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A Game Called Bullet Hell! (The Lich vs Han Jee-Han)

Why does time manipulation mean very little? It makes attacks appear in slow motion and allows him to weave out of danmaku. It's far from just a little point here, as that's one of the main arguments for how Han would go down.

That telekinesis though, if they're bullets, he should actually be able to reflect them back at him with a wave of telekinesis. In addition to the obvious solution of ripping the guns from his hands.

The golems are resilient to his danmaku for the most part, so they'll be harder to deal with.
 
Explain how time accel does anything.

Shooting bang bang kill. Gungeon characters have Non-Physical due to being able to interact with conceptual beings (those that embody Will) and the dead.

Because our wiki rarely holds it to be true that X Character has a forcefield that cannot be broken due to regen. Enough damage overcomes it. Even if it regens afterword, Lich can slowly deal damage.

Game mechanics. He's shown he can regen from dust.

Neat. Except he apparently can't.
 
It makes danmaku much less effective.

That helps against the golems just putting themselfs back together how? I don't think you understand the difference between intanh and elemental intang.

That will be healed away, or regenerated away, or potioned away.

That geels rather... weird, but alright. He still can't kill golems, Han can still go into a pocket dimension, and Han will be becoming perpetually stronger.

He can.
 
Time acceleration makes it so the bullets, the danmaku that's supposed to kill him, move in slow motion. Meaning he can walk/run/fly out of range rather simply. If 1000 bullets are coming at him, but they appear to be moving as fast as a snail, they can be avoided rather simply.

I'm not sure why the shooting bang bang kill is relevant here. Could I have some elaboration here please.

That's true. But seeing as how Han can layer his forcefields, such that if one breaks he can put up another, and given his constantly regenerating mana, it makes it a valid option if push comes to shove. Though he would likely just teleport some distance away.

I wasn't arguing the regen. Han can't get past it.

Just realized you were replying to risci, not me.
 
H o w.

They can hit concepts. They can hit a Golem.

Explain. Finite potions to scum with make that unlikely.

Yes he can.

I don't see how.
 
He becomes faster. Do I need to expand on that?

They can hit it. It still reforms. Seriously, do you know how elemental intang works?
 
So, looked it up, he's danmaku ain't that impressive. Especially with Han reducing damage by 56% and having multiple forcefields that regenerate, healing, Regenerationn, him getting perpetually stronger and using golems as shields to get around that.

I would ask, how exactly does he get Han to him in his second phase? He lacks the Lifting strenght as far as I can tell, and ge cannot directly grab him due to mana shields.

So, as far as I see: Han can simply break out of the dungeon

Keep creating golems and have them torture the guy

Have gnome make a hole for him and throw down a few monsters to torture him

TK away his danmaku and his weapons, at which point he can have a golem distract it while he does he's stuff.


He can outlast it.

He could likely disarm and have his mana create a few barriers around him.

I also don't see why just litirally binding him wouldn't work.
 
"Han can break out of the Gungeon"

Can't. Sealed. Been over that.

Golems are a thing that can be dealt with.

Cool.

So far Han still has no win con. These are all essentially methods of stalling while Lich can feasibly just fire until he's dead. Also I get the distinct feeling Han's character is being seriously torn asunder, and being suggested to work in ways he does not actually work in.
 
Excuse me? Han has broken out of stuff like this already. You need to prove that he can't just break out like he normally does.

How? How can they be dealt with? They will keep putting themself back together, and I don't see anyhting he has that can pulverize them or anything.

He cannot feasibly just fire. He's guns would easily be taken away, and his bullets handwaved away with TK. And he does actually do stuff like this, it's the point of his character that he keeps finding unfair ways to become stronger and win. He does retreat, heal up, and go back in-character, and Gamer's Mind forces him to take the best action he can think of regardless.

And incapacitation exists. Him having he's golems keep beating it counts for that, as well as just tying him up and having him tortured.
 
No, you need to prove that he can get out of sealing from a Low 7-B god.

