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A hot man with a wool jacket and hat vs. A hot woman with pink hair and horns

Woah. She's becoming a hot topic around here. I didn't expect that...

Anyways, I'm voting for Lucy due to better hax and range:

Her range is at least 11 meters, while Jotaro can only exceed it with projectiles.

Lucy has better hax due to her possessing 14-28 vectors (meaning more angles to attack from), and that mixes well with her Durability Negation (rendering Jotaro's superior durability usesless). So, Lucy can just swarm SP with 7-14 vectors and Jotaro with another 7-14 and kill Jotaro.

Jotaro is smarter, has better stamina and even one-shots with SP, but he would probably be dead before he can figure out something game-changing due to Lucy's bloodlusted nature, range advantage and hax advantage. So with all this said, I believe Lucy takes this more often than not.
 
For what it's worth, Jotaro actually throws objects at opponents out of his reach with the intent to kill or incap (Arabia Fats, N'Doul, Pucci, Bug-Eaten (these were much weaker though), Forever) so make of that what you will. Not voting or commenting, only pointing that out because it was made clear that he actually does that a lot in another thread.
 
Interesting...

Though, Lucy likes to do that too. Not as frequent as Jotaro per say, but she likes to do it even if her opponents are in range. And considering Lucy's precision with her vectors is really good (can manipulate cells), she should respond to Jotaro's thrown objects just fine.
 
Star Platinum is more precise than any machine on earth as of the late 80's (in a world where cyborgs with high precisions existed in the late 30s) and the most accurate Stand as of 1999 minimum so make of that what you will and can catch The Lovers who's microscopic in his fingers with zero issue while exerting exactly enough energy to inflict a specific amount of damage on it.

I was mostly wondering if Lucy can stop an object thrown (if not multiple) with enough force to heavily wound or kill characters higher in durability than this Lucy, like Enrico Pucci.
 
Right. Forgot about that.

No, but the moment she tries to block them with her vectors and sees that they're not doing anything, she will just dodge or levitate in the air making it easier for her to dodge (she'll be able to react in time due to better range). I should also mention that her vectors have at least High 7-A durability meaning she can just cushion the impact of the projectiles.

But would he really lead with that when he has no prior information about his opponents? For all we know, SP interacts with her vectors, Jotaro finds out he outmuscles them, and won't try to consider said option.

One last thing, Lucy still has a greater attack rate due to having 28 vectors.
 
Yeah? He does that in like, almost every instance where his opponent is out of his range (in which he cant instantly close the gap), it ain't a he doesn't know thing, it's a I can't punch so i'll throw thing. I named off a handful examples already. If he knows that he's fightng an opponent and the opponent aint in his range, something is getting launched. It's what comes after that's debatable.

In one instance he threw an object specifically to distract (forcing the opponent to protect against the object while he closed the distance to melee range) and get in range to incap with Platinum so that's one of his methods.

Although you are right, if he doesn't know much about Lucy he may actually pull his secret technique and back off and observe, and if he notices the vectors have a specific range (he most likely definitly will, he's extremely observant, it ends up becoming his main trait other than being strong as shit). Well he may just snipe after deducing Lucy's range and the vector's abilities. If Lucy tries to retaliate via throwing objects herself, well that's a losing battle on her end, Star Platinum wins that eve if she has more arms to throw, lacks the ap, Star Platinum could litterally just stand there and body block while throwing things himself.

Her profile doesn't mention Vector durability, although ill take your word on it (only watched the anime, ill assume theres a feat i didnt see for this key).
 
Alright, you convinced me that he will do that (and the fact that the OP stated that the starting distance is 20m. Whoops).

But you have to remember that her vectors' range without projectiles is greater than Jotaro's without them (+11m vs. 2m IIRC). So, I think that's too much of a distance to cover if he tries that strategy, especially when speeds are equalized (meaning no speed difference between the two). She also has had experience with opponents that outreach, so she'll know a thing or two about strategies overcoming a range disadvantage.

Also, SP body blocking everything is assuming she throws every projectile thrown at him. But she can just throw from different angles (like swarm?). But anywho, not like it matters considering Jotaro is durable enough to tank anything Lucy throws at him.

