Berdly fights literally just a real falcon.

[GodlyCharmander]

Deemed by you.
It's not like their argument was "The falcon wins because it can teleport."
They made real arguments.

I personally think that bird would **** me up.

By me?
The guy who made the reasoning is not vouching for it anymore. Why would the already debunked reasoning still be casted as a valid vote? This makes no sense. Unless they, or you can counter the points I presented against the reasoning itself, then go ahead "fra" it as much as you want.

You're too obsessed with size. This bird has a completely different method of attack, and I don't think it would necessarily one-shot, but it could certainly get Berdly bloody enough for a draw at least.

Birds don't normally kill people, this is true, but birds normally aren't trying.

It wouldn't. The collision strong enough to damage a human would be nearly impossible to hit due to prep time, and would kill the bird (which doesn't even use full speed collision as its attack).

Falcons don't use collision with dives, they use with their forward momentum, which has 117 J at best (which they obviously also don't use because it would, y'know, cripple them), which hurts less than your average punch.

Falcons use their claws, and grab a lot too, so yes, Berdly simply has more wincons here, as he could negate the bird's flight by slamming it once (by predicting it's path, or by countering an attack, using, you know, human intellect?), grab it and snap it's neck, dodge the fatal shit.

I don't see how the bird winning is the most likely outcome to you.

 

[FinePoint]

By me?
The guy who made the reasoning is not vouching for it anymore. Why would the already debunked reasoning still be casted as a valid vote? This makes no sense. Unless they, or you can counter the points I presented against the reasoning itself, then go ahead "fra" it as much as you want.

I will, and I'm also going to drop this topic. Let's get into the schmeat instead. Convince me.

It wouldn't. The collision strong enough to damage a human would be nearly impossible to hit due to prep time, and would kill the bird (which doesn't even use full speed collision as its attack).

Falcons don't use collision with dives, they use with their forward momentum, which has 117 J at best (which they obviously also don't use because it would, y'know, cripple them), which hurts less than your average punch.

The 117 J is from them flying normally, not diving.
And what do you mean prep time? There's no prep time.

Also, Berdly's not dodging it. First of all, he's not a ninja, he's a normal high schooler.
The entire point of the high-speed dive is that it allows the Falcon to do precise adjustments to catch agile prey.

 

[GodlyCharmander]

The 117 J is from them flying normally, not diving.

Exactly. That's with their energy while not diving, lmao.

And what do you mean prep time? There's no prep time.

They cannot reach a high enough dive speed to kill a human if they don't get pretty high and accelerate.

Also, Berdly's not dodging it. First of all, he's not a ninja, he's a normal high schooler.

You need to be a ninja to get away from a predictable trajectory from a bird that cannot change direction easily (which is why they only use their 390km/h dive as a surprise attack)?

nah, just move out of the way if you know its coming, bro.

The entire point of the high-speed dive is that it allows the Falcon to do precise adjustments to catch agile prey.

They use it to stab their pray with their claws. The KE isn't transfered to the target whatsoever.

Again, Predict > Slam > No Flight > Now you're fighting a chicken.

 

[GodlyCharmander]

Also, Berdly's not dodging it. First of all, he's not a ninja, he's a normal high schooler.

Also nah, Berdly has some fighting experience. His Dark World knowledge isn't useless.

 

[FinePoint]

They cannot reach a high enough dive speed to kill a human if they don't get pretty high and accelerate.

Why does that matter? Berdly can't fly after it.

You need to be a ninja to get away from a predictable trajectory from a bird that cannot change direction easily (which is why they only use their 390km/h dive as a surprise attack)?

Well the articles I'm reading say that the reason it goes so fast is to make it more accurate and also more aerodynamic so it can adjust itself to hit agile targets.

They use it to stab their pray with their claws. The KE isn't transfered to the target whatsoever.

Again, Predict > Slam > No Flight > Now you're fighting a chicken.

Wouldn't their break still be long and sharp enough to kill you if it hit something vital?

 

[GodlyCharmander]

Why does that matter? Berdly can't fly after it.

Berdly can think, and predict... It takes time.

Well the articles I'm reading say that the reason it goes so fast is to make it more accurate and also more aerodynamic so it can adjust itself to hit agile targets.

Yes, on a set path with an unknowing target. It can't sharply change direction due to air resistance

Wouldn't their break still be long and sharp enough to kill you if it hit something vital?

