Wuthering Waves Jiyan Feat

[Arkenis]

Edit: This is the new calc being used for Jiyan's feat

So I kinda got interested in Wuthering Waves since its been talked about recently and I wanted to know how strong it was. I look and see it's got 6-B from this Jiyan calc. I don't play the game so I could be missing something here but I don't think so. The visuals are completely wonky for this calc and I'll explain why this calc shouldn't be used for scaling.

I had posted about it in the thread already and got a response but after reading the response and seeing how inconsistent the feat is, I figured why not just respond in my crt.

I don’t think your interpretation of the scene is correct, though it could just be me misreading it. My interpretation: The dark clouds that appear in the trailer are actually generated by the Tacet Field. After Jiyan launches his attack, he creates a hole that reveals the normal clouds behind it. The energy then spreads outward, dispersing the remaining Tacet Field clouds. The vortices in the final scene are essentially parts of the Tacet Field, and once they’re cleared away, the normal clouds become visible again.

To reinforce my point, at the beginning of the video, the energy from the Tacet Field can be seen pushing the clouds before forming the vortex and the dark clouds.

Go to 0:30

As you can see here, these are the dark clouds generated by the Tacet Field. They’re the ones Jiyan dispersed, and once the vortex vanished, the normal clouds appeared afterward.

Visuals:

So for starters, this calc is Jiyan's attack dispersing the clouds and yet when they clear up, we can still see other clouds around. And those close to the city are likely cumulus clouds. The issue is, the calc gets 86 Teratons. That's a lot of force that Jiyan would have to output and would result in a massive aoe. Those cumulus clouds we see aren't hundreds of km in the air, just 200-2000m range. How could he release so much energy but somehow not effect clouds directly under the one's the Tacet Field made? That doesn't make sense unless his force only expanded horizontally, which doesn't follow physically even in the scene as we see when he slams on the ground he releases a big dome-like shockwave. The most evident thing that shows he didn't disperse them, is the fact when Jiyan does his move, the way the clouds are removed, is akin to it being disintegrated rather than dispersed. Dispersal would be spreading them away, in an almost uniform circular formation like a raindrop does when it hits the surface of water.

One more thing, at 0:30, we can see the Tacet Field cloud does indeed push the clouds away, but this entire fight happens within a couple of minutes. I'm not a geologist but I do know clouds don't travel hundreds of km in mere minutes. This is another inconsistency with the feat and shouldn't go unnoticed.

Calc:

This is a smaller point but still an error in the calc and is tied to visuals. The calc combines the supposed dispersal of each cloud each tacet field made. This would be alright but as I mentioned above about range, Jiyan would need to have released energy well over a 1000km in basically every direction to hit each cloud, but he doesn't as we see there are still clouds in the Earth's atmosphere and like I said his attack would not have been a horizontal shockwave.

Alternatives:

I've calced the feat using storm based calcs here getting us to 7b off the biggest tacet field and the original calc, although still following the issue, was recalced with only the smallest tacet field in mind still using KE getting H6C

 

[IStar0thh]

One more thing, at 0:30, we can see the Tacet Field cloud does indeed push the clouds away, but this entire fight happens within a couple of minutes. I'm not a geologist but I do know clouds don't travel hundreds of km in mere minutes. This is another inconsistency with the feat and shouldn't go unnoticed.

For the record, I’m not one of the verse’s Knowledgeable members—you should’ve asked one of them. I was only offering my interpretation. That said:

1. As far as I can tell, nothing in the material indicates the Tacet Field was created and the whole fight happened immediately afterward. By the time they reach the city everything is already devastated, and the Tacet Field’s creation is shown as a flashback when the character picks up the ball left by the child.

 

[Arkenis]

For the record, I’m not one of the verse’s Knowledgeable members—you should’ve asked one of them. I was only offering my interpretation. That said:

That's okay. You pointed out decent things and my points were issues I noticed overall about the feat, I just wanted to add your responses so it doesn't look like I ignored them.

 

[IStar0thh]

The most evident thing that shows he didn't disperse them, is the fact when Jiyan does his move, the way the clouds are removed, is akin to it being disintegrated rather than dispersed. Dispersal would be spreading them away, in an almost uniform circular formation like a raindrop does when it hits the surface of water.

I agree with you that it seems to disintegrate rather than disperse.

Additionally, I’d like to point out that this visual effect might also be related to the Inverted Sea. In addition to the clouds we see, the Tacet Field description also states:

“Tacet Fields are easily identifiable locations, featuring a sky of inverted seas and a deep cross-shaped Tacet Mark on the ground.”

There are different types of Tacet Fields, but the one shown in the trailer appears to be the standard version. So, besides the clouds, there’s also still water in the sky — essentially liquid suspended above.

I’d also like to note (and I know this might sound like a bit of a cop-out) that these phenomena completely distort all known physical laws, except for gravity. Because of that, many details lose conventional meaning — the laws of physics simply don’t apply anymore.

“As revealed in Chapter I: Act VIII – To the Shore’s End, The Lament disrupts the fundamental laws of physics, with gravity remaining the only consistent force.”

