Two teenagers that get mad if people mess with their hairs fight

[Chariot190]

But enough about that, what's even your point? He didnt block those missiles to begin with? So no shit he's not gonna be able to restore em if he never made contact with em. You're arguing something that was never denied.

Unfortunately for Yang, she doesnt have the ability to fire projectiles from a variety of directions and take him from surprise given they all come from her gauntlets.

 

[Morlock435]

It wasn't by surprise! There is no feasible way he could not see that left pair of missiles unless he turned in a 270 degree direction to block the right pair. And the point is that he cannot automatically reflect projectiles back at his attacker without them doing damage. Look at the missiles in your picture, they did not explode because he didnt hit the part that carries the explosive ordinance. He can't do that to Yang, as the whole projectile itself is volatile, and enhanced by her semblance.

 

[LSirLancelotDuLacl]

Hmmm, with what I have seen so far I am leaning up for Yang.

 

[Thebannanaworkshop]

Even tho jouske could just floor yang then fuse her but yeah I'm not gonna influence your decision

 

[LSirLancelotDuLacl]

That sounds a little too passive aggressive for my liking.

And yes, I read the majority of the arguments and have seen part 4 in the manga. I still am siding in that direction.

 

[Thebannanaworkshop]

Okay but everyone needs to know if jouske really wants to he could floor yang and fuse her to the ground and yang can't really do anything about it.this whole argument is assuming jouske doesn't feel like killing yang in any other circumstance yang would win.

 

[Morlock435]

i can't believe i actually had to go into paint to demonstrate this

 

[Thebannanaworkshop]

You know because of how OP restoration is and all the arguments we just went through you would think people would be more civil.

 

[Chariot190]

>hat? He knocks aside the right pair of missiles that would require him to completely skip past the left pair. Do you ever reread your replies, both of your last paragraphs are so high and mighty. Every reply you have made even to my original post has been hostile. I just posted the context and there is no way he didnt see the left pair of missiles.

Uh, I hope you're joking, you do realize the camera shifted right? He didnt turn, the camera did. He's looking at his right side and only attacks his right side, the POV is what moved, like, actually, ever look in a mirror, I mean that unironically, it's the same concept. One panel is from behind, one is from the front, that's why it looks shifted.

I mean given he didn't notice the left pair of missiles, I'm inlcined to say he didnt notice the left pair of missiles, especially because we see him finally notice in the second page.

>they did not explode because he didnt hit the part that carries the explosive ordinance. He can't do that to Yang, as the whole projectile itself is volatile, and enhanced by her semblance.

You do know he purposely didnt restore those missiles though? He purposely broke them but didnt restore it so when his enemy got cocky and all high and mighty, he the activated his power and took his enemy from surprise up close by restoring the missile and blowing him up from close distance to beat him.

Now what's that mean? Well hopefully I dont have to explain but given it seems likely that I will, it means if he's actively using his powers to avoid getting hit by Yang's projectiles much like he does later on in the part, well no issue, they wont explode, they wont do anything, they'll never actually get far enough to explode, much like SHA didnt have time to explode even though it explodes upon contact, why? Because the exact moment that energy touches CD's fist, it's going back, it's in a constant of revertion till Josuke ceases it or it goes back to the point of origin. You're arguing that because CD punched the missile it didnt explode but not because of his power but because he simply didnt hit the detonator? Well, you're right, that is what happened but nobody was using that as an example in the first place, nobody is saying CD can revert yang's attacks without damage because of that scene, mostly because Josuke didnt do in that scene, he simply broke it and left it as a trap.

 

[Morlock435]

Yes, the page you posted was mirrored. if you flip it around though to orientate it with the previous page, you can see that his right arm is hitting the missiles. He then gets struck in the left by the other two, which as i showed he clearly saw. Look at the paint edit, it shows his path of vision he must have taken. this wasnt a surprise attack. Josuke simply doesnt have a feat of auto reflecting attacks without taking damage.

 

[Chariot190]

i can't believe i actually had to go into paint to demonstrate thi

Fair enough, although I'm still gonna say he didnt notice em because we see when he does indeed notice em, even accompanied by !!. Although gonna point out he's looking down and the missiles still change their trajectory to get him from behind. That much is blatant. Still was taken by surprise as the exclamation marks indicate and the whole missile trajectory.

