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DC Rating Revamp Project (Why 4-B is wrong whether or not it's an upgrade or downgrade)

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Jasonsith said:
And we have had Mechagodzilla (Kiryu) who has some large country attack from its Absolute Zero Cannon which uses up 40% of total power reserves for one shot and then every Godzilla Millennium characters scale. So maybe we should be more lenient towards the scaling of DC heralds from Wally.
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DC Comics runs on the "Everybody can fight everybody" principle, even if it is not quite as extreme as Marvel Comics in this regard. We definitely cannot scale everybody else to 2-A or Low 1-C from the Flash at his peak.

I think that Amelia and Impress have the right idea in that we have to use individual feats a lot more, rather than blanket scale everybody.
 
@The_Impress @Amelia_Lonelyheart

I would appreciate your further input here. Or would you prefer that I close this thread, so you can create a new thread when you are ready?
 
Antvasima said:
Thank you. I hope that will be useful, but there was a lot of controversy surrounding FanofRPGs, so I do not know whether or not Impress and Amelia are willing to use the information.
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I mean if it’s valid we can at least discuss what’s there
This was also in response to LungeFish wanting the blog (I misread it tho lmao)
Confluctor said:
Yeah. Varied should only be used for those who have canon reasons for varying power. Captain Atom is one of the few with in-canon explaination and reasons. (I need to start fixing him)
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Agreed; characters like GL and Ares also work by this (he might need more revisions)
Antvasima said:
DC Comics runs on the "Everybody can fight everybody" principle, even if it is not quite as extreme as Marvel Comics in this regard. We definitely cannot scale everybody else to 2-A or Low 1-C from the Flash at his peak.
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I agree but I think we can use stuff like the RMP to scale the others if we have evidence
Antvasima said:
I think that Amelia and Impress have the right idea in that we have to use individual feats a lot more, rather than blanket scale everybody.
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I do agree with this
 
Da_Lunge_Fish said:
Well, Superman took the supernova blast while weakened, and breaking the star chains was also implied to not be that hard to him. By the way, can Post Crisis and Post Flashpoint be scaled to each other? Cause there’s Mogo illuminating the universe too then.
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That could work, we can use this feat too, where Post-Flashpoint Orion and Metal Golem's clash destroyed a star system.

And if i'm not wrok ,there was a statement about Post Crisis Superman be more powerful than Post-Flashpoint Superman (before merging with the latter).
 
Amelia_Lonelyheart said:
As for the tier they should end up in, Supergirl has a butt-load of casual Tier 5 stuff that I'll get to calculating today. Here's a list of the Tier 5 stuff I've calculated thus far.
  1. Flash attacks Wonder Woman wth the mass of a moon (5-A) (Post-Crisis)
  2. Kyle Rainer blows up Moon (5-A) / Donna Troy survives said explosion (5-B) (Post-Crisis)
  3. Weakened Superman causes a sunspike (5-B, 5-A, High 5-A) (Post-Crisis)
  4. Superman, Wonder Woman, and Martian Manhunter move the Earth (5-B) (Post-Crisis)
  5. Mon-El moves a White Dwarf (High 5-A) (Post-Crisis) (likelly unusable)
  6. Black Adam and Sinestro move the moon (5-B) (Post-Flashpoint)
  7. Weakened Ultraman moves the moon (5-A) (Post-Flashpoint)
  8. Superman and Martian Manhunter stop planet sized-ship (5-B) (Post-Flashpoint)
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There's also Superman pushing a replica of Krypton, which is a 34g planet that's larger than Jupiter.
Stefano4444 said:
That could work, we can use this feat too, where Post-Flashpoint Orion and Metal Golem's clash destroyed a star system.
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That links to nothing.
 
When it comes the scaling PC Supes to New 52 Supes, the way I usually see is Clark himself saying that it's harder to do things than before (Lois and Clark #1), meaning that PC Supes > Start of Rebirth. However, in Superman Annual, Swamp Thing states start of Rebirth Superman still gets more sunlight than New 52 did. Not sure if there are any other scales or statements, but this is what I usually see.

Edit: Also how is Alan Scott's Solar System level statement applicable to Superman and other herald-tiers?
 
