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Transformers General Discussion

RippleFrog said:
There is a lot of universe level stuff for Cybertron/Galaxy Force that should scale to Optimus/Megatron and the other Key Leaders, but it is very much an avatar of Vector Prime in that show. There is not really a way to scale anybody to Vector's best showings/lore based on the show and its tie in information.

I don't agree in general with scaling the Unicron Singularity to anyone but Primus who closed it. The Singularity is extremely convoluted and difficult to scale linearly because it manifests both inside universes/timelines while also acting outside of them. Thus from the perspective in one universe, you witness it slowly suck in planets and destroy the universe, even though it is also destroying time outside of this and affecting the multiverse as a whole.

Despite Vector saying in the show the Singularity will destroy all universes, Galvatron only ever says specifically he is going to use the Omega Lock to survive the destruction of their universe and create a new one. That is pretty solid grounds for not scaling him or any of the other main cast to the black hole. Primus was also running on fumes up until the very end of the show and it isn't "True Primus" regardless who has never appeared since the 80s and exactly one panel of a Regeneration One flashback, so no justification for Primus-scaling either.

I am honestly quite happy that Cybertron is as strong as it is though, it's a fantastic show with a cosmic scope I miss. It's the strongest cartoon continuity by a fair margin and it deserves that spot.
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I unfrotunately never watched Cybertron since it was never dubbed in my country, the only thing I've ever seen from it are the transformations which, probably repetitive in the show, I found quite cool, favorite being Mudflap! Anyhow, Low 2-C seems neat I guess, though I'll say that, while Megatron holding an entire dimension together is a solid feat for Lifting Strength, I think more stuff that supports the tier 2 ratings is welcomable (Specially if Galvatron says he needs the Omega lock to survive the destruction, though if there is enough tier 2 feats, it is probably just PIS)
 
Drite77 said:
I unfrotunately never watched Cybertron since it was never dubbed in my country, the only thing I've ever seen from it are the transformations which, probably repetitive in the show, I found quite cool, favorite being Mudflap! Anyhow, Low 2-C seems neat I guess, though I'll say that, while Megatron holding an entire dimension together is a solid feat for Lifting Strength, I think more stuff that supports the tier 2 ratings is welcomable (Specially if Galvatron says he needs the Omega lock to survive the destruction, though if there is enough tier 2 feats, it is probably just PIS)
Click to expand...
There's quite a lot of lore for Cybertron especially as we have some raws from the DVD booklets to work from now, but off the top of my head the main reason there's any 2c scaling across the board is that this universe-survivingg Galvatron has his shields broken by Optimus (who does not have an Omega Lock) and this Galvatron is ultimately beaten by Optimus, Scourge, Override, and Evac. There's a lot of shounen powerup syndrome going on in the show, so even after this whole thing is resolved, in later episodes Galvatron comes back for one more round with Optimus on the moon where he is able to overpower him until Optimus gets Rhisling.

It's a kind of convoluted scaling chain and I'd have to take some time to sort the information but that's the short version, it supports itself when you dig far enough into it but sounds kind of outlandish out of context. It's Transformers though so hey.

Regardless of all that though, definitely do not believe the show or Balancing Act tie-in supports the show characters being at 1A.
 
SpookyGunShip said:
I have a Megatron (Galaxy force) profile completed. It just needs to be reviewed.

https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/User_blog:SpookyGunShip/Galaxy_force_megatron
Click to expand...
The others already state it, but everything about this profile is pretty much wrong.

1. Why is Galvatron weaker than Megatron?

2. Vector Prime's avatars heavily vary from universe to universe. There's nothing to show he'd scale to his highest level of feats in this show, especially when the Cybertron comic implies he's pretty weakened after scrapping with Ramjet. Same goes for Primus.

3. Massively FTL+ has no calc behind it, and Unmeasurable speed isn't justification for Immeasurable speed.

4. Holding the fire dimension open wouldn't be a universal LS feat, that's just portal creation from the looks of it.

5. Several justifications in the P&A lacks scans or any type of references

6. The Black hole in no way scales to Outerverse level. The singularity has nothing to shown it'll affect the Tree of Life. Even during just Cybertron, it wasn't shown to be spreading throughout the entire universe just yet, and it's main power is that it can simply replicate itself from reality to reality. At best, this is Universe level+ with Low Multiverse level range.

7. That's not really justification for Nigh Omniscience.

It's better for you to list down and collect other proper feats from Cybertron than haphazardly doing it like this.
 
  1. It doesn’t say Galvatron is weaker than Megatron.
  2. Un and Im are both prefixes for “not”.
  3. He actually can open portals, except it looks completely different than the dimension feat.
  4. I'm scaling the black hole to hyper, not outer.
 
SpookyGunShip said:
It doesn’t say Galvatron is weaker than Megatron.
Click to expand...
Why is Galvatron 5-B and 1-A at the same time?

SpookyGunShip said:
Un and Im are both prefixes for “not”.
Click to expand...
Things like that can often be used hyperbole for characters just being insanely fast. Nothing in it shows it lines up with the wiki's standards of what Immeasurable speed is.