 

[LSirLancelotDuLacl]

Okay but everyone needs to know if jouske really wants to he could floor yang and fuse her to the ground and yang can't really do anything about it.this whole argument is assuming jouske doesn't feel like killing yang in any other circumstance yang would win.

I find it ridiculous and pretty funny of you to assume and argue about this like it would be immensily easy to do.

 

[Chariot190]

> Josuke simply doesnt have a feat of auto reflecting attacks without taking damage.

Hold up, did you just ignore

>You do know he purposely didnt restore those missiles though? He purposely broke them but didnt restore it so when his enemy got cocky and all high and mighty, he the activated his power and took his enemy from surprise up close by restoring the missile and blowing him up from close distance to beat him. Now what's that mean? Well hopefully I dont have to explain but given it seems likely that I will, it means if he's actively using his powers to avoid getting hit by Yang's projectiles much like he does later on in the part, well no issue, they wont explode, they wont do anything, they'll never actually get far enough to explode, much like SHA didnt have time to explode even though it explodes upon contact, why? Because the exact moment that energy touches CD's fist, it's going back, it's in a constant of revertion till Josuke ceases it or it goes back to the point of origin. You're arguing that because CD punched the missile it didnt explode but not because of his power but because he simply didnt hit the detonator? Well, you're right, that is what happened but nobody was using that as an example in the first place, nobody is saying CD can revert yang's attacks without damage because of that scene, mostly because Josuke didnt do in that scene, he simply broke it and left it as a trap.

 

[Morlock435]

Let's even say that Josuke didnt see the missiles. How does this in any way prove that Josuke can reflect attacks without taking damage? People say it happened in the fight against superfly, oh turns out it didnt Josuke got hurt. People said he did it vs bad comapany. oh he didnt turns out he got hurt. Josuke has absolutely 0 feats of autodeflecting explosive attacks without taking damage.

 

[Chariot190]

> find it ridiculous and pretty funny of you to assume and argue about this like it would be immensily easy to do.

Now to be fair, it honestly aint that hard to do if he's talking about the fusing, Obviously he aint gonna floor her but fusing just requires Yang and something else to be in contact. Whether that be rock, the floor, etc. In theory he could do it with Yang's own gauntlets if he really wanted, would he though? Unless vehemtly pissed off I doubt it.

 

[Chariot190]

>Let's even say that Josuke didnt see the missiles. How does this in any way prove that Josuke can reflect attacks without taking damage? People say it happened in the fight against superfly, oh turns out it didnt Josuke got hurt. People said he did it vs bad comapany. oh he didnt turns out he got hurt. you even just said yourself that the missiles Josuke sent back weren't the one that he batted aside without exploding! you just gave validity to my point. Josuke has absolutely 0 feats of autodeflecting explosive attacks without taking damage.

Wot, actually what, he did do it in Superfly though? CD reverts the energy he touched without damage, Josuke took damage, but not from the energy CD touched. Two different things.

Nobody said anything about it happening in Bad Company. At least I didnt, most I said about Bad Company was that Josuke effected the Stand. And uh, I actually said exactly that? The missiles CD sent back where the ones he touched? The missiles that tagged him hit him and that was it, never to be seen again.

Nobody gave validity to your point, mostly because the former actually happened, Josuke was damaged by ones CD never touched, you skipped SHA, and the Bad Company example was never actually a example.

 

[Thebannanaworkshop]

Okay but everyone needs to know if jouske really wants to he could floor yang and fuse her to the ground and yang can't really do anything about it.this whole argument is assuming jouske doesn't feel like killing yang in any other circumstance yang would win.

I find it ridiculous and pretty funny of you to assume and argue about this like it would be immensily easy to do.

Very easy close your eyes and imagine flooring her then open your eyes.thats my strat anyways

 

[Chariot190]

>Very easy close your eyes and imagine flooring her then open your eyes.thats my strat anyways

To be honest, that just sounds a bit like bias. I don't like the usage of the word flooring, it makes it sound like he's stronger, he aint.

