Boruto movie upgrades.

[Non-Bias]

I'm still baffled by all this.

Having the power of the Juubi automatically puts you near Hagoromo's power, which means that Obito, Madara, and Naruto were near him in power according to the databook and Hagoromo.

Madara gained more power than Hagoromo which should automatically put him at Moon Level.

Naruto not only got power from Hagoromo, he gained all the power of the Bijuu and gained all the powers of a Juubi Jinchuriki as seen and stated by Madara. This was before he harnessed all the energy on the planet which greatly increased his power output.

Naruto being Multi Continent Level for his EOS, The Last, and adult counterpart seems to suggest he's never gotten stronger, which is false. This attack itself was Small Country Level in potency while he was in BSM for managing to stalemate Toneri's attack and it's nowhere near his strongest attack or his strongest form. He should be Moon Level via powerscaling pretty easily in my opinion.

 

[HokageMangaVox]

Is Kaguya moon level+ with her powers or with brute force? You should at least scale her with Naruto and Sasuke. Kaguya should be Continent level+ since this happen after they beat her-(Survived the clash from TBRS and Indra's arrow)/ then you can put Moon Level+ after that. Becuase looking at their profiles it seems that a continent level naruto and sasuke defeated Kaguya a moon level character. It doesn't seem right even do they where using the tsb to by pass durability but that would mean that Sasuke, Naruto and speacilly Sakura would never had deal any damage to her as a whole.

What you can't be serious here the technique used to seal Kaguya is moon level in it of itself what is this downgrade you speak of?

Donwgrade? She could still be Moon Level+ with her powers. Unless Naruto is Moon Level+ before fighting Sasuke since both are but at Continent Level and Naruto manage to hit her a few times. That makes no sense, if she was truly moon level+ in base form she would have kill them completly. Also, she got seal in Ten Tails form, so her Ten Tails should be the one to have Moon Level+ and not her.

She should be at least Continent Level+ to Multi-Continent Level+ in her base form and Moon Level+ in Ten Tails form. Last i check Kaguya was in Ten Tails form when she got seal.

 

[CHILLVIBEZZ]

I think I addressed that many times over in this thread she brushed off their attacks.The only time she got hurt was by moves that bypass conventional durability.Naruto has senjutsu her sole weakness and kamui raikirii bypasses durability.Sakura only caught her off guard it's common.

 

[HokageMangaVox]

That does not explain why she was scale to Moon Level+ from her durability and later chance that she could terra form a planet. Since her durability with the Chibaku Tensei came from her been in Ten Tails form not in base form.

 

[CHILLVIBEZZ]

Because both Hagoromo and hamuras powers are just scattered chakra of hers and both performed moon lvl feats.And I had no idea she was scaled off Juubi but that isn't relevant here.Youre free to make a thread about it tho.

 

[Antvasima]

I have placed Kaguya's durability at "Unknown", given the highly inconsistent showings.

 

[CHILLVIBEZZ]

Alright then.But did we get enough input to have a conclusion?

 

[HokageMangaVox]

Because both Hagoromo and hamuras powers are just scattered chakra of hers and both performed moon lvl feats.And I had no idea she was scaled off Juubi but that isn't relevant here.Youre free to make a thread about it.

Is too much of a headche for me to do, right now. Maybe later.

 

[KamiYasha]

Finally i've ended of reading this thread...

Before give my verdict i've a question: Why Momoshiki is Moon level+?

 

[CHILLVIBEZZ]

Did an admin not do his page? Because I don't know..probably for overpowering too high 6A characters at once...or something

 

[LordAizenSama]

^^probably off the misconception that hes above kaguya,(that he was the thing kaguya was worried about and needed a army) idk. theres no real reason for it

 

[HokageMangaVox]

Didn't someone post a thread saying that Momoshiki was weaker than Kaguya? Nevermind i founded.

Here, what he said:

Naruto upgradesUncleSpacema
The Boruto Movie was written by both Kodachi & Kishimoto. Kodachi turned the Boruto Movie into a novel. Ergo, the novel is canon, because it was written by a primary source.