And again, I’m not a Knowledgeable member. Still, if the calculation is wrong, I hope someone corrects it so we don’t run into problems later

 

[Arkenis]

bump

 

[AlipheeseXIV]

I have nothing to say here regarding this because I'm not a calc member and know nothing about calcs, the most I can do is just bring this up to the person who made the calc.

 

[Arkenis]

I asked mods to get calc members for this so it can be looked at. Hopefully it can be resolved

 

[AlipheeseXIV]

If there's any questions regarding the lore behind stuff, since it seems the issue is interpretation of dispersal vs disintegrations vs whatever. Feel free to mention me by replying to one of the messages I sent ig.

 

[Jamesthetaker]

As the person who made the calc and is not knowledgeable in the verse, I tried to interpret the context of the clip based on my understanding.

The Tacet Fields are responsible for the abnormal state of the clouds. Jiyan then does his thing where he erases them.

Therefore, I assume that the size of the distortions visible at the end of the clips corresponds to the distance the clouds extend, and then I calculate the speed at which they vanish.

Furthermore, I did not calculate the force of the shockwave he released and assumed that it traveled thousands of kilometers horizontally to disperse the clouds. My understanding was that his shockwave had some sort of power that simply negated the Tacet Fields without causing any further destruction.

Also, I assumed that the clouds were stratocumulus, which have an average height of hundreds of meters at best.

Finally, I'd like to reiterate that the calc was based on my interpretation of what occurred in the clip, I only know that the Tacet Field is the primary cause of the abnormal clouds. If the OP claims that the calc does not align with the context of the verse lore or such, I have no problem with not using it, as it was done as a request.

 

[AlipheeseXIV]

I mean OP stated they don't play the game, so I don't think the issue is it not aligning with the verse lore. Appears to be the calc itself but, as I stated earlier I know absolutely nothing about calcs so I can't say much on that front specifically.

 

[Arkenis]

Furthermore, I did not calculate the force of the shockwave he released and assumed that it traveled thousands of kilometers horizontally to disperse the clouds. My understanding was that his shockwave had some sort of power that simply negated the Tacet Fields without causing any further destruction.

When I say force I'm talking about the energy needed to push the clouds. The way you're calcing would require him releasing energy to push the clouds. Negating something through pushing doesn't make sense. That's why I'm saying Jiyan would have to have done that since you combined the KE of every cloud which are definitely 1000km away from each other altogether.

Finally, I'd like to reiterate that the calc was based on my interpretation of what occurred in the clip, I only know that the Tacet Field is the primary cause of the abnormal clouds. If the OP claims that the calc does not align with the context of the verse lore or such, I have no problem with not using it, as it was done as a request.

Yeah I get that. I don't think you willingly ignored potential problems, the feat doesn't seem to have been explained maybe.

I mean OP stated they don't play the game, so I don't think the issue is it not aligning with the verse lore. Appears to be the calc itself but, as I stated earlier I know absolutely nothing about calcs so I can't say much on that front specifically.

Well you can explain the thing about the disintegration point. Jiyan's powers look more greenish and he doesn't control fire either. So what exactly is the blueish energy we see on the clouds after he defeated the

 

[AlipheeseXIV]

Okay, now that I'm done with fixing all the dead links on the wuwa pages I can actually fully read this. I will mostly ignore the strict calc stuff cuz as I said, idk anything about that.

Visuals:

So for starters, this calc is Jiyan's attack dispersing the clouds and yet when they clear up, we can still see other clouds around. And those close to the city are likely cumulus clouds.

This is because the clouds formed in the feat are created specifically by the Tacet Field, its definitely something you'd only know if you played the game. Another member brought that up, they are correct in their interpretation.

How could he release so much energy but somehow not effect clouds directly under the one's the Tacet Field made?

Not sure what you mean here, phenomena within Tacet Fields are entirely unrelated to phenomena outside of themselves.

 

[AlipheeseXIV]

Well you can explain the thing about the disintegration point. Jiyan's powers look more greenish and he doesn't control fire either. So what exactly is the blueish energy we see on the clouds

That's just a visual of the Tacet Field dispersing.

 

[AlipheeseXIV]

This is because the clouds formed in the feat are created specifically by the Tacet Field, its definitely something you'd only know if you played the game. Another member brought that up, they are correct in their interpretation.

Here is another feat of a weaker Tacet Field being formed. That is kinda just how they work in verse. They aren't related to the other clouds.

 

[Arkenis]

That's just a visual of the Tacet Field dispersing.

That isn't how dispersal would look. That looks like its disintegrating.

Here is another feat of a weaker Tacet Field being formed. That is kinda just how they work in verse. They aren't related to the other clouds.

This doesn't change what the issue is though. If he's releasing a massive shockwave of energy to move the clouds, he'd have moved all the clouds, not just the tacet field clouds.

 

[AlipheeseXIV]

That isn't how dispersal would look. That looks like its disintegrating.

I mean it has been referred to as dispersal in the game when a Tacet Field is destroyed, not sure how a space would "disintegrate" when it doesn't have the physical properties needed to do so. At least, not unless a verse makes it clear that's what's going on due to whatever fictional reason.

This doesn't change what the issue is though. If he's releasing a massive shockwave of energy to move the clouds, he'd have moved all the clouds, not just the tacet field clouds.

