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Yeah you know, that what i says and give the scan for arnos and graham but still not qualifyFixxed: Probably? Sounds promising, but the scans should get posted.
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Yeah you know, that what i says and give the scan for arnos and graham but still not qualifyFixxed: Probably? Sounds promising, but the scans should get posted.
Bruh just explain why it is not qualify, because it is explicit says the attack does not reach the head, because the result in the head is already not exist. It is explicit says not being interacted because of lacking causalityFixxed: That quote you link to is not sufficient. If you link another quote that does not qualify, I will stop reading your quotes, because I do not want to be stuck here for days reading page after page of nonsense that doesn't qualify.
Sorry I know it's staff thread. But Graham's nothingness is unchangeable it's still exists inside the Anos source. Both of them co exist and neither of them unchangeable.I know that they're not the same, but when the criteria to qualify is "Be unable to be changed because you're outside of causality" or "Be unable to be interact with because you're outside of causality" it does not matter if you say "He's not just outside of causality, he's unbound by it!"
Bruh just explain why it is not qualify, because it is explicit says the attack does not reach the head, because the result in the head is already not exist. It is explicit says not being interacted because of lacking causality
Destroying the result of an attack =/= being unable to be changed/being uninteractible.
Really, it just seems like causality manip, to destroy the effects of an attack.
Here Nothingness refers to Graham's nothingness which was absorbed by Anos but both his source and Graham's nothingness coexist without undergoing any changes. Its even described as Anos Source is even deeper than Nothingness.Soon the "fusion reincarnation Radpilika" will be completed, but inside his body is an environment that is nothing less than hell. Incredible perdition is raging, even emptier than nothingness. I have never seen such an aggressive root, and it is too much of a bad match.
No bruh, he is not destroy the result. I think you misunderstand because my translation is not correct. Yeah i translated it againDestroying the result of an attack =/= being unable to be changed/being uninteractible.
Really, it just seems like causality manip, to destroy the effects of an attack.
Graham's nothingness is stated be not having the reason itself where Reason > order in the verse. Order keeps the Casualty as a Subset"What is destroyed returns to nothing, that is the order of the world. In the face of the sword of reason and destruction, all reason is meaningless, and all things perish. Its effect will only work until the object is destroyed."
Only a voice echoed from the surrounding emptiness.
"But the emptiness after the destruction, the emptiness without reason, is the true form of my origin."
Also Anos Absorbed Graham's nothingness but neither of their states changed Graham's nothingness can turn anything in the verse into nothing no matter what but it couldn't do anything to Anos source and Anos source destroys anything in the verse but it couldn't destroy Graham's true form both co exists without undergoing Changes as you can seeA single scratch is enough to cut down and destroy the root cause. If a pseudo-root can't serve as a shield, then you should prepare a sturdier shield. It just so happens that there is a nihilism in my root that is not easily destroyed. I used it."
He used Graham's root of emptiness, which he had taken inside his root, as a shield to catch the graze rami.
The claim was that a single scratch would bring it to an end, but there was no way that emptiness could be wounded.
It seems you can't end what you don't have, God of the End.
Here another example of both co existing without undergoing Changes and Here Anos even absorbed a Multiversal Destroying+99 layers of hax negating spell into his own source where spell got absorbed while not affecting neither of the sources which backs up they are not affected to changesHe ripped his chest open with his left hand and threw the <Egil Grone Angdroa, the Extreme Prisoner of the World's Destruction Ashmolean Cannon> held in his right hand into his own root, daring the <Leon, the Grasping Demon Hand> to fail and explode.
I mitigate it with Graham's emptiness and destroy it with my destruction.
As I said here Graham's nothingness is stated to be nothing infront of Anos source. Well both are not changed even based on anything in the verse.Sorry I know it's staff thread. But Graham's nothingness is unchangeable it's still exists inside the Anos source. Both of them co exist and neither of them unchangeable.
Here Nothingness refers to Graham's nothingness which was absorbed by Anos but both his source and Graham's nothingness coexist without undergoing any changes. Its even described as Anos Source is even deeper than Nothingness.
We actually involved other characters as well. No need to judge you can check the whole thread. Again, get staff permission and send something usefulThis is a discussion concerning Acausality 5 but why are a large portion of posts here about Anos?? Like, he isn't the only one concerned here, we should be discussing Acausality itself instead of pointlessly debating our favorite characters specifically because we're scared they'll lose one superpower
We must have different eyes given what I'm seeing is actual characters being used for reference for good standards of Acausality 5 and then rows and rows of Anos fans arguing with consultants about Anos' Acausality (and I did say large portion). Contrary to what you may think, getting this thread back on track from the Anos wave is rather useful given we should actually discuss the thread topic that was hopefully prompted by good faith.We actually involved other characters as well. No need to judge you can check the whole thread. Again, get staff permission and send something useful
Again, you can check the thread once again and we involved many different characters.We must have different eyes given what I'm seeing is actual characters being used for reference for good standards of Acausality 5 and then rows and rows of Anos fans arguing with consultants about Anos' Acausality. Contrary to what you may think, getting this thread back on track from the Anos wave is rather useful given we should actually discuss the thread topic that was hopefully prompted by good faith.
Well, then you're referring to an Unmoved Mover entity.Well to illustrate:
Imagine causality as a line. Anything above it is type 5 and anything below it isn't.
If you're above it, I (a being within causaliy) could punch you yesterday, tomorrow, or next week, and it wouldn't affect you at all at anywhen. I could also move you from point A to point B but you never moved.
