Hasty12345
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I think the idea is that the AP is equivalent to 5D, or rather, inaccessibly above 4D?
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DBH Revision?
- Thread starter Zamasu_Chan
- Start date
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- Tags
- dragon ball
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Uncountably infinite amount of universes is above baseline 2A
Countably infinite universes is baseline 2A.
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Which is also why the "infinitely superior" stuff is irrelevant, I suppose. Since we're not talking about a transcendental dimension, right?
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Uncountably infinite universes is Low 1-C.
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Damn.....
Well yes I can see the logic now.....I stand corrected.
Well yes I can see the logic now.....I stand corrected.
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This isn't helping anything.
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At all
Hasty12345
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If the argument presented is legit, then it's not wank....
and I don't even think anyone in DBS would scale to this cosmology upgrade? So it would just be DBH who's profiles will be altered.
Vietthai96
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Calling wank is actually wrong here. You only wank is when you claim verse tier without backup, evidents and being unreasonable. But in here they make effort to upgrade and make an reasonable CRT so people could discuss, their reputation is not damage at all
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DBS Zen'o and IZ "2-C" key would
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Most likely Yeah.
My_area
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I still dont understand the weird logic of bigger timeline encompassing smaller timelines being 5D due to uncountable snapshots when its simply just a bigger spatio-temporal timeline encompassing smaller 4D timelines which makes it 2-C or low multiversal to multiversal+ depending on number of universes being encompassed and not just uncountably larger
I believe reason why timeline is Low 2-C is not because of uncountable snapshots(there is no way to know how many snapshots are there in a timeline) but due to it being combination of 3 spatial+1 temporal dimension which makes it 4D space and time continum making it on par with 4D spatial spaces ie qualifying for Low 2-C so I dont really agree with the upgrade
But for now,I will remain neutral and just watch over this thread as this reasoning is not something I can understand
I believe reason why timeline is Low 2-C is not because of uncountable snapshots(there is no way to know how many snapshots are there in a timeline) but due to it being combination of 3 spatial+1 temporal dimension which makes it 4D space and time continum making it on par with 4D spatial spaces ie qualifying for Low 2-C so I dont really agree with the upgrade
But for now,I will remain neutral and just watch over this thread as this reasoning is not something I can understand
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I agree.
I also think they should have infinite speed because they can fight on the demon world, which has no time.
I also think they should have infinite speed because they can fight on the demon world, which has no time.
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timeless void is not a reason to infinite speed here
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But the point is that the encompassing timeline has infinite superiority over lower 4D universes....same way a 4D timeline has infinite superiority over 3D objects.
3D < 4D universes < Hypertimeline.....with hypertimeline having same lvl of trancendence as 4D over 3D....hence low1C.
Hasty12345
Username Only- 4,365
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I'm going to explain it to the best of my knowledge so you can make an informed decision.
Consider a single universe. Conventionally this is a 3D object at any given moment in time. Now if you allow time to flow, you can imagine each sequence of events creating a snapshot in some later point in time. If you allow time to be continuous, when you "stack up" (like a tower of pancakes) each snapshot, you'll arrive at uncountably infinite moments of a 3D object which effectively "builds" your low 2-C structure.
Since the Multiverse in DBS/DBH are 2-C structures sharing a timeline, the argument is the "moments" are 4D, so when time is allowed to flow, the overall object that results (i.e. the pancake stack) is an object uncountably infinitely larger than a 2-C object which meets the requirement for a low 1-C cosmology.
This is the argument as I understand it.
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Hasty explained it best...
My_area
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I dont get the encompassing being equated to infinite superiority.Makes no sense to me.
Timelines only has such superior over 3D universes not because they encompass them but because timeline is 3 spatial+1 temporal making it 4D spatio-temporal dimension meaning its qualifies for Low 2-C.So "hypertimeline" just encompasses timelines means its 2-C.Merely encompassing something doesn't equate to higher dimension jump or a uncountable increase
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No one is using that as proof...
Many people provided extra evidence for Inaccessible infinite superiority as proof...
Now the point is would mods accept it...
Or more specifically Ultima.
My_area
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Thanks for the explanation but unfortunately I will have to disagree
I understand that timelines flowing creates a snapshot of a 3D objects,but I dont understand why timeline flowing necessarily equates to snapshot uncountable infinite 3D objects
So hence I dont understand how a bigger 2-C structure containing a snap shot of 4D timeline necessarily equates to it having uncountable number of 4D timeline snaps shot when we dont even know how many snap shots or "moments" a timeline contains before its end.
But thanks for the explanation anyways.
I see...I thought the hypertimeline encompassing uncountable infinite 4D timeline is the reason why Low 1-C DBH is being pushed
Hasty12345
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Time is considered "continuous" on this wiki afaik, what that mathematically translates to is an object which has a 1-1 correspondence to the real number line which has cardinal of the continuum (ultima probably could explain that better).