I'm pretty sure this still counts for something though? Tacet Fields are specifically stated to be alternate spaces, so I don't see why his shockwave of energy would move the clouds outside the Tacet Field when they are completely unrelated to the one's within it.

 

[Arkenis]

I mean it has been referred to as dispersal in the game when a Tacet Field is destroyed, not sure how a space would "disintegrate" when it doesn't have the physical properties needed to do so. At least, not unless a verse makes it clear that's what's going on due to whatever fictional reason.

They're factually wrong or the translation is wrong since the visuals don't show dispersal. And we aren't talking about the space itself being dispersed, we're talking about the clouds within it.

I'm pretty sure this still counts for something though? Tacet Fields are specifically stated to be alternate spaces, so I don't see why his shockwave of energy would move the clouds outside the Tacet Field when they are completely unrelated to the one's within it.

That could make sense but I don't think that changes the clouds still being there after it's over. The initial creation of the field pushed clouds away but when Jiyan beat the monster, the clouds are still there. I guess it could make sense if they took hours to get to the tacet field.

And of course there's still the issue of combining every KE. Either his shockwave wasn't inter-dimensional or it is which still presents an issue with the visuals.

 

[AlipheeseXIV]

They're factually wrong or the translation is wrong since the visuals don't show dispersal. And we aren't talking about the space itself being dispersed, we're talking about the clouds within it.

Its possible.

That could make sense but I don't think that changes the clouds still being there after it's over. The initial creation of the field pushed clouds away but when Jiyan beat the monster, the clouds are still there. I guess it could make sense if they took hours to get to the tacet field.

And of course there's still the issue of combining every KE. Either his shockwave wasn't inter-dimensional or it is which still presents an issue with the visuals.

Not sure exactly what you mean by the clouds still being there after its over, they clearly disperse shortly after his strike. If your issue is with the math itself, that's a different matter entirely.

 

[Arkenis]

Its possible.

Not sure exactly what you mean by the clouds still being there after its over, they clearly disperse shortly after his strike. If your issue is with the math itself, that's a different matter entirely.

The regular clouds. We see them after the dark ones go away. The only issue with the math is just combining the clouds ke, I'm still mainly focused on the clouds and the way they go away not reminiscent of what dispersal normally looks like.

 

[AlipheeseXIV]

The regular clouds. We see them after the dark ones go away. The only issue with the math is just combining the clouds ke, I'm still mainly focused on the clouds and the way they go away not reminiscent of what dispersal normally looks like.

I see, yeah probably best to mull it over with a calc member I guess. I can't really offer anything beyond lore based stuff and like in verse phenomena and whatnot.

 

[Jamesthetaker]

Anyway, now that I've stated my stance on the calc, I'll let you all discuss the problem and potential solutions.

If you need my assistance, just quote this post when needed.

 

[Arkenis]

bump

 

[IStar0thh]

The regular clouds. We see them after the dark ones go away. The only issue with the math is just combining the clouds ke, I'm still mainly focused on the clouds and the way they go away not reminiscent of what dispersal normally looks like.

Reading the latest posts, I don’t think there’s anything wrong with the calculations themselves. It doesn’t seem like he included the other clouds — just the ones generated by the Tacet Field, right? Most of the OP’s arguments have already been addressed.

That said, I still agree with you about the dispersion vs. disintegration part. It could just be a visual effect, though — if they had animated the dispersion in that scene, it might’ve looked a bit awkward.

Anyway, if we consider that he didn’t actually disperse but rather """destroyed""" the clouds, wouldn’t that require an even greater force?

 

[IStar0thh]

So for starters, this calc is Jiyan's attack dispersing the clouds and yet when they clear up, we can still see other clouds around. And those close to the city are likely cumulus clouds. The issue is, the calc gets 86 Teratons. That's a lot of force that Jiyan would have to output and would result in a massive aoe. Those cumulus clouds we see aren't hundreds of km in the air, just 200-2000m range.

To summarize my opinion so far:
This first point seems to have already been resolved. The clouds are generated by the Tacet Field, and the calc member mentioned he only used a range of a few hundred meters.

How could he release so much energy but somehow not effect clouds directly under the one's the Tacet Field made? That doesn't make sense unless his force only expanded horizontally, which doesn't follow physically even in the scene as we see when he slams on the ground he releases a big dome-like shockwave.

It also seems that the Tacet Field exists in a space separate from the normal world — or at least interacts with it differently — so Jiyan’s attack not reaching the other clouds doesn’t really seem like an issue to me.

One more thing, at 0:30, we can see the Tacet Field cloud does indeed push the clouds away, but this entire fight happens within a couple of minutes. I'm not a geologist but I do know clouds don't travel hundreds of km in mere minutes. This is another inconsistency with the feat and shouldn't go unnoticed.

As for this point, I mentioned earlier that we don’t know how much time passed between the creation of the Tacet Field and the start or end of the fight. Because of that, it’s hard to determine whether the clouds could have moved back to a certain position. We also don’t know if the energy pushed the clouds extremely far away or just beyond the initial explosion radius.

Do you still agree or disagree with the reasoning I presented? If there are any remaining inconsistencies, we can go over them point by point.