Beak? They don't use it with the dive. If they did, their skull would go "bhlluh" due to collision.

By themselves, they don't have nearly the strength necessary to pierce to bones. And the likelyhood of a falcon hitting a vital part of an animal they don't hunt, thus, have zero knowledge about is so low...

 

[FinePoint]

By themselves, they don't have nearly the strength necessary to pierce to bones. And the likelyhood of a falcon hitting a vital part of an animal they don't hunt, thus, have zero knowledge about is so low...

Well, they really don't have to pierce bones, just the throat.
Which I do think is a valid wincon, but, uh, fine. You've convinced me.

I don't think it's a stomp, but going over the evidence a second time time it does seems more likely than not that Berdly could win.

 

[GodlyCharmander]

Well, they really don't have to pierce bones, just the throat.
Which I do think is a valid wincon, but, uh, fine. You've convinced me.

Yeah it's valid, just very unlikely to happen effectively due to discrepancy in intelligence between the two.

I don't think it's a stomp, but going over the evidence a second time time it does seems more likely than not that Berdly could win.

That's 5 votes for Berdly.

 

[TauanVictor]

Berdly FRA.

 

[ZillertheBucko]

I've already voted berdly I believe, just here to say I'm still watching the thread

 

[SuperDino85]

“I’m stupid now!” FRA

 

[GodlyCharmander]

7 votes for Berdly
7 votes for Bird

Well... Frick.

 

[Imaginym]

7 votes for Berdly
7 votes for Bird

Well... Frick.

Would you say this is a case where "If both sides have equivalent posts with constructive arguments, the thread shall be deemed inconclusive." applies?

 

[ZillertheBucko]

Would you say this is a case where "If both sides have equivalent posts with constructive arguments, the thread shall be deemed inconclusive." applies?

N O

 

[Imaginym]

N O

Understandable. Still, 7 votes isn't the end of things; It's just the minimum vote count where a 3 vote difference or higher can be a basis for the resolution of the match, AFAIK.
Ergo, this match can still be resolved conclusively, it just needs more votes, lol. But I guess that's easier said than done, right?

 

[ZillertheBucko]

Understandable. Still, 7 votes isn't the end of things; It's just the minimum vote count where a 3 vote difference or higher can be a basis for the resolution of the match, AFAIK.
Ergo, this match can still be resolved conclusively, it just needs more votes, lol. But I guess that's easier said than done, right?

N O

 

[Imaginym]

N O

Oh, so it's not easier said than done, meaning it's easier to do than say, so it should be trivial to resolve this match. Yay! : )

 

[Livinmeme]

Berdly FRA

 

[Greatsage13th]

Why is it hard to believe that a falcon can't kill a humanoid bird that has tendencies to screw up?

 

[GodlyCharmander]

Why is it hard to believe that a falcon can't kill a humanoid bird that has tendencies to be a god like gamer

Ya see.

"Can't" implies it's literally impossible for the 0.915kg bird to kill the 60kg bird, which it seems obvious when I put it like that, but let's argue it can so this won't be deemed as a stomp match.

 

[GodlyCharmander]

Would you say this is a case where "If both sides have equivalent posts with constructive arguments, the thread shall be deemed inconclusive." applies?

I don't know, this seems pretty conclusive, argument-side. It's inconclusive voting-side.

 

[Imaginym]

Ya see.

"Can't" implies it's literally impossible for the 0.915kg bird to kill the 60kg bird, which it seems obvious when I put it like that, but let's argue it can so this won't be deemed as a stomp match.

You shouldn't argue to portray a match as not a Stomp if you believe it's a Stomp, or there's reasonable concluding that it is a Stomp.

 

[GodlyCharmander]

You shouldn't argue to portray a match as not a Stomp if you believe it's a Stomp, or there's reasonable concluding that it is a Stomp.

I do not believe it's a stomp. Valid winning condition have been provided, and Bird has the AP advantage, it just doesn't use it in-character. Other than that, it can win through piercing damage as well. Again, just very unlikely due to human intellect

 

[frissen]

Berdly FRA. Also, if the Peregrine Falcon goes for a dive, what stops Berdly from taking cover inside Sans's shop?

 

[Greatsage13th]

Ya see.

