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Bijū Ability Additions (Naruto CRT)

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Godernet

Godernet

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Evening Nardo fans, with the latest chapter we received a bit more lore about how a long-standing mechanic works, the Tailed Beasts' ability to resurrect itself.

So I wanted to look over the statement, as well as some other facts about the Biju, to see what additions this might entail.


New Chapter Statement:

In Boruto Two Blue Vortex Chapter 10, Kurama explains how he came back from Baryon Mode consuming the entirety of his chakra and unaliving him.

According to Kurama, death for a Biju is not eternal, even if their flesh or soul perishes, over time a "kernel" of them will sprout somewhere and they will manage to return to life.

A Kernel, for those wondering, can be synonymous with "essence", "core", or "essential part."

With other translations also using the phrasing "a Biju's Essence", it's very likely referring to an essential part of a Biju existence that resides outside of the life of their physical body or soul.

When and where they reincarnate is completely unknown and seemingly out of their control, however, certain factors like lineage or inheriting a sliver of their chakra seems to influence where it happens a bit.


Proposed Abilities:

At the very least I believe this statement qualifies Biju to receive Mid-Godly Ressurection (The ability to resurrect from complete erasure of one's mind, body, and soul.)

As we already know the process of burning through Baryon Mode destroyed all of Kurama's chakra in a process akin to Nuclear Fusion. (And Chakra is comprised of the physical energy in living cells and the mental energy of one's mind.)

With this chapter confirming that even if the soul and body perishes, a Bijuu will still resurrect as a kernel regardless.

So admittedly I am posing this more as a question because I'm genuinely not sure if this qualifies.

But I would like to propose that Bijuu also receive Abstract Existence (Type 2)

The reason is that as we've seen, Biju cannot be killed permanently by destroying their minds, bodies, and souls.

Abstract Existence is defined as embodying a concept, thought, or information, with Type 2 being defined as the capacity to continuously regenerate or resurrect as long as this abstraction exists.

the only problem with this ability in this case is that it's currently not clearly defined what exactly this esoteric property is that allows Biju to keep respawning endlessly, only that it's outside of Mind, Body, or Soul.

which is why I'm also fine with this being a possibly rating or shelving this ability entirely until new information is presented in 2027 when the manga gets to that point.

So this one has a bit more nuance to it,

There are some types of Immortality I do believe they should have and others I'm not 100% sure on .

Type 1(Eternal Life): The reason for this one is simple. Bijuu are beings made up entirely of chakra, essentially solid Soul Kaijus, while they do grow in size it really doesn't make sense for them to be capable of dying from old age as beings of pure life force, and as we've seen previously, when people die in Naruto, they physiologically become the same kind of chakra ghost that Bijuu already exist as(except the Bijuu can exist in a solid form.)

Type 4(Immortailty via Resurrection): This is one I feel is less controversial, if we do except that they have Mid-Godly Resurrection and that "Death is not eternal for them", as Kurama put, then they should naturally receive this as well.

Type 8(Reliant Immortality): This Immortality is described as getting the benefits of 1 of more types of Immortality as long as a certain being, object, place, or concept exists.

Whether or not Biju receives this type of Immortality is dependent on the same factors as Abstract Existence, can this esoteric property that allows the Bijuu to exist and return outside of Mind, Body, and Soul be qualified as an object, being, place, or concept?

I think at the very least Mid-Godly Resurrection over time, and Immortality (Type 4) is a given with the statement presented.

Immortality (Type 1) should work based on the physiology of the Bijuu being that of a living soul(or chakra ghost), with chakra ghosts in Naruto being shown to be the natural state a living person turns into after death, though I'm fine with this being a possibly if an argument that brings some skepticism is presented.

Abstract Existence (Type 2) and Immortality (Type 8) are things I am skeptical of as well but I believe there is enough evidence for this to pass if not fully as a possibly rating.

Affected Profiles: Shukaku, Matatabi, Isobu, Son Goku, Kokuo, Saiken, Chomei, Gyuki, Kurama, and Shinju

Anyways, let's stay civil and chill. thank you for reading and let me know what you all think.

