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yes but i was using it prove that you dont need mention of rf to prove transcendence
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Chaos Force Low 1-C Upgrade?
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And they describe it as a higher plane
Vietthai96
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Why i'm not familiar with Sonic, i disagree cause you need more evident than just some Higher Plane of Existence context, cause if we go by this logic, DBH will also get Tier 1
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U don't need to mention RF to prove transcendence, but RF proves it, and Higher Planes are vagues, and the scans don't have enough feats or statements to it
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Higher Plane is vague, Outside Space-Time is also vague, it doesnt envolves transcendences or RF, a lot of things in DB are stated to be Higher Planes, but when we see the context, it isnt enough to Higher Dimensional, and the contexts for Archie Sonic case also isnt enough
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I agree with this thread. Before we progress, I think it's important to note why the reasons for the original thread were wrong.
tl;dr all of the old reasoning to deny this is very outdated and doesn't hold up, this is good to go through
- The thread argued that the Chaos Force transcending space and time doesn't mention multiple universes, let alone infinite. However, such a mention would be rather unnecessary considering other realities like Mobius have things like Anarchy Beryl (the Chaos Emerald equivalent for Moebius' reality) or Power Rings of their own too. Not only that, Ian has stated other zones are offshoot divergences from the Prime Zone if I recall correctly, so they should naturally have their own manifestations of the Chaos Force in some way, shape, or form. It's pretty conclusive that the statement would refer to all universes of the cosmology.
- People argued that the Chaos Force was "only treated as a spiritual dimension" when that's untrue given it's specifically above spiritual planes of existence. Not only that, this view is outdated as to how the Chaos Force is treated by the site now.
- It was argued that it doesn't exist fully above the multiverse when that its very transcendent nature as shown above would literally debunk any sort of notion revolving around that.
- Some were arguing that it needed to specifically mention the concepts of space and time when that has literally never been a requirement for such a simple jump like this as far as I can tell.
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I don't remember nobody here using these arguments ^
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Kinda are
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the higher planes is not just the only evidence people, it works along with the repeated statements of transcendence and the SUPPORTING evidence of existing outside of space and time to say that it is 5d
Vietthai96
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Then could you bring out the supporting evidence? cause just higher plane of exitence and outside of space and time, i don't think it is enough
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It is when it is the fact that is beyond the Archie Sonic Verse itself soooooo....
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What does transcending to a higher plane of existence mean to you? twice over.
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Also, I'm just going to put some counters:
- comparing madoka and the chaos force is a huge false equivalency, Madoka doesn't have any statement for 5D since it says nothing about being above or outside of time, while the chaos force is literally stated to be a higher plane outside of time and space
- The JJBA thing is also a false equivalency, and once again, they literally said they ascended to a higher plane due to their connection with the chaos energy
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those are not the main pieces of evidence those are the supporting pieces of evidence to the multiple statements of transcendence posted in the op
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Pasting this of the VSB page
Characters who can affect, create and/or destroy the entirety of spaces whose size corresponds to one to two higher levels of infinity greater than a standard universal mode
The Chaos Force is beyond two higher levels of infinity even the Multiverse
Characters who can affect, create and/or destroy the entirety of spaces whose size corresponds to one to two higher levels of infinity greater than a standard universal mode
The Chaos Force is beyond two higher levels of infinity even the Multiverse
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I didnt used the JJBA equivalency due the higher planes, I used the comparison of grandfather not seeing them, but the scan just shows that they are in the same place, but just can't by seem, similar to JJBA case
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Being levels of infinite above the multiverse is not enough to 5-D
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Outside time and space is not 5-D, and neither is Higher Plane of reality
Vietthai96
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Iike i said, i know about transcendence this and that, outside of space and time this and that, i'm not mean to be rude, but that just it, if this is enough for tier 1, then i think a lot of verse will be tier 1. Anyway, i'm here to agree or disagree, just have some opinion regard this upgrade
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off to go downgrade pokemon, gl, and a whole bunch of other verses cause 3d beings can see and interacted with higher dimensional beings
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I don't care to Pokemon, if u care to it, try to upgrade/downgrade it
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yes but themselves they are not, but together with the two separate statements of them transcending it should be enough
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Except that the scan don't show statements to transcendence, it just says that is a place outside time and space, and Higher Plane of reality also envolves it
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Bernkastelll: “Higher Plane of Existence” = “Same Dimensional Existence”
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I didnt said it, please, don't lie, I said that Higher Plane of reality is vague to be Higher Dimensional, which makes sense because the scan shows that the others are on the same level o existance as Grandfather, but grandfather just can't see them, and them don't see it as lower dimensional/fictional
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Did... did you not click on the links from the OP to the Encyclopedia pages?
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I did
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Did you read them? If so, how did you miss the words transcendence in both pages?
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I already said, I read it, and it is vague, like all this context, even tiering system FAQ talks about how vague the word transcend can be
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Anyways, if the all problem is the word transcend/higher plane, just call Ultima and gg, if he/she agrees, nice
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Transcendence + higher plane of existence (x2) + Outside of Space and Time after Transcending past the 2 Higher Planes of Existence
Yep, sounds vague to me
Hasty12345
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I'm pretty sure all relevant characters already have higher dimensional existence.
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Transcendence on the context talks about characters that transcend to the Higher Plane of reality, that is just a place outside time space, so, you envolving it a lot of times won't change the fact that it isnt enough to tier 1, anyways, just call Ultima and gg
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how the hell is it vague, it is literally a statement of transcendence regarding characters that we known have become apart of the chaos force when in combination with the statement of it existing outside of space and time and it repeatedly being called a higher plane of existence and being described as beyond perception, tell me please i'm really curious as to how it is vague
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copy-paste from my previous comment ''Transcendence on the context talks about characters that transcend to the Higher Plane of reality, that is just a place outside time space, so, you envolving it a lot of times won't change the fact that it isnt enough to tier 1, anyways, just call Ultima and gg''
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Correction: “described as beyond comprehension” to 3 Dimensional Tails
Hasty12345
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So being beyond the comprehension of a 3D being is 5D now?
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