about god of destruction feat...

[Antvasima]

@Matthew

Do you have any suggestions for what the discussion rule should say?

 

[HrishikeshM]

can you all please answer my question first?

 

[Kepekley23]

Destroying four universes, but not their space-time is a 3-A feat.

@Antvasima

I posted one above.

 

[Antvasima]

Probably 2-C. We tend to consider such feats from other series in this manner.

 

[AKM sama]

Guys he has a point. Just because that feat happened in the past when we had no reference of space-time in DBS and no character that strong, we treated it as 3-A, right?

I am sure that if a hakaishin or GP does the same stuff now, or some episodes later, we will treat it as 2-C anyway.

 

[Antvasima]

However, we would have to give Zen'o an unknown rating in conjunction, given that he is supposed to be infinitely stronger than the other characters.

 

[Kepekley23]

Zeno's 2-C rating should stay.

 

[HrishikeshM]

Guys he has a point. Just because that feat happened in the past when we had no reference of space-time in DBS and no character that strong, we treated it as 3-A, right?
I am sure that if a hakaishin or GP does the same stuff now, or some episodes later, we will treat it as 2-C anyway.

this is what i was saying

 

[Antvasima]

I just mean that if another character destroys several universes in a single attack, they would have to encompass the 5-D gulf between the continuums, and if Zen'o is unfathomably or infinitely (according to a power level card, but that is probably unreliable) above that, then we would not know where to place him anymore.

 

[Kepekley23]

Does that mean we should upgrade him to "Unknown. At least 2-C, likely much higher"?

 

[HrishikeshM]

@kepekley

how do we know if spacetime is involved if the statement is only what i wrote earlier, that statement is very vague? how do we know zeno also destroyed the spacetime of other 11 universes?

@antvasima

yes, you said we consider them 2-c in other cases in a general sense, because of multiple universes when the statement is vague. so why are we not considering this feat as 2-c?

 

[AKM sama]

I am almost sure if a DBS character destroys more than 1 universe in the future from this point onwards, it will be automatically considered as 2-C.

 

[Azathoth_the_Abyssal_Idiot]

Guys he has a point. Just because that feat happened in the past when we had no reference of space-time in DBS and no character that strong, we treated it as 3-A, right?

You mean like Goku vs Beerus?

No, we treat it as 3-A because it's blatantly 3-A. The entire feat revolves around the destruction of everything i the universe, which is what Beerus vs Champa was shaping up to be.

Zamasu's feat was Low 2-C because it was extremely blatantly affecting space-time.

 

[AKM sama]

No I wasn't talking about Goku vs Beerus.

I was talking about Beerus vs Champa in which the word "void" wasn't used. And the statement was about destroying the universes itself instead of destroying everything in the universe.

 

[Azathoth_the_Abyssal_Idiot]

Rewatch the scene. When Beerus and Champa start fighting, the destruction they begin to cause is the destruction of physical matter. It's pretty similar in nature to Goku vs Beerus.

 

[ProfessorKukui4Life]

Because even if we take this at face value, and assume space-time would be affected on such a scale (which nothing points to, since Beerus and the like aren't even tier 2 because of it, just scaling to Zamasu), this feat still isn't 2-C due to it being completely baseline and 2 GoD's needed to do it. Thats just combining one Low 2-C power with another to get baseline 2-C. The results would just be split between them, it wouldnt be the same as if they were doing it solo.

 

[HrishikeshM]

@kepekley
how do we know if spacetime is involved if the statement is only what i wrote earlier, that statement is very vague? how do we know zeno also destroyed the spacetime of other 11 universes?

@antvasima

yes, you said we consider them 2-c in other cases in a general sense, because of multiple universes when the statement is vague. so why are we not considering this feat as 2-c?

look guys, if at any point you all thought i was being rude or annoying, just to clarify i was not.

i am just confused and want answers to my questions. so please answer my questions and dont hold anything against me

 

[AKM sama]

Rewatch the scene. When Beerus and Champa start fighting, the destruction they begin to cause is the destruction of physical matter. It's pretty similar in nature to Goku vs Beerus.

We can't actually see space-time continuum be destroyed on screen tbf. And that destruction was very different than Goku vs Beerus tbh.

 

[Antvasima]

Just to clarify, I was speaking hypothetically, for a potential future scenario. We do not know how Beerus and Champa would have destroyed their universes.

My apologies for causing you trouble Azathoth.

 

[HrishikeshM]

@antvasima

ok if beerus vs champa is considered 3-a due to lack of evidence despite them being low 2-c themselves, i think zeno should be downgraded to low 2-c because we have evidence of only 1 spacetime being destroyed, we still lack evidence for other 11 spacetimes...