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"Yeah. Arguing for an overarching flow of time which encompasses multiple smaller timelines within itself and exists independently of them is just arguing for the existence of a higher temporal dimension which the Dragon Ball Multiverse exists in, and this is one of the reasons that make choosing between "The 12 universes are all in the same spacetime and the timeline is just Low 2-C" and "The 12 universes are all independent spacetime continuums and the timeline as a whole is a 5-D space"
"The whole reason for why Low 2-C is above 3-A to begin with is that a spacetime continuum basically contains an uncountably infinite number of 3-dimensional cross-sections (Infinitely small lower-dimensional slices of it), each of which correspond to the spatial volume of the universe at a given moment, and to qualify for that, you'd have to destroy the universe through all of time. Some people just only came to realize that recently, apparently. The argument for Low 1-C is basically a generalization of that, but for a larger flow of time which holds 4-D timelines as its cross-sections instead.
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"The whole reason for why Low 2-C is above 3-A to begin with is that a spacetime continuum basically contains an uncountably infinite number of 3-dimensional cross-sections (Infinitely small lower-dimensional slices of it), each of which correspond to the spatial volume of the universe at a given moment, and to qualify for that, you'd have to destroy the universe through all of time. Some people just only came to realize that recently, apparently. The argument for Low 1-C is basically a generalization of that, but for a larger flow of time which holds 4-D timelines as its cross-sections instead.
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Not interest for the discussion but Low 1-C is 5D-6D, uncountably infinite 4D is 5D, hence why an uncountably infinite 4D universes is a baseline 5D universe, which is Low 1-C.
So Low 1-C is 5D at minimum, but not all 5D is Low 1-C, because non-insignificant dimensional size is a thing. Infinite^infinite = R = 1 dimension.
So Low 1-C is 5D at minimum, but not all 5D is Low 1-C, because non-insignificant dimensional size is a thing. Infinite^infinite = R = 1 dimension.
My_area
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Hmm I see what you are talking about,but isn't continous 1:1 correspondence countable infinity like in case of set of natural numbers and not uncountable infinity like in case of set of real numbers where 1:1 correspondence isn't true?
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Go on Ultima's message wall, I think he explained this there. Thought I'm not sure
Hasty12345
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I believe natural numbers are considered discrete, which are countably infinite. The real numbers are continuous as you shouldn't be able to find any gap between any number that cannot be filled by more numbers.
like how when restricted to the set of natural numbers, there are no numbers between 1 and 2.
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True....there are no "consecutive" numbers on real number line.
My_area
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Okay,let me check.
Natural numbers are considered countable infinity because of there always being 1 to 1 correspondence so every number in natural number set would have a equivalent next number matching it.However for real numbers its considered uncountable infinity like for example 0 and 1 which as Cantor diagonal theorm proves that there is always a unique number which entire infinite set of numbers doesn't have hence not fulfilling 1 to 1 correspondence and being declared as uncountable infinity.Though I dont know about natural numbers being discrete.I will have to check
True
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4D pocket realities, 5D macrososm, 6D timeline. And a multiverse of 6D timelines.
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Do you want to fry our brains?Has anyone considered the fantasy of each pocket reality inside U7 to be as space-time would further complicate things.....basically another layer of space-time from this foundation would lead to 6D cosmology.
4D pocket realities, 5D macrososm, 6D timeline. And a multiverse of 6D timelines.
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Lormac_CC
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Good questionDo you want to fry our brains?
Stefano4444
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We really need to make a thread about the entire cosmology of the entire Dragon Ball verse and decide how we are suppost to treat it (otherwise there always going to be confusion over and over again), but personally speaking it does seen to me that each universes should be treated as their own universal space-time continuum.
Since the Living World and Afterlife in each universe exist in two separated dimensional realms, where time was even stated to flow differently and that the only way to travel between realms its with special techniques (like Instant Trasmission for Goku or Warp for Whis), if it wasn't the case then Living World and Afterlife should physically interact with each other.
Meaning each timeline in Dragon Ball its made by a 2-C cosmology structure.
Since the Living World and Afterlife in each universe exist in two separated dimensional realms, where time was even stated to flow differently and that the only way to travel between realms its with special techniques (like Instant Trasmission for Goku or Warp for Whis), if it wasn't the case then Living World and Afterlife should physically interact with each other.
Meaning each timeline in Dragon Ball its made by a 2-C cosmology structure.
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The 2-C Universe 7 stuff was already rejected here, unfortunately.
Thought I agree with you in general
Stefano4444
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I did specify that this is what i personally think, not what the wiki currently think.
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