Bill Cipher Revision Summary

[Elizhaa]

Someone is re-adding Thanos's loss to Bill's profile, I will remove it since his profile is now updated.


Can you explain why you are adding it again because I am confused?

 

[Magi_Hussie]

@DMB It depends.

@Edward Well technically he can't always do this unless the Nightmare Realm remains opens.

 

[Magi_Hussie]

@Nedge It appears like you forgotten to add some abilities and some of the descriptions for them, I'll add the remaining ones to the profile then.

 

[Elizhaa]

@Magi Hussie, which abilities?

 

[Magi_Hussie]

@Nedge Oh, sorry about that. I almost didn't notice this while I was currently editing the page but its ok, I'm already adding them.

 

[Magi_Hussie]

@Nedge Nvm, Ant already closed it. So we're done for now I guess.

 

[Elizhaa]

@Magi Hussie, I think that I have added them in time. You can verify.

 

[Magi_Hussie]

@Nedge Disintegration, Retrocognition, Weirdness Inducement, Empathic Sense, Telecommunications Manipulation, Death Inducement, and Heat Vision.

 

[Elizhaa]

@@Magi Hussie

Disintegration is under Matter Manipulation

Retrocognition (under Clairvoyance, Enhanced Senses, Precognition ).

Telecommunications Manipulation ( as Technological Manipulation).

Death Inducement, I forgot

Heat Vision ( I didn't know the page exists, but I added a page that Bill should have Energy Manipulation, where it apply)

 

[Jinsye]

@DMB It depends.

@Edward Well technically he can't always do this unless the Nightmare Realm remains opens.

He can't exactly exist unless the Nightmare Realm remains open.

 

[Elizhaa]

@Edwardtruong2006, can provide where is this is stated?

 

[Antvasima]

Some of the changes were either poorly structured and/or seemed illogical.

Bill has not demonstrated immunity to the laws of cause and effect as far as I am aware, so I removed acausality.

Neither is he undead, so ditto for immortality type 7.

And Nigh-Omniscience also seemed like a massive exaggeration.

 

[Elizhaa]

@Antvasima,

Nigh-Omniscience was accepted in the previous thread and this thread and this thread so I added it.

Immortality type 7 was agreed in the threads, we based it on the definition it's technically being already dead. I understand your reasoning though.

Acausality's reasoning is agreed but it was accepted in the thread.

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

Acausality was accepted, iirc. And whatever happened to immeasurability? That was agreed too.

 

[Antvasima]

Acausality is a very extreme ability that requires conclusive proof, as is Nigh-Omniscience.

What are the reasons for adding them?

 

[Antvasima]

What do you mean with immeasurability?

 

[Jinsye]

Bill Cipher is supposed to have Immeasurable speed.

For existing in the Nightmare Realm, a realm without constant physics and is between dimensions. He also looks down on humans for being restricted by time.

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

@Ant. Bill is free from the rules of cause and effect, the laws of physics, and the from passage of time. His entire motive was to "free" our dimension from them.

 

[Antvasima]

Well, the problem is that if he was naturally acausal himself, no action/cause that any character would have made against him would have had an effect per definition.

Also, when did he demonstrate the ability to move through time via speed alone?

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

I'm almost certain that literally zero of our acausal characters (that aren't 1-A) are like that.

Ant, 80% of our immeasurable characters haven't shown the capacity to do that... Even then, Bill sends phone calls to John the witness in the past and the like.

 

[Antvasima]

As I tend to say, several wrongs do not make a right. Acausal characters are immune to the laws of cause and effect per definition. That requires a very extraordinary nature.

And most of the characters listed with immeasurable speed should likely have it removed after our recent revisions: Timeless Voids Standards

 

[The_Everlasting]

Can confirm that virtually no Acausal characters work like that, even ones that are explicitly beyond causality.

 

[Antvasima]

Well, that is what acausal means per definition.

 

[Kaltias]

Pretty sure that the consent in the last thread about it was that there are different degrees of acausality, just like with most other abilities.

I can have EE that erases only the body while someone else can have it on a level where 1-B characters can't do anything about it, doesn't mean that I don't have EE, just that the other guy has better EE.

The definition isn't really relevant. "Immortality" isn't a thing for people below tier 0, but we obviously don't limit it to them

 

[Magi_Hussie]

@Edward Well yea, that's basically what I meant by that but you understand what I mean.

@Nedge

• "Disintegration is under Matter Manipulation

Telecommunications Manipulation ( as Technological Manipulation)."

Despite the loose similarities, Disintegration and Matter Manipulation are 2 different things and you didn't even mention it nor even leave a description for Matter Manipulation anyways. Another thing, you do know that Telecommunication Manipulation is a form of information & should be linked under Information Manipulation right? And I did left a helpful reminder of where exactly was it supposed to be linked to, did I not?