 

[Antvasima]

Zen'o should stay at 2-C. He would have to encompass the 5-D gulf between the 12 4-D universal continuums in order to completely eradicate them in a single attack.

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

I agre that we should apply the regulation

 

[HrishikeshM]

similarly beerus and champa would also have to do what you said (the complicated part) between 4d universal continuems in order to destroy both universes, no?

 

[Sidali891]

I thought the only reason this wasn't accepted is because the 12 universes are connected by 1 space-time continuum, not because "space-time wasn't explicitly mentioned in the statement of Beerus and Champa destroying both their respective universes."

 

[AKM sama]

I thought the only reason this wasn't accepted is because the 12 universes are connected by 1 space-time continuum, not because "space-time wasn't explicitly mentioned in the statement of Beerus and Champa destroying both their respective universes."

Not sure but I think we got rid of that nitpicky theory because all of this mess is caused by that thing to begin with.

 

[Sidali891]

Not sure but I think we got rid of that nitpicky theory because all of this mess is caused by that thing to begin with.

@Antvasima Is this true?

 

[Antvasima]

Can every non-staff member please stop posting repeatedly here? This discussion is turning completely unmanageable.

@Matthew

That should be fine. Do you have any suggestions?

 

[Kepekley23]

@Antvasima

I posted a suggestion above.

 

[Antvasima]

"Do not try to upgrade the Gods of Destruction to 2-C based on the outcome of a hypothetical Champa and Beerus destroying their respective universes, as the statement likely referred to them destroying all the matter within their universes, and not the space-time".

Perhaps, although the wording should likely be slightly improved. What do you think Azathoth and Matthew?

 

[HrishikeshM]

Zen'o should stay at 2-C. He would have to encompass the 5-D gulf between the 12 4-D universal continuums in order to completely eradicate them in a single attack.

similarly beerus and champa would also have to do what you said (the complicated part) between 4d universal continuems in order to destroy both universes, no?


i will not bring this up again but i deserve an answer to this question from you antvasima before you make the rule and close this thread, please. ;-;

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

"Do not try to upgrade the Gods of Destruction to 2-C based on the outcome of a hypothetical Champa and Beerus destroying their respective universes, as the statement likely referred to them destroying all the matter within their universes, and not the space-time".

Perhaps, although the wording should likely be slightly improved. What do you think Azathoth and Matthew?

"Do not try to upgrade the Gods of Destruction to 2-C based on the outcome of a hypothetical Champa and Beerus destroying their respective universes, oas the statement likely referred to them destroying all the matter within their universes, with no proof of space-time being affected".

 

[Sidali891]

How isn't space-time affected? Vados explicitly stated that a fight between Beerus and champa would mean the annihilation of both Universe 6 and Universe 7.

This is entirely different from when Goku clashed with Beers, because not only did they mention 2 universes here, but those 2 universes being the entriety of the both both of them. U6/7 destruction can't be interpreted as matter destruction only, whereas mentioning a universe ALONE, can be interpreted as matter destruction since we're refering to the Mortal Realm here.

In other words, Beerus and Goku clashing would destroy the universe (the Mortal Realm), and Beerus and champa clashing would destroy U6 and U7 (aka the Mortal Realm, Makai Realm, the Afterlife etc...) and we've already accepted the Afterlife being sepertae from the living universe, this is the reason why Zen'o is 2-C to begin with, right?

 

[Kepekley23]

Yeah.

EDIT:

Hypothetical Champa and Beerus FIGHT* by the way. Sahrry.

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

They honestly are. Which is why people can go across universes flying.

 

[Antvasima]

similarly beerus and champa would also have to do what you said (the complicated part) between 4d universal continuems in order to destroy both universes, no?

We do not know how they would have destroyed their universes. It might have been gradual, or one at a time.

 

[AKM sama]

Only Angels can do that btw Matt. The mortals need the cube.

 

[ProfessorKukui4Life]

They honestly are. Which is why people can go across universes flying.

As far as this goes, if a revision is in order it should be Staff-Only given what it'd effect if accepted.

 

[Sidali891]

Matthew... Again with this whole "this why the can fly across universes"? You SERIOUSLY think this should be among the reasons justifying the universes being connected?

 

[MeleeniumRXJ]

They honestly are. Which is why people can go across universes flying.

I removed my reply because someone else already asked it, but the only examples of beings flying across it are angels, and they're able to visit the Kaioshin realm as well which, from my understanding, is also a separate spacetime. On top of that, Whis can time travel. There's no reason to believe they can't travel to separate spacetimes.

 

[Antvasima]

"Do not try to upgrade the Gods of Destruction to 2-C based on the outcome of a hypothetical Champa and Beerus fight destroying their respective universes, as the statement likely referred to them destroying all the matter within their universes, with no proof of space-time being affected".

I made a few minor changes to the above wording.