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Diavolo is Giorno, Giorno is Diavolo

Eficiente

Eficiente

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Continuation from this mostly done thread.

GER should have Time Manip due to reversing time, that seems self-explanatory to me. King Crimso should have Causality Manip due to canceling and erasing the cause of everyone's actions with his power, he doesn't just erasure time as doing that wouldn't kill the cause of something while also leaving everyone unable to realize what just happened.

He should also have Nonexistent Physiology, only for everything that isn't Diavolo during the erasured time. Diavolo never attacked anyone during this, merely doing stuff like throwing blood at them, so no ability to touch nonexistent beings for anyone.

Bruno should have Deconstruction, and Spatial Manipulation as when he separates something and makes it moldable it is still as concrete as it was before.

From the other thread, Heaven DIO should have Biological Manip, Technological Manip and resistance to mind manip (here and here)
 
If Diavolo is able to move within his own time erasure, would that give him Infinite speed only within erased time?
 
DragonEmperor23 said:
I don't get the Nonexistent reasoning.
Click to expand...
During the erasured time everything is erased yet still functional, with everyone being unable to modify anything as their actions are meaningless. Diavolo being unable to interact with others also helps them have the power.
 
The point on the Nonexistent Physiology part is that we don't need to say "Diavolo can't attack others during the erasured time" or "during the erasured time no one can.. [...]", there is a power applied to everyone that generates that, which we should list.

DragonEmperor23 said:
So what's the difference between that and giving people infinite speed via timestop?
Click to expand...
And that's why I wanted to downgrade GER in the other thread. One of this days I will do it.
 
https://imgur.com/a/kVv0TfY

To avoid confusion, the past Bruno is the one with Nonexistent Physiology. Future Bruno seeing it and getting confused reinforces the relevance of this, even if it was a one time thing.
 
 
  • Kira should have Limited Acausality (Type 1) due to keeping his memories in the activation of BtD, meaning when he killed Hayato and what he was aiming to do in the end of DiU. We know it's not time travel.
 
From what I've understood from that chapter, it's because when he told his identity to that woman, he planned to use BtD on himself

... Which is weird, because as far as I remember, Kira says that BtD can't be used on Stand Users.
 
TriforcePower1 said:
Ehm, doesn't Kira say that he doesn't keep his memories when he talks to Hayato in the BtD arc?
Click to expand...
When time resets by someone trying to know Kira's identity, yes. When initially used, going by feats, no. Even in games it's like this.
 
I...honestly don't know about the mechanics behind those powers to properly assess this, but pretty sure that this wouldn't be nonexistent physiology. Just a limit of his power (in the same but not really same vein of people unable to interact with stuff in stopped time).
 
I don't think that it should have Nonexistent Physiology, yeah. It's just a limit of its powers; it's weird, but it's misleading and inaccurate to describe it as such.

Kira should definitely not have Acausality. It's a function of Bites the Dust when it is first implanted in a host and manually activated; this much is clear.
 
If Kira doesn't have Limited Acausality then he should have an annotation somewhere saying that he can keep his memories under those circumstances.

For the Nonexistent Physiology, it's not just Diavolo not being able to touch them, they themselves exist (being able to move and think) and they do so within erased time and causality, with no one remembering themselves after the erased time. If a character were able to always exist like this, would it not have Nonexistent Physiology?
 
Yeah, but they don't always exist like that, and the only reason it operates like that is because of the nature of Diavolo's abilities.
 
As point out above, Diavolo took advantage of this via the past Bruno attacking the future Bruno (no damage, but it left confusion on him), that's like saying that a character that can turn others intangible for brief periods of time should not have Intangibility in his P&A, written in some way.
 
Except those are just forecasted images.

I'm happy with adjusting Epitaph's description and changing Diavolo's durability. I dislike the current durability scaling anyways, and I don't think King Crimson should be Building level+ either.

That is not adhesivity though, that's just King Crimson grabbing onto the wall. That's not how it works. Does anyone who lifts themself up a wall by grabbing into dents that form handholds have adhesivity?
 
For adhesivity, I initially saw Knuckles having it via not natural adhesivity, so proposed Bowser having that and it was accepted. I'm doing the same here, it would be good to have a note in the adhesivity page saying if we accept this kind of stuff or not.
 
I really disagree with that. Digging in your claws or your weird knuckle spikes is not adhesivity. There is no adhesion.
 
For the durability King Crimson took some hits from Sticky Fingers (which he erased but survived) so the Stand itself should be Building level there.

Promestein said:
I really disagree with that. Digging in your claws or your weird knuckle spikes is not adhesivity. There is no adhesion.
Click to expand...
It should honestly have a name like Wall Crawling, "adhesivity" is a very specific and useless power.
 
That'd be more acceptable, yeah.
 
I'm fine with removing both of that.
 
Nero comes from tanking 2 barages from Aerosmith. He doesn't have a stand body or anything to protect him, and it was with killing intent that he got hit both times. You cannot really write that off
 
Both of which successfully damaged his body. The first one alone would have killed him eventually, his dura is << Aerosmith's AP...which in turn is also wrong.
 
Yeah, I don't see the issue with back scaling. Dying from bleeding out isn't the same as just straight up not tanking an attack. What do you mean Aerosmith's AP is wrong?
 
About the "Diavolo can't interact with guys in Erased Time", doesn't he kidnap Trish and kill Narancia in erased time?
 
He also cuts the hand of a street fortune teller but all this cases are unclear and he could have use his speed to take advantage of the confusion his powers generates.

Iapitus The Impaler said:
Yeah, I don't see the issue with back scaling. Dying from bleeding out isn't the same as just straight up not tanking an attack. What do you mean Aerosmith's AP is wrong?
Click to expand...
Right now, damaging Diavolo wouldn't be Building level. Without that, I think we agree on not scaling AP from Stand users' durability. And even without that, his feat is having his target dodging his attack, which is not a feat, especially not when Diavolo's using that to attack other.
 
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