"Can't" implies it's literally impossible for the 0.915kg bird to kill the 60kg bird, which it seems obvious when I put it like that, but let's argue it can so this won't be deemed as a stomp match.

why did you modify my quote?

either way, berdly would have a fatal neck wound at the very least which would lead to death.

 

[Greatsage13th]

Berdly FRA. Also, if the Peregrine Falcon goes for a dive, what stops Berdly from taking cover inside Sans's shop?

bad idea. if he runs there, his entire back is exposed.

 

[Mariogoods]

I vote to Inconclusive FRA. Both have constructive reasons for their victory.

 

[Armorchompy]

Peregrine falcons are tiny and completely unable to fight human-sized targets. This is a stomp and believing otherwise shows a gross excess of trust in our tiering sistem over real life logic.

 

[frissen]

bad idea. if he runs there, his entire back is exposed.

Yes, if he runs, but it takes a long time (in combat terms) for the Peregrine Falcon to get high enough for a dive, so Berdly, with his basic combat experience from the Dark World, should be able to do a safe retreat into the shop if the Falcon readies a dive

 

[Armorchompy]

There is literally no way the Falcon can use the actual KE behind his dive in a direct way without turning into pulp wtf. Most it can do is scratch and bite

 

[ZillertheBucko]

The only win condition it has is the scratching
Which is still a win con so it’s not a stomp

 

[Armorchompy]

... No it's not because Berdly would literally have to sit there doing nothing for minutes before receiving actually lethal damage

 

[frissen]

The only win condition it has is the scratching
Which is still a win con so it’s not a stomp

Yes, but scratches need you to either get lucky and hit a vital spot (if monsters even have vital spots) or attack for a long time, during which Berdly could definitely get at least one hit off. The Falcon's only viable wincon would be to use its maneuverability/speed advantage to harass Berdly until he bleeds out (assuming monsters have either blood or an appropriate anagalous bodily fluid), but it's not very likely for it to do this for several minutes without Berdly getting a lucky hit.

 

[GodlyCharmander]

There is literally no way the Falcon can use the actual KE behind his dive in a direct way without turning into pulp wtf. Most it can do is scratch and bite

It can kill a human with its claws if they hit the right place. Have you seen the size of these things? If that hit your neck, that's death

 

[GodlyCharmander]

Peregrine falcons are tiny and completely unable to fight human-sized targets. This is a stomp and believing otherwise shows a gross excess of trust in our tiering sistem over real life logic.

Unfortunately, VsMatches are about the profiles, and the systems rather than real life logic. The profile says it can use its KE, therefore it can in this match.

 

[frissen]

It can kill a human with its claws if they hit the right place. Have you seen the size of these things? If that hit your neck, that's death

1: how would it know to target the neck? it doesn't have any instincts for dealing with humanoids
2: We don't even have any proof berdly has vital points / the same vital points as humans

 

[Armorchompy]

Unfortunately, VsMatches are about the profiles, and the systems rather than real life logic. The profile says it can use its KE, therefore it can in this match.

Uhhh, no? The profile says it can "use its KE" because it can, it just doesn't, and if it were to attempt it it would turn itself into a pile of mush. And also no lol we don't ignore real life logic when it comes to real life profiles

 

[ZillertheBucko]

it's one sided but it's not a stomp if the bird has a technical wincon regardless of how unrealistic it may be

 

[GodlyCharmander]

1: how would it know to target the neck? it doesn't have any instincts for dealing with humanoids.

It uses its claws to slash targets. It wouldn't know to target the neck, it CAN target the neck, and it CAN win through that. It's simply unlikely.

2: We don't even have any proof berdly has vital points / the same vital points as humans

That is just bullshit. We assume he is similar to humans in these aspects. Otherwise, we'd assume he has bird vital points, which, surprisingly.

Uhhh, no? The profile says it can "use its KE" because it can, it just doesn't, and if it were to attempt it it would turn itself into a pile of mush. And also no lol we don't ignore real life logic when it comes to real life profiles

Read the profile again, it doesn't say that at all, it says "it uses the KE without dying from the collision"

 

[Armorchompy]

"They use this via digging claws into objects at this speed, thus not being killed by the collision"

Mate, the profile literally acknowledges that if they actually tackled something at that speed instead of using it in a more indirect way they would be killed. I'm pretty sure a second grader's reading comprehension is sufficient to understand that