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Winx Club Stuff

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We generally treat such feats as plot convenience outliers for characters that have othervise not demonstrated anywhere near infinite speed. We only tend to count such feats for characters that are naturally part of that kind of environment, or ones for whom it is explicitly stated that they can move there because of infinite speed, such as Giorno Giovanna.
 
Well the great dragon was created inside the void and later created the universe so I guess that has sense, but taking a look on how he is described it's said that he created the universe witin aunknown amount of time which could mean he was creating planet per planet and stars per stars and once he got tired he decided to rest on domino which looks like at max star lvl feat? Since he didn't simply create the universe at once but trough Unknown amount of time.... It says that the dragon with his breath created the magical universe spreading light and life and energy trough the universe and when he got tired he decided to rest on domino Now when I read that it looks more like he was creating diffrent planets, stars, Galaxy but not all of them at once thou I guess that could be just writing still what does staff think?

There is also to say that the dragon is not the strongest thing in the winx club universe as we already know about the great beast and relix.

And yeah it says Acheron created legendarium and that he imprisoned diffrent creatures inside of with time and space manipulation magic but we don't know whether the universe was created by him but one thing is sure the world's within are his creation because they match the stories and because before he creates legendarium it's said that the universe within was an empty and that it absorbs magic.
 
Azathoth the Abyssal Idiot said:
Again, there was never any doubt Acheron created the Legendarium. The Legendarium is merely a book containing a portal. The Legendarium World itself was not created by Acheron, and ancient Fairies even lived there, beforehand.

The Legendarium itself is only one way to enter the Legendarium World. The Mythix wands are another, and they were supposedly created by the Ancestral Fairies, who came from said world.
Click to expand...
But Azathoth (please excuse me if i sound rude)....he did create the Legendarium World.

I literally posted a link to the episode above where he confirms he created it while fighting Bloom inside it.

So at this point whether the Legendarium has only one universe or not doesn't matter. Acheron admitted to creating it so it's definitely a feat for him.
 
@William

By great beaat, if you mean the beast of the depths, we ignore that because the beast is featless and is only hyped by Icy which can very well be hyperbole.

As for Relix, im not sure on that yet but since no enemy in winx has ever actually obtained it (Darkar was the closest but never got it) it shouldnt matter.

And as for the Great Dragon, that should still be a casual feat, especially when the magic dimension has muliple universes inside itself as well. It is not just a single universe. And wouldn't Earths universe be created by it to? It may be separate from the magic dimension but Fairies and Magic used to exist on earth before humans. That implies Earths universe got created by the Dragon in order for it to obtain magic as well me thinks.
 
Dude those multiple universe were not created by the great dragon he created only and exclusive magical dimension... The fairies could of simply traveled to earth and live on it cause it was said that the order was established when the fairies first came to that world which implies humans were there first and the fairies arrived later on.

Beast of depths was completly unaffected by any attack bloom or anyone else used and was only controlled by daphne only as it was stated a nymph can control that beast and just because it didn't have a feat it doesn't mean anything cause a clear statement is not something to be ignored,when it comes to relix just because the power wasn't used by anyone that doesn't change the fact lord darker who was created with the great dragon has described it as stronger than the power of the dragon. Feats are not absolute cause as I said we never saw how the dragon created the universe and from how is described it implies he needed time to do so and for that wouldn't make him low 2-C, but instead we take the statement of him creating the universe.

What Acheron created is the world within the legendarium's universe because the universe before he added those creatures from myths and legends was empty but the universe already existed as the doorway wasn't something added inside by Acheron.

Cause feats>statements can be used only if the 2 contradict each other, but when there is nothing that contradicts the statement it's ridiculous to do such thing...
 
For one, i said IMPLIED. Im fine if we dont accept it but when was it stated fairies just migrated to earth?