And when she finds that out, she'll force CQC. And I think she'll successfully force it considering the vectors give her better mobility (unless there's a mobility ability that isn't listed in Jotaro's profile) as she can levitate, impulse herself across the stage, and that is when her durability negation and vector swarm comes into play.

Lastly, for her vector durability, it is stated in her EoS key. However, considering that they have never been destroyed at any point in the manga, it is safe to assume that they have said durability (for in that key they have done their strongest AP/Durability feat), and her previous Durability ratings for her Base & Long Horns key are only her corporal durability (excluding vectors).
 
Yes, and? I'm aware that she has the basic range advantage, but Star Platinum has the range advantage with projectiles (threw iggy almost 400 meters casually, has feats that put'd his punching/throwing strength a few hundred meters for much larger objects too after accounting drag), as that's as easy as picking up a rock off the ground like in Arabia Fats or grabbing the closest thing next to him like uh, a dog, or a button.

Speeds being equalized is actually a detriment for her, it means she can never actually catch up if he tries to book it and SP can throw things as much as he wants and Jotaro doesn't gotta stop moving. If you mean close the distance, when he throws objects she absolutely must defend herself or she's gonna die, while if she does, Star Platinum can litterally stand in the way and take it to the face like he did with Nukesaku, and that's gonna give Jotaro enough time to close the distance and get in range. He's done exactly that before, distract and by the time the opponent is done defending the thrown object he's already behind them. I'm sure she has experience, but so does Jotaro, with up close and long distance opponents, and he's far more cautious and calculating.

If she doesnt throw objects at him, why would they even hit? angles or not Star Platinum can kinda just, float within Jotaro's reach and deflect the projectiles. Could probably throw em right back.

Jotaro can levitate too (somehow, then never again, but he does it in this key, in a situation like this (city battle), and he can effortlessly jump buildings and the like and propel himself with KE via Stand to pull off physically impossible maunevers in the air or richochet off objects, she probably has better mobility definitely, but if Jotaro doesn't want to get caught, he's not gonna. But at the same time, when she finds that out? At that point it's probably far to late to get close to him if he doesn't want to do so.

This aint EOS though, if her vectors got far stronger why would the durability be assumed the same when the difference in vector capability is litterally billions? It not being destroyed doesn't matter, at that point it's Uknown.
 
Oh, apparently we treat it as flight, Dio has it listed as flight, and Jotaro has the exact same thing as him. Why Jotaro doesn't have it listed idk, but Dio does (despite Dio's flight and Jotaro's flight being the same and used against each other, so you'd think if it was noticed and put on Dio it would be put on Jotaro too but oh well). I can link a few panels or a video if you want to see it.
 
GojiBoyForever said:
Jotaro can't fly he just jumped really high.
Click to expand...
And yet Dio has Flight, and there's also the fact he didn't jump.

Can Jotaro jump really high? Yes.

Can Jotaro also fly through unconventional means? Also yes.

He does both in Dio's World Arc, it's pretty clear, I mean the fact he straight up starts floating upwards then starts flying should be evidence of that.
 
He even floats in the air, turns around, looks at Dio and holds an entire conversation outside of time stop. While like 30 meters in the air.
 
GojiBoyForever said:
Are you using anime or manga?
Click to expand...
Seeing as I have both opened right now checking and it's the same between both. It doesn't matter, he does it in both the manga and anime.
 
Did you just randomly change the starting distance? Could you not do that? It invalidates all discussion up to this point almost, keep it the same or go with SBA or something, don't change the rules after like 6 hours.

Especially because the starting distance prior was still relatively fair for both sides.
 
But that's irrelevant when they both start at 20 meters. Lucy destroyed an airborne helicopter with a pebble. The range difference isn't that bad.

Your argument on her failing to catch up relies on Lucy being dumb, doing nothing when SP does something and not dodging his projectiles with her mobility advantage after blocking his projectiles, and thus, invalid. She's not dumb and is very practical: she sees something doesn't work, she won't do it again. And SP charging in like that is actually detrimental as Lucy can just swarm Jotaro with her vectors and rip him apart. And it also relies on speed and infinite object supply.

