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Honestly Garous intelligence rating also needs a upgrade just like Weiss, split up his intelligent section more as it makes it seem like Garou is as skilled as he is up until he becomes a full on Monster with his perfect fist martial arts sense the BoS, which isn't true as he becomes more skilled as the series goes on via copying more and more moves as the series progressesI like everyone to remember this Garou isn't as skilled as he is later on as this is his frist key
Eh? While his mastery of the WSRF isn't as refined as later keys his skill level and technique copying are pretty much the same, its not like he suddenly got more "skilled" he just learned and perfected new techniques.I like everyone to remember this Garou isn't as skilled as he is later on as this is his frist key
Simply because Garou is still able to do the same things when human doesn't mean he is able to do them to the same extent as when a monster, and don't even dream of using Cosmic Garou. That doesn't even make sense, it's like saying that because Mash has been able to control his muscles and body since the first arc he's able to do it to the same extent he did in the last arc. Thats just a não, no, negative, nonpositive, nono. Yes, he can copy, but as good as his monster state or ******* cosmic mode and after all his battles and hardwork? Come on, that's just silly. His copying skills are clearly improved throughout the story, since his First of Following Water was pathetic at first when compared to Bang's even after training with him for years and years, and just in his monster form he showed to have reached Bang's levelAnd even so he showed failures, what a bozo fr fr.
Weiss was trained by the best fighters in Atlas, and youre using feats from after this key to argue his skill lol@WeeklyBattles Them not trying to kill each other doesn’t mean anything when the fight was determined by who’s Aura lasts the longest, so Weiss using that at the end of the fight doesn’t help her. Yeah, freezing him which won’t stop him forever as he can just muscle through the ice with the superior AP and LS. Also Weiss learning to fight since she was a kid means nothing in terms of a skill feat when she’s easily distracted by others as shown when Ruby cheering her on during the boar fight was enough to mess with her concentration, also Garou was trained by a martial arts master and literally adapts and evolves his skills to the point he rivals the skills of other S rank heroes in a short timeframe.
She doesnt need the AP to oneshot him when he doesnt have the regen in this key to withstand his body being turned to a pile of shattered iceFirst off you haven’t proven it lasts as long as she likes, second off Garou’s adaptation will just let him react and counter Weiss’ strikes as time goes on so this isn’t going to help her in the long run. Forcefield can be broken by superior AP, speed amp means nothing to a guy with precognition/Analytical prediction, and being sent flying away means nothing when she doesn’t have the AP to oneshot him.
Such as?I have, you just refuse to acknowledge any of them that has nothing to do with numbers.
Weiss' experience is in fact backed up by actual skill feats.That doesn't invalidate anything I said, later Garou keys hone in his mastery of WSRF and grant him new techniques but that doesn't change his inherent skill level and prodigy status.
Experience means jack shit if not backed up with actual skill feats
Is this the RWBY skill chain that I've heard bout? Damn
That is a heavily condensed, significantly simplified, and currently incomplete version of it yes lolIs this the RWBY skill chain that I've heard bout? Damn
We need that blog with scans and everything and the whole nine yardsThat is a heavily condensed, significantly simplified, and currently incomplete version of it yes lol
Basically thats the copypasta we have on hand at the moment that we use as a reference while we write up the full explanation blog
?Also just to let you know, I'm not counting any votes until the debate is over
Is that allowed?Also just to let you know, I'm not counting any votes until the debate is over
I'm sorry but that first part is completely untrue. Although Weiss definetely has a lot of combat experience fighting opponents with various weapons, she has never been shown fighting opponents who soley rely on hand on hand combat, much less fight anyone confirmed in story to be a martial arts master outside of proving themselves capable in combat. Garou on the other hand was stated to be one of Bang's greatest disciples prior to his removal from the dojo, meaning he should be in similar skill to the him, and was capable of defeating the likes of Tanktop Vegetarian, who was the second in command of the Tank Topper Army, a group comprised of heroes soley devoted to hand to hand combat.You are significantly underestimating Weiss in this regard. Weiss even in her earlier keys was capable of matching the best martial artists in the world, who themselves have feats comparable to Garou's,
She still relies on her semblance a lot for her acrobatics. But I will agree with the second part.Weiss' acrobatics are not fueled by her semblance, its just something she can do naturally. Also, pressure points wont work as long as Weiss' aura is up.