 

[Bedroombedrock]

Her Dura would scale to her AP, she isnt getting floored easily, maybe knocked back a bit when caught off gaurd by CD but floored is not happening

 

[Morlock435]

It was bedroomBedrocks reply where he said that he reversed Bad Companies missiles as well as superfly's energy on contact. which is demonstratably wrong. Looking through the Superfly fight again but im very sure there isnt a point where he just nopes the attack back at him. Even then its a different case since yang's projectiles are stronger AND enhanced by her semblance and explode unlike superfly's projectiles.

 

[LSirLancelotDuLacl]

Very easy close your eyes and imagine flooring her then open your eyes.thats my strat anyways

Your tone keeps getting worse and worse. Leaving aside the AP difference, he'd have a much easier time fusing something like her gloves instead of her to the ground, like Char proposed, leaving aside the possibility of him doing that.

 

[Chariot190]

>there isnt a point where he just nopes the attack back at him

How about the literal way he defeats the enemy by restoring the rebounded energy back at him? How did you manage to miss that?

Hell here's the chapter.

Well I aint Bed, I never made that claim but it is true he reversed his missiles, he just delayed the effect to lay a trap, he just didnt do it instantly, so it's half right.

> Even then its a different case since yang's projectiles are stronger AND enhanced by her semblance and explode unlike superfly's projectiles.

Her projectiles are around the same strength as CD, it'd just be like doing a fisticuff clash against another Stand. Dont think they're enhanced by her semblance but even then, they arent exploding on contact and the most that would happen is, well not much really given the projectiles lose all their momentum and KE upon contact and instantly start going backward upon contact with CD's fist.

Also SHA dude, why do you keep ignoring that? CD punched SHA, and instead of exploding it began retracing it's path and trajectory backwards and never ended up exploding. Even though it does explode, even if it's a Stand doing the contact, see Star Platinum.

 

[Morlock435]

Yeah i thought so, I couldnt remember what it was that did all the energy attacks at Josuke. It was knife cuts, so because superfly reflects everything it takes exactly, it sent back an equivalent force to what was a bunch of knife slashes. I wouldnt even call this comparable, not only were the energy projectiles reflectable (which yangs projectiles are not), the strength of them is not comparable to one of Yang's attacks. especially powered by semblance. And even then this is STILL not an example of Josuke nulling an explosion. These were effectively knife slashes flying through the air. (this is not to say they were weak since they hurt a building+ character) but the attacks arent equivalent. Gonna go and reread the SHA panels next.

 

[Bedroombedrock]

His power isn't really limited by AP, id doubt it caps at his own ap either

 

[Bedroombedrock]

Also you're just playing semantics at this point, he's not nulling explosions he's just restoring them, and he's already shown to be able to restore explosions and raw energy

 

[Morlock435]

Well yeah, it reflects the attack that it recieved. If yang punched it she would be hit by an attack that is her AP. And i wouldnt exactly say Superfly's stand user was more powerful than josuke for that attack. Also i just read chapter 363, Sheer Heart Attack wasn't in the process of exploding when Josuke reverts it back to Kira. there was no signs of him even starting to explode. No smoke, no fire, no nothing.

 

[Bedroombedrock]

Josuke reverts Hayato before he disentigrated into nothing, whom Kira explicitly turned into a bomb. He's restoring not reflecting. It's semantics

 

[Chariot190]

You realize that the things in question are rebounded in the exact same way they and are manifested as the same type of energy right? It's energy, explicitly energy, kinetic energy specifically. The deflected damage takes on the form of exactly what it is. Crazy Diamond punches it? It manifests as the Crazy Diamond punching it back for example.

>energy projectiles reflectable

Crazy Diamond deflected the rebounded energy, specifically of a kinetic variety. Which is what Yang uses, what's that mean? Nothing, other than CD can revert KE energy.

And ignoring the fact Crazy Diamond reverted a transmutated Hayato mid exploding so we know he can revert explosions anyway, you fail to understand what's actually happening here. Crazy Diamond, if he so chooses, can stop the projectiles in their tracks upon contact with his fist, instantly stop its momentum, energy and power and reverse it back along its original trajectory ceasing any and all potential damage, given he doesnt delay the effect and punches the projectile.