Secondly, maybe thats because Sirenix power doesnt work on it via magic resistance? Just like how Enchantix power is almost completely useless on the wizards, or how Believix couldnt even scratch Tritannus because its alot less effective under-water? It is only a statement by Icy of all people so it is very likely hyperbole. Besides, if it were really more powerful then the Dragon Flame, why would almost all knowledgeable people in the verse like Ms. Farigonda would consider it the most powerful? Or why would the trix want the flame in the first place when they could have merely just claimed the beast?

Okay? Even if Relix is stronger, it doesnt change the fact that no character has canonically claimed it so Bloom still scales above them regardless.

Unknown time =/= needed time. As a matter of fact ill look up the lore later to get more info on the dragons feat as im on my phone rn.

Evidence of the Legendarium World existing before Acheron created worlds in it?
 
1. I don't know what we're we discussing in the first place since Earth is part of magical dimension in the first place the humans simply forgot about magic after the earth fairies were beaten and sealed by wizards of the black circle. While the fairies actually came to earth from their own kingdom that was simply connected to earth with the magic of white circle.

2. If it had magical resistance daphne and particularly trix could not control it ethier unless you want to use the excuse "that's just an exception to the rule"

3. Using pharagonda's words as argument is really bad since it was pharagonda who said Valtor was the supreme and most powerful wizard of magical dimension to just 3 seasons later find out that is actually Acheron or that she never mentioned the water stars had the power to nullfie the dragons flame or the fact she said The great dragon is the strongest, even thou we all know Lord darker has the exact same power just opposite. Reason is simple: she had no reason to tell the winx every detail; 1. Because at that time the power of the dragon flame was the only important thing to the first season and if she mentioned Lord darker she would of spoilered us the second season; 2. Why would she explain so many things the winx who back at the day barely knew basic incantation figures about the greatest powers in universe and not to mention that back then pharagonda only said a part of the storie to later talk with bloom alone specifcly about the great dragon. So yeah the reason she didn't mention them is because the first season was about the great dragon and nothing else.

3.unknown time=/= needed time=/=small amount of time. The dragon was explained as bringing life trough the magical dimension until he got tired and has decided to rest on domino. That way of describing it implies it was not just one second and everything was created but who knows how much time...

4. What's said about legendarium is that the book of legendarium was created by Acheron and that this book simply absorbs magic to put it simple everything inside the book is not made by Acheron, he simply used the book to absorb the diffrent creatures from different legends and nowhere implies that he created an actual universe within it. In fact it also said the book is used to conect the real word with imaginary world but no where is implied that the world within was created by Acheron and a good proof of that is that he himself can't get out of that world if he stays for too long which wouldn't have any sense if he actually created the world it self and again Acheron says he created legendarium not the universe within it. So it's on you to prove me wrong which is also a little hard cause I want the original versions as well and not just some random copy where the translations can be inaccurate even thou the English version I found say Acheron creates legendarium that works as portal to the dimension of legends and nothing else

5. Do not quote large amount of text...
 
"Multiple interplanetary travel feats would give us a solid MFTL+ for Bloom's speed."

How? There is no way to know the distance between the planets, so it cannot be conclusively MFTL+.

As for the topic on the creation of the universe, I believe the only imagery we get of it shows the dragon breathing and then seeing planets and stars already formed. The rest of statements of what happened or what it did after it created it.

"Also, does anyone happen to know the 4-B feat Darkanine mentioned? Because that could be incredibly helpful for scaling."

You are likely speaking of the earthquake feat from seaosn 5.
 
Well hopefully we can find that feat which I don't remember she ever did.

By the way her weaknesses part is to be corrected as well

Being emotional is not how it should be described, but that her emotional state affects her use of power cause whenever she is sad her magic is weaker while when she gets angry her magic grows. Second her fatigue after sharing the dragon flame is no longer a problem after she absorb the power from vortex and regains control over her own magic.

So weakness should be.

Her emotinal state affects her magical power and when she is sad her power is at its lowest. Or something like that...
 
