Travis Touchdown vs Grimgor Ironhide! WAAAGH!

[Blackcurrant91]

Again Grimgor fights massive groups of people who are more skilled and agile then Travis.

 

[Armorchompy]

Skill isn't a magic trick that you can use to automatically prevent your opponent from dodging, you know? Obviously you're gonna know when to punch and how to defend yourself but it doesn't make it impossible for someone to just move out of the way of an attack, especially when they've got instinctive reaction to help with that.

 

[Blackcurrant91]

I dont see how Travis can hit Grimgor enough to kill him without opening himself up to a Grab into Headbutt. Travis can't magically attack and dodge at the same time against a more skilled opponent with a massive reach advantage. Grimgor abuses his range advantage, grabs Travis headbutts him and knocks him out.

 

[Armorchompy]

Range advantage? Travis has got a sword that can grow from 1.5 meters up to 3 meters long lmao. Also the fact that Grimgor beats agile and skilled people doesn't mean he's immune to Travis just getting behind him if he doesn't have the mobility to counter that. Finally, you're greatly underselling Travis' stamina here, the dude getting the shit beaten out of him before every fight is basically a ritual in No More Heroes, and he has regen too. A headbutt is absolutely not enough, especially considering it's coming from someone without a big AP advantage (if there's any)

In fact, if Grimgor does indeed go for grabs a lot, that's a great opportunity for Travis to punch/kick and stun him to both get out of his grab and set up a perfect winning situation. Or just stab him in the face but I assume Grimgor would expect that lmao

 

[Blackcurrant91]

Grimgor is covered neck to toes in Glomril plate, punching/kicking him isn't gonna do shit. Grimgor isn't just going to give Travis his back, he would back himself into a corner sooner then do that. Punching/Kicking Grimgor isn't going to be enough to make him let Travis go.

 

[Armorchompy]

Travis can stun people through armor too, but he can just hit him in the face anyway. And yeah, he stuns people hard enough that they're completely defenseless for a few seconds.

Also this is in the middle of a battlefield, there's no corner to back yourself into

 

[Blackcurrant91]

I mean dwarves and orcs act as a nice barrier for him to abuse. Saying he can stun Grimgor just because enemies in No More Heroes get stunned by his physical attacks is kinda weird. We talking about someone twice his size with skin harder then leather and covered in plate who literally doesn't feelpain. No way is Grimgor letting go if he gets a grab. Class 100 lifting strength goes burr.

 

[Armorchompy]

I mean dwarves and orcs act as a nice barrier for him to abuse. Saying he can stun Grimgor just because enemies in No More Heroes get stunned by his physical attacks is kinda weird. We talking about someone twice his size with skin harder then leather and covered in plate.

Travis can stun undead who seemingly can't feel any pain or dudes who're blocking the attack with several inches of metal, and Shinobu who's less skilled than him can straight-up stun robots somehow (I say she can cause travis never fights them). Besides, armor and tough skin don't change the fact that Grimgor's durability isn't superior to Travis' attack, it's not like he can just shrug off blows from him anyway (well, if it wasn't for the stun he would, but only cause of stamina, not durability)

No way is Grimgor letting go if he gets a grab. Class 100 lifting strength goes burr.

He could have class P for all it matters, if he's stunned he's not going to be able to keep grappling even a toddler. This is cartoon-style "waddle back and forth confused while stars circle above your head for several seconds", to clear things up. And once again, if nothing else works Travis can just tank the headbutt then pull out one of his swords (assuming grimgor disarmed him) and cut off grimgor's arm/head

 

[Blackcurrant91]

I think you're underestimating Grimgor's stamina now. This is a guy that fights for weeks to months at a time.

 

[Armorchompy]

I'm not saying Travis can outlast him, don't get me wrong. But stunning someone is completely unrelated to their stamina, especially when it's such an unrealistic kind of stun. I assume he has no feats of resisting this kinda stuff.

 

[Blackcurrant91]

Grimgor resisting getting stunned? (If I was trolling I would say he beat Gork himself in a headbutting contest so he resists Low 1-C stuns)

orcs in general are incredibly resistant to stuns hence why they go for head butting as first move in a grapple. Grimgor headbutted Archaon so hard he almost shat his pants.