 

[Morlock435]

I know it kind of seems like semantics. The whole point of it all is that Crazy Diamond isn't just invincible to projectiles, auto reverting every attack that he see coming. Would you also argue that if a projectile that he saw coming such as, lets say a 7-A (random power above him selected) bullet, hit him, it wouldnt hurt because he would revert it back? because you HAVE to argue that point otherwise your point doesnt work. If he doesnt take damage from a sembalnce Yang then he wouldnt take damage from that either.

 

[Chariot190]

> Also i just read chapter 363, Sheer Heart Attack wasn't in the process of exploding when Josuke reverts it back to Kira. there was no signs of him even starting to explode. No smoke, no fire, no nothing.

Yes, SHA didnt explode, because Crazy Diamond reverted him back, he never got the chance to explode becaue CD restored him preventing the explosion, if CD did not restore it, SHA would of exploded as it explodes upon contact with things, even in retaliation to a Stand punching it, such as Star Platinum, SHA never got that far though because CD said lol no sayonara. This really shouldnt be difficult to understand, I dont even know why this has to be explained.

 

[Bedroombedrock]

hard to say, it's hax and most hax usually dont have a known tier, usually let's you go above your own tier, so I doubt he can't revert things of his own levels of AP

 

[Chariot190]

Yang's bullets arent overly strong compared to him, it'd be no different than clashing fists with another Stand in practice. And even in semblance, he'd be taking that force, for an infintasmly small amount of time before it deals any real damage, to give an idea, You ever watch the slow mo guys? It'd be like that, imagine that the bullet hits whatever theyre shooting, it causes maybe some surface level epedermis damage but then instantly stops everything and reverts and stops dealing said damage.

Fyi that's assuming that it doesnt instantly take effect and begin reversing, if it does and the effect is instant, well technically speaking, yeah he'd take 0 damage as the projectile instantly reverted it's KE away from him.

 

[Morlock435]

In chapter 355, Star platinum punches Sheer Heart Attack not in stopped time and doesnt explode. SHA does not always explode when punched, lets not forget Echoes Act 3 also hit it multiple times to freeze it and it didnt explode there either. There is a delay. It really really sucks to argue semantics like this but it does matter since the situations arent equivalent, it doesnt give Josuke the ability to null explosives that he punches. Even when he reverted Hayato, that was another person that he reverted. As is well known by everyone else, Josuke can't affect himself with his stand. That (the Hayato thing) is by far the best point, but its actually really hard to say its equivalent. If Josuke could just punch an explosion itself and revert it that would break a lot of what happens in diamond is unbreakable. There is always a tangible object that he reverts.

 

[Morlock435]

SHA he punches and reverts back to kira, SHA wasnt in the process of exploding. Hayato he punched pieces of which then reverted back (even though he cant bring people back to life but ok). Superfly the knife slashes manifested as projectiles slashes, which he then deflected. All of these are tangible things that he deflects and reverts. But i don't see how that equates to nulling something that explodes on contact. And personally im not of the belief that if CD punched a for example 7-A bullet he would be fine if he reverted it. I think that's nonsense.

Edit; missed 1 word that changes the context of what i said a lot, if you read it already before this edit please reread.

 

[Chariot190]

Ya know, I could pull up the scans that suggest otherwise such as SHA exploding on contact, (Jotaro even says as much literal panels before SHA gets restored and thus not to touch the thing). But better yet to simply nip it at the bud, Here Hayato, of which Josuke punches and restores while he's already an exploding ball of fire.

Although you're still misintepreting the argument in general, SHA never exploded because he was restored, even if it isnt 100% instant, he would of exploded anyway, never did though , he was reverted.

>Crazy Diamond had only restored tangible objects.

The fact he can use his ability on Stands completely shuts that point down, the fact he can restore Okuyasu who was turned into eletricity back to normal under his power, not RHCP's shuts that down, the hayato fireball thing as well, and Superfly's weird ass energy rebound as well. None of those are tangible. Yet he can fix em because they're cohesive.

>If Josuke could just punch an explosion itself and revert it that would break a lot of what happens in diamond is unbreakable.