• Momoshiki is objectively weaker than Kaguya, as Momoshiki's goal was to attain the same power Kaguya had by recreating the God Fruit and eating it. Also Momoshiki lack's a rinne-sharingan & his own chakra
• In the Boruto Movie, it's clear that both Naruto and Sasuke did not use their full power against Momoshiki, as they did not use Chibaku Tensei, Three Headed Kurama, etc.
• From the Boruto Novel "Shockingly, the power inside him that he'd absorbed from Kinshiki which should've been his trump card was insufficient. No, that wasn't it. He had no choice but to acknowledge it. The men in front of his eyes…were strong. If it was one on one, he would be able to keep up." Ergo Naruto & Sasuke are both roughly equal to Momoshiki

From this, we can establish a power-scale of,

Kaguya > Naruto = Sasuke >= Momoshiki

 

[CHILLVIBEZZ]

If the novel was canon then Momoshiki created a dimension casually and Kaguyas dimensions are parallel to theirs.....but it's not canon since he didn't have part in the novel

 

[HokageMangaVox]

Also, giving the fact that the Tain Tails feat was made with Chibaku Tensei, which put Kaguya at Moon Level+ should be added here:

• Moon Level (Juubi)-Ten Tails, giving the calc, also someone should add the Juubi to Kaguya's page since she's the medium and she can transform into it.
• Now we can have a Planet Level (Hagoromo) -since he was said to be stronger than the juubi and he re-shaped the world with the sword of nunoboko after sealing the juubi.

 

[CHILLVIBEZZ]

Well I need to go now.I'll be back later until then.

 

[KamiYasha]

^ This seems rasonable. Anyway, my final veredic is this:

Kaguya: It's imposible to be stellar level. (the sun probably was an ilusion just like Aizen's las noches(who have anilusion of a sun))

Sasuke: Agreed about the portals via tomoe rinnegan.

Naruto: This... i'm not sure.

Madara: Fully agree, he should be equal or at least as strong as hagoromo who is Moon level+ (I will rate him as Possible Moon level+ via stated by hagoromo himself)(With a side note: It's certainly unknown how powerfull is madara at his maximum, since he got mostly of all the powers and he was "getting near" to hagoromo before the absorption shinju and the second rinnegan, plus the obtaining of the sha-rinnegan)

 

[ImagoDesattrolante]

I agree with KamiYasha, to sum it up.

 

[Antvasima]

All right, everybody who are not staff members and have already commented should probably stop posting now, as I think that they have all explained themselves by now.

I am waiting for all the staff members to get the time to evaluate this without having an overly long cluttered discussion to sift through.

In addition, I am waiting for the calculation group to get the time to decide whether or not Hagoromo's Moon-creating calculation is legitimate, and if so, which of the values that is most reliable? This is necessary to decide whether or not Naruto and Sasuke should be Moon level or Multi-Continent level.

 

[Illuminati478]

not one single feat that is actually calculateable or provable in any case, besides we have already discussed most of these stuff and reached a conclusion about the topics.

naruto doesn't get the upgrade because we don't know enough about chakra, and besides, feats that were preformed by 2 or more characters cannot be applied to any specific one of them, even if one character is stronger then the rest. thats my final say about this

kaguya, sigh..., why again? whether her dimensions have a sun or not isn't the point, the point is that even at star level (which is already a massive outlier compared to narutoverse), your trying to hide the much more obviuos outlier, if there's a star, theres a solar system, if there's a solar sytem, theres a galaxy, and if rheres a galaxy there's a widespread universe filled with stars, and a universe level kaguya is even more of an outlier, and even if its not what youre trying to say, that is what your evidence leads to, which means, you guessed it, no upgrade.

about madara, we had this conversation already so many times, Feats take precedents before statements, especially vague ones, madara's feats put him at continent level, and that is a much clear precise indcator then some statements and circumstantial plot points.

those are my final opinions on the matter and they won't change...

 

[CHILLVIBEZZ]

Even without the assumption that it has a star the mere size between the planet and the moon shown would be enough to upgrade her you do realize that right?Also having space does not mean a place is universal.....

As for Madara well many characters make statements and are rated for them Yamamotos being one for example while he hasn't shown anything close previously.Hagoromo saying what he did about Madara would make complete sense as he was gaining the same power he did to begin with.Hagoromo himself is 5C for one move his Arsenal is not 5C same goes for Kaguya being planetary.

