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Black Clover: Ancient Demon Size

The point is that if he wanted to drawn the humans and demon to scale the humans would look microscopic. He needs to scale it down to show the people at all. It is a limitation of the drawing that needed to be fixed. The demon is otherwise consistently shown to be taller or at least as tall as the mountain.
 
Dragoonseraphim said:
The point is that if he wanted to drawn the humans and demon to scale the humans would look microscopic. He needs to scale it down to show the people at all. It is a limitation of the drawing that needed to be fixed. The demon is otherwise consistently shown to be taller or at least as tall as the mountain.
Click to expand...
You actually need to prove that the demon is that big compared to the mountain. There are more scans showing he is smaller than that he is taller. You should first prove that the author intention was the make the demon as big as the mountain, even with a lot of panels showing otherwhise.
Dragoonseraphim said:
The demon is otherwise consistently shown to be taller or at least as tall as the mountain.
Click to expand...
Definetly not true. Only one scans against all others.
 
Even factoring in perspective, the demon is at least close to the mountain’s height (though being honest, I don’t get this whole perspective thing as I keep looking and the demon always appears larger). The demon’s actually close to the mountain too, closer than the humans are to the demon in that final shot from the looks of it.
 
DragonGamerZ913 said:
Even factoring in perspective, the demon is at least close to the mountain’s height
Click to expand...
No, you are far from being correct. I said that above. If something is far away from you, and the is still bigger, it'd be bigger if it was closer.
 
I took some pics irl to show you what this means. Take a look at this. You can see my cubik and a tape. You can see that even some centimeters away, the cubik is still taller than the tape. Now both at the same angle you can see that the cubik is still taller. The same applies here (demon = tape, mountain = cubik). You can do it yourself.
 
Okay, well I get what you're saying. However, the demon itself is actually close to the mountain, so for it to be close while still being depicted as at that height is pretty indicative. This is especially the case given that these are after the shot that you say is the only one supporting the demon being that size. In that shot, the demon is close to the mountain, and it didn't move at all since then, so it still is.
 
Just gonna say now that I'm turning it in for the night so I won't be responding anymore now. I'll discuss stuff here again tomorrow.
 
DragonGamerZ913 said:
Okay, well I get what you're saying. However, the demon itself is actually close to the mountain, so for it to be close while still being depicted as at that height is pretty indicative. This is especially the case given that these are after the shot that you say is the only one supporting the demon being that size. In that shot, the demon is close to the mountain, and it didn't move at all since then, so it still is.
Click to expand...
That's actually supports my point. The demon is close to the mountain (diminishing the effects of the perspective) and he is much smaller than the mountain.
 
I personally think the issue lies in the Clover Kingdom Mountain size calc and the Ancient Demon adds to this with it's inconsistent size shots.
 
M3X said:
That's actually supports my point. The demon is close to the mountain (diminishing the effects of the perspective) and he is much smaller than the mountain.
Click to expand...
He is not. There's the "in this world" shot, and then the "I'll join forces with a devil" shot, and then the shot of the demon being sliced. All of these shots show the demon close to the mountain and in all of them, the demon is at a size comparable to the mountain.
 
I think using "likely/possibly" in characters profiles is better

"At least Low 6-B, likely/possibly [Calculation result]
 
That's the last time I'll explain this, since that's a simple thing and anyone can easily understand what this means. If you don't understand, read it again and again.
DragonGamerZ913 said:
Now, I saw someone mention this image and that it further shows an inconsistency:
pr34KTr.jpeg

On the contrary, I believe this shot actually proves my claim more. Yeah, humans are visible in that shot, but it's also a large panel, and it shows that even with humans present, when there's a large panel, the demon gets drawn to be the size of the mountain, not a size to accommodate for the humans. Basically, the mountain size took priority over the size of the humans.
Click to expand...
Not the first time, not the second time I'll explain this. In this scan, the demon is far away from the mountain, and he is relative to humans near him. You are, again, justifying an inconsistency. You don't need to be very smart to understand about perspective, at this point is just ignorance, since I've explained with my pictures. I'll quote it again.
M3X said:
I took some pics irl to show you what this means. Take a look at this. You can see my cubik and a tape. You can see that even some centimeters away, the cubik is still taller than the tape. Now both at the same angle you can see that the cubik is still taller. The same applies here (demon = tape, mountain = cubik). You can do it yourself.
Click to expand...
This draw I did makes it easier to understand. The manga panel gives you a perspective where the demon and the mountain are facing each other, that's why you think they are relative. I did a pixelscaling below to find the distance between the mountain and the demon.