 

[Arkenis]

Reading the latest posts, I don’t think there’s anything wrong with the calculations themselves. It doesn’t seem like he included the other clouds — just the ones generated by the Tacet Field, right? Most of the OP’s arguments have already been addressed.

That said, I still agree with you about the dispersion vs. disintegration part. It could just be a visual effect, though — if they had animated the dispersion in that scene, it might’ve looked a bit awkward.

Anyway, if we consider that he didn’t actually disperse but rather """destroyed""" the clouds, wouldn’t that require an even greater force?

I'm still iffy on the idea the other clouds not being effected at all but I can see how tacet fields are different spaces make it a moot point. I would agree with destruction but we simply don't see that either, the clouds begin breaking apart from some light blue energy and then disappear seconds later without that effect. To me it doesn't even look like destruction, just looks like the tacet discord was beaten and the field destabilized due to that. Is there some proof that tacet fields are supposed to be physically destroyed through destroying their clouds?

And yes I think so, if we assume it was vaporized.

It also seems that the Tacet Field exists in a space separate from the normal world — or at least interacts with it differently — so Jiyan’s attack not reaching the other clouds doesn’t really seem like an issue to me.

No the issue still exist just now it's more about combining the results and assuming he dispersed all the clouds unless we're asserting he has inter-dimensional range and effected each of them via pushing them.

As for this point, I mentioned earlier that we don’t know how much time passed between the creation of the Tacet Field and the start or end of the fight. Because of that, it’s hard to determine whether the clouds could have moved back to a certain position. We also don’t know if the energy pushed the clouds extremely far away or just beyond the initial explosion radius.

That'd still make it hundreds of km since the tacet field clouds expanded that distance and would mean at least 3hrs passed before the resonators got there. Not very relevant atp.

Do you still agree or disagree with the reasoning I presented? If there are any remaining inconsistencies, we can go over them point by point.

• The visuals don't show dispersal.
• The calc combines the KE of every tacet field cloud as though he effected them all but from my understanding, the fields are different spaces and in the outer space view are hundreds of km away from each other.

 

[IStar0thh]

I'm still iffy on the idea the other clouds not being effected at all but I can see how tacet fields are different spaces make it a moot point. I would agree with destruction but we simply don't see that either, the clouds begin breaking apart from some light blue energy and then disappear seconds later without that effect. To me it doesn't even look like destruction, just looks like the tacet discord was beaten and the field destabilized due to that. Is there some proof that tacet fields are supposed to be physically destroyed through destroying their clouds?

And yes I think so, if we assume it was vaporized.

I think this point has already been addressed in the game. After Rover defeats the Crownless, the Tacet Field they were in doesn’t just vanish — it remains "active" as usual. The Tacet Field is only “destroyed” once Rover releases he's energy after absorbing the Crownless, affecting the entire region. So, to me, it makes sense that the one who actually closed the Tacet Field was Jiyan.
Minute 1:00 Rover vs Crownless

No the issue still exist just now it's more about combining the results and assuming he dispersed all the clouds unless we're asserting he has inter-dimensional range and effected each of them via pushing them.

That'd still make it hundreds of km since the tacet field clouds expanded that distance and would mean at least 3hrs passed before the resonators got there. Not very relevant atp.

• The visuals don't show dispersal.
• The calc combines the KE of every tacet field cloud as though he effected them all but from my understanding, the fields are different spaces and in the outer space view are hundreds of km away from each other.

But I don’t think he closed all of them at once — he probably traveled between each one and shut them down individually. I believe the calculation took that into account, though I’m not completely sure.

 

[Arkenis]

Minute 1:00 Rover vs Crownless

What's happening here? Why does the discord become see through and his hand gets pulled to it? That just looks like it's still alive, versus the discord in the other vid which crumbled away and that's what they do when dying.

But I don’t think he closed all of them at once — he probably traveled between each one and shut them down individually. I believe the calculation took that into account, though I’m not completely sure.

No look again. His supposed travel isn't included within the calc, the dispersal speed is what's calced. Also, doing that within a couple of seconds would contradict the fact they took time to get to the field in the first place. If that's at all implied that could be calced. Or are you saying each visual depiction is happening hours apart from one another? This would also affect the calc.

• Assuming he traveled to each one within the video's short timeframe would contradict them taking time to get to it initially.
• If he had traveled that could be calced.
• We'd still only scale him to each individual.

 

[AlipheeseXIV]

I'm still iffy on the idea the other clouds not being effected at all but I can see how tacet fields are different spaces make it a moot point. I would agree with destruction but we simply don't see that either, the clouds begin breaking apart from some light blue energy and then disappear seconds later without that effect. To me it doesn't even look like destruction, just looks like the tacet discord was beaten and the field destabilized due to that.

I mean that is entirely your own interpretation as someone who doesn't know about the verse, there is no "perfect" answer that will completely fit your logic for the feat. What happened on screen is just what it is, there's really nothing more to it.

Is there some proof that tacet fields are supposed to be physically destroyed through destroying their clouds?

No, the clouds are not the tacet fields themselves it's just a phenomena that occurs when tacet fields are formed. They are not the same.

No the issue still exist just now it's more about combining the results and assuming he dispersed all the clouds unless we're asserting he has inter-dimensional range and effected each of them via pushing them.

