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Puella Magi AP Revision (Continued)

Kaltias

Kaltias

VS Battles
Retired
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Making a new thread because no one is really paying attention to the old one anymore (And because i want to discuss another thing).

Suzune's tiering
It's stated by Kyubey twice that both Suzune and Kagari are far more powerful than the average magical girl, to the point where Kyubey is fine allowing Kagari's plan which includes killing multiple magical girls, only to collect her energy.

While i honestly don't think that this put them on the level of Mami, given that Kyubey says that he met quite a lot of girls who are stronger than them, they should still be more than capable of taking out witches on Oktavia's level (Considering that Suzune consuming all her magical power killed Kagari's witch form, who is definitely leagues above Oktavia)

TL;DR: Suzune should be "At least City level". Durability as well, as she survived attacks from a boosted Arisa, who could overpower her attacks, and from Kagari.

Stuff left to discuss from the old thread
Thread here for reference.

Mami and Elisa's tiering.
Elisa one shot a witch who can tank attacks from Tart.

Tart one shot Lapin's witch form.

Lapin's witch form can likely tank her own attacks due to witches generally not being glass cannons.

Lapin's witch form is vastly above her magical girl self who is either 7-B+ or 7-A.

Given that it requires a bit of assumptions, i'd propose "At least Mountain level+, possibly higher", the problem is that i' not sure how to implement it without turning Mami's Magia Record key into a mess :\

Tamura's 6-C durability feat.

IMG 1627
IMG 1628
Tamura tanks an explosion that kills Walpurgisnacht.

While she wasn't standing near the epicenter, Madoka hasn't exactly shrugged off the explosion, so maybe "Possibly 6-C" or something
 
>Implying that the wiki isn't constantly busy with DB threads
 
Well, to please you, I'm going to participate in this thread:

  • About Tamura:
I do not know the context of the manga but I feel that this is somehow a comic scene so it's not 100% legit (say me if I'm wrong huh)

  • About Lapin
Firstly I'm glad that PMverse uses French names (rabbit, jeanne d'arc ...) Second, Mountain + is not necessary in my opinion, At least Mountain - likely far higher is already cool.

The rest seems ok
 
1) I mean, Tamura's entire manga is a comedy.

2) It happens when they live in France lol.

I dunno about the +, but it's basically the same reason why Ryuko is Mountain+, so.

Lapin herself stays as she is btw, it only affects Mami and Elisa
 
I see, I thought to myself that the Manga or Tamura appeared is...... atypical? lol

I still find it strange in general use of the + But, I guess it's okay
 
DodoNova2 said:
I see, I thought to myself that the Manga or Tamura appeared is...... atypical?
Click to expand...
Tamura's manga is pretty much "If i have infinite possible universes at my disposal, let's try to invent the most absurd one"
 
it's really not a bad idea to have infinite Timeline possibilities, you can create many other things without creating incoherence, much like the Comics
 
Tamura is basically Homura Akemi after she get rid of her glasses.

Also, who gets the "at least Mountain Level+, likely higher"?
 
For the same reason why Elisa and Mami don't get "Likely higher" but "Possibly higher"

The only one who is 100% 7-A without a shadow of doubt in Elisa's scaling is Tart (And the tanky witch).

Lapin's witch form has 7-A dura if we don't consider her a glass cannon, which is a fair assumption based on what we know but no 100% solid proof.

Base Lapin being 7-A is also kind of an assumption because while she scales upwards from super casual 7-B+ people, she is still possibly a very high end of 7-B+ instead of 7-A.
 
I'm fine with at least mountain+, possibly higher for Mami. For Elisa, I'm not sure if it's better to use possibly or likely. Leaning more towards the former, but not sure.

Fine with the Tamura feat. As for Suzune it seems to make sense, but i haven't read the manga so I don't know if there's more to that.
 
Elisa is the one with the scaling that entails the "possibly higher", actually.

Mami would just scale from her.
 
Well yeah, that was more or less the issue.

Granted, looking at it:

"At least 7-A, possibly higher. At least 7-A, likely higher when using Doppel" doesn't look as horrible as i thought it would
 
Shouldn't Doppel Candeloro have the same rating as Candeloro:

Cuz her magireco key would be like this: "At least 7-A, possibly higher Normally. At least 7-A, likely Higher when using Doppel".
 
But Candeloro and Doppel Candeloro are already both "At least 7-A, likely higher"
 
Which is what confuses me. Because it's also what i said.

So i don't get which was the point of the comment lol
 
Bump. Also a thing that was brough up here.

Should Riz be "Likely 6-C via Darkness Manipulation" by virtue of restraining Tart?
 
Nah, it wouldn't.

Mami has her status effect immobilization thing going for her, plus she restrained False Mami for like, a second then one shot her, we don't even see the latter struggling, she barely understands what happened.

Meanwhile Tart is pretty blatantly trying to break free.
 
I'm eh on that. Though I feel like it should be more specifically "Restain", as just putting Darkness Manip would make it sound she can deal 6-C damage as well.
 
Bump.

Also Kazumi and Hyades should be MHS+ scaling from Wal I think
 
Buuuuuump.

Also, i thought about the scaling of the 2-As and there are some issues.

First, the whole "Full potential UKG has Low 2-C curses" thing.

Honestly, the statement is way too vague. Even more so when in context, it seems to talk about Madoka's burden

It doesn't specify "At her peak", it doesn't say "Right now" or anything.

Everything that we know is "UKG can destroy the universe". We don't know when or how.

Second, UKG being far above Ultimate Madoka.

It makes no sense. The statement above doesn't mention any huge gap between them, if anything it puts them on the same level, and the WA shows that Madoka can restrain UKG, which again wouldn't make sense if UKG was literally Madoka+++ (Which is how she is considered right now). Also Madoka and UKG are fighting eternally, so it's pretty clear that they need to be equal.

I know that it's the general rule that witches are stronger than their magical girl form, but it's just that. A general rule. Here it's explicitly contradicted and they are portrayed as equal.

UKG is still above baseline by virtue of being >>>>>>>>>>> AoC however. Madoka scales from UKG because she can restrain her and they are fighting eternally. Homura scales from Madoka

TL;DR: Ultimate Madoka and Akuma Homura should become a higher degree of 2-A scaling from UKG who is above baseline by virtue of being vastly above peak AoC, who is only a byproduct of UKG's curses.

The curse thing should be discarded because it's too vague.
 
Also, the conceptual manipulation in PMMM is type 2 i think.

Madoka is the "Not bound by the multiverse, but only by conceptual stuff" kind of abstract. And Aristotelian concepts are bound by linear time, Madoka is not.
 
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