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the entire point of garou killing genos was to cause an upsurge of emotions to make saitama use his full strength
that's quite definitively when the graph would start
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Yes, it is the Power Graph chart calculation
- Thread starter HammerStrikes219
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that's quite definitively when the graph would start
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It most cases it is shown
Yes they are at the explosion source, but that does not matter as said explosion source is outside of their bodies and the force of it is shared between both of them. Nobody scales people who clash with other people to two times their own AP in Dura which is the same case as what you are trying to argue
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It also from Garou fighting Saitama.
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saitama wasn't going all out until genos died, that was when the first serious punch happened
what are you trying to say
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- #85
Don’t forget Garou also stated he wanted to draw out the full strength of Saitama while trying to defeat him.
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yes
that was the s t a r t o f t h e f i g h t
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- #87
I saying that Saitama’s accelerated development/RPL kick in because of him fighting a opponent and after Geno’s death. My wording is because of “Not just Geno’s death”.
As a reminder, it didn’t say he was angered. Just that a massive surge of emotions occurred because of the fact he was fighting against Garou. Someone was arguably comparable to him even though Garou was getting destroyed during their fight.
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And the damage to the ground in most cases where it doesn't involve craters, is often shown to be way too miniscule compared to the actual explosion radius itself.
Except they are not punching against someone else, they are punching into each other. Garou would need to not only survive Saitama's punch but also the recoil of his own punch that he's trying to dish out to cancel out Saitama, and vice versa.
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Yeah explosions are much bigger then the craters that they form
They are clashing here. They don’t multiply their durability 2x their feat because they are clashing
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That Graph doesn't satisfy most of the Graphing Standards.
- Titles/Captions
- Any graph should be labeled with a short self-explanatory title.
- Axes.
- Both the horizontal and the vertical axis should be labeled with variable names and units. The major values should be clearly labeled with a meaningful numbering system (e.g. 1-2-5). The dependent variable should be plotted on the vertical axis and the independent variable on the horizontal axis.
- Origin.
- The origin should be zero. If the scaling of any axis prohibits the inclusion of the origin, a broken axis should indicate the offset from the origin.
- Error Bars.
- If the uncertainty of a parameter is known, it should be represented by an error bar.
- Size and Clarity.
- The range of the axes should be assigned such that most of the data (or the region of interest) occupies the whole graph.
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This doesn’t even begin to address the argument in support of the graph as well as how this standard has many things that don’t relate to the graph by Murata in the slightest.
—First the titles are not needed for the graph since it’s explicitly noted what each axis is representing. (Power and time)
— As discussed many times, units do not play a factor into the graph multiplier. You can plug in any units you want and the multiplier remains the same.
— The origin, or zero starting point, is the Saitama and Garou from SP^2
— Why in gods name are error bars important for this graph that Murata made specifically to depict the exponential increase in Saitama’s power in comparison to Garou.
— The size and clarity are perfectly fine for depicting the multiplier they received.
— The size and clarity are perfectly fine for depicting the multiplier they received.
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- #94
The thing is. I not sure if it is zero necessarily as it definitely not at zero during their fight, but that is a requirement anyway.
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No as that would violate the first law of thermodynamics making them both have the full force the the explosion hitting them
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? What do you mean? The graph is representative of Saitama’s expedient growth due to an uptake in emotions from Genos’ death and the subsequent fight that follows. Thus since the SP^2 happened at the very beginning of that emotional burst, the points that follow are how much stronger Saitama got after that point on. This is supported by how Garou and Saitama are each on the same point at the beginning, which is exactly what happened for the SP^2.
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- #97
I was thinking of what the initial value they start at, but it isn’t that important for now
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it's newton's third law dude, this isn't even debtable
the punches that caused the explosion directly collided and neither fist was hurt. Ez
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Anyways, graph gets accepted when? there's actually 0 opposition to the graph rn, since the main opponent just said 1 sentence about it not having units, and got debunked instantly
I'd say this is fairly non-controversial.