Lets be real its not like its some magical effect that guarantees that he gets stunned, stuns are caused by damage to the head or by doing major damage to someones body. (Honestly I would argue its just a game mechanic anyway and he is hitting someone a lot tougher in the head then anyone in his verse) I dont see how Travis landing 1 hit guarentees Grimgor is stunned, not to mention orcs fight purely on fighting instinct and can basically fight with brain damage.

 

[Armorchompy]

I don't really agree with the "tougher head than anyone in the verse" since they're about the same in AP and literally everyone in No More Heroes can keep fighting after being suplexed head-first into the ground, but either way, I really don't see how Grimlock could ever grab Travis without being gutted by him as a direct consequence, sure he's tall but his arms don't have more reach than a dude with a sword, from what I understand.

 

[Naito-desu]

Based on the arguments, and the profiles I'm leaning more towards Grimgor, for the skill gap and his superior lifting strength. The stun argument is a little flimsy from my perspective, though I have little to no energy to properly counter it, so I'll side with Blackcurrant's reasoning and vote Grimgor

 

[Armorchompy]

Ok but like, that's ONLY if Grimgor manages to get past Travis' superior range and gets a grab BEFORE Travis manages to get either of his speed amps going. And keep in mind, this is in the middle of a battlefield so Travis can just kill a couple of random enemies to build up Super Mode way faster than usual.

There's also the fact that LS is obviously gonna prevent any escape from being grabbed, but what's Grimgor gonna do then? His hands are busy and he's not superior in AP, I don't see how that situation is particularly advantageous for him.

 

[Blackcurrant91]

I don't really agree with the "tougher head than anyone in the verse" since they're about the same in AP and literally everyone in No More Heroes can keep fighting after being suplexed head-first into the ground, but either way, I really don't see how Grimlock could ever grab Travis without being gutted by him as a direct consequence, sure he's tall but his arms don't have more reach than a dude with a sword, from what I understand.

I mean I don't think Grimgor wins with one headbutt based on what you said. Grimgor is going to try to fight with Gitsnik first before he goes for a grapple unless he has an opening so he would have a slight range advantage. He will just use his superior lifting strength to combo the shit out of Travis if he does land a grab. I honestly don't know who wins this. It seems like a fight that would go one way 4-6 times out of 10 and the other 4-6 times out of 10

 

[Armorchompy]

I can agree actually, I thought it was mid-diff before but with Gitsnik actually resisting heat I can compromise on an inconclusive if you're willing to as well.

 

[Blackcurrant91]

Yeah, its a 50-50 from what I can tell

 

[Armorchompy]

Changing my vote to Incon then. Good matchup, honestly.

 

[Armorchompy]

By the way I just remembered, Travis' stunning attacks work perfectly fine on Skelter Helter, who kept talking and moving even after his head got cut off just by sticking it back on- he didn't regenerate or anything he just kept going after that. This doesn't really change my Incon vote but I do think it's decent evidence in favor of stuns working

 

[SomaKing13]

I can agree with it being Inconclusive, both seem to have a pretty definitive ways of ending the fight and counter each other pretty well, so incon it is

 

[Sonicflare9]

some shiny git fra

 

[Sergeant_Hypocrite]

Incon FRA

 

[Armorchompy]

Seems like Travis might get upgraded to Class K. So uh, Grimgor ain't gonna be grappling anymore. I'm still fine with Incon tho.

 

[Jimboyjuan12]

I looks like going voted for Incon FRA

 

[Armorchompy]

bump

 

[Loyd]

incon fra

 

[Armorchompy]

bump

 

[Armorchompy]

bump

 

[Starter_Pack]

Inconclusive FRA.

 

[Armorchompy]

bump

 

[Oleggator]

Inconclusive FRA and I guess that's grace

 

[Armorchompy]

hallelujah

 

[Armorchompy]

who adds this?

 

[Armorchompy]

... that'll be me, i'll add this