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Controlling space-time is just hax/range without further context, but if there’s something implying “complete control of space-time” extends to being able to recreate it in your image it can likely be used for AP
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Xenoverse and Heroes possible separation
- Thread starter Keeweed
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I always saw TokiToki as the same logic that the spirit of the moon from avatar has with the moon, they are correlated, if the fish of moon dies, the moon also dies, but the fish doesnt really scales to moon level, as it can be killed by humans, and i dont remember tokitoki having physical feats, just hax that if he is affected, the space-times also are affected, but maybe im wrong
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TokiToki's creation feat is done via an ability, so not AP worthy unfortunately
Although it's implied that it extends to his power, his True Form won't scale to anyone anyway
Although it's implied that it extends to his power, his True Form won't scale to anyone anyway
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Well technically he can destroy the multiverse/and create it
as for his "can destroy all universes" it needs more context. At lowest would be low 2-C if we assume he would just destroy them one after the another
But context is withing the favour of immediate destruction to the point all gods were going to kill toki, so it's at least 2-C
Tho all universes would either mean just a timeline or literally all universes.
It was also stated that he can do this without using his full power
So base form would be at least 2-C likely 2-B
his full powered form would be 2-B [plus multiple statement of being the governor, protector, controller of time. Plus he is responsible for sustaining the existence of all dimensions] he would also scale above chronoa I think
as for his "can destroy all universes" it needs more context. At lowest would be low 2-C if we assume he would just destroy them one after the another
But context is withing the favour of immediate destruction to the point all gods were going to kill toki, so it's at least 2-C
Tho all universes would either mean just a timeline or literally all universes.
It was also stated that he can do this without using his full power
So base form would be at least 2-C likely 2-B
his full powered form would be 2-B [plus multiple statement of being the governor, protector, controller of time. Plus he is responsible for sustaining the existence of all dimensions] he would also scale above chronoa I think
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As already pointed out, even "likely 2-B" is a no, as you have stabilization standards and controlling space time being just hax, and thus not scaling to physicals. You don't have Weakened SK at "Unknown, likely 3-A/Low 2-C", and we don't have "2-C, likely 2-B" TokiToki for this true reason.
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Nullflowerblush
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2-B:
- Dark King Mechikabura
- Dark King Fu
- Super Saiyan Blue Vegito (Big Bang Mission)
- Super Full Power Saiyan 4 Limits Broken Xeno Vegito
- Broly, right?
- Everyone else, because Demigra absorbing Tokitoki happened in the first story arc.
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Some characters like Base Towa and Base Mira will be probably tier 3
And yes about the scaling
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There's also Gravy one shotting the GT timeline as feat to make it more solid
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Ss4 limit breaker xeno goku isn't 2-B? And what about ssg trunks?
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Trunks is a 2-C with a 2-B sword
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^^^
Nullflowerblush
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The Vegitoes are 2-B because they scale to Dark King Fu, which Xeno Goku and Trunks don't.
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Damn... I am having a really hard time believing that xenoverse demigra can AP stomp all of heroes.
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Xeno goku LBSS4>Janemba>ssg trunks~TPU mechi
That's how I see it
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Again. Trunks is on Mechi level only with the Keysword.
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Does he have any feats of affecting mechi or being able to fight him without the keysword?
Or does any time patroller has any feats against mechi?
If not then I guess you are right.
So their 2-A came from demigra(xenoverse)?
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Ironically XV Chronoa can one shot Mechikabura, the same guy who mindfucked her in Heroes
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Yeah that's why I have a hard time getting along with this downgrade. Xenoverse Demigra can now oneshot DBH grand priest and pretty much AP stomp the entire DBH.
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Only SSJ4 Vegito from that arc was able to fight against Mechi on par without it
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Yeah,theoretically. They're getting hax stomped before that happens though
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Yeah. You know what? Hax is more important in tier 2 anyway. And heroes characters are fairly haxxed now.
Nullflowerblush
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lucky guy
Dark King Mechikabura alone scaled above everybody else. Once he transformed, their only hope of even affecting him was through the Power of Light, which is a foil to his Power of Darkness.
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FPSSJ3 Cumber should scale to 2-B too. In the manga, he over powered ssj4 vegito, who went toe to toe with TPU mechikabura
Nullflowerblush
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Vegito didn't go "toe to toe" with Mechikabura. They briefly engaged, and Mechikabura shrugged off all of his attacks. In the Arcade, Vegito even laments that his support proved futile and that, "At this rate, the situation’s gonna get worse". They relied on the Keybl- sword during that battle.
Nullflowerblush
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Does anybody have a link to Gravy destroying a timeline?
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The panels clearly show that Gravy nuked a chunk of a city, not an entire timeline.
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The history is stated to be gone, though. Unless that's not to be taken literally, That is
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Also add the fact that her world got erased
No the timeline got destroyed
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If it was, it was not Gravy's attack that did it.
Nullflowerblush
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So, everything in the timeline but that city was destroyed?
Also, the original Japanese text, "わたしのいた 歴史も消え ちゃったのか……" seems to imply a question, something along the lines of "Has my history disappeared, too?" (at least, according to the machines), rather than a definite declaration.
Also, the timeline clearly is not destroyed.
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Domino also told me the arcade implies the timeline is fine, so that's out of the question.
I guess we'll just stick to TokiToki stuff
I guess we'll just stick to TokiToki stuff
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Yeah, the arcade has a similar line of dialogue, despite the timeline being at the time unambiguously intact.
Nullflowerblush
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No.
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Also the logic here sucks.
Heroes and Xenoverse have the same cosmology so the statements that talk about the size of said cosmology should literally be no different regardless of DBH statements or lack there of
What we need to focus here is on continuity not cosmology otherwise you would need to prove that the cosmology works differently in Heroes than in Xenoverse.
We literally do the same for Hell in both the Toei and Super Continuities despite the clear differences they have.
Heroes and Xenoverse have the same cosmology so the statements that talk about the size of said cosmology should literally be no different regardless of DBH statements or lack there of
What we need to focus here is on continuity not cosmology otherwise you would need to prove that the cosmology works differently in Heroes than in Xenoverse.
We literally do the same for Hell in both the Toei and Super Continuities despite the clear differences they have.
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Theirs no evidence they share the same Cosmology so we won't treat them as such despite certain similarities shared between them. We don't have to prove anything, you do.
Nullflowerblush
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Do we?
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I’m calling BS on that statement:
The Dragon Ball XV cosmology is made up of :
• conventional universes (Heaven, Hell, The Living Realm and the parallel Demon Realm, basically the shows cosmologies) with the additional realm of kais
• Zeno’s realm
• The Time Nest
• The Dark Demon Realm
• The Crack of Time
• World of Void
(With the only additional “realms” being the Canton Cities)
Heroes has every last one of these realms so there’s actually more evidence that they share the same cosmology
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