Hmm... He can fly? Well, he can't use his surroundings as projectiles when he's in the air. And approaching is just going to give Lucy the opening for her to negate his durability and kill him.

Also, Lucy's vectors can't interact with SP, meaning that they'll likely phase through him, leaving Lucy no choice but to swarm Jotaro. Again, 28 vectors vs 2-4 limbs. Obviously the 28 vectors are going to win especially when they can negate durability. They're just too many. And you cannot tell me that SP will block 28 vectors/projectiles coming FROM ALL DIRECTIONS (in front, behind, left, right) at the same time with speeds equalized. Your argument also relies that there will be an infinite supply of objects to throw when that's not true. Meaning that advantage won't hold on for so long when he has no more objects to throw, leaving Lucy to just overwhelm him with Durability Negating Vectors.

Also, AP scales to Durability, but not the other way around. Hell, Jotaro is Wall Level, but he has Building Level durability. Considering the material that they're made of doesn't change, I don't see how her vector's only real durability feat wouldn't scale to other of her keys. They might not be as powerful, but that doesn't mean their durability is lesser.
 
Also, yeah. Don't change it CaptainNutpunch. Keep it the way it was.
 
I didn't say she didn't, the issue isn't her not being able to launch things back at him or attacking him, it's that said things are ineffective against him completely, her vectors being out of range is an an issue because while Jotaro can effectively attack at that range, Lucy can't.

I'm aware and I actually thought to bring that up, the thing is Star Platinum can act indepentely from Jotaro, Jotaro decides to run? He can do that while Star Platinum is launching things at him, he doesn't have to stop so SP can attack. She must still deflect the projectiles or dodge em, and if I recall, she needs to use her vectors to float and move around, while Jotaro doesn't have to stop moving, and that's the key here, he can move and attack while Lucy can move and attack but said attacks are ineffective or move and dodge/deflect, no matter how slight, he's going to be increasing the gap and seeing as how fast he can move, speed equal or not, Lucy can still lose track of him (Seeing as it takes place in the city with decent cover). That's only half true, if he charges yeah that could happen but in this situation if he does that he'd almost certainly ohko while she's preoccupied. Although I'm pretty sure we agreed that due to a foreign opponent and his nature that'd he'd back off first. Speed? The speed is at least as fast than him, and infinite item supply? Yeah, only has to grab a rock off the ground or even just rip a chunk of the ground out, SBA is New York, there is effectively infinite ammo all things considered.


More like high end levitation but yeah. You're ignoring the context of him approaching, he does it while the opponent is preoccuppied and doesn't notice him, he won't charge in at this distance if he knows Lucy knows that he's coming and especially not when he can see how many vectors there are. Plus you already pointed out he probably won't do that due to his nature. And he can easily grab chunks of concrete off the top and sides of buildings and such, once again, SBA is central New York, ammo and all that is available no matter where he goes, he could probably shot gun it at that.


If you're actually trying to say Lucy can't interact with SP in this then she's at a extreme disadvantage, because he can wall her then, like he did with Nuksaku (being unharmable by him but acting as a solid so he didn't reach Jotaro) because he sure as hell can interact with em, thanks selective intangibility. Ignoring the fact Lucy has to be within range to swarm him (would be hardpressed to do so) and given it's been said he'll likely observe first before runing in, and SBA gives him all the debree in the world, well, yeah.

That's a huge not how it works. Jotaro has feats of having that durability, if he didn't he'd be wall and that's it. You can't randomly assume something like that, we need feats or statements. Hell, using Jotaro as an example, he's made of the same material as >insert litteraly any other jojo humanBut they sure ain't as durable as him, why? Because feats that's why.
 
And thinking on it, he can like, jump way further and higher and fly way higher than she can float (which I think in this key is only around 20meters in height, please tell me if I'm wrong). He jumped so high that like ten story buildings were tiny from the panel height and he could see most of the city. Of course, this only matters if it's Dio's World Jotaro, as that's the only time in his life he could do that (basically his peak minus time stop).
 
Good response.

I said she can attack at 20 meters with projectiles, too. You know, hitting an airborne helicopter?