Also by Hagoromos own words which can't get anymore credible stated he was near him that alone is 5C since being near is obviously being more than half as powerful let alone Madara after acquiring shinju three his second rinnegan and awakening his complete rinne sharingan.

If Madara wasn't moon+ than Kaguya wouldn't be either before taking back her chakra from everyone....

I just dropped Kaguya since none of the admins agree however Madara is perfectly justified as far as I know.

Anyways it's if its you're opinion.

 

[CaptainFalcon64]

While I do think Madara should get an upgrade. Kaguya, Naruto and Sasuke should stay where they are, Naruto and Sasuke having Moon Level potency at the war would make no sense at all, and Kaguya's reasoning makes even less sense. Also: Momoshiki is defeated by naruto and boruto rasengan.Boruto uses rasengan a small regular one and naruto adds his chakra to it and makes it huge while hes being stabbed by black rodds which i believe were sucking his chakra away from him.Anyways thats a 5C feat for him .Lets not forget that minato and naruto already did a father son rasengan and it didnt do much at all this one is exceptional because of narutos six paths chakra as well as his kyuubi which he has both halves off now.Borutos chakra has nothing exceptional that would do anything out of the ordinary or trigger something naruto used his chakra to amplify that regular rasengan and make it moon+. <--- just no if it was because of both them, only BOTH Naruto and Boruto together would have Moon Level+ not Naruto separately other wise Naruto would have beaten Momoshiki by himself.

 

[Faisal_Shourov]

not one single feat that is actually calculateable or provable in any case, besides we have already
about madara, we had this conversation already so many times, Feats take precedents before statements, especially vague ones, madara's feats put him at continent level, and that is a much clear precise indcator then some statements and circumstantial plot points.

those are my final opinions on the matter and they won't change...

If feats take precedence over statement yusuke wouldn't be country level, raizen wouldn't be continent level. Yu yu hakusho is all about statement. The best feat was sensui busting a small hill.

There shouldn't be double standard, just saying

 

[Illuminati478]

the difference is that yamamoto's statement goes along with the plot, actually limiting his actions considerably, is consistent with the nature of his bankai, and most importantly, has nothing that contredicts it, meanwhile all the statements that say Madara>=haguromo are actuallt contredicted by both feats and portrayel alike. when i bring up a suggestion and it gets denied, i drop it, most certainly i don't necromance topics every two months, we had this conversation, the upgrade got denied, let it be.


statements when and where they contredict feats, become unusable, this is a prime case, madara at his best produced a continet level feat, what are going to believe, words or visuals? i believe visuals, as in scientific debate (or a semi-scientific one like this), words are less credible then meassurments and feats.

 

[CHILLVIBEZZ]

Hagoromos statement is not contradicted nor invalid whatsoever.

First of all Hagoromo himself is only moon level via single technique he doesn't have a 5C moves filled Arsenal and this goes for Kaguya as well.

Madara performed chibaku tensei which was calculated at continent+ yes but it was just to distract them.He performed shin jokai koutan and mugen tsukuyomi as well two techniques directly from Kaguyas Arsenal one of which is high 6A via ensnaring the entire planet.


Finally if Madara did surpass at least current Hagoromo then Kaguya would not be 5C moon+ without obtaining her full power and Madara wouldn't become her vessel.

Madara was near Hagoromo and he easily kept up with Naruto and Sasuke both of which had half of Hagoromos power with a single rinnegan.

He gained his second rinnegan and absorbs shinju three and what does he awaken the same rinne sharingan that Kaguya herself awakened ages ago and likely Juubi jinchuriki Hagoromo .

 

[HokageMangaVox]

I'm lost now, how is scientific debate usable in fiction?

 

[Antvasima]

Please immediately stop derailing this thread by discussing Bleach, or blocks will start to be handed out.

 

[HokageMangaVox]

Please immediately stop derailing this theead by discussing Bleach, or blocks will start to be handed out.

I was not the one to brought that subject up, but I agree we should stop. This is about Naruto not Bleach.

 

[CHILLVIBEZZ]

Please immediately stop derailing this theead by discussing Bleach, or blocks will start to be handed out.

I only exemplified how statements were accepted but my bad tho.

 

[CHILLVIBEZZ]

Besides all of this..

All of the admins agreed upon Madaras upgrade.