Wait why for poiltea wasn't she the monster that simply lost her powers to darcy... And convergence feat for stabilising the pillars can't be calculated so unless you are talking about something else maybe tell me what did she do.
 
Of course it can be calculated. The crystal provided energy to keep the worlds stable. Without it, the worlds began to shake and the Winx provided the energy that matched the crystal to re-stabalize the worlds. That is a perfectly valid energy feat.

And Politea manhandled every character in the movie, including stalemating a Sirenix Convergence that was boosted by the Pearl of the Deep.
 
Oh that I am not sure was that movie canon honestly I know the first one was but the movie after the 5 season didn't look like it since its completly diffrent than the original storie where poiltea dies after having her magic absorbed.

There are 3 pillars that that stabilise the world's so the energy to "stabilise" the world's is divided and anyway how can you even calculate the energy to stabilise something it's not immediately considered as the energy to destroy them. Then again it is to consider that they stabilised the pillar but that doesn't necessarily mean they charged it completly they could of just given enough energy for it to stabilise that's all. And then you would also have to divided per 6 since it's all winx doing it.
 
This site's cannonicity policy is none of my concern, but the only movie I would outright reject is the second one. Well, the one with the Nabu contradictions would be the one. Whichever it was. There are no real contradictions between the two from what I saw. It comfortably continnues from the end of the season as well.

"There are 3 pillars that that stabilise the world's so the energy to "stabilise" the world's is divided"

The three pillars stabalize different things, so the energy being divided is not something you can argue for.

"how can you even calculate the energy to stabilise something it's not immediately considered as the energy to destroy them"

This is an interesting question considering that you are an active memeber of this site. Your site actively encourages the use of GBE of a body to equal its creation energy, so your first complaint has no bearing on here.

"Then again it is to consider that they stabilised the pillar but that doesn't necessarily mean they charged it completly they could of just given enough energy for it to stabilise that's all"

Yes, that was the calculation.

"And then you would also have to divided per 6 since it's all winx doing it."

When I made the Winx profiles on another site, I did not divide it by 6 because I recalled there being a line about how Convergence boosts the magical ability of those participating in it. Whether I remember this correctly or not (I've never been able to find the line again), the division would still place the characters, as per this site's tiering, at 4-B.
 
"After the revision we could probably make other profiles cause I only found Bloom..."

I also found it interesting that a profile for Bloom was created but not a profile for the series or any other character. But it is not a site I frequent and so didn't comment on it since I assumed they would be created eventually.
 
Well, I know about calculating... Yeah that's it. So that problem is something you can solve with calc members here.

And I know right having one random profile without anything else about the series...

One more question how did you decided how many worlds are there? Since more world means more energy I guess.
 
I will not argue the calculation on here. It was not made on this site and used none of this site's standards of assumptions or anything like that, so whether it is accepted here or not does not matter to me because it was not made with this site in mind. Those interested in using it here can argue for it here.

With that said, I just used the low-end and high-end estimations for the number of planets in the universe.
 
Witch Bernkastel said:
"Multiple interplanetary travel feats would give us a solid MFTL+ for Bloom's speed."

How? There is no way to know the distance between the planets, so it cannot be conclusively MFTL+.

As for the topic on the creation of the universe, I believe the only imagery we get of it shows the dragon breathing and then seeing planets and stars already formed. The rest of statements of what happened or what it did after it created it.

"Also, does anyone happen to know the 4-B feat Darkanine mentioned? Because that could be incredibly helpful for scaling."

You are likely speaking of the earthquake feat from seaosn 5.
Click to expand...

What exactly happened with this earthquake that made this a 4-B feat and in what episode???
 
@Witch Bernkastel

Because unless the planets are obscenely close together or travel takes literal years, they would need to be Massively FTL to travel to planets outside of a single solar system in any reasonable amount of time.

@Julian

It was the shaking of every world in the magic dimension, I believe.
 