Votes

Agree: Mamaroza, Kayzz, Shadowbokunohero, Robo432343, EldemadeDityjon (Immortality Type 1 and 4 & Mid-Godly Ressurection), RenderGK (Immortality Type 1 and 4 & Mid-Godly Ressurection), Faa_Tzy (Immortality and Ressurection), Damage3245 (Immortality Type 1 and 4 + Mid Godly Ressurection), ActuallySpaceMan42 (Immortality Type 1 and 4 + Mid-Godly Ressurection), noniho, NaruRiasUzumaki (Immortality Type 1 and 4 & Mid-Godly Ressurection), AnimesFreak2 (Immortality Type 1 and 4 & Mid-Godly Ressurection), Faa_Tzy (Immortality and Ressurection), PatatesR, KingogKings777 (Low-Godly Res + Immortality 1 + 4)

Neutral: RenderGK (AE Type 2), AnimesFreak2 (AE Type 2),

Disagree: EldemadeDityjon (AE Type 2 & Immortality Type 8), RenderGK (Immortality Type 8), KingogKings777 (Immortality Type 8 + AE Type 2)

Going through the thread later: Deceived3596
 
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  • "The reason is that as we've seen, Biju cannot be killed permanently by destroying their minds, bodies, and souls." This is not enough to get AE type 2. Just list it as Inorganic physiology.
  • Disagree with Immortality type 8. Immortality type 4 already covers resurrection. There is no object or something else is working for that resurrection to write it off as Immortality type 8 here.
  • Also resurrection should be noted as Overtime.
Other things seems fine.
 
EldemadeDityjon said:
  • "The reason is that as we've seen, Biju cannot be killed permanently by destroying their minds, bodies, and souls." This is not enough to get AE type 2. Just list it as Inorganic physiology.
Click to expand...
Mind explaining what Bijuu are lacking to qualify for AE Type 2?

as far as I was aware the qualifications are:

  • embody a concept, information, or a thought(aka an Abstraction)
  • the capacity to endlessly regenerate/resurrect as long as said abstraction exists.

For Bijuu, they will continuously come back regardless of death to the body or soul via a kernel/their essence.

Am I wrong in labeling a Biju's essence as an abstraction such as information or a thought?

especially since it's a seemingly intangible and esoteric property the Biju have that is separate from chakra, its components, or any other property of life in the series.
EldemadeDityjon said:
  • Disagree with Immortality type 8. Immortality type 4 already covers resurrection. There is no object or something else is working for that resurrection to write it off as Immortality type 8 here.
Click to expand...
I'm not feeling that strongly on Type 8 anyway so if others disagree that's fine.
EldemadeDityjon said:
  • Also resurrection should be noted as Overtime.
Click to expand...
already got that covered👌
EldemadeDityjon said:
Other things seems fine.
Click to expand...
🤝
 
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Godernet said:
Mind explaining what Bijuu are lacking to qualify for AE Type 2?

as far as I was aware the qualifications are:

  • embody a concept, information, or a thought(aka an Abstraction)
Click to expand...
Can you show the scans where they embodied any of these
Godernet said:
  • the capacity to endlessly regenerate/resurrect as long as said abstraction exists.

For Bijuu, they will continuously come back regardless of death to the body or soul via a kernel/their essence.
Click to expand...
This is resurrection. Has nothing to do with abstraction. Otherwise we would give anyone with Godly Regeneration or Resurrection AE type 2 which we don't.
Godernet said:
Am I wrong in labeling a Biju's essence as an abstraction such as information or a thought?
Click to expand...
Yeah there is no supporting scans as far as I see. All you are talking about resurrection feats in your arguments.
Godernet said:
especially since it's a seemingly intangible and esoteric property the Biju have that is separate from chakra, its components, or any other property of life in the series.
Click to expand...
Whatever you are saying already covered under inorganic physiology.
 
Agree with immortality type 1&4, skeptical about immortality type 8 and Abstract existence. Both entails a 3rd party per se that’s not really contemporary, although I fell a possibly would be fine for AE.
 
EldemadeDityjon said:
Can you show the scans where they embodied any of these

This is resurrection. Has nothing to do with abstraction. Otherwise we would give anyone with Godly Regeneration or Resurrection AE type 2 which we don't.

Yeah there is no supporting scans as far as I see. All you are talking about resurrection feats in your arguments.

Whatever you are saying already covered under inorganic physiology.
Click to expand...
The lore hints the nine-tails appear due to the world's 'malice'

YKSexxu.jpeg
 
EldemadeDityjon said:
Bijus are part of ten tails and Ten tails are otsuki Pet. What are you talking about? Jeraiya didn't even know about Ten tails here. Dude was long dead before Ninja war started.
Click to expand...
You're asking me. Do you even know what you are talking about?