Uh. Actually his guns can pulverize, assuming they're anything at all like other Gungeon guns. They shatter the stone enemies pretty easily.

Yes, he can. Even without guns he can fire danmaku. Did so with his chain ability for example.

Again, not really. They can be dealt with.
 
I'd also like to note Kaliber has made it so the Gungeon passively alters its space to prevent people from getting a lay of the land and moving around it freely.
 
Tier is widly useless for sealing. He did however break out of a dungeon created by a Low 7-B being, so yay for that. It's a chaos god comparable to Arc Company, who was above Low 7-Bs when a newborn.

Yeah... the golems are ten meter tall. Don't think he has the AOE.

Rather unimpressive danmaku. And again, he will run out pf juice before Han will.

How? They will keep reforming from the damage dealt.
 
"widly"? Also, not the same thing. This thing passively seals you inside. Not the same as walking out of a structure.

Yes he does.

"Juice" kek. I doubt it.

Because, like I just said, he maintains the ability to pulverize them.
 
Yes, tier and sealing do not correlate.

He didn't walk out. He broke a rift in the dimension to escape from.

Can ya link that please? And he can't really pulverize aomething that is on his level of AP.

Why? Han vannot run out of stamina, regenerates it faster than he uses it.

Pulverize something much stronger than 8-A characters? This things are not 9-B in dura ya know?
 
Perhaps the term "more powerful than he is" would be better.

Doesn't work, seen it before. People cannot teleport out of the Gungeon, likely due to the spatial bullshittery.

Watch any video with the Lead Maiden in it. Common enemy. And... yes, he probably can. Pulverizing other Tier 8 happens. Hell, Gungeoneer (weaker than Lich) pulverized the steel off of the Dragun.

So yes. Also, "much stronger than 8-A" kek.
 
It is still not worth mentioning. AP doesn't matter with sealing.

He doesn't teleport, he breaks the reality. He couldn't teleport out of it either.

Pulverizing someone who is at most a fourth of your own AP is plain impossible, you can't do that.

Edit: The Lead Maide is motsly hollow and five meters tall at most.
 
Also, how does one get bfr'ed into the gungeon? They start in cemtral parl, so I would like to see that.
 
1. ok

2. So does Kaliber.

3. Yes. Yes you can.

4. What do you mean here? Lich has BFR.
 
...

Kaliber can break pocket realities? Really?

How exacly? The attack wouldn't even pass through. Also, which one of liches attacks have at least ten meter os aoe?

Yeah, how does that work? The main one I saw was the hand one, which I already pointed out that wouldn't work.
 
Kaliber can warp space, yes.

Literally all of Danmaku.

How would it not work kek.
 
Warping space and breaking reality to make a portal to the real world is not the same.

None of his danmaku is that wide, they are a meter wide at best. Also, why can't just grab all of his bullets with TK?

If you showcase how it works I would point it out. If you mean the hand one, Han is always flying in the air, has a forcefield around him that makes dragging him down impossible unless he breaks it and he has better liftinf strenght.
 
No. I agree, it isn't.

But making a pocket dimension from nothing, and warping the space of that area within, is.

The amount of Danmaku is.

He can just... grab the forcefield. And actually, I'm not sure on Lifting Strength. Could do a calc for that real quick I guess.
 
Warping the insides of a pocket dimension and warping a rift between the real world an it is not the same either.

Dude, there are very few attacks where that large amount of bullets is at the same place, they are more all over tha place. Also, TK, again.

And grabbing that helps how? It isn't directly connected to Han, he won't go down with it. And flight, again.
 
It is if that spatial manipulation is used to cut off all contact.

What are you asking AoE for again?

If it covers him it will bring him down because the top will just hit him. Also, it works on flying gungeoneers, too. So again, moot point.
 
Wait, what? You mean the guy who made the dimension is doing that? That's basic stuff, that doesn't stoo Han from fragmenting it. And again, how would he get into the gungeon?

How it pulverizes a 10 meters tall golem that is stronger than characters that are stronger than 100 ton wizards.

And he teleports away then, he also has two enhanced senses specifically against getting caught of guard.