• "Death Inducement, I forgot

Heat Vision ( I didn't know the page exists, but I added a page that Bill should have Energy Manipulation, where it apply)" Like I said, no need to rush and take your time. Heat Vision + Energy Projection is all you need to put for that, not just Energy Manipulation. Not to mention that it was not a good idea to randomly add "Conceptual Manipulation" without a description because it won't be too long before someone makes a revision requesting upon removal of that ability on Bill's profile.

 

[Antvasima]

@Kaltias

Well, acausality still seems very exaggerated and contradicted to me, if we look at what happened in the actual episodes in which Bill took part.

 

[Kaltias]

I do not know GF enough to judge. I was just explaining that you don't need to be "literally beyond any form of causality as a whole" level of acausal to get the ability.

 

[Antvasima]

Well, agreed, but Bill was not even beyond being affected by actions of regular human beings.

 

[Elizhaa]

Well, agreed, but Bill was not even beyond being affected by actions of regular human beings.

@Antvasima wouldn't this give Bill Time Paradox Immunity at least?

 

[Antvasima]

Perhaps. In what way has he shown the ability to resist time paradoxes?

 

[Elizhaa]

@Antvasima, I just wanted to Bill's exciting nature would warrant or is further proofs needed?

 

[Antvasima]

You need to explain in what way he has been immune to changes to the past.

 

[Elizhaa]

@Antvasima, alright, and thanks for the clarification.

 

[Elizhaa]

@Antvasima, what would Bill Cipher 's Intelligence be based on his mental abilities and the wiki's definition?

 

[Antvasima]

I do not know. He does not seem to know almost everything, so Nigh-Omniscience is likely an exaggeration, and he is also not an inventor, so it is hard to specify him as a Supergenius or Extraordinary Genius, but he is likely highly superhuman in his area nevertheless, given his enhanced perception of reality.

 

[Elizhaa]

@Antvasima, I agree with your reasoning. I feel thhat there should a new category since some characters' abilities undermine Intelligence 's logic. I would to say that with the Intelligence's defintion Bill should at least be genius as his relationship with Stanford Pines shown


Synopsis: Presenting himself as a muse, one who chose a genius intellectual to inspire once every century, Bill offered Ford a partnership: Bill would bestow his knowledge to Ford in exchange for the ability to move freely within and without Ford's own mind.Under Cipher's guidance, Ford was introduced to vast information, learning of a parallel dimension of paranormal phenomena that had leaked into his world, which gave birth to the weirdness of Gravity Falls. With Bill's assistance, Stanford drafted blueprints to create an interdimensional gateway beneath his home.


Under Cipher's guidance, Ford was introduced to vast information, learning of a parallel dimension of paranormal phenomena that had leaked into his world, which gave birth to the weirdness of Gravity Falls. With Bill's assistance, Stanford drafted blueprints to create an interdimensional gateway beneath his home.

 

[Antvasima]

Well, the official intelligence ratings are just suggestions. When it is hard to fit a character into a certain type, it is possible to simply use "High", "Extremely High", "Superhuman", etcetera. I.e. something less specific.

 

[Elizhaa]

@Antvasima, a superhuman category might be needed between Extraordinary Genius 'and' Supergenius would make sense

 

[Elizhaa]

@Antvasima, I would say that with the Intelligence's definition Bill should at least be Supergenius as his relationship with Stanford Pines show


Standford Pines is stated to be genius numerous time while a teenager and should be classified while older as a Supergenius

Even without Bill's intellectual influence, Stanford

From his research Gravity Falls, he had more dangerous projects and experiments , such as the Shape Shifter, Truth Telling Teeth,

made use of his talents and newly acquired knowledge of Gravity Falls to create new and extraordinary inventions, including the mind-swapping Electron Carpet as an experiment and a mind-controlling tie designed for the masters of presidential electio candidate Ronald Reaga.(Source ). Stanford

With Bill's influenced:

Synopsis: Presenting himself as a muse, one who chose a genius intellectual to inspire once every century, Bill offered Ford a partnership: Bill would bestow his knowledge to Ford in exchange for the ability to move freely within and without Ford's own mind.Under Cipher's guidance, Ford was introduced to vast information, learning of a parallel dimension of paranormal phenomena that had leaked into his world, which gave birth to the weirdness of Gravity Falls. With Bill's assistance, Stanford drafted blueprints to create an interdimensional gateway beneath his home.

 

[Antvasima]

I am not sure if Stanford should be a supergenius. He needs to easily be able to create completely physics-defying extremely powerful inventions for that. Extraordinary Genius seems more reasonable from what I remember.

I am also not sure if Bill should exactly scale from him.