I'd say this is fairly non-controversial.
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Recoil dude.
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Logically, characters capable of physically achieving a certain degree of energy output, must be able to at least withstand a comparable amount of damage, or their bodies would break apart from the strain and automatic counterforce, whenever they exert themselves.
wiki standards, so this isn't really worth discussing anyways
wiki standards, so this isn't really worth discussing anyways
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- #103
Tbf, recoil doesn’t have to go by multiplers too.
Anyway, just neutral overall.
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Recoil would be dura, then it goes around the circle of trading blows and damaging each other without clashing fists, and then the graph multiplier kicks in.
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- #105
The graph multiplers was after the feat and was referring to Saitama’s RPL outpacing Garou’s RPl. Both of them anyway.
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Yeah that's what I was talking about.
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- #107
Ah, okay. Welp, at least it doesn’t get needlessly over complicated like doing formula for a building’s weight.
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This goes wildly against our standards for multipliers.
An image such as a graph is, in fact, not a statement. I would consider stated power levels to be far more worthy of being considered a statement than this. I have no clue how y'all can read "Multipliers come from direct statements instead of being reasoned from something else" and argue "Okay but it's in the story so it's pretty much a statement" without being aware that you're just trying to create a loophole.
Far stronger statements, such as "Were we to rate a vampire's offenses at a hundred, our defenses are capped between ten and twenty" have been dismissed due to being imprecise and demonstrative.
An image such as a graph is, in fact, not a statement. I would consider stated power levels to be far more worthy of being considered a statement than this. I have no clue how y'all can read "Multipliers come from direct statements instead of being reasoned from something else" and argue "Okay but it's in the story so it's pretty much a statement" without being aware that you're just trying to create a loophole.
Far stronger statements, such as "Were we to rate a vampire's offenses at a hundred, our defenses are capped between ten and twenty" have been dismissed due to being imprecise and demonstrative.
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Perhaps ,Y-axis should be power by logic
However ,perhaps the problem lies in the X-axis ,The graph does not begin from the origin (i.e the point of intersection of X and Y axis ),instead it begins somewhere from negative x-axis as seen on the bottom left part of the graph which questions its validity , Considering X-axis to be time is an assumption which is contridictory as time cannot be negative.
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- #111
Tbf, according to that thread, the 10x multipliers seems to being accepted while 5x multipliers was rejected.
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10x was accepted from another statement (the character, when they performed a certain feat, was not even a tenth as strong as they were at full power), while the 5x one based on the statement I brought up was rejected, for the reasons I gave.
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- #113
Yeah, that is from a different verse too. We going by in verse statements anyway as well. Not sure if it is compared to one verse to another like that way.
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Talking about the specifics of another verse is derailing. I've already commented about the relevance to how I evaluate this OPM statement. But we can continue discussion about the rest on your wall.
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- #115
This also mentioned by DonTalk as well.
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No, not really. The dotted points are entirely on the positive x-axis which is again representative of Saitama and his explosive increase in power from the emotional burst. From then on the graph clearly shows the rise from that stagnated point.
A lot of the opposition to this seems entirely based on minute or standards not related to how the graph multiplier is being determined or used. It’s validity is perfectly legit considering all the various statements surrounding what the graph represents and it’s demonstration of the clear exponential rise in Saitama’s growth.
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Yeah Recoil does not multiply it
You are basically saying that the force they take is more then they put out.
Also recoil isn’t actually fully equal to the force of a punch
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Yes but that does not make them take the full explosion value each as that is coming up with energy out of nothing
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Ok.
That's a reasonable point.
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It's not just his fist's recoil in the mix, it's Saitama's punch in the mix as well.
Garou's dura: Recoil of his own punch + Saitama's punch
Saitama's dura: Recoil of his own punch + Garou's punch
It's comparable to the point where the difference is negligible so there's that.
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