Sasuke is just gaining new techniques.

Naruto is inconclusive but since Momoshikis tier is apparently unjustified it's complicated....

And Kaguyas was refused for numerous things..

Is that it?

 

[CaptainFalcon64]

Pretty much.

 

[Faisal_Shourov]

I agree with all mods except Illuminati here. I dont find his 'feat' argument logical given Madara can clearly be scaled to Hagoromo with all the stuff he obtained. Post god tree absorption + rinne sharingan Madara would be above hagoromo if not equal. If we count feats then there are plenty of characters from other verses who're powerscaled without having much feats, just empty statements. It's the same argument peoole has always used against DBZ until Super arrived

This is my final comment here. I dont like Madara so I take leave from discussion

 

[Edgar_Layelton]

I think people are trying to downgrade kaguya becouse naruto and sakura were able to punch her and also hurting her that only happens becouse chakra can be used for enhance streng speed and also durability. just as when sage mode naruto was able to block pain rods



But later then he stabs himself whith the same object



my point here is that they use a similar version of armament haki thats why whenever kaguya was being punched by naruto it was after he trickis her such as this one



But when ever she is on guard nothing has shown to hurt her






even by moon busting attacks


hope i helped.

 

[Sheoth]

Agreed with everything Lord Kavpeny said.

 

[SwordSlayer99]

Kaguya: There is no way that Kaguya is Star level or anything higher than that. Kaguya's ETSB was calculated at 87.855913 Zettatons. Planet level+ starts at 8 Yottatons. In order for Kaguya to advance from the Planet level to the Planet level+ category, she would have to get literally 91.0581852356369 times stronger than she is currently listed.

Sasuke: I agree about the portals via Tomoe Rinnegan.

Naruto: I don't know what to think about this. However,if Momoshiki really is Moon level / Moon level+, then I think Naruto and Sasuke should get upgraded as they were capable of keeping up with him / overpowering him, and Momoshiki even admitted that Naruto and Sasuke fighting together were stronger than him. So Momoshiki, Naruto, and Sasuke are all roughly equal in power, with Naruto and Sasuke having a slight advantage.

Madara: Fully agree, he should be equal or at least as strong as Hagoromo who is Moon level+. Hagoromo himself stated that Madara was near him in power, and that was when Madara only had 1 Rinnegan. Hagoromo has no reason to lie, so I think we can trust his statement.

 

[CrossverseCrisis]

Kaguya: There is no way that Kaguya is Star level or anything higher than that. Kaguya's ETSB was calculated at 87.855913 Zettatons. Planet level+ starts at 8 Yottatons. In order for Kaguya to advance from the Planet level to the Planet level+ category, she would have to get literally 91.0581852356369 times stronger than she is currently listed.

Sasuke: I agree about the portals via Tomoe Rinnegan.

Naruto: I don't know what to think about this. However,if Momoshiki really is Moon level / Moon level+, then I think Naruto and Sasuke should get upgraded as they were capable of keeping up with him / overpowering him, and Momoshiki even admitted that Naruto and Sasuke fighting together were stronger than him. So Momoshiki, Naruto, and Sasuke are all roughly equal in power, with Naruto and Sasuke having a slight advantage.

Madara: Fully agree, he should be equal or at least as strong as Hagoromo who is Moon level+. Hagoromo himself stated that Madara was near him in power, and that was when Madara only had 1 Rinnegan. Hagoromo has no reason to lie, so I think we can trust his statement.

This as well.

 

[Credible_Hulk]

I'm fine with all the upgrades except for Kaguya. Maybe she could be 5-B+

 

[CrossverseCrisis]

I'm fine with all the upgrades except for Kaguya. Maybe she could be 5-B+

No, we won't upgrade her to that high(unless your refering to her ETSB, that is). Even then, we have already decided on not upgrading Kaguya in anyway.

 

[Credible_Hulk]

^I was just expressing how I feel on the topic.

 

[CrossverseCrisis]

^I know that, but you could have at least be specific as to what Kaguya would be upgraded to. If it was to her ETSB, that would make more sense. If was to her AP, then no cause she would have stomped Naruto and Sasuke in the manga and not lose.

 

[Valar_Melkor_2]

I agree with what Lord Kavpeny said.