It's a Toad that is talking about the lore in that frame, not Jiraiya.

Other Otsutsukis have nothing to do with this. Hagoromo is the creator of the tailed beasts from the Ten Tails chakra. And Hagoromo has been in contact with the Myoboku Toads before his death.

It is very reasonable the toads have an extent of understanding of the concept of the tailed beast reincarnation due to being close with Hagoromo, and even having info about Ten Tails (anime)
 
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Kayzz said:
You're asking me. Do you even know what you are talking about?

It's a Toad that is talking about the lore in that frame, not Jiraiya.
Click to expand...
My bad.
Kayzz said:
Hagoromo is the creator of the tailed beasts from the Ten Tails chakra. And Hagoromo has been in contact with the Myoboku Toads before his death.

It is very reasonable the toads understand the concept of the tailed beast reincarnation due to being close with Hagoromo.
Click to expand...
Sure, the Toads are saying that. But that doesn't change the fact that the Bijus are created one way or another from the Ten Tails. This still has nothing to do with abstraction.

Also, the scans you are posting don't even state anything about them being made of abstraction. The Nine Tails appearing when humanity's shows malice doesn't mean they themselves are made up of it. There is no statement to back it up. Your scan still missing the enough context to say they are humanities malice themselves.

You don't see Kurama appearing Inside Boruto's sister because of Humanities Malice. Kurama never talked about anything like that. It's just natural order that they would just reappear once they gets destroyed that's all.
 
EldemadeDityjon said:
My bad.

Sure, the Toads are saying that. But that doesn't change the fact that the Bijus are created one way or another from the Ten Tails. This still has nothing to do with abstraction.

Also, the scans you are posting don't even state anything about them being made of abstraction. The Nine Tails appearing when humanity's shows malice doesn't mean they themselves are made up of it. There is no statement to back it up. Your scan still missing the enough context to say they are humanities malice themselves.

You don't see Kurama appearing Inside Boruto's sister because of Humanities Malice. Kurama never talked about anything like that. It's just natural order that they would just reappear once they gets destroyed that's all.
Click to expand...
TBH, whatever ten tails chakra was in the past doesn't matter. Ten Tails chakra is still the accumulation of the planet's chakra (which includes humanity's chakra) fused into one. All chakra is connected.

I don't know bro. Hagoromo seem to imply Kurama being made of hatred.

LMNhcyU.jpeg


Concretion - "a hard solid mass formed by the local accumulation of matter, especially within the body or within a mass of sediment."

Himawari's situation is different. It is more about Himawari being special, than Kurama's ressurection.
 
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The abstract existence should be suspended till more information is given on the issue. There is too much speculation right now
 
Kayzz said:
TBH, whatever ten tails chakra was in the past doesn't matter.
Click to expand...
It does matter. Just because you don't want it doesn't mean we should ignore the narrative.
Kayzz said:
Ten Tails chakra is still the accumulation of the planet's chakra (which includes humanity's chakra) fused into one. All chakra is connected.
Click to expand...
Already said this is just inorganic physiology nothing to do with abstraction.
Kayzz said:
I don't know bro. Hagoromo seem to imply Kurama being made of hatred.

LMNhcyU.jpeg


Concretion - "a hard solid mass formed by the local accumulation of matter, especially within the body or within a mass of sediment."
Click to expand...
Kurama is nothing but a chunk of Chakra beast created by Ten tails chakra. Nothing shows it being a Abstraction of something special. You are just taking the statements out of context.

"Had become"
Here clearly Hagu is talking about how Kurama is hated throughout humanity because causing chaos. This has nothing to do Kurama itself being formed by Concept of hatred.
Kayzz said:
Himawari's situation is different. It is more about Himawari being special, than Kurama's ressurection.
Click to expand...
It has nothing to do with she is being special for Kurama's existence. She is just good medium compared to Naruto. How being special existence means Kurama is abstraction?
 
EldemadeDityjon said:
It does matter. Just because you don't want it doesn't mean we should ignore the narrative.

Already said this is just inorganic physiology nothing to do with abstraction.

Kurama is nothing but a chunk of Chakra beast created by Ten tails chakra. Nothing shows it being a Abstraction of something special. You are just taking the statements out of context.

"Had become"
Here clearly Hagu is talking about how Kurama is hated throughout humanity because causing chaos. This has nothing to do Kurama itself being formed by Concept of hatred.