If she can't interact with him, it just means she can't even touch him, no? With that said, when she finds that out, she'll rely on intuition and target Jotaro while being weary of SP's presence. Also, what can Jotaro himself do to Lucy when his striking strength is Wall Level? And what's the maximum distance they can be separated? But him being independent from his stand does change things quite a bit. But it also means that Lucy can distract SP, too.

Funny thing is that Lucy also likes to do that too (distract her opponents with her surroundings and try to inch her way forward once they stop paying attention), so she should be able to pick up on what is up. She never stops paying attention to her opponents (only outside interference and PIS has ****** her over). Also, It's also likely that she's 8-C in this key.

Huh... Now that I think of it, what exactly is SP's AP?

I should say that Lucy relies on her vectors. She herself literally does nothing, so in case you're trying to use that as a disadvantage, there's that.

One last thing is that one of her race traveled all the way from one end of the city to the next one just by pushing herself off the side of a building (took her about +10 seconds to get to her destination). It's a clone of a character that Lucy has eviscerated, and as such should scale. So, she can also jump up on buildings and do what he does.

But I just listed an AP feat that scales to durability of the vectors... And that's a bad analogy considering you're comparing the durability of organic material and non-organic material.
 
Ok. I looked into the APs of both.

SP at this time should be about 0.75-1 Tons of TNT (correct me if I'm wrong).

Lucy is a wee bit tricky considering that her calculation that puts her at 9-A is 0.11 Tons of TNT from her Base form. But she did it when she was a child, and Lucy in Long Horns is much more powerful since then. How much? Well, if we lowball the multiplier to 2x, considering that she effortlessly killed Mariko clones (all of which who scales to Lucy and the original one casually overwhelmed Base Lucy) in her Long Horns form, she would come about 0.22 Tons of TNT.

Hmm...SP doesn't one-shot Lucy. That also does change things quite a bit.

EDIT: I just found out that if SP gets too far away from Jotaro, SP grows weaker.
 
I know what you said, and I said her attack range with projectiles litterally doesnt matter because her projectiles can't hurt him. Otherwise she'd be 8-C with projectiles, not 9-A. I didn't deny that she could attack opponents that are in the air, only that it wouldn't do anything to Jotaro.

No it means she can't hurt him, and if he so chooses, key word chooses, the attacks will phase through him, otherwise it's a solid wall of No u given her AP and the fact durability negation is now useless on SP because she can't actually hurt him due to his noncorporal status, which you yourself brought up, hell, honestly Jotaro probably could straight up walk up to her given this situation now if we're treating Lucy as unable to harm Stands, because now SP can straight up wall her.

Jotaro can't do shit to lucy himself, what even gave you that idea that anyone here or even in any Jotaro thread discusses what he can do? Not once in this entire thread did anybody say Jotaro would damage Lucy, why are you changing topics like that?

The maximum distance? Like 2 meters in any direction minimum, has been shown to go up to a few extra (It's the same stand as the world so... idk, a few meters in any given direction). Uh, something tells me you have zero idea how JoJo or even Stands work in general going by that response. Lucy ain't distracting SP, he's always gonna be close to Jotaro (otherwise this wouldn't even be a match, SP would just fly over to Lucy and ohko while Jotaro stands back), when I said independent I meant the actions the two take can be completely different, Jotaro can back off and continue to back off without stopping while SP flies around him ripping up debree to launch, Jotaro doesn't need to stop moving while Star Platinum doesn't need to stop doing what he's doing. Independent actions like that, SP doesn't have a big range like HG or something, he cant piss off and do his own thing.


Inch? Jotaro didn't inch he ran to his opponent so fast that by the time the opponent was done deflecting he was already there and not even three feet away, and behind them at that. But that doesn't matter, the situation is Jotaro backs off and tries to observe a foreign opponent and studies them till he can deduce the optimal plan of action, you brought that up yourself, and you're likely right, so continuing to talk of him charging straight in is off topic now. If she's only likely 8-C that's still bad, Jotaro can punch holes clean through characters that are 5x above characters that are a bit over baseline. Star Platinum is punching clean through if in any circumstance Lucy enters his range.

