A Pica Revision! Again!

[Xulrev]

why are you asking me to calc the thing this is unrelevant can you answer my question if you cant then that means you accept it.

You're making a significant claim here, so to engage it, we need quantification.

The entirety of Pica's stone golem moving is tier 6-C+ by simply walking, so how much stone is required to be tier 6-C+? Me asking you to explain your assumptions is not me acquiescing to any point, it's me seeing if your point even can stand up when examined under scrutiny.

 

[Aerozz]

what?

im here to suppurt the idea that these stones are harder than normal stones becasuse as we saw in many cases why should i answer your question there are many people here who can do that im only throwing facts from this show

 

[Xulrev]

It's not a fact that holds up under scrutiny, is my point.

The entire golem moving, with all the distributed mass and energy, is 6-C+

So why would Zoro creating a slash the width of his sword's blade throughout the golem be tier 6-C+? Especially when we have it calc'd at 7-A?

The presumption falls apart on itself.

 

[AstralKing7]

Pica already is 7-A scaling to Zoro who scales to the Golem. Therefore the values would simply be increased to 6-C+/Likely 6-C+ for the same exact reasons. We're not changing standards based on value changes. That's silly.

Fujitora (despite inevitable fanboy-ism) is obviously superior to Zoro, therefore he would also scale, affecting Gear 3rd and partially Gear 2nd Luffy.

I agree with this

 

[IMadeThisOn8-1-2017]

I still agree with Verlux.

Same, as I addressed before, I see nothing supporting this scaling to anyone.

Plus, Bambu is a calc member and has even stated Pica's calc wouldn't scale to durability.

 

[Antvasima]

Isn't it possible that Pica reinforced and protected the stone golem with Haki to make it not collapse under the energy of its own movement? The antagonist in the Stampede movie was stated to do so in the same situation.

 

[Antvasima]

Anyway, what should we do here? Zoro doesn't seem to scale in terms of raw power, but it is strange to assume that Pica has among the greatest energy outputs in the series, beyond even the admirals.

 

[Wrath_Of_Itachi]

Is the Stampede movie canon?

 

[Antvasima]

Probably not, but it revealed the name of the final island (Laugh Tale), and should have the same verse mechanics as usual.

 

[The_Prince_of_Counters]

No, certain characters could possibly become canon later down the road but the events aren't canon. If you guys genuinely want upgrades for Zoro and Pica then your best shot is to increase Zoro's own feat by finding a short timeframe or simply calculate the amount of KE Pica can produce by punching.

 

[Stefano4444]

Isn't it possible that Pica reinforced and protected the stone golem with Haki to make it not collapse under the energy of its own movement?

I doubt since this was never stated or show.

It far more likely that Pica's Devil Fruit is what allow Golem Pica's body to remain intact under the energy of its own movement and physical strikes without be shattered in the process, like the time Golem Pica's punch could hit the ground without be destroyed in the process.

After all, if his power allow him to move and accumulate rock as his liking, it isn't a strentch assume that he can also keep it from falling down or keep it compact enough that it doesn't shatter everytime it had to move the rock to one place to another.

 

[Stefano4444]

Anyway, what should we do here? Zoro doesn't seem to scale in terms of raw power, but it is strange to assume that Pica has among the greatest energy outputs in the series, beyond even the admirals.

Like i stated before, the fight between Zoro and Pica clearly show that Zoro was the strongest fighter and that Pica as always on the defense, which couldn't have happen if Pica with his Devil Fruit had superior strength.

Something like that would have been show or stated in the Manga or in the Anime, but nothing like that is brought up.

So unless we are going to put Pica above nearly anyone in the series beside the Yonko and Zunesha, which is so moronic that i hope nobody trully want to considered it, Zoro had to fully scale to Pica Devil Fruit's AP.

 

[Damage3245]

Isn't it possible that Pica reinforced and protected the stone golem with Haki to make it not collapse under the energy of its own movement? The antagonist in the Stampede movie was stated to do so in the same situation.

Usually when Haki is imbued into an object, it is visible. Such as Vergo putting Haki into his bamboo stick, Doflamingo putting Haki into his feather cloak, etc.

There is is no indication this is the case for Pica and an entire mountain's worth of stone.

> Anyway, what should we do here? Zoro doesn't seem to scale in terms of raw power, but it is strange to assume that Pica has among the greatest energy outputs in the series, beyond even the admirals.

We could avoid scaling anyone to the calc, and therefore not introduce any scaling issues.

 

[The_King_of_Prudence]

Maybe it's spread too thinly for us to see?

 

[Damage3245]

Maybe it's spread too thinly for us to see?

Again though, that requires us to make an unnecessary assumption when such a thing hasn't been implied in the series.

 

[Aerozz]

haki can be used without it being visible for an example sai's brother used it on his axe without the black colored and it still made his axe stronger

 

[Eminiteable]

True, Armamant can be used without the application of Koka.

 

[Damage3245]

In context though, it wouldn't make sense. Pica knew the entire battle that Zoro was capable of cutting his stone apart, but it was only after he applied Haki over his entire body that he tried to face him unarmed. If he had been using Haki on his stone golems the entire time it wouldn't make any sense.

