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Black Clover: Ancient Demon Size

DemonGodMitchAubin

DemonGodMitchAubin

He/Him
VS Battles
Thread Moderator
Calculation Group
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Ok, so I wanted to make a discussion thread for this as I know it is a contentious topic and should probably be discussed

In this calc, I got 6-B to 6-A results based on the Ancient Demon's height being comparable to the Clover Kingdom Mountain, which was found to be around 20 to 60 Kilometers, the issue is that I know some people will have with this is that this height is inconsistent as we can see the Ancient Demon's height compared to human beings is not nearly as big as the Clover Kingdom Mountain

The question is whether to write this off as an art inconsistency or to treat this as a sign not use the calc at all since the calc is solely reliant on the size of the Demon being that big, honestly I am pretty neutral on this topic, but I am sure both sides are very passionate about their arguments for sure, so I will deliberate from what they say

Of course any regular users can give their arguments either in support or against the ratings
 
There's also this shot, where you can see humans characters near him. What I think is what we currently do to every single verse where size inconsistency is something: Don't calc feats using the big boy. Just like Naruto with the Bijus and summonings.
 
Personally, I think it's for the best to not try and use the demon's size for anything but it's own size. No fear of over inflating ratings or worrying about the inconsistent size.
 
Oh boy I hope y'all are ready for a long one because I've admittedly been waiting for this thread. Okay, so while I understand the reasoning for being against using the demon's size, I think it should be used. The main reason is that I've noticed a pattern with when the demon is comparable to the Clover Kingdom mountain and when it's not, and it's a pattern that's very easy to attribute to design limitations.

Take these two shots for example:
YomWwvN.jpg


UXYHnqO.jpg

In both of these, there aren't any humans in the panel that the demon is in to restrict the size it can be drawn at, not to mention they're all spreads or large panels, which allows the demon's size to be drawn more accurately. Hence, every instance of the demon being at the size of the Clover Kingdom mountain is a spread or a large panel.

On the other hand, here are examples where the demon is depicted as being much smaller:
mrX3mjW.jpg
zWoryIs.jpg

Like before, there's a pattern. With this, it's that there are humans present in both shots (which is true for the entirety of the demon's 2 chapters of existence). On top of that, the panels are generally smaller. These are simply design limitations that force the demon's size to be less than it really is so as to ensure that everything that needs to be visible is visible. I believe that this shouldn't be accounted for in regard to the demon's size because the times where the design isn't limited by such factors depict a consistent size; that size would be at least the size of the Clover Kingdom mountain.

Now, I saw someone mention this image and that it further shows an inconsistency:
pr34KTr.jpeg

On the contrary, I believe this shot actually proves my claim more. Yeah, humans are visible in that shot, but it's also a large panel, and it shows that even with humans present, when there's a large panel, the demon gets drawn to be the size of the mountain, not a size to accommodate for the humans. Basically, the mountain size took priority over the size of the humans.

TL;DR / Conclusion: The demon's size is only "inconsistent" when faced with design limitations such as smaller panels and humans being present. When it doesn't have those limitations, it's consistently the size of the Clover Kingdom mountain. In fact, the one time there's a large panel with humans present, making the demon the size of the mountain takes priority over making the demon a size that accommodates for the humans, further showing that the size of the mountain is the intended size of the demon and should be used.
 
DragonGamerZ913 said:
Now, I saw someone mention this image and that it further shows an inconsistency:
pr34KTr.jpeg

On the contrary, I believe this shot actually proves my claim more. Yeah, humans are visible in that shot, but it's also a large panel, and it shows that even with humans present, when there's a large panel, the demon gets drawn to be the size of the mountain, not a size to accommodate for the humans. Basically, the mountain size took priority over the size of the humans.

TL;DR / Conclusion: The demon's size is only "inconsistent" when faced with design limitations such as smaller panels and humans being present. When it doesn't have those limitations, it's consistently the size of the Clover Kingdom mountain. In fact, the one time there's a large panel with humans present, making the demon the size of the mountain takes priority over making the demon a size that accommodates for the humans, further showing that the size of the mountain is the intended size of the demon and should be used.
Click to expand...
Won't really agree or disagree with the size stuff, but in that last panel. The Demon is nowhere as big as the mountain, it's just the perspective.
 