Shouldn't a serious, not-holding-back Superman scale to his golden age self considering they clashed with eachother at the point that golden age supes was 2-C, would make a good high-end i think
 
ZephyrosOmega said:
Shouldn't a serious, not-holding-back Superman scale to his golden age self considering they clashed with eachother at the point that golden age supes was 2-C, would make a good high-end i think
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I haven't read it in awhile, but doesn't fully serious Superboy and Superman clash wiith Superboy-Prime in Infinite Crisis? Could be usable now I suppose.
 
Amelia_Lonelyheart said:
I haven't read it in awhile, but doesn't fully serious Superboy and Superman clash wiith Superboy-Prime in Infinite Crisis? Could be usable now I suppose.
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Yeah, but it's after all get depowered from flying through the red sun. Considering he needs the Solar Suit and all, I'd pretty sure that had more of an effect on SBP than it did the others. Though PC Supes fighting GA Supes is a 2-C feat regardless.
 
Qawsedf234 said:
Its literally a dream, the demon who did all of this says as much. The entire section is taken from Superman #666, which mostly occurs in Superman's dream.
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Apparently only a small part of the story takes place in a dream.

“The plot is that Superman has a nightmare and wakes up and still thinks he's in a nightmare, so he just goes around causing havoc, but the reason he did this is because he was being corrupted by a Kryptonian demon after purposely weakening his soul and his mind so that he would be brought to the demon after being corrupted by him so that he could defeat him.”
 
Ehnkr2beboh said:
Yeah, but it's after all get depowered from flying through the red sun. Considering he needs the Solar Suit and all, I'd pretty sure that had more of an effect on SBP than it did the others. Though PC Supes fighting GA Supes is a 2-C feat regardless.
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He still keeps up with him beforehand.
 
Greenshifter said:
The plot is that Superman has a nightmare and wakes up and still thinks he's in a nightmare, so he just goes around causing havoc, but the reason he did this is because he was being corrupted by a Kryptonian demon after purposely weakening his soul and his mind so that he would be brought to the demon after being corrupted by him so that he could defeat him.
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The issue is that the event he's talking about specifically occurs in the Dream, as the demon himself states
The lords loaned Rakkar dark power! Mighty power! To draw you into a corrupting dream! It was not literal, but it damned you still. And now--
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It was not literal
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Like the stuff in hell was legitimate, but the event you wrote about him defeating his entire enemy cast occurred in a non-literal dream to corrupt Superman's soul. Its not a feat.
 
San-Kakarot said:
The person that said "Superman holding back by several tiers of magnitudes doesn't make sense". Then you have to ignore of all the instances where Superman touches humans without shattering them or running at human speed, or shaking hands without crusing it etc.
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And also the fact that Superman has son, well, you get the point
 
Amelia_Lonelyheart said:
I haven't read it in awhile, but doesn't fully serious Superboy and Superman clash wiith Superboy-Prime in Infinite Crisis? Could be usable now I suppose.
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Honestly considering even a mildly sundipped superman like the one in rebirth could amp to 2-A that seems pretty consistent
 
ZephyrosOmega said:
Honestly considering even a mildly sundipped superman like the one in rebirth could amp to 2-A that seems pretty consistent
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As someone else pointed out, they're weakened during the conflict. Howoever, I do not believe they were weakened when Earth-Two Superman fought Superboy Prime, so, not sure.
 
ZephyrosOmega said:
Shouldn't a serious, not-holding-back Superman scale to his golden age self considering they clashed with eachother at the point that golden age supes was 2-C, would make a good high-end i think
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It never occurred to me Tier 2 Superman might be a thing now

Oh Lawd
San-Kakarot said:
The person that said "Superman holding back by several tiers of magnitudes doesn't make sense". Then you have to ignore of all the instances where Superman touches humans without shattering them or running at human speed, or shaking hands without crusing it etc.
Click to expand...
literally any superhero would get variable for this argument
 
@Amelia_Lonelyheart @The_Impress

What do you think that we should do here?

I would personally appreciate if you use all available useful information during your upcoming revisions, even if it comes from somebody that you do not get along with at all.
 
Do we have the Mageddon feat calculated? Also, wasn't there some controversy regarding the actual size of the machine in question?
 
Ehnkr2beboh said:
Yeah, but it's after all get depowered from flying through the red sun. Considering he needs the Solar Suit and all, I'd pretty sure that had more of an effect on SBP than it did the others. Though PC Supes fighting GA Supes is a 2-C feat regardless.
Click to expand...
To be honest i still feel iffy to have GA Supes at 2-C during that story.

Since powerscaling wise GA and SBP should be comparable when instead SBP was much stronger than him.
 
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