I'm aware, and that's actually an issue for her, to levitate she must use vectors, to attack she must use vectors, to deflect she must use vectors, gonna be hardpressed to close the distance before losing him while trying to catch up to him while deflecting debree, trying to attack back, or any combination of the three.


That's cool but he can fly, she can't, she can levitate via her vectors but that's only up to her maximum vector length, no more than that. And while she's good at jumping she also needs to jump off other things to change trajectory, she could jump, and inadvertely completely screw herself if he dodges and she can't instantly change trajectory off of something depending on how and where she jumps. Meanwhile he can. Time doesn't matter because time is speed and if we're using the speed of their jumps and reactions or short burst movements and the speed of thrown objects, he's MFTL in all accounts. Speed is equal so the time it took litterally doesnt matter.

But I just listed an AP feat that scales to durability of the vectors... And that's a bad analogy considering you're comparing the durability of organic material and non-organic material.


You listed an AP feat that scales to her vectors at the end of the manga.

Why ain't Panacotta Fugo's Purple Haze comparable to Star Platinum in durability? Both are made out of Stand Energy? See, same issue applies, feats (or statements) or bust, I can see where you're coming from but that simply ain't how this works.


>SP at this time should be about 0.75-1 Tons of TNT (correct me if I'm wrong).

You're wrong, he absolutely fodderizes characters that are as strong as the former and the latter he can outright punch so hard that it explodes into dust when he's mad, and when he isn't mad he punches hard enough where his fist goes straight through their torso or caves their skull in.

It's why he's At least Building+ (or not, odd seeing as he's stated to be the strongest Stand, of which others are listed as at least). Regardless he still can (and I mean this litterally) dust 8-C opponents.


Star Platinum when further away from Jotaro is when he DID his feats of note.
 
EmperorDoom25 said:
Jotaro cant flight tho, since its anime only iirc
And even then, its not on the profile so we cant assume he does
Click to expand...
It wasn't anime only, it's in the manga too.

You're right, but it's on Dio's, for uh, the exact same scene where Jotaro flies. So like, I'm gonna assume somebody simply hadn't noticed and it's accepted because Dio has it.
 
Yeah, says Dio has flight. And I mean he does, he actually in all instances of that fight flies except one time (Throwing the knives) even after becoming High DIO he flies toward jotaro and then changes his trajectory 90 degrees to fly upward instead of simply jumping off the sidewalk.
 
Emperor, Yeah, but that's the Jotaro that's being used here, Dio's World Jotaro, meaning it's apart of his powerset and given the situation and his opponent along with his nature I see him doing it, and if not he's going to be forced to do it so it's not a question of will but a question of when (probably the moment he sees Lucy can do something close to it). (Plus I don't think he even can do it after, SP got weaker after Part 3, it's outright stated).
 
Migue79 said:
According to this link on JoJo wiki, they really weren't flying: https://jojo.fandom.com/wiki/Thread:43615
Click to expand...
And they're wrong, unless you mean to tell me one can suddenly start floating in the air without jumping or doing ANYTHING and then float in the air and talk OUTSIDE of timestop while being held in place mid air without falling then finish talking then proceed to move upwards then do a hard U-Turn, all without touching anything else. Unless Jotaro and Dio have telekinisis or something.
 
Jotaro's Star Finger could be used as a ranged option. Not saying that'd change anything, but it's a thing.
 
Star finger only adds 2 meters on to his range. That's a technique used mostly when he's restrained. (In fact that's the only cann time he used it, DBM and agains Strength. When he could't move. Anime only had him use it on Chariot though) He's far more likely to just throw something going by the amount of times that he's done that.
 
I didn't read EVERYTHING but Jotaro can lead with TS and reach Lucy/dodge her vectors, can't he? Jotaro's durability is atleast small building level from feats, and with Star Platinum's added mobility he can basically move as fast as Nina did during her fight with Lucy, and Nina held up very well against her. Both can phase eachother but Star Platinum has better precision. Idk I'd have to give it to Jotaro for timestop hax
 
Also doesn't Jotaro have Ligthspeed reaction time with Star Platinum? I know he almost got beat by a rat but I have to make that a outlier for Jotaro since that doesn't match up with his prior fights.
 
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