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Warhammer Fantasy revision

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I'm honestly agreeing with everyone here, there is nothing inherently wrong with poetic prose if it is backed up by other things and is still clear enough to be taken as a feat or statement, like these are.
 
Blackcurrant91 said:
What the heck lol...you're the one that brought up it being poetic as a point against it.
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I called them extravagant sentences, that doesn't mean I think they're poetic as in false and thereby not Low 1-C due to not being meant to be taken as facts, none of that sh*t was Low 1-C even if it wasn't poetic and it was all professionally, firmly structured. I have no idea what do you even think matters in that text as you showed me all of it as a point when I already said that transcending doesn't cut it, so I just said "hey, none of this matters".
 
Eficiente said:
Well if you talk with this levels of redundancy and poetism in real life then I applaud how you can get away with it.
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I mean your only point against it so far is that whats said in the scan is redundant and poetic. It doesn't even say 'transcend' in the scan so I dont know why you keep bringing that up.

Your only argument against it so far is 'I disagree that it proves transcendence' but you also have to prove why it doesn't because everyone else agrees with me so far.
 
Look man when I said "transcending isn't Low 1-C" I didn't mean it as in "it turns out this is wrong" but that it was never correct to begin with, and I was able to diagree with it because I saw it being claimed as Low 1-C. Here I have no f*cking idea what is being claimed to be Low 1-C because there isn't anything pointing out that tier.
Eficiente said:
and believe that anyone who thinks otherwise missed how it would be a more productive use of their time to make a CRT to reword the Tiering System to how they see fit
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What in that text and based on the Tiering System is being claimed to be Low 1-C? You enlighten me.
 
Honestly man, I can barely read your comments.

vsbattles.fandom.com

Warhammer Fantasy Cosmology.

vsbattles.fandom.com vsbattles.fandom.com

this is what I am claiming is Low 1-C.

I showed this to the person who literally MADE the tiering system and they agreed with it.

You clearly haven't even read my blog. Honestly I'm not going to entertain your comments anymore because they are nonsensical.
 
I have noticed that Ultima does seem to have a tendency to accept higher tiers far too easily, yes.

I agree with Eficiente about that transcending does not automatically mean infinitely superior.
 
thats fine but it doesn't say transcend anywhere in the scans I posted. It says they exist in a realm beyond the space time of the multiverse. This is backed up by Tzeentch's power creating higher dimensional spaces in the physical universe. Also Ultima hasn't even commented on the thread so like so far it's 7 agreed and 2 disagreed.
 
Okay cool so now we are at least having a discussion about it. So I assume you disagree? so 7 agreed 3 disagreed.
 
Just baseline 5-D. I can't find any evidence for higher. There seems to be 'Endless planes' and 'Boundless sea's' nested within each other inside the realm of chaos, but nothing concrete about transcendance.
 
I agree with the above.

Also off-topic but I am legitimately surprised how empty the Warhammer Fantasy page is with only a small fraction of mentioned characters having their dedicated profiles. I'd do it but I'm no loremaster of WHF.
 
When I showed it to Ultima and asked about infinitely above baseline 5-D he said no so I dropped it. He said there is no evidence the Planes referred to are the same as the 'Boundless sea's' mentioned.

@Naitodesu I'm the only one making the profiles currently so its taking a long time. Each profile has like 30+ years of lore I need to go through as well.
 
Antvasima said:
I have noticed that Ultima does seem to have a tendency to accept higher tiers far too easily, yes.

I agree with Eficiente about that transcending does not automatically mean infinitely superior.
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While i do agree with Eficente i absolutely agree with Ant here. Ultima does tend to accept any "transcends time and space" as infinitely superior by default unless there is proof against it afaik.

But i will remain neutral on this thread, cus it all depends on whether we stick with the "transcend = infinitely above by default" or "transcend =/= infinitely above without context".
 
Firephoenixearl said:
While i do agree with Eficente i absolutely agree with Ant here. Ultima does tend to accept any "transcends time and space" as infinitely superior by default unless there is proof against it afaik.

But i will remain neutral on this thread, cus it all depends on whether we stick with the "transcend = infinitely above by default" or "transcend =/= infinitely above without context".
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That’s actually false, as I have consistently asked (more like bugged) him over and over about things that transcend space-time, and have been shot down 8 out of 10 times, and require extensive evidence.
 
I have debated him on that very point with the "transcendence doesn't necessarily mean superior, it can mean outside" and he said "we don't assume transcendence to mean outside by default". So eh, everyone has different experiences.
 
Blackcurrant91 said:
When I showed it to Ultima and asked about infinitely above baseline 5-D he said no so I dropped it. He said there is no evidence the Planes referred to are the same as the 'Boundless sea's' mentioned.

@Naitodesu I'm the only one making the profiles currently so its taking a long time. Each profile has like 30+ years of lore I need to go through as well.
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I ask because I want to throw SMT at these guys, but if they’re baseline I’ll have to try the weaker Low 1-C’s.
 
Just a statement of being beyond space and time is not enough if not more statements/feats back it up. Just being beyond space time doesn't mean you are superior in dimensionality like how transcending it without more information is not good enough to use.

