Cross-Dimensional Vs Low Multiversal Range

[DarkDragonMedeus]

No, i heard the thing about clairvoyance. But this isn't explicitly about precognition or clairvoyance, it's about the difference between Universes and pocket realities with different space-times.

 

[SomebodyData]

Clairvoyance was just the example Wok was mentioning.

Like I said, I would just specify the range's finer details within the explanation.

 

[Wokistan]

Again you're missing the point. Don't fixate so much on the specific power, the more important bit is that it seems really weird to say that characters with range across multiple universes that doesn't actually encompass those universes would stay listed as multiversal. It makes no difference whatsoever how big the rest of the universe is if clairvoyant can only see within earth's radius and it is bizarre that it would effect how it's listed.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

Of course those who can see alternate timelines but can't quite see things coming from outside the Earth's atmosphere wouldn't quite have Low multiversal range via clairvoyance. And being able to destroy multiple pocket realities at once would simply be Cross-Dimensional as well.

 

[Wokistan]

But that's conflicting with this.

Traveling to another Universe for example would be Low Multiversal via dimensional travel. But traveling from the universe to the RoSaT for instance would just be Cross Dimensional. Since RoSaT is simply a pocket reality where time is 360x faster.

Both cases involve interaction with a non universal size for the extra universe. Why does how big the destination is matter here?

 

[Milly_Rocking_Bandit]

What if you were to watch over "a time period that shouldn't exist", which was the result of a bunch of space-time warping creatures?

Just asking for more input.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

Characters with Low Multiverse levels of dimensional travel should be able to travel anywhere in the Universe as well as travel to other Universes. If someone can travel to other Universes via dimensional travel but can't escape Earth's atmosphere, it's probably still Cross-Dimensional. If something can reach anywhere in the Universe as well as places in other timelines, it's Low Multiversal. Effecting multiple pocket realities + the Entire Universe is simply Cross-Dimensional. And being able to effect multiple things across multiple universes but are limited by certain things within there are universe as far as traditional range is still cross-dimensional.

 

[Wokistan]

Characters with Low Multiverse levels of dimensional travel should be able to travel anywhere in the Universe as well as travel to other Universes.

But how exactly is this proven just by the fact that they popped into a universe that's large?

If something can reach anywhere in the Universe as well as places in other timelines, it's Low Multiversal. Effecting multiple pocket realities + the Entire Universe is simply Cross-Dimensional.

These two are the same thing...

 

[Crabwhale]

I'm leaning on Wok's argument here.

 

[Andytrenom]

Limiting low multiversal range to being able to affect the entirety of multiple time space contnuums and cross dimensional to being able to access limited portions of these contnuums makes sense

 

[Antvasima]

So should this be applied then?

 

[Sera_EX]

Are we really altering range because of Dragon Ball? Because there's so much wrong with that.

 

[Sera_EX]

Also, since when does range, which primarily involves combat reach, have to do with physical travel or teleportation? You guys know that we don't scale range to speed (or distance traveled) right? Nobody should have cross-dimensional range via teleportation unless it's specified with teleportation, and even then not every case is applicable.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

@Sera Yes, if it's via non-combat applicable stuff, it would be specified.

Also, it's not just Dragon Ball, but Bleach, Castlevania, and Metroid and several other verses. Several characters and verses have Low Multiversal via attacks or abilities that reach multiple pocket realities significantly less than Universal, and are rated as Low Multiversal. Where as Samus being able to kill enemies who"Exist across two parallel dimensions" where only the only way to attack kill them is to attack both halves at the same time. Which for one character, that requires attacks having AoE to cross those spatial barriers. But she's rated as Cross-Dimensional as opposed to Low Multiversal.

I personally thing Buu's Vice Shout should be Cross-Dimensional rather than Low Multiversal. And it was mostly a thread involving Soul King and Ywhach is where I was asked to make this thread. And same with Castlevania, I think creating/destroying multiple 4-A sized pocket realities should be cross-dimensional rather than Low Multiversal. I also personally think Cross-Dimensional as opposed to Low Multiversal makes sense for Samus as well. It was Wokistan who brought up the non-combat applicable stuff such as precognition and all that. Which was agreed would be specified.

Side note, I recall you actually mentioning Cross-Dimensional as opposed to Low Multiversal range for DB characters. But the thread was made for multiple other verses and not just that.

 

[Dino_Ranger_Black]

When it comes to feats like this, I prefer to have Low Multiversal being limited to feats involved with the realms themselves and travelling them. The characters who happens to exist in more than one at the same time can have Cross Dimensional range.

 

[Sera_EX]

There's a difference between existing between/across dimensions (which clearly affects one's range) and simply teleporting somewhere. Existence is also passively combat applicable.

 

[Wokistan]

We still should list the range people's teleportation and other abilities are effective over.

Also how the hell is precog and clairvoyance non combat applicable what

Anyways you seem to have still missed my point. I don't think it's important the size of the area for stuff like traveling to a place or hitting a guy over there. Either one would be listed as cross dimensional. Low multiversal/multiversal/multiversal+ would be for actually affecting the totality of those universes. I'd say none of your examples qualify unless people are doing stuff that affects all of 2+ universes.

 

[TheUnshakableOne]

what if you can affect strictly only the earth on a scale of infinite multiverse? As in the attack affects an infinite number of earths in a multiverse

Cross-dimenisoinal still??