He does have inter-dimensional range, most characters who scale to Changli do. I haven't made her profile, so I have yet to actually add this to him and any other resonator that isn't some god tier.

That'd still make it hundreds of km since the tacet field clouds expanded that distance and would mean at least 3hrs passed before the resonators got there. Not very relevant atp.

Hm? How this is relevant to the calc? I can destroy a country and it wouldn't matter at all how long ago I got to the country I destroyed to get any relevant calcs pertaining to that, so why exactly is this relevant? I'm a little confused.

• The calc combines the KE of every tacet field cloud as though he effected them all but from my understanding, the fields are different spaces and in the outer space view are hundreds of km away from each other.

Ah, okay I see what your issue is now. I can understand the skepticism with this, however the fact is they were only "destroyed" or "dispersed" or "disintegrated" whatever word we want to use. After, Jiyan performed the strike. I've already stated he does in fact have interdimensional range, I can even prove this to you if that'd further satisfy your skepticism. It'd be pretty incoherent and just...kinda weird to argue that the other tacet fields were just...destroyed or whatever, by someone else? Or, that they just...randomly stopped functioning as that goes against not only the trailer but the entire lore on tacet fields. However yeah, I can totally empathize with you on that front.

 

[IStar0thh]

What's happening here? Why does the discord become see through and his hand gets pulled to it? That just looks like it's still alive, versus the discord in the other vid which crumbled away and that's what they do when dying.

When a Tacet Discord dies, it can leave an Echo behind, which Rover simply absorbed. This is the game’s introduction, so if you play, you’ll get it from the very beginning.

No look again. His supposed travel isn't included within the calc, the dispersal speed is what's calced. Also, doing that within a couple of seconds would contradict the fact they took time to get to the field in the first place. If that's at all implied that could be calced. Or are you saying each visual depiction is happening hours apart from one another? This would also affect the calc.

• Assuming he traveled to each one within the video's short timeframe would contradict them taking time to get to it initially.
• If he had traveled that could be calced.
• We'd still only scale him to each individual.

I don’t think his traveling to each of them contradicts the fact that we don’t know how much time passed between his arrival and the creation of the Tacet Field. There are countless variables in this equation that could have simply prevented them from reaching it in time.

That said, you’re right that the overall calculation would change in this case. As for whether Jiyan has inter-dimensional range, I’m not sure, so I won’t comment on that specific point.

 

[IStar0thh]

After, Jiyan performed the strike. I've already stated he does in fact have interdimensional range, I can even prove this to you if that'd further satisfy your skepticism.

It would be great if you could share this information here — I think it would cover most of the topic.

 

[Arkenis]

I mean that is entirely your own interpretation as someone who doesn't know about the verse, there is no "perfect" answer that will completely fit your logic for the feat. What happened on screen is just what it is, there's really nothing more to it.

It does matter? If the visuals don't show dispersal then it's not right to say it is that but "lol it just looks different"

He does have inter-dimensional range, most characters who scale to Changli do. I haven't made her profile, so I have yet to actually add this to him and any other resonator that isn't some god tier.

inter-dimensional range to send their energy cross dimensions?

Hm? How this is relevant to the calc? I can destroy a country and it wouldn't matter at all how long ago I got to the country I destroyed to get any relevant calcs pertaining to that, so why exactly is this relevant? I'm a little confused.

I said "not relevant atp" why respond...

Ah, okay I see what your issue is now. I can understand the skepticism with this, however the fact is they were only "destroyed" or "dispersed" or "disintegrated" whatever word we want to use. After, Jiyan performed the strike. I've already stated he does in fact have interdimensional range, I can even prove this to you if that'd further satisfy your skepticism. It'd be pretty incoherent and just...kinda weird to argue that the other tacet fields were just...destroyed or whatever, by someone else? Or, that they just...randomly stopped functioning as that goes against not only the trailer but the entire lore on tacet fields. However yeah, I can totally empathize with you on that front.

The feat matters, the words used have to match what we see so we know exactly what we're calcing. Fiction can often get even basic descriptives/concepts wrong after all. Yeah that'd be good to see what you mean by inter-dimensional. It'd be weird to argue anything for it, that's kinda why I made this crt since it doesn't resemble cloud KE calcs.

When a Tacet Discord dies, it can leave an Echo behind, which Rover simply absorbed. This is the game’s introduction, so if you play, you’ll get it from the very beginning.

Pretty sure it's not Rover absorbing it, it's something inside him and why can't him absorbing it's echo be what got rid of the field? Even in this case, it doesn't look like Rover's absorption shockwave dispersed the clouds, looks like they disappear along with the dimension.

 

[AlipheeseXIV]

It does matter? If the visuals don't show dispersal then it's not right to say it is that but "lol it just looks different"

??? I never said it didn't matter, I just stated that at the end of the day as someone who's ignorant on the verse your opinion and interpretations would naturally differ.

inter-dimensional range to send their energy cross dimensions?

Yeah.

I said "not relevant atp" why respond...

Well you still mentioned it anyways, so it seems it may have had some level of relevance in spite of what you said but that's fine. We can ignore that.

The feat matters, the words used have to match what we see so we know exactly what we're calcing. Fiction can often get even basic descriptives/concepts wrong after all.