An antifeat would be me having punched you yesterday and still having a bruise today (obviously), or me moving you from point A to point B and you actually moved.
Take my words with a grain of salt, I'm simply trying to interpret this myself. Of course equivalent feats should apply. In the case of being non-physical, I think being "unmoving" in the case I brought up above would also apply.
Warhammer Warp Beings. Slaanesh is a prime example cause she was active before her birth. Only reason it's a "possibly" is because the statement for granting immunity due to being outside Causality is vague with multiple outcomesWell, then you're referring to an Unmoved Mover entity.
Then to qualify you'd have to not go through any change at all
That's what a true Acausality type 5 is irl, but this is fiction.....
Ehh... Do you know any qualifiers?
You do realize that Slaanesh is a chaos god who controls the Realm of Chaos yes? You do realize that anything "naturally" happening in the Warp is literally made of Warp stuff yes? You see how this would apply to these beings in the warp yes?About Slaneesh, I don't think that's combat applicable
It seems it's more of the nature of the Realm Of Chaos rather than the entities themselves. Or I'm missing something
To steelman, maybe the argument is that it would only apply in the Realm of Chaos, and if they get put in, say, NYC because of SBA, that wouldn't apply?You do realize that Slaanesh is a chaos god who controls the Realm of Chaos yes? You do realize that anything "naturally" happening in the Warp is literally made of Warp stuff yes? You see how this would apply to these beings in the warp yes?
It's closer to by SBA the place would probably implode or if they're an actual daemon and not a god they'd just automatically go into their Materium keyTo steelman, maybe the argument is that it would only apply in the Realm of Chaos, and if they get put in, say, NYC because of SBA, that wouldn't apply?
Seems a bit silly, since following that logic any characters based on reality-fiction differences would become ordinary humans in every SBA fight.
It would not affect you because you are no longer bound by causality. This is only the reason.Well to illustrate:
Imagine causality as a line. Anything above it is type 5 and anything below it isn't.
If you're above it, I (a being within causaliy) could punch you yesterday, tomorrow, or next week, and it wouldn't affect you at all at anywhen. I could also move you from point A to point B but you never moved.
An antifeat would be me having punched you yesterday and still having a bruise today (obviously), or me moving you from point A to point B and you actually moved.
Take my words with a grain of salt, I'm simply trying to interpret this myself. Of course equivalent feats should apply. In the case of being non-physical, I think being "unmoving" in the case I brought up above would also apply.
Agreed, my whole point, actually. I am trying to bring this to light. Thanks for understanding, and thank you again for your input.@Sir_Ovens again, there lies the issue that type 5 acausality has an unnecessarily strict requirement where you have to get a specific wording on "You need to have a statement that because you're beyond causality you're uninteractable" that's rendering every single type 5 obsolete. We're trying to change that to something more reasonable, and my proposition is on the lines of "they would lose a true physical form thanks to transcending cause and effect".
It is just there were also other characters involved (for example, Elder). But agreed, let's not bring any topic further.Also as for everyone else, stop derailing the thread to talk about Anos specifically, we're talking about type 5 acausality in general, once we get across the standards then we can focus on the specific verses.
Wouldn't this imply that type 5 can get mind/soul haxed?and my proposition is on the lines of "they would lose a true physical form thanks to transcending cause and effect".
That leads to different levels of type 5 Acausality. Also some characters have it for "laws of causality" being transcended or just plain old ordinary "all systems of causality" with no elaboration on weather it's Conceptual (Types 1 or 2) or laws (or some other fundamental ability equivalent.)I think simply put, if you're beyond causality as a whole, conceptually, physically, and whatnot, you should just automatically get type 5?
What it gives you would be completely subjective to the material.
Demons are made out of the substance of the warp and the Chaos Gods literally are the Warp itself. It is their body essentially.To steelman, maybe the argument is that it would only apply in the Realm of Chaos, and if they get put in, say, NYC because of SBA, that wouldn't apply?
Seems a bit silly, since following that logic any characters based on reality-fiction differences would become ordinary humans in every SBA fight.
problem is. the new standard just confused the entire wiki userbase and sent people in an uproar because of the misunderstanding created by the wording that is currently being used on the acausality page. I think Ultima might have accidnetally mentioned how to possibly solve this conundrum as well.I think the standard is fine as is simply because it fulfills its purpose of preventing the absurdity of what being outside causality entailed without the need for further evidence or implications of what this means. Acausality Type 5 is essentially the limit for what the site allows for specially acausal beings, and should not be given out so recklessly. Though I'm more personally partial to evidence that is implied or derived from interpretations of multiple sources, I think the new change is a good way to curb the ease and access of a power that's been heavily wanked beyond the context of the character's feats and what's normally logical. Ultima already stated examples that work and qualify, and I think that eliminates any doubts over whether these changes are helpful.
Personally, I'd say what counts as an anti-feat for Acausality Type 5 would largely be restricted to occasions where the alleged acausal character is interacted with by normal people, or more generally beings that have absolutely no precedent for being able to do that; in these cases, I'd be fine with just giving them resistance to Causality Manipulation, by virtue of those statements having demonstrable proof of not being fully literal, or at least, not literal enough to be taken to their logical conclusion. Pretty much what Agnaa said up there.
I don't think characters being shown to act at all would necessarily count as an anti-feat, though, particularly if those scenarios strictly involve the Acausal character in question and other entities participating in the same state of existence as them. Depending on the case, I believe it'd be fine to treat these occasions as narrative concessions, since art certainly has its limits and can't exactly depict a lot of other things as is.