Yet Garou is capable of Instinctive Reaction thanks to his mastery of the Water Stream Rock Smashing Fist. Also your statement is not entirely untrue as Glyphs do take a small amount of time to appear as seen in the Nevermore Grimm fight, and can only be made one at a time (though the are fast enough for it to appear instantaneous). Garou can dodge the glyphs.I mean, even if he gets past both of those Weiss still has multiple ways to freeze him in CQC, but thats a big IF as Weiss' glyphs dont have any tells, theres no projectiles to look out for, they just appear.
Fair enough, but since Wiess isn't bloodlusted, its unlikely she will use it instantly to win the fight, nor is it really in character for her to use it on human beings. I could see her using it to try and cripple Garou though once she realises Garou's not holding back.I mean, pain tolerance is great and all but its not going to save him from having his body frozen inside and out and then shattered.
Garou himself also has a skill chain. Garou downscales from his master Bang, who is a Master Martial Artist himself and was previously considered the 3rd Best hero in the Hero Association, placing him above the likes of other fighters such as Metal Bat, Superalloy Darkshine, Atomic Samurai, Puri-Puri Prisoner and Tanktop Master. Garou himself also defeated a number of heroes before his transformation into a monster began such as the Previously mentioned Tanktop Vegetarian, as well as contending with S ranked heroes such as Tanktop Master and Metal Bat, only struggling with the latter due to other being physically superior.I can post the RWBY skill scaling chain if you'd like, but friendly reminder that people near Weiss' level have been agreed to be above Garou in terms of skill in threads here before. Garou's CQC skill alone is not enough to win him this fight, and Weiss uses everything in her arsenal at close range as well as long range, just because Garou can get close to her doesnt mean she just stops being able to use those abilities.
That uh, is not allowed ya knowAlso just to let you know, I'm not counting any votes until the debate is over
My guy, everyone that Weiss has fought in the series is a world class fighter, Weiss has absolutely fought people on that level before.I'm sorry but that first part is completely untrue. Although Weiss definetely has a lot of combat experience fighting opponents with various weapons, she has never been shown fighting opponents who soley rely on hand on hand combat, much less fight anyone confirmed in story to be a martial arts master outside of proving themselves capable in combat. Garou on the other hand was stated to be one of Bang's greatest disciples prior to his removal from the dojo, meaning he should be in similar skill to the him, and was capable of defeating the likes of Tanktop Vegetarian, who was the second in command of the Tank Topper Army, a group comprised of heroes soley devoted to hand to hand combat.
Touching her weapon gets him frozen solid as i have explained above.With all that being said, Weiss isn't truly perpared to deal with someone as skilled like Garou, and it should also be taken into account that Garou can disarm Weiss of her weapon, which would leave herself defensless outside of her standard glyphs and summons.
Bro what show have you been watching, im not sure if youve seen Weiss' fights ever lol. Her glyphs appear instantaneously, and she can make dozens at once. There is nothing for Garou to dodge, they instantly appear on whatever she wants them to, theyre not dodgeable projectiles.Yet Garou is capable of Instinctive Reaction thanks to his mastery of the Water Stream Rock Smashing Fist. Also your statement is not entirely untrue as Glyphs do take a small amount of time to appear as seen in the Nevermore Grimm fight, and can only be made one at a time (though the are fast enough for it to appear instantaneous). Garou can dodge the glyphs.
It should also be noted that Garou had prior knowledge on all of these people due to having a guidebook that listed all of their capabilities, techniques, and weaknesses, something he does not have against Weiss.Garou himself also has a skill chain. Garou downscales from his master Bang, who is a Master Martial Artist himself and was previously considered the 3rd Best hero in the Hero Association, placing him above the likes of other fighters such as Metal Bat, Superalloy Darkshine, Atomic Samurai, Puri-Puri Prisoner and Tanktop Master. Garou himself also defeated a number of heroes before his transformation into a monster began such as the Previously mentioned Tanktop Vegetarian, as well as contending with S ranked heroes such as Tanktop Master and Metal Bat, only struggling with the latter due to other being physically superior.