Pixel scan

Panel: 611px
Human: 34px = 1.7m
Castle lenght: 102px = 654.6375m (according to the calc)

Human to the panel

2atan(tan(70deg/2)*[34/611]) = 4.4626978039 degree

Distance: 21.815m

Castle to the panel

2atan(tan(70deg/2)*[102/611]) = 13.33435303 degre

Distance: 2800.2m

Total: 2800.2 - 21.815 = 2778.385 or 2.77km

The mountain is ALMOST 3KM from the demon, and he isn't even near the size of the mountain. If he gets closer to the mountain, the demon would be smaller. To make it easy: An airplane flying some km above the ground seems small, but if you are close to it, the thing is big. Same here.
 
You’re on about me justifying an inconsistency but I’ve explained why it really isn’t. You haven’t said anything more than just “design limitations don’t exist” when I’ve shown otherwise with the scans I sent. Yes I get the perspective thing but still, that doesn’t address my point about why the demon is the way it is.

Also, again with the backhanded remarks? Yeah I admit I’m slow on some things but come on.

Anyway, there’s also the fact that at the end of chapter 280, the demon is depicted as being so large that despite being at around the border of the Clover Kingdom, Julius could see it all the way from the castle, which is at the very least several hundred kilometers. A demon relative to the size of humans wouldn’t be able to do that.
 
... Didn't we just have a thread about this exact same issue with Naruto's moon feat where it was said that art incosistencies like this are very common when dealing with big sizes when compared to humans? Considering the calc people saying that just because the moon size gap was shown as smaller that was calced didn't invalidate the calc, I really don't see what's the issue here taking that into account.
 
If you have an inconsistent object which could lead to multiple different results for size, what justification do you have for just going with the biggest possible value?
 
Far different. The split could be seen from Earth and another shot. It's consistently portrayed as a huge gap between both parts of the moon. The demon here is consistently portrayed as small and relative to humans, having only one scan showing to be comparable to the mountain. Just take the Bijus as an example, different sizes, we don't use it.
 
Damage3245 said:
If you have an inconsistent object which could lead to multiple different results for size, what justification do you have for just going with the biggest possible value?
Click to expand...
I've already demonstrated how the only times the demon is much smaller are when it's done to account for humans being present or for smaller panels, both of which are limitations that hinder how big the demon can be drawn as. The larger size is more consistent due to shots that lack those limitations showing that it at least approaches the size of the mountain, and also because it's been (as mentioned before) depicted as being fully visible even from several hundred kilometers away.

I see no reason to not use this size just because of something that cannot be helped and was done in order to make everything that needs to be seen visible.
 
Whenever possible the demon is always portrayed larger or close to the mountain. It’s only when something else in the shot needs to be shown clearly that the demon is drawn smaller. it makes sense to use the larger size as it’s consistently used when there isn’t any limitation like that.
 
If they have official height statements; then normally we could use that. But otherwise, it's often preferable to pixel scale; though inconsistent sizes do make it very difficult.
 
Ionliosite said:
... Didn't we just have a thread about this exact same issue with Naruto's moon feat where it was said that art incosistencies like this are very common when dealing with big sizes when compared to humans? Considering the calc people saying that just because the moon size gap was shown as smaller that was calced didn't invalidate the calc, I really don't see what's the issue here taking that into account.
Click to expand...
To be fair, the major difference is that the Moon has a confirmed standard size that we can use to pixel scale, this Ancient Demon doesn't have a confirmed size yet, so the issue of inconsistency is more valid, once again I am neutral, just pointing out that this and that are in fact separate things
 
I don’t think that method works because the mountain you’re using doesn’t look like the Noble Realm mountain (there’s no castle at the top)
 
Castle height isn’t the issue at all, it’s that the lack of a castle at the top means this is probably not that specific mountain
 
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