Well, if you're not talking of one that was made on here, it was just some other energy. Probably an earthquale calculation. It has been a long time since I looked at it. But it was not GBE.
 
Okay im sorry but a lot of this is extremely incorrect.

1. If that is the case then the universe where earth comes from is a creation of the Great Dragon too as it did the Magical Dimension, no?

2. Resistance is not the same as immunity, just as using attack magic is not the same thing as using it in the form of hax. Clearly the Beast's weakness is mind control while it has high resistance to attack magic so that goes along with my earleir point here.

3. Completely incorrect. Ms. Farigonda is not only a member of the Company of Light (one of the most oldest groups of warriors in Magix history), but she is also one of the most intelligent and well known knoweldgeable fairies in the Magic Dimension constantly helping the winx develop and giving them info to try and help them defend everyone by any threat. She has absolutely no reason to lie or make anything up, rather the opposite and be very 100% serious and literal with what she says. For one, Acheron is never stated to be the most powerful wizard. He was stated to study wizard magic to try and become the most powerful wizard. That was his purpose in making the Legendarium. Secondly, exact same power but opposite contradicts youself heavily. Darkrar does not have the same power. The G.D. gives energy and life while Darkrar absorbs it. Thirdly, they didnt need Farigonda to tell them about the water stars. Techna found it for the winx themselves through research, something she constantly does. That does not mean Farigonda doesnt know about them in any way. She has every reason to tell them every detail so that they can do their jobs as the guardians of the Magic Dimension and defeat their enemies. Besides, Bloom at that point in the series was desperately seeking info on her birth family and was even considering going to Valtor to ask her since he was the last to see them before Domino got destroyed. If Farigonda was willing to hold back info til when Bloom is ready, it'd be because of this anyway.

4. So what if not in one second? That timeframe is still a tier 2 feat and if anything, him doing it overtime does not matter because at the time, time and space didnt exist. The Dragon roamed in nothingness before anything came to be, even space-time. By this logic we should downgrade the Creation Trio from Pokemon for the exact same thing.

5. And where would those said absorbed magic go to? Into the dimension he created. No offense but you are reaching pretty hard right now. Acheron out-right stated to be the creator of the Legendarium World. There should be no refruting that. And that weakness of staying there forever never applied to him. He got stuck in the book because the legendariums power was too much for him to handle. He only could control it and the legendarium world after obtaining some of Blooms dragon flame. Creating a universe(s) doesnt neccesarrily mean you can always maintain control over them. It has happened in fiction before. And you want proof? Theres the vid I posted above which seemingly people are ignoring.

@Witch

My fault for forgetting you lol. You wanted reasoning for why each story in the Legendarium world is a separate universe?
 
ProfessorKukui4Life said:
It has happened in fiction before. And you want proof? Theres the vid I posted above which seemingly people are ignoring.
Click to expand...
Again, we are looking for the original dialogue so there are no translation issues, and to my knowledge, unless he has not checked it yet, Kalitas only confirmed the Italian version to state "You must know that I was the one who created the Legendarium".
 
Ahh my bad then.

Does S6 have an italian dub version or RAI up yet? Usually Nicks english dub is around more before the other. Besides if it was a mistranslation wouldnt it have been noted somewhere?
 
1. Earth is part of the magical universe dude it doesn't come from another universe.

2. I still go by the clear statement of the great beast being superior to dragon flame and probably to the dragon himself thou I can give you at least some doubt there.

3. Acheron was stated to have been the strongest wizard of the magical universe after creating the legendarium. Italian versions says o you can even check the wiki if you can understand something or just watch it, if you can understand it as well. Dragon shares energy, darkar absorbs energy that indeed is the opposite. Cause if you don't know the opposite of giving is taking and absorbing it is a synonym. The point for the water stars is that when pharagonda said the dragon is strongest creature she lied considering she knew about the water stars and relix. And don't tell me the ultimate power inside relix isn't stronger cause I can use your own argument Pharagonda may be smart but Darkar is a primordial creature from before time so he knows a thing or two. I am not gonna even comment the rest of this...