True, but at the end of the day depending on how it's shown there are very little visual differences between something like dispersal, destruction, or disintegration at these levels. You would not be able to tell the immediate difference between the two with visuals alone, the calc was done by James who interpreted it as "dispersal" whether it's actually "destruction" or "disintegration" is kind of a minor thing I feel (especially when destruction or disintegration would just yield greater energy for the feat) because there is no direct statement. The crux of the issue here seems to be you disagreeing with Jiyan scaling to all the tacet fields right?

Yeah that'd be good to see what you mean by inter-dimensional. It'd be weird to argue anything for it, that's kinda why I made this crt since it doesn't resemble cloud KE calcs.

Changli can break out of Sonoro Sphere's through sheer force, Sonoro Spheres are transdimensional/alternate spaces.

Pretty sure it's not Rover absorbing it it's something inside him and why can't him absorbing it's echo be what got rid of the field? Even in this case, it doesn't look like Rover's absorption shockwave dispersed the clouds, looks like they disappear along with the dimension.

It is 100% Rover absorbing it, regardless, I think this is a little off topic from the current point which has to do with Jiyan specifically.

 

[IStar0thh]

Pretty sure it's not Rover absorbing it, it's something inside him and why can't him absorbing it's echo be what got rid of the field? Even in this case, it doesn't look like Rover's absorption shockwave dispersed the clouds, looks like they disappear along with the dimension.

The thing you’re referring to is Abby — Rover’s pet. If you’re suggesting that it was the entity that absorbed Crownless through Rover’s Taced Mark, that’s fine. However, there’s no in-game evidence linking the absorption of an Echo to the closing of a Taced Field; it’s simply never stated — at least as far as I can remember.

I also disagree with the claim that

“it doesn’t look like Rover’s absorption shockwave dispersed the clouds; it looks like they disappeared along with the dimension.”

You can clearly see the energy spreading right after the absorption.
Rover and Jiyan scenes actually complement each other in this case, making it far more likely that they were the ones responsible.

1. The clouds don’t just vanish out of nowhere — when Rover defeated Crownless, they were still visible.

2. It couldn’t have been caused solely by absorption, since Jiyan didn’t absorb any Echoes to close the Taced Field.

Taken together, these points strongly suggest that both characters used their energy to disperse the clouds.

 

[Arkenis]

??? I never said it didn't matter, I just stated that at the end of the day as someone who's ignorant on the verse your opinion and interpretations would naturally differ.

My interpretation isn't something complex, that's why I'm saying it matters because its a simple observation. And I'm barely ignorant at this point, I've watched a couple walkthroughs, I've read up on what tacet fields are. If there's something missing for what they are and how they're stopped could you show it?

True, but at the end of the day depending on how it's shown there are very little visual differences between something like dispersal, destruction, or disintegration at these levels. You would not be able to tell the immediate difference between the two with visuals alone, the calc was done by James who interpreted it as "dispersal" whether it's actually "destruction" or "disintegration" is kind of a minor thing I feel (especially when destruction or disintegration would just yield greater energy for the feat) because there is no direct statement. The crux of the issue here seems to be you disagreeing with Jiyan scaling to all the tacet fields right?

Yeah you would. This would be omnidirectional dispersion meaning we'd see a uniform pushing of the clouds, this doesn't show that. Instead, it shows the clouds breaking apart. It doesn't matter if it yields something greater or less, the whole point is for the calc to be accurately done. That's not the crux, that's just something I noticed while making this crt. And we wouldn't even qualify calcing disintegration if it's doing that because the discord was defeated, not because Jiyan's attack did it.

Changli can break out of Sonoro Sphere's through sheer force, Sonoro Spheres are transdimensional/alternate spaces.

That isn't inter-dimensional. That says he burned it from the inside. Is there some scene of the burning getting through the space? And still, I feel like this idea he inter-dimensional effected all the tacet fields with his attack being him specifically targeting the discord sounds unlikely, but I would like to know if there's more evidence on this.

The thing you’re referring to is Abby — Rover’s pet. If you’re suggesting that it was the entity that absorbed Crownless through Rover’s Taced Mark, that’s fine. However, there’s no in-game evidence linking the absorption of an Echo to the closing of a Taced Field; it’s simply never stated — at least as far as I can remember.

I'm not saying the specific action of absorption is what did it. I am saying getting rid of the discord's echo is what got rid of the field since they happen right after the other.

You can clearly see the energy spreading right after the absorption.
Rover and Jiyan scenes actually complement each other in this case, making it far more likely that they were the ones responsible.

The energy doesn't spread to the sky, it disappears no more than a couple meters from Rover.

Lastly, KE calcs get heavy scrutiny for not representing destruction comparable to the result. I don't see why Jiyan's feat wouldn't fall under this, but I'll wait for cgm to respond on this point.

 

[AlipheeseXIV]

My interpretation isn't something complex, that's why I'm saying it matters because its a simple observation. And I'm barely ignorant at this point, I've watched a couple walkthroughs, I've read up on what tacet fields are.

Since when does watching a couple videos and reading up a bit on a subject suddenly mean you don't still lack knowledge on said subject?

If there's something missing for what they are and how they're stopped could you show it?