How? Literally never got the chance too before Hayato, and once he knows that he can do it, he straight up tells Kira he doesnt give a shit about hostages because he can fix em even if they blow up.

 

[Chariot190]

I'd like to make special note of that when Kira's bombs explode, it's the matter, the object in question becoming the explosion, not simply exploding. By restoring Hayato, he's explicitly restoring the already transmutated bits that already became an explosion given Hayato is already half gone by the time he tries to heal.

 

[Morlock435]

I disagree though. With Hayato he was punching bits of Hayato, which then got reverted back to a full Hayato. With Okayasu and RHCP, he hit Okayasu before he got turned into energy (or it might have been that josuke had a piece of Okayasu, either way this is not Crazy Diamond punching energy), then activated his ability once Okayasu became energy. He never actually punched them while they were in the energy form. This last one is a bit weird to think about but you stated this yourself in an earlier reply. Superfly returns an attack as it was. When Josuke and Okayasu were hitting the tower, it returned their attacks as a bunch of fists, this makes those knife rebounds conceptually a flying edge of a knife. That one is really weird to think about it i know, but that is a tangible object. if it was pure energy being reflected it wouldnt have manifested as the tower itself punching them. it would be whatever energy looks like striking them.

 

[Morlock435]

Yes Hayato becomes a bomb himself, but wouldnt that mean that his entire body would vaporize instantaneously leaving Josuke unable to heal him? To me it seems like the bomb originates from the center of the object then goes outwards, which is why Hayato's extremities were the last to vaporize.

 

[Chariot190]

Yes, bits of transmutated, flaming, bits of Hayato. Hayato was already half a bomb and the rest of him was already underway, as indicated by the fact he's glowing orange and black, he was already half an explosion and the bits that weren't were on the onset of igniting.

Missed the point on the Okuyasu thing, it doesnt matter what CD touched in that instance, as CD used his preciion in his ability to restore not what he had on him, but Okuyasu's main body, which was converted into pure eletrical energy. Cd's power was capable of reverting that state of energy. What matter's here is that the restoration effects energy, it does, it reverted an energy Okuyasu.

While you have a point, that isn't what happened in the instance of the knife or even the bullet screws, Superfly rebounded not the actual act of the knife hitting it but the energy and damage that the knife left it, opposed to where it rebounded the actual act of Crazy Diamond punching it. Honestly thinking on it, I don't know why it differentiated it but point is the things CD restored, fortunately is stated to be pure energy and the rebounding of the damage the knife inflicted. Actually ****, I'm gonna do some research and look at the original manga as well as JoJoveller.

Ok, I checked. It's kinda fucky but the user does actually explain it. All energy and force (in context is kinetic energy) is absorbed by the tower, sent throughout an then sent back out. Even bringing up the conversation of energy in that all energy applied to the twoer will be redirected back out. Not only that but the method of energy applied will be sent back out the same way it was applied, if the energy is of the kinetic variety it'll be unleashed as kinetic, if it's a slash or a cut, it'll be sent back out as the same type of energy. Even abilities will be sent back out if the ability in question is offensive. Which tells us two things, yes Crazy Diamond did indeed manage to revert the kinetic energy and force (that's a keyword in the explanation) but the fact that the Stand's punching it is rebounded as the Stands as well seems odd, if we take it face value, it's rebounding the Stand Energy in that case. Which is neat I guess? Regardless it's explained and said to be explicitly simply returning the energy and force back as per the conversation of energy dictates. (Depending on the energy and force as well it may not even be visible as shown with the energy rebound that cut Mikitaka). Also paying close attention, the energy seems to be intangible as well, given it could cloak objects and use them as projectiles so it isnt a solid type of energy. ****, there's actually a lot of tiny details regarding this Stand, more so than most. This thing deserves a profile.

Actually, Hayato's limbs where shown to be engulfed and exploding as well (his arm started exploding first), it's all simutaneous, unless it's a transfer charge, in which the explosion begins where the the contact with the charge was made, although there is an implosion afterward after in most cases that gets rid of the dust and smoke.

 

[Chariot190]

Thanks autocorrect, conservation of energy, not conversation.