It’s the size of the mountain. It’s basically the same as the “I’ll join forces with a devil” panel but zoomed out
 
DragonGamerZ913 said:
It’s the size of the mountain. It’s basically the same as the “I’ll join forces with a devil” panel but zoomed out
Click to expand...
Actually in both those panels. The Demon is depicted as smaller than the mountain and mages are able to seen from those shots, now that I notice it.
 
It's not. It's just perspective. The mountain is in front of him, and it's bigger than him. If something is far away from you, and even with the distance the thing is bigger, it'd be a lot bigger if it's closer. Hard to explain, but easy to understand.
 
Even if the demon isn’t bigger then the mountain in that one panel the point about it only being smaller when humans need to be visible still stands. There isn’t really a way to show the demon and humans without shrinking it down but without that limit it is always shown as tall or taller then the mountain as far as I can see.
 
What dragoon said

I also agree with Gamer

As for the panel with the demons facing each other, the mountain is actually smaller than the demon and not the opposite. It could have been perspective if the demon wasn't literally at the bottom of the mountain
 
No, it's called inconsistency. There is no such thing as "design limitations". If the demon is that big, then he'd be like that in literally every panel.
 
M3X said:
No, it's called inconsistency. There is no such thing as "design limitations". If the demon is that big, then he'd be like that in literally every panel.
Click to expand...
Yes there is, especially since you’re not always going to have big panels or spreads, so fitting everything you want to fit will come with some limitations. The panels I sent basically prove this.
 
The only way to show what the humans are doing and show the demon is to either scale up the humans or scale down the demon otherwise the humans would be too small to make out. Yet whenever that isn’t an issue it is always shown comparable and taller then the mountain.
 
His reason does make sense and seems consistent that when it’s drawn small there are humans in the same panel with the demon and when he’s drawn big it’s by itself
 
Ah yes three different people responding to a post in a small timeframe is spamming. How were we supposed to know the others were gonna post?
 
DragonGamerZ913 said:
Yes there is, especially since you’re not always going to have big panels or spreads, so fitting everything you want to fit will come with some limitations. The panels I sent basically prove this.
Click to expand...
Completely irrelevant. Doesn't matter if the author doesn't always have double pages to represent the size of the demon. He could just make the humans or any other character small enough to the point of not being compared with the demon. You have only one scan where the demon has the same size of the mountain, and in literally every other panel he is smaller.
Limit-breaker9910 said:
Well he explained the reason for that inconsistency
Click to expand...
He did not. Doesn't metter if the inconsistency has x, y or z justifications, it still an inconsistency.
Dragoonseraphim said:
The only way to show what the humans are doing and show the demon is to either scale up the humans or scale down the demon otherwise the humans would be too small to make out. Yet whenever that isn’t an issue it is always shown comparable and taller then the mountain.
Click to expand...
Exactly, it just proved that the demon isn't that big, he isn't portrayed like that, he is relative to humans, trees and buildings in size. You are just giving excuses for an inconsistency, and it really doesn't matter, inconsistency is inconsistency.
 
We now reached a point where doesn't matter how inconsistency the size of something is, but if you have EXCUSES for it, it's fine to use.
 
M3X said:
Completely irrelevant. Doesn't matter if the author doesn't always have double pages to represent the size of the demon. He could just make the humans or any other character small enough to the point of not being compared with the demon. You have only one scan where the demon has the same size of the mountain, and in literally every other panel he is smaller.
Click to expand...
Not that easy, hell one of the scans I sent was of a small panel to demonstrate such limitations and the humans were REALLY tiny, yet that still doesn’t work. Yes, there are limitations.

Also, please stay civil. I don’t want this to become a full-blown argument
 
And it is true that if he has to draw the demon in a smaller panel it would most likely come out smaller then when he has a full panel to draw it in not just limited to double spreads
 
DragonGamerZ913 said:
Not that easy, hell one of the scans I sent was of a small panel to demonstrate such limitations and the humans were REALLY tiny, yet that still doesn’t work. Yes, there are limitations.
Click to expand...
Limitation doesn't matter

Author needing to draw both humans and demons, doesn't matter

What matters is if the size is consistent. You literally posted a lot of scans and only one of them proves your point. Do you really think the demon has 23km while you can see humans near him? Only they have hundred of meters in size. That's obviously not the case.

Limit-breaker9910 said:
Not excuses it’s a justified with some solid logic
Click to expand...
Same as excuses, You doesn't not justiy a mistake. Inconsistent is a mistake
 
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