Depends on what you're looking for, you'd have to be specific.

Yeah you would. This would be omnidirectional dispersion meaning we'd see a uniform pushing of the clouds, this doesn't show that. Instead, it shows the clouds breaking apart.

You're still focusing on the clouds from outside the field?

It doesn't matter if it yields something greater or less, the whole point is for the calc to be accurately done.

I'm just kind of confused why you're mentioning the calc being "accurately done" when it doesn't really seem like you have anymore of an idea of what this hypothetical "accurate way" would be, and unless I'm mistaken feel free to correct me if I'm wrong. You haven't mentioned what this "accurate way" would be yet.

And we wouldn't even qualify calcing disintegration if it's doing that because the discord was defeated, not because Jiyan's attack did it.

Have no idea what the TD being defeated has to do with the feat displayed, it's not an integral factor of the calc at all.

That isn't inter-dimensional. That says he burned it from the inside. Is there some scene of the burning getting through the space?

What? You cannot destroy an alternate space without having equivalent range needed to do so, that's like saying in order for an attack to have universal range it needs to be able to affect outside the universe, how does that make sense?

And still, I feel like this idea he inter-dimensional effected all the tacet fields with his attack being him specifically targeting the discord sounds unlikely, but I would like to know if there's more evidence on this.

That is your opinion, it is far more unlikely that he didn't do this because the feat itself directly shows and implies this. No, there isn't more evidence than what was shown during the feat, it just seems like this is going to spiral into a pointless back and forth of "I feel like" so let's cut to the chase. You disagree with the feat, okay. What is your proposal then?

 

[Arkenis]

You're still focusing on the clouds from outside the field?

No...

I'm just kind of confused why you're mentioning the calc being "accurately done" when it doesn't really seem like you have anymore of an idea of what this hypothetical "accurate way" would be, and unless I'm mistaken feel free to correct me if I'm wrong. You haven't mentioned what this "accurate way" would be yet.

That's a general statement. It is not about this because I don't believe a feat was even done here.

Have no idea what the TD being defeated has to do with the feat displayed, it's not an integral factor of the calc at all.

And I'm saying it is because so far that's the main factor in both events. Jiyan destroys the discord and the clouds disintegrate. Rover absorbs the discords echo and clouds disappear.

What? You cannot destroy an alternate space without having equivalent range needed to do so, that's like saying in order for an attack to have universal range it needs to be able to affect outside the universe, how does that make sense?

Inter-dimensional is reaching into other dimensions, not about range. This feat says he burned it from the inside. Are you saying he was outside it and burned it from the inside? If you are then show that, otherwise the statement reads to me he was inside.

That is your opinion, it is far more unlikely that he didn't do this because the feat itself directly shows and implies this. No, there isn't more evidence than what was shown during the feat, it just seems like this is going to spiral into a pointless back and forth of "I feel like" so let's cut to the chase. You disagree with the feat, okay. What is your proposal then?

That's what crts usually are about, disagreement and interpretation. I don't think anything is likely here. My proposal is to drop the idea he did anything to the clouds and find another feat to scale them off like calc the fields creation of the clouds or calc the ke of the clouds being made and if people can scale to fields then make that the calc they scale to.

 

[IStar0thh]

I'm not saying the specific action of absorption is what did it. I am saying getting rid of the discord's echo is what got rid of the field since they happen right after the other.

The energy doesn't spread to the sky, it disappears no more than a couple meters from Rover.

But there’s no information in the game stating that absorbing an Echo ends a Taced Field — what you’re saying is pure speculation. Even from a gameplay perspective, Taced Fields end regardless of whether you absorb the dropped Echo or not.

You’ll need to provide evidence for that claim; otherwise, I’m sticking with what the game actually shows — which, in this case, is Rover’s energy spreading across and the clouds clearing. And yes, the energy expands in all directions; if you pause right before this frame, you can clearly see it forming a dome shape.

And I'm saying it is because so far that's the main factor in both events. Jiyan destroys the discord and the clouds disintegrate. Rover absorbs the discords echo and clouds disappear.

What you’re describing are two entirely different situations. An Echo isn’t something "“alive”" like a Tacet Discord — the two cases operate under completely different conditions. You’ll need to show evidence for your claim.

Again, from a gameplay standpoint, it would make more sense to argue that Tacet Fields end after defeating the enemy, since they also have a dormant period. If Rover hadn’t absorbed the Crownless, the Tacet Field would’ve likely closed naturally over time — but as shown in the cutscene, that process isn’t instantaneous or even particularly fast.

In both Rover’s and Jiyan’s cases, the clouds only disappeared after they took specific actions — both involving a clear release of energy.

That's what crts usually are about, disagreement and interpretation. I don't think anything is likely here. My proposal is to drop the idea he did anything to the clouds and find another feat to scale them off like calc the fields creation of the clouds or calc the ke of the clouds being made and if people can scale to fields then make that the calc they scale to.

I agree that CRT is the right place for this. I’d just like you to provide in-game evidence supporting your claims. At best I can accept that the calculation might change if you factor in the time Jiyan needed to close each field. However, your assertion that the Tacet Field wasn’t closed by Jiyan lacks solid support — the Rover scene actually undermines that claim. Even using the (imprecise) game mechanics, the correlation you propose still doesn’t add up.