It has nothing to do with she is being special for Kurama's existence. She is just good medium compared to Naruto. How being special existence means Kurama is abstraction?
Click to expand...
Inorganic physiology does not mean it is mutually exclusive from abstract existence.
You're going on an on about ten tails chakra. Are you saying it is impossible to use chakra to create an abstract existence?

Where did you get Hagoromo implying Kurama being hated throughout the ages by humanity? Kurama's chakra and existence has always been attributed with hatred, not once or twice but on numerous occasions throughout the series. In fact, it is necessary to fill one's vessel with so much love in order to contain Kurama.

No, Kurama stated him coming back so soon and inside Himawari was stated that it could possibly be from she having a sliver of his chakra or her destiny from her genetics.

So what's your own reasoning for Kurama stating Tailed Beast come back due to an unknown factor/kernel/essence that is not soul, mind and body (basically not chakra)?
 
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Kayzz said:
Inorganic physiology does not mean it is mutually exclusive from abstract existence.
Click to expand...
You haven't provided a solid proof for Kurama made up of some concepts/information or thoughts or something similar. All I see is chakra this and chakra that. Which is just formed by energy.
Kayzz said:
You're going on an on about ten tails chakra. Are you saying it is impossible to use chakra to create an abstract existence?
Click to expand...
Abstract existence is not created by energy alone so yes it's impossible to create abstract existence with energy alone. It's Inorganic physiology.
Kayzz said:
Where did you get Hagoromo implying Kurama being hated throughout the ages by humanity? Kurama's chakra and existence has always been attributed with hatred, not once or twice but on numerous occasions throughout the series. In fact, it is necessary to fill one's vessel with so much love in order to contain Kurama.
Click to expand...
Show me scans for Kurama existence being symbol of hatred before Madara tamed it and ran amok causing chaos.
Kayzz said:
No, Kurama stated him coming back so soon and inside Himawari was stated that it could possibly be from she having a sliver of his chakra or her destiny from her genetics.
Click to expand...
So in other words it has nothing to do with abstraction.
Kayzz said:
So what's your own reasoning for Kurama stating Tailed Beast come back due to an unknown factor/kernel/essence that is not soul, mind and body (basically not chakra)?
Click to expand...
I don't know what you are talking here. Having soul and mind ≠ AE lmao.
 
Disagree on AE.

Agree on resurrection but it wouldn't really be combat applicable and should be noted.

Disagree with mid godly, seems more low godly.

Agree on immortality minus type 8.
 
It's important to note that when a character dies, all their chakra disappears including chakra that has been released externally. The exception is chakra bound by sealing jutsu.

I still agree at least possible rating for Reliant Immortality and Abstract Existence.

The (kernel) logical conclusion for tailed beast rebirth even after soul destruction is either reliant on
1. The body of the ten tails (Gedo Statue) alive and sealed.
Or,
2. Hagoromo's yin-yang manipulation of the natural world bringing forth abstracts (eternal souls) from the chakra of the ten tails.
Or,
3. Both.
 
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I’ll get back to this in a bit, though my opinions are on the same on everything except AE can go if Mods agree with the takes in the thread, I was never all that strong on that part.
 
After talking with some people familiar with AE off-site I agree there is not enough evidence to determine whether or not the Bijuu "Essence" meets the qualifications needed for AE so I've crossed that out of the CRT.

Hopefully, the series will go into more detail in the future which could perhaps make that topic more viable.

Luckily it seems that the Mods that have participated agree with everything else proposed so I'll give it another 24 hours before closing.
 
Godernet said:
After talking with some people familiar with AE off-site I agree there is not enough evidence to determine whether or not the Bijuu "Essence" meets the qualifications needed for AE so I've crossed that out of the CRT.

Hopefully, the series will go into more detail in the future which could perhaps make that topic more viable.

Luckily it seems that the Mods that have participated agree with everything else proposed so I'll give it another 24 hours before closing.
Click to expand...
You can just implement it right now and close it
 
karo_senpaii said:
You can just implement it right now and close it
Click to expand...
I know that I could, But it's just a personal habit to wait a bit after I get the staff votes I need to implement just in case anyone has any last thing to add, I'm never in a rush to add stuff.

Plus it also gave me some time to finish prepping for my next CRT.

It's been well over 24 hrs so I'll implement them now.
 
Alright new abilities have been added so I'll ask for this to be closed.

Thank you to all who participated!
 
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