4. " if anything, him doing it overtime does not matter because the time and space didn't exist" I am not even gonna comment on this, it's just sad. Anyway I don't want want to downgrade him it was just explaining to how wording in winx club series creates situations that are difficult to handle so you can drop it before you say something like you already did.

5. Since trying to change your idea is worthless I will just go by what is said in the series that is Acheron creates legendarium nothing else and it seems others here agree with me as well so I won't waste my time trying to change idea of one person that has a diffrent point of view from me.

Last thing if you need other arguing do it with someone else cause I saw your last thread where you tried to upgrade bloom on 2-A and now I understand I am just wasting my time here.
 
@kukui

I'm not auper invested in this topic, but if you wish to post stuff you can. I am.mostly here to defend the FTL feats and the Vortex situation.
 
1. No it isnt in the same universe. Because then not only would Earth have magic all the time even after the defeat of the earth fairies but the Winx wouldnt need to cross dimensions to reach it everytime they go there.

2. Which is very likely still hyperbole and with reasoning behind it being superior doubtful.

3. For one I can't speak Italian so I wouldnt know that. All i've ever been able to get to is the Nick Dub after Nick took the rights from 4Kids to dub the show. And two, no it isnt. Acheron no where is stated to be the strongest wizard other than the "version" your claiming has it. And yes that is the opposite so theres nothing that makes Darkar and the Great Dragon the same. One gives life. The other takes it away. Thats like saying Xerneas and Yveltal are the same. Also, what does her not mentioning the water stars have to do with it? They are only comparable to the Great Dragon and really can't do anything on their own. Same thing with Relix which is something no one never ever canonically obtains. The last part of this point doesnt even have anything to do with this.

4. Again, time and space were non-existent concepts by the time the Dragon was born so whether he did it instantly or in a timeframe shouldnt matter. That would be like downgrading the Creation Trio again by the same logic.

5. And whats said in the series is he's the creator of the Legendarium World as ive found and until someone can find a different english version or the italian version to see if its different, this is what we have to work with.

Also, what does me once arguing for 2-A Bloom have anything to do with this?
 
They never had to pass trough a diffrent dimension to get to earth I have no idea where you get that. The reason earth didn't have magic is because Fairies where the only creatures on it that were using magic and it's clearly said the humans simply stopped believing in magic re watch the fourth season if you have to.

Not gonna argue about anything else except for this since I already said everything I had to you about the other arguments.
 
Alright, so Acheron also said "Il mondo del Legendarium è sempre stato il mio regno! È la mia creazione!" which means "The world of the Legendarium has always been my kingdom! It's my creation!"

Btw, William is probably more reliable than me for that, given that he can check the source material too and is more familiar with the verse
 
You do realize they've had to either teleport or open dimensional portals to get to earth everytime they go there and back to the M.D. right? There are so many scenes of this in the show....

Yes but again, if Earth was really a part of the Magic Dimension in that way, then losing the earth fairies wouldnt take away Magic off of earth. There would still be magic there all the time as the Magic Dimension has literally everything magical.
 
Kaltias said:
Alright, so Acheron also said "Il mondo del Legendarium è sempre stato il mio regno! È la mia creazione!" which means "The world of the Legendarium has always been my kingdom! It's my creation!"

Btw, William is probably more reliable than me for that, given that he can check the source material too and is more familiar with the verse
Click to expand...
To check the source I need the actual source. Where did you find this so I can see the entire thing before it's taken out of context.
 
Prof. Earth has magic, but none uses it because it was the fairies the only creatures that were capable of using it as it's said that they have also ruled the earth another proof of that is the existence of the white circle and roxy.They were always using teleport bro and not only for earth but Andros as well as the closest example since it happens in season 3
 
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