Don't those, lime, fly four meters in the air at most?
 
Also, the bfr onlt brings you deeper into the gingeon, not into the gungeon from outside of it.
 
1. It does if Kaliber is actively paying attention. And again, BFR. Han has pitiful lifting strength, I'm very certain Lich's is higher.

2. Unquantifiably stronger being the main thing here.

3. 'kay.

4. Could be.
 
Pitiful? It's superhuman because it's mostly unknow. He was capable of no selling o giant snake, and if Kep's calc for Naruto is anything to go by, it's probably pretty high as far as energy that didn't even stagger him goes. Can upgrade him to class 5 due to being hilariously above legion zombies tough, so there's that for tomorow.

Yes, but dince he doesn' t have enough power to one-shot the main thing regardless, that's kinda moot.

... So how do they end up in the gungeon. Han isn't getting physically dragged down.

So it does not mean it works on someone dozens of meters in the air, wonderful.
 
Lifting Strength calc to add to this.

Low-End Mass: 1122.947 kg

High-End Mass: 15042.147 kg

Velocity = 11217.915 m/s

Low-End Force = 12597123.996 Newtons

High-End Force = 168741526.464 Newtons

Timeframe in this case was 0.0167 seconds, so we'll divide by that to get Lifting Strength.

Low-End: 1.285e6 kg, Class M

High-End: 1.721e7 kg, Class M

Lich has Class M lifting strength.
 
Ricsi-viragosi said:
snip
Click to expand...
His arm is that long, he can drag them. If he is inside of a forcefield, he gets dragged with it. So Han absolutely is getting dragged. Superhuman is low-tier for this wiki. Moving on.
 
What is that mass, The arm? Is that actually aplicable? I can swing a warhammer at great speeds, and this would give me a lot higher lifting strenght than what I have. Plus couldn't I do the same with any giant monster in-verse?

Also, you ignore teleportation and enhanced senses, again. Also, mind showing where his hand can reach dizens of meters into the air?
 
1. We've used this before, yes, because that is the mass he could viably move. If so, feel free.

2. "Enhanced Senses" kek. And... have you seen the size of Lich? Are you uh... are you joking?
 
The giant golem is at least twice the liches size and is made of metal, but alright, I guess I'll I'll do that.

Saying kem doesn't counter Han knowing where the lich is at all times. And yes, I saw his size. Han flies on skyscraper heights, so that doesn't change much.
 
"kem"

How does Han know where Lich is at all times? Considering Lich can just open a portal from a literal other dimension, no, he absolutely doesn't know where Lich is at all times.
 
First of all, how would Lich open stuff from another dimension when they are 25 meters aoart in central park.

Secondly, the bfr is used once you are already in the gungeon. Could ya show me the scan of where he drags someone from outside in?

Thirdly, you have yet to explain how he drags Han bring faster, being able to teleport and his enhanced senses being able to tell him enemies locations and whenever he is unknowingly in danger.
 
I'm back. For a split second.

I don't see any new votes, though I'm assuming Risci is voting for Han.

Ooh, a lifting strength feat, nice. There seems to be a lot of good points flung around here.

Also, Mr. Bambu, please don't forget to check out the fight against Sanura, please. I'm just curious as to your thoughts on it.

I'm going to go bump the Danny Phantom fight.
 
Ricsi-viragosi said:
First of all, how would Lich open stuff from another dimension when they are 25 meters aoart in central park.
Secondly, the bfr is used once you are already in the gungeon. Could ya show me the scan of where he drags someone from outside in?

Thirdly, you have yet to explain how he drags Han bring faster, being able to teleport and his enhanced senses being able to tell him enemies locations and whenever he is unknowingly in danger.
Click to expand...
1. Lich gets passively brought back to the Gungeon, he is sealed. This has already been established.

2. No, because that literally doesn't exist. It's more like proof on you to show they can actually get out of the Gungeon, a sealed off sub-dimension.

3. Dunno what Bring Faster means, but Lich has countered teleportation before and Enhanced Senses are practically useless here.
 
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