It is better not to try and force out own head canon for this when it isn't stated or implied that Pica was using Haki on his stone.

 

[Stefano4444]

No, certain characters could possibly become canon later down the road but the events aren't canon. If you guys genuinely want upgrades for Zoro and Pica then your best shot is to increase Zoro's own feat by finding a short timeframe or simply calculate the amount of KE Pica can produce by punching.

I don't think any shorter timeframe than the one we had will ever be accepted.

And for Golem Pica's punches it depend, i asked to KGiffoni if the same method for Stone Giant Pica's KE can be used for other things like punching, if yes then i could try to calc and see what result i get.

 

[Aerozz]

its not about forcing things its what we saw the most logical one is that the stones are harder than normal stones becasue of the cannon that didnt scratch his stones or,


( 2 ) he really did use haki on his body because he wouldnt go there to full of marines soilders without him being coated with haki these are more logical than that his stones are normal it really doesnt make any sense

 

[Damage3245]

@Aerozz; when exactly did they use cannons on him? Have you got a chapter number?

 

[Aerozz]

@Damage3245

Sure chapter 777 (in the last pages ) and chapter 778

 

[Damage3245]

I see what you mean, but looking at the pages Pica at that point is so huge that the cannonball explosions are tiny and would do negligible damage to him anyway at that size. And even if they did, Pica has already demonstrated that he can repair his stone golem extremely quickly so there wouldn't be visible damage for long even if they did leave a mark.

 

[Eminiteable]

Why is Pica's size relevant and why are you making an unnecessary assumption about Pica's regenraiton.

 

[Damage3245]

Why is Pica's size relevant and why are you making an unnecessary assumption about Pica's regenraiton.

Because cannons aren't going to do significant damage to what is essentially a humanoid mountain, and I'm not making any assumptions about Pica's Regenerationn. We've seen that he can regrow entire arms within seconds so making up for a small amount of damage from cannon balls is a reasonable possibility.

 

[Eminiteable]

Regardless of the size cannon balls are still going to damage Pica's golem if it's just regular stone yet they don't at all, pica regenerating requires actual proof of it happening not assumptions.

 

[Aerozz]

these cannon balls isnt as small as you think they are actully big compared it to a mountain these cannon balls are bigger than several big houses together (like these houses have 4+ floors) and these marines didnt fire only 3 cannons they must be firing hundreds of cannons becasue of how a huge threat he is.

 

[Damage3245]

@Aerozz; you've made quite a leap there to "they must have been firing hundreds of cannons".

I think we should just dismiss the cannon ball argument. Cannon balls aren't going to cause significant damage either way to Pica, so trying to argue that his "6-C+ durability" is supported by this is a bad argument.

 

[Dr.Fix]

Isn't it possible that Pica reinforced and protected the stone golem with Haki to make it not collapse under the energy of its own movement? The antagonist in the Stampede movie was stated to do so in the same situation.

Usually when Haki is imbued into an object, it is visible. Such as Vergo putting Haki into his bamboo stick, Doflamingo putting Haki into his feather cloak, etc.
There is is no indication this is the case for Pica and an entire mountain's worth of stone.

> Anyway, what should we do here? Zoro doesn't seem to scale in terms of raw power, but it is strange to assume that Pica has among the greatest energy outputs in the series, beyond even the admirals.

We could avoid scaling anyone to the calc, and therefore not introduce any scaling issues.

The Haki could be the invisble lower lV kind. You make a good point though in that Pica did confront Zoro after his golem failed. As many others have told you Pica's base should scale to his golems and then some.

 

[Damage3245]

@Dr. Fix; we've gone over why that shouldn't be the case. And the only reason Pica actually decided to fight Zoro was because he was forced out of his stone by Zoro who was cutting apart his golem in the air, preventing him from retreating into the ground.

 

[Antvasima]

So is somebody willing to update Pica's profile at least?

 

[Damage3245]

So is somebody willing to update Pica's profile at least?

There are still some people who have argued against it behind applied so I'm not sure if it can be added yet.

 

[AstralKing7]

Ask more staff

 

[Xulrev]

Ask more staff

How many do we need? So far everyone I've asked to check the thread out has said 'yeah this cannot scale', two calc group members are saying 'this isn't how scaling via walking KE works', I don't think we need every staff member on-site to give input on something that is already decided really

 

[Wrath_Of_Itachi]

What's the Agree to Disagree ratio?

 

[Damage3245]

@Wrath of Itachi; so far I haven't seen a staff member arguing for this to scale to anyone but Pica, aside from Antvasima.

 

[AstralKing7]

Umm DDM and Schnee???

 

[Damage3245]

Umm DDM and Schnee???

I'm spoken to DDM and they don't agree with this scaling to Zoro.

Schnee has just stated that this isn't an outlier. That isn't a specific agreement for who this should scale to.

 

[Strawboi]

I think someone should maybe get Calaca on the thread btw.

 

[Damage3245]

I think someone should maybe get Calaca on the thread btw.

Calaca has already commented on the thread. Let's please not badger him when he's already commented his feelings on the subject.