To be fair, Garou did lose to his former master Bang, but there are some factors to consider beforehand
Given that most of Garou's victories were done while in a weakened state from many prior battles and with severe injuries, I believe that Garou at his peak will Absolutely decimate someone like Weiss.
- He had been previously fighting other heroes and was not fighting at full stamina.
- He was also extremely weakened due to fighting other heroes such Genos moments prior, a group of other heroes whom he struggled with at first but eventually overcame, and Metal Bat and Watchdog Man.
- He also got wacked by Saitama Lmao, it left him still heavily injured by the time he woke up
As previously stated, if he tries to take her sword he gets frozen, but on top of that, Weiss' glyphs are not Dust fueled, they are her semblance, she does not need her sword to make Glyphs.On regarding skill however, Weiss skills also demonstrate an obvious weakness: if she manages to lose her sword, she will not only be severly handicapped when it comes to melee, but she also loses access to her dust powered glyphs due to said dust being held in her weapon. Given that Garou has superior LS to Weiss (Class G vs Class M), Garou could easily take the weapon away from her if he managed to get in close.
Weiss doesn't exclusively camp people out in character until Atlas against Marrow. Before Atlas she does still use her regular swordplayVoting Weiss.
I will be the first to admit I'm not too knowledgeable on OP, but the arguments I've seen haven't been terribly convincing (No offense). I'm sure Garou is a very skilled and talented fighter, but I don't see anything that would really save him from being frozen every time he get's hit by most of her attacks or makes any form of contact with her blade, and even if he breaks out of being Frozen, Weiss can use various other technique's and abilities, of note is using Gravity Dust to create Anti-Gravity Glyph's, or using Time Dilation on herself to give herself a speed amp. Granted, Garou could hypothetically grow faster than her, but I imagine that by the time Weiss uses Time Dilation, she wouldn't really be messing around anymore, and would likely become willing to complete freeze him from the Inside-Out. From what I see, Weiss has blatant advantages in Manuverability and Versatility via her Glyphs, she has a Pseudo Health Bar via her Aura which can tank certain hits and negate Pressure Point Attacks, and she has a number of way's to restrict Garou with varying degree's of it being in character. Garou's best argument's seem to be Fear Manip (Which I honestly can't think of a counter against), Superior AP (Which while impressive, would first require him to get close enough to hit Weiss, as well as hit her hard enough to go through her Aura), and better Skill, which from what I see, They both personally have convincing arguments.
Most of these Arguments I see have devolved into Garou rushing down Weiss and attacking her, but if that's his first move, I feel Weiss would take the win more often then not. It's not out of character for her to Freeze Garou, and if it becomes apparent that merely freezing him is proving ineffective, then she can easily resort to one of her other wincons. She can also heal herself to a extent, and can summon her various summon's to fight Garou and get a good read on him and his threat without actually engaging. I'm afraid I simply find that Weiss has way more in her tool kit, and Garou's strategy of "Get Close and Hit her Hard" isn't very convincing in comparison to Weiss's potential gameplans. One has the advantage of Versatility and Options, the other doesn't seem to have the same luxury.
All in All, I find Weiss simply has far more options to hold off or deal with Garou, while Garou is kind of lacking in options.
They are nowhere near equal in skill or experienceVoting inconclusive.
Even saying they are equal in skill, Weiss lacks analytical prediction and information analysis and thus she would not be able to keep up with Garou regardless.
If he lands a single hit on her, she's dead.
Her win-con is apparently doing some OOC stuff. Which, yeah, to be fair anti gravity or internal freezing are instant kills, but I can't at this moment say that they are any more or less likely than Garou just hitting her a single time, based on the arguments.
Incon.
Nah she does, against that Grimm she froze it's wings (2:13) so much it shattered it@Phoenks She literally does not have internal freezing, it’s just normal ice powers she does plus she’s never shown doing anything like this against someone stronger than her.
My guy, the power to freeze people internally is quite literally listed on her page@Phoenks She literally does not have internal freezing, it’s just normal ice powers she does plus she’s never shown doing anything like this against someone stronger than her.
They are nowhere near equal in skill or experience
She also doens't have internal freezing