aizen. Simply cause he is stronger, tougher, has better hax and is smarter overall.

Madara has cool abilities yes, but Aizen has counters for all of them, including Infinite Tsukuyomi.

 

[KillerNerd007]

No, a scan saying that the reason why IT did not work on Edo Tensei is because they were in a Zetsu body.

Where is the clear reason? I've reread the chapter to make sure, but I couldn't find it.

All I'm hearing is Aizen in a gigai would be immune to IT, since Aizen is an immortal soul.

Even assuming that Aizen gets hit by it, somehow, Aizen's massively higher Reiatsu would resist it, basic Reiatsu has mind hax resistances, and the Hogyoku kind of negs. What's the Genjutsu's answer to it just evolving Aizen to resist it and manipulating fate for it not to work?

Beyond the fact Infinite Tsukuyomi don't work on souls.

 

[Arcker123]

What are votes at anyway?

 

[Raiden_Azno]

What are the arguments for both sides?

 

[ReaperAndBlues]

What are the arguments for both sides?

Madara's only wincon is Infinite Tsukuyomi. Aizen has everything else. Also no one has tackled why Madara would stand a chance against fate hax, so rn Madara is kinda f**ked

 

[Raiden_Azno]

So for 1 I think the fate hax stuff is wonky, not going to lie. I didn't see Aizen's Mahoraga lvl adapting but as far as Madara's win cons go....

Infinite Tsukiyomi as said before but also Limbo clones that are the same strength as Madara including they can all utilize their own perfect Susano'o which should bring up his AP, Genjutsu should be vastly superior compared to Aizen's atp and Madara could possibly steal the Hogyoku better than Gin did and probably destroy it.

 

[RanaProGamer]

What are votes at anyway?

From what I’ve read, Aizen seems to have more votes but not marginally more for this to be added yet

 

[Arcker123]

Infinite Tsukiyomi as said before

Probably won't work.

but also Limbo clones that are the same strength as Madara including they can all utilize their own perfect Susano'o which should bring up his AP,

That would've been a perfect ability to use in the manga to win any of his major fights, shame that they didn't.

Hogyoku is also cable of evolving Aizen cosmic awareness to sense them (It did this in canon for muken Aizen, no reason it couldn't if it felt like aizen needed it here), along with its own arguable interdimensional range.

Genjutsu should be vastly superior compared to Aizen's atp

Reikaku flat out negs any occular jutsu. Aizen doesn't use eyesight.

Madara could possibly steal the Hogyoku

The Hogyoku is a physical object, so Chakra absorption feats (tailed beasts are pure chakra) means nothing (Aizen also resists absorption)

Even if we assume Madara muscles it away from Aizens superior durability (which increases exponentially mid fight due to the Hogyoku), Gin shows us that stealing it from Aizen means literally nothing, and it will still allow Aizen to evolve, regen, and teleport to it at will. Madara stealing the Hogyoku will get him one-shot.

than Gin did and probably destroy it.

Hogyoku has mid godly regeneration just like Aizen does (they both regenerated from Mugetsu), and has been destroyed numerous times (scans in profile) and still regenerates. Madara has absolutely nothing in his kit to destroy mid godly permanently.

 

[Raiden_Azno]

Probably won't work.

Why?

That would've been a perfect ability to use in the manga to win any of his major fights, shame that they didn't.

Cool, glad we agree.

Hogyoku is also cable of evolving Aizen cosmic awareness to sense them (It did this in canon for muken Aizen, no reason it couldn't if it felt like aizen needed it here), along with its own arguable interdimensional range.

He'd have to know what they are before an effective counter-measure is used.

Reikaku flat out negs any occular jutsu. Aizen doesn't use eyesight.

He uses both. Genjutsu is still incredibly effective here.

The Hogyoku is a physical object, so Chakra absorption feats (tailed beasts are pure chakra) means nothing (Aizen also resists absorption)

Tailed Beasts are physical chakra manifestations, can I see that btw? ( Does the Hogyoku?)

Even if we assume Madara muscles it away from Aizens superior durability (which increases exponentially mid fight due to the Hogyoku), Gin shows us that stealing it from Aizen means literally nothing, and it will still allow Aizen to evolve, regen, and teleport to it at will. Madara stealing the Hogyoku will get him one-shot.

No no, Gin did nothing with it besides run away and plan on what to do with it. I'm arguing Madara destroys it right there to a much weaker Aizen than in his stronger fusion. Perfect Susanoo amps him significantly. Can I see that his durability increasing exponentially during the fight?

Hogyoku has mid godly regeneration just like Aizen does (they both regenerated from Mugetsu), and has been destroyed numerous times (scans in profile) and still regenerates. Madara has absolutely nothing in his kit to destroy mid godly permanently.

I looked. Where has the Hogyoku regenerated?

 

[ReaperAndBlues]

Why?

Cool, glad we agree.

He'd have to know what they are before an effective counter-measure is used.

He uses both. Genjutsu is still incredibly effective here.

Tailed Beasts are physical chakra manifestations, can I see that btw? ( Does the Hogyoku?)

No no, Gin did nothing with it besides run away and plan on what to do with it. I'm arguing Madara destroys it right there to a much weaker Aizen than in his stronger fusion. Perfect Susanoo amps him significantly. Can I see that his durability increasing exponentially during the fight?

Look at the AP diff from the first fusion to the second fusion, if Madara triggers his RE, he's cooked beyond belief because then he dies from Reiatsu Crush due to the AP diff. Also you need to neg Mid-Godly to destroy the Hogyoku, which Madara cannot do

I looked. Where has the Hogyoku regenerated?

The Hogyoku itself grants regen and has a mind of its own, so logically the Hogyoku can regenerate on its own. There are probably scans of it doing so, but I'm too tired rn to look but Arcker might have them.