 

[Arkenis]

You’ll need to provide evidence for that claim; otherwise, I’m sticking with what the game actually shows — which, in this case, is Rover’s energy spreading across and the clouds clearing. And yes, the energy expands in all directions; if you pause right before this frame, you can clearly see it forming a dome shape.

And if you look just after, we don't see it even hit the clouds.

What you’re describing are two entirely different situations. An Echo isn’t something "“alive”" like a Tacet Discord — the two cases operate under completely different conditions. You’ll need to show evidence for your claim.

You're misunderstanding my point, idc if its alive or dead. The conditions I'm asserting, since it's what we see: discord goes away -> field goes away.

I agree that CRT is the right place for this. I’d just like you to provide in-game evidence supporting your claims. At best I can accept that the calculation might change if you factor in the time Jiyan needed to close each field. However, your assertion that the Tacet Field wasn’t closed by Jiyan lacks solid support — the Rover scene actually undermines that claim. Even using the (imprecise) game mechanics, the correlation you propose still doesn’t add up.

The clear fact that when Jiyan attacked, the cloud wasn’t pushed away but disintegrated, contradicts the idea that it was dispersed.

So to clarify for when a mod comes in and I'll wait until a mod comes:

1. There is no clear indication that Jiyan pushed the tacet clouds with his energy, we in fact do not see Jiyan's energy push anything, what we see is the disintegration of the tacet clouds and then it fades away it. Rover's example is exactly the same, his absorption explodes, and the tacet clouds disappear, they aren't pushed.

2. The KE gotten from this calc does not show destruction comparable to the tier and thus should fall under the same scrutiny other KE feats have. For clarification if this is not understood: Jiyan's calc asserts he pushed the clouds, if you watch the video Jiyan does not attack the clouds, he attacks the discord on the ground and releases a shockwave from it. This shockwave, if it truly was capable of causing clouds hundreds of km wide to be pushed at mhs speeds, we'd see more than just wind being blown away, but we do not.

3. There is an assumption made that in the last moments of the video, Jiyan is the one who got rid of all the tacet fields we see, this requires us to assert he did so through his energy with inter-dimensional range and my contention is, like most of the feat, visuals don't demonstrate such a claim. A supporter provided evidence of inter-dimensional range but it's from another character destroying a sonoro sphere.

 

[AlipheeseXIV]

That's a general statement. It is not about this because I don't believe a feat was even done here.

...Okay bro..."I don't think you're making a point" I guess there's no reason to continue this CRT then.

And I'm saying it is because so far that's the main factor in both events. Jiyan destroys the discord and the clouds disintegrate. Rover absorbs the discords echo and clouds disappear.

No, that's your assumption and said assumption is false. TD's are not the source of tacet fields, they are a product of it yes but they are not the same. The only exception is TDs at or above overlord class level, such as Crownless with Rover because it quite literally is above an overlord class TD. You are completely wrong to apply that logic to the random, elite class TD in the case of Jiyan.

Inter-dimensional is reaching into other dimensions, not about range.

Ah yes...then I guess planetary AP is not about destroying planets but breaking them, like what are we saying dawg? Reaching into other dimensions is a RANGE feat??? Hello???

This feat says he burned it from the inside. Are you saying he was outside it and burned it from the inside? If you are then show that, otherwise the statement reads to me he was inside.

She* not he, secondly her attack would have needed to pierce outside the scope of the sonoro sphere in order to escape it otherwise she would not have affected it. Even then, there are far more feats that prove this such as frequencies just naturally being able to reach outside of other Sonoro's, and the real world itself like Cartethyia's sliver of frequency.

That's what crts usually are about, disagreement and interpretation. I don't think anything is likely here. My proposal is to drop the idea he did anything to the clouds and find another feat to scale them off like calc the fields creation of the clouds or calc the ke of the clouds being made and if people can scale to fields then make that the calc they scale to.

Ok, then I am asking specifically how do you propose we do that? Because that is not clear in the slightest, what formation of cloud? Exactly where in the video time stamp? Should it be calced via dispersal, destruction, or disintegration? You haven't offered any of this information, yet you're critiquing the existing calc for these exact points.

 

[IStar0thh]

And if you look just after, we don't see it even hit the clouds.

Bro...

You're misunderstanding my point, idc if its alive or dead. The conditions I'm asserting, since it's what we see: discord goes away -> field goes away.

Yeah — you need to prove that. If I take your assumption, I’ll be contradicting what the game actually shows. So should I trust your speculation or the footage? If you can provide evidence that links a Tacet Discord’s Echo to the closing of a Tacet Field, I’ll agree — otherwise, no. A Tacet Discord and an Echo from a Tacet Discord are different things.

1. There is no clear indication that Jiyan pushed the tacet clouds with his energy, we in fact do not see Jiyan's energy push anything, what we see is the disintegration of the tacet clouds and then it fades away it. Rover's example is exactly the same, his absorption explodes, and the tacet clouds disappear, they aren't pushed.

If you don’t think it was dispersion, then what do you think it was? Because again, saying that Jiyan or Rover didn’t remove the clouds makes no sense based on the reasoning you’ve presented.