Just because Ultima made the System doesnt mean he can't be wrong. Sure, he's more knowledgeable than most but at the same time he can be easy misslead by not having the entire context, not being carefull when reading or etc.

Anyway, i disagree till more information is added on "beyond time and Space".
 
is there a blog post explicitly stating what is required for low 1-C and what "boxes" a being must tick to gain this tier?

Because aside from an explicit statement of "I am a being who exists on 4 spatial axis and a temporal axis hahahaha" staff seem to disagree a lot of the time with low 1-C proposals.

If there isn't a dedicated page which explicitly outlines the low 1-C criteria, the tiering system lends itself to double standards over semantics and uses of specific words.
 
Zaratthustra said:
Just a statement of being beyond space and time is not enough if not more statements/feats back it up. Just being beyond space time doesn't mean you are superior in dimensionality like how transcending it without more information is not good enough to use.

Just because Ultima made the System doesnt mean he can't be wrong. Sure, he's more knowledgeable than most but at the same time he can be easy misslead by not having the entire context, not being carefull when reading or etc.

Anyway, i disagree till more information is added on "beyond time and Space".
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I have provided more then just said statement already actually but no1 is acknowledging it. Tzeentch who's power cannot manifest at it's full potential on the mortal realm yet light wizards channelling his power can create higher dimensional spaces in the physical universe where he cannot manifest his full power. The scans and statements are in the blog I posted.
 
OP provided more info than just a passing statement otherwise we wouldn't be here, it's pretty damn straightforward.
 
Eficiente said:
Transcending doesn't inherently mean something being infinitely more complex than the thing transcended, or seeing it as non-real fiction on an equivalent way. Anyone seeing any dictionary can tell that by seeing the word transcend. Making up avatars from other, more special and fancy realm doesn't mean anything.

I take this as a fact and believe that anyone who thinks otherwise missed how it would be a more productive use of their time to make a CRT to reword the Tiering System to how they see fit, because they go rogue by agreeing with stuff like this. Why are you guys ok with anyone reading the tier getting that transcending=infinite times more complex? Do you guys actually think this is understandable in the tier or are just fine with a privileged some getting this secret exploit? Or maybe you guys are correct and then I need to make Kirby characters Low 1-C too as people there mess with a special reality that transcends time and space where the vessels of the true form of a god-like being originate from.
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To answer those concerns: I was actually fine with this being Low 1-C because Blackcurrant showed me an earlier version of the blog containing a few scans where the Realm of Chaos was described as "a state of metaphysics containing all things," and as being far less concrete and material then anything in the physical universe.

The former statement, coupled with the "beyond space and time" stuff shown in the OP, would warrant that rating, especially if it was done in contrast to an infinite multiverse. This is because, as I've explained on another thread, a 2-A multiverse is already a structure whose size (or hypervolume, if you prefer) is mathematically set at "∞," and as our current standards on being capable of affecting multiple infinite multiverses attest to, there is really no such thing as being finitely or countably infinitely bigger than that. If you contain and exceed the entirety of an infinite multiverse's spacetime, then the difference between you and said multiverse has to be uncountably infinite, which would in turn imply Low 1-C

Of course, those scans which I've mentioned seem to have been removed from the blog post, so.
 
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Ahh I did remove them too. I didn't realise they provided more context. I'm more then happy to post them here/add them again.
 
Ultima_Reality said:
The former statement, coupled with the "beyond space and time" stuff shown in the OP, would warrant that rating, especially if it was done in contrast to an infinite multiverse. This is because, as I've explained on another thread, a 2-A multiverse is already a structure whose size (or hypervolume, if you prefer) is mathematically set at "∞," and as our current standards on being capable of affecting multiple infinite multiverses attest to, there is really no such thing as being finitely or countably infinitely bigger than that. If you contain and exceed the entirety of an infinite multiverse's spacetime, then the difference between you and said multiverse has to be uncountably infinite, which would in turn imply Low 1-C
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Mathematically yes, but in fiction there very much is such a thing as "finitely or countably infinitely above infinity". It's the reason we have levels to 2-A to begin with.

@Antvasima As for the scans, im not sure if being more metaphysical and more abstract means you're infinitely superior to such a thing. I will wait for Eficiente and Zara's opinion on this.
 
Firephoenixearl said:
Mathematically yes, but in fiction there very much is such a thing as "finitely or countably infinitely above infinity". It's the reason we have levels to 2-A to begin with.
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You can't exactly make such general statements in regards to something as broad as all of fiction, nevermind the fact that we still assume verses follow actual mathematics unless otherwise stated or implied. We do allow multiple infinite multiverses to be considered higher into 2-A if the verse deems it as so, yes, but that's an exception, not a rule.
 
You are completely missing the point. Earl is saying Low 1-C doesn’t work, so how does saying 2-A, possibly Low 1-C act as a compromise when Low 1-C is being argued against to begin with?
 
Since there's contention and arguments from both sides are fairly solid, "possibly Low 1-C" is the safest bet, I mean that's the only reason we have "possibly [insert tiering]" in the first place.
 
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