 

[Wokistan]

This is what we're trying to determine and exactly what I'm saying rn

 

[The_Causality]

To answer at The OP, i see no real problem with the Low Multiverse ranting only with the specific ability (like Vice Shout for DB cast), Low Multiversal by definition is at worst two different Time-Space, being able to travel throught different Space Time, no matter the size should grant Low Multiversal range with the said ability
Cross Dimensional should be used for characters who can travel throught different Dimension but aren't specified (due to a lack of feat) to be a different Time-Space (like 80% of the Dimensional travel used on this site)

EDIT: Thought it should be noted that Low Multiversal range in this case is mostly for "affecting" via travels throught the dimensions, i'am still iffy about other stuff like "destroying two different (but not universal) time space" should grant Low Multiversal range sinc this is nothing compared to a basic Low Multiversal range.

i just repost what i'm proposing regarding the whole stuff.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

@Causality I mean, Space-Time Pocket Realities are a thing.

 

[Antvasima]

So should this be applied then?

 

[Agnaa]

There seems to mostly be a consensus now?

I think the one point of contention is: If a character teleports to their copy of their planet in another universe, should that be Cross Dimensional or Low Multiversal?

I think DDM assumes that such a character should be able to teleport anywhere in their universe by default (even if that's never shown), and so it would be Low Multiversal. But Wokistan and others don't want to make that assumption, and thus would rate it at Cross Dimensional.

I think the Range page could be updated, since it seems like it's just this specific application that's being argued over.

 

[Antvasima]

I thought that cross-dimensional would be simply reaching to another universe with some ability, whereas low multiversal would be affecting several entire universes at once.

 

[Sera_EX]

I thought that cross-dimensional would be simply reaching to another universe with some ability, whereas low multiversal would be affecting several entire universes at once.

That would be Trans-Universal, whereas Cross-Dimensional is just as it sounds, crossing dimensional barriers (like pocket realms and such). Low Multiversal is indeed affecting at least two universes.

 

[Antvasima]

Okay, but should we really make a distinction between cross-universal and cross-dimensional, or add both of them?

 

[Wokistan]

I feel like making a distinction between trans universal and cross dimensional is pedanticism. I don't see why the size of the destination really matters when you're not using all of it. Like I can enter a house or I can enter the empire State building, both through a door, but it's the exact same process and nothing special happens just because I entered a bigger structure.

Also, infinitely large pocket dimensions exist.

 

[Antvasima]

I agree with Wokistan. My apologies Sera.

 

[AnonymousBlank]

So ...... lemme see if I have this right.

• Low multiversal: Affecting the entirety of two time spaces at once.
• Trans Universal: Affecting something in another time space.
• Cross Dimensional: ..... ngl, I am in the same boat as Ant and was under the impression that this was Trans Universal. What is the difference between the two?

 

[Rocker1189]

I would say cross dimensional they are still within the same time? Just different spaces.

 

[AnonymousBlank]

So something like an Instant Dungeon or Limbo Clones where it's still part of the same time space as the real world but on a different "plane" as it were?

 

[Rocker1189]

So something like an Instant Dungeon or Limbo Clones where it's still part of the same time space as the real world but on a different "plane" as it were?

I think Limbo clones are described as in different time spaces(just coincides with the time of the normal world) as well, but if they were just in a seperate space then yeah, thats how I would see it.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

Need I remind you that Range does not have to be omnidirectional. That's confusing range with Area of effect; there's a big difference. For example, a projectile that starts from the sun and can reach beyond the Earth is Interplanetary range, it doesn't have to be an omnidirectional explosion that covers the Earth, sun, and every in between to be a range feat. It just needs to be able to reach far.

Effecting the entirety of two or more universes is Low Multiversal AoE; and attack that simply reaches other Universes is still range. It may not be AoE but it's still range. Being able to teleport anywhere on planet earth is considered "Planetary via teleportation", you don't need to have an attack that covers the planet to have planetary range.

I know that was off topic, but it seemed people got range and AoE mixed up. Back to the main topic, I don't think Trans Universal is necessary. Because based on what I read about, that just sounds like Low Multiversal range where as the suggestion for Low Multiversal range sounds like it has to be AoE.

• Low Multiversal: Being able to reach alternate Space-Time Continuums/Universes
• Cross Dimensional: Reaching within or outside pocket realities that are outside the main space, or nonlinear time.

 

[Celestial_Pegasus]

Sounds right to me.

 

[Rocker1189]

^I agree with DDM.

 

[Overlord775]

@Dark

Actually, with the ability to affect multiple universes would entain that you can shoot a blast and make it travel the lenght of multiple universes

meanwhile, Cross-dimensional range doesn't entail the ability to hit someone from like a galaxy away, but only to different universes

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

I agree with that bit, Low Multiversal would be assumed to be above and beyond the edge of the Universe to the point where it can reach other Universes as well. So perhaps this.

• Low Multiversal: Attacks are able to reach anywhere between two to a thousand 4-dimensional space-time continuums
• Cross-Dimensional: Attacks can reach outside of conventional space; whether through pocket realities, certain portions outside the Universe, and possibly certain portions within other universes, but are less than multiversal in reach.

 

[Overlord775]

Seems good to me

 

[Milly_Rocking_Bandit]

What if you were to watch over "a time period that shouldn't exist", which was the result of a bunch of space-time warping creatures?

Just asking for more input.

 

[Wokistan]

Low Multiversal: Being able to reach alternate Space-Time Continuums/Universes

Cross Dimensional: Reaching within or outside pocket realities that are outside the main space, or nonlinear time.

But why are we assuming that you can reach anywhere in the universe you're doing stuff in? Say there's two cities that are I dunno 3 km apart. If I teleport the 3 km into a city, you're saying that i'd get city wide teleportation ratings, at least if we keep principles consistent here. That doesn't really make sense. You still have not explained exactly what makes doing stuff in a large universe any more impressive than doing stuff in a pocket dimension and are just kinda asserting that it is.