SpookyGunShip said:
He actually can open portals, except it looks completely different than the dimension feat.
Click to expand...
It's just him tearing a hole open through the dimension. That's just a hax feat.

SpookyGunShip said:
I'm scaling the black hole to hyper, not outer.
Click to expand...
The blog says otherwise, that and there isn't anything either that shows the singularity would affect the Multiverse' higher dimensions, only space and time.
 
ByAsura said:
Also, how weakened was Primus when he fired at Galvatron?
Click to expand...
We don't how much, but he was already weakened before due to not having the omega lock, apparently being weakened further before that, and Galvatron was amped by both the omega lock and Unicron's power.
 
SpookyGunShip said:
They can but it makes sense for Super starscream and Primus.
Click to expand...
It really doesn't. The databook doesn't mention anything else beyond unmeasurable speed. Again, Primus' avatars vary. And Primus is not at full strength here. Even if Primus is at full strength, nothing would show that this specific Primus scales to his higher end feats.

And where did you get the databook translated?

SpookyGunShip said:
Jetfire states the dimension was collapsing so it's a universal feat.
Click to expand...
Is there even anything that shows said dimension is Universal in size? From what I gather, it's just a pocket dimension, and we don't give ratings for something so vague.
 
SpookyGunShip said:
What else does it need to mention?
Click to expand...
vsbattles.fandom.com

Speed

Speed is simply how fast a character can move in a given amount of time. There are five types of speed used for VS purposes: Attack Speed, Combat Speed, Reaction Speed, Travel Speed, and Flight Speed. The term "Speed" normally refers to Combat Speed. The speed at which an attack moves. For...
vsbattles.fandom.com vsbattles.fandom.com

SpookyGunShip said:
Google translate
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Yeah, iirc we don't allow Google translation. You're gonna have to get a proper translation or request it from here.

SpookyGunShip said:
Megatron was using the full power of the Unicron armor which is universal, indicating it’s that size.
Click to expand...
And what states the Unicron armor is Universal? Like how does it's durability correlate to the size of the dimension.
 
Emirp sumitpo said:
Could you show it?
Click to expand...
8z7VFfn.jpeg
 
Emirp sumitpo said:
Why though. Why would his forcefield be so insanely lower.


Your scan is heavily out of context. It would only affect the entire multiverse if Ramjet's plan succeeded. It did not. So it wouldn't scale to 1-B.
Click to expand...
it was supposed to destroy the entire multiverse even in the show according to Vector, but this is a moot point because of the way the black hole works in general, nobody but Primus can actually scale to the entire thing. The Primus that Galvatron “beat” didn’t even have all his power at the time (and is just an avatar body so???)
 
RippleFrog said:
it was supposed to destroy the entire multiverse even in the show according to Vector, but this is a moot point because of the way the black hole works in general, nobody but Primus can actually scale to the entire thing. The Primus that Galvatron “beat” didn’t even have all his power at the time (and is just an avatar body so???)
Click to expand...
Galvatron with the omega lock stated himself to be stronger than Unicron and Primus. I’m not sure which Unicron though.
 
SpookyGunShip said:
He was actually making it grow instead of stopping it.
Click to expand...
that was a last resort after Optimus, Scourge, Evac , and Override beat him. He just tossed the Lock straight into the black hole. The fact that with the lock he was overpowered by Optimus and the other planet leaders should also signify he was not as powerful as Primus is
 
SpookyGunShip said:
It is allowed
Click to expand...
Only for smaller stuff. Stuff like databook require proper translations from members.

SpookyGunShip said:
8z7VFfn.jpeg
Click to expand...
"spreading across the universe" seems to be a mistranslation. From what I'm getting, it's likely referring to the Unicron Singularity, which Megatron doesn't scale to. Again, you really need to get better translations.

SpookyGunShip said:
Galvatron with the omega lock stated himself to be stronger than Unicron and Primus. I’m not sure which Unicron though.
Click to expand...
Unicron also heavily varies so this isn't a good point either.

RippleFrog said:
it was supposed to destroy the entire multiverse even in the show according to Vector, but this is a moot point because of the way the black hole works in general, nobody but Primus can actually scale to the entire thing. The Primus that Galvatron “beat” didn’t even have all his power at the time (and is just an avatar body so???)
Click to expand...
I'm aware, I'm just saying the way it functions, it's not outright 1-B overall and heavily relies on chain reactions + overtime
 
What is the rule on multipliers? The Armada Dreamwave's minicons are more like Amps then unlocking new powers (Outside of Red Alert) and it stacks a lot. Is the rule of thumb 2x or should it should be "higher" on the profile?
 
Drite77 said:
What is the rule on multipliers? The Armada Dreamwave's minicons are more like Amps then unlocking new powers (Outside of Red Alert) and it stacks a lot. Is the rule of thumb 2x or should it should be "higher" on the profile?
Click to expand...
If a multiplier is outright stated or unless there’s enough (usually a lot) of evidence that some kind of multiplier exists. If not then it just gets added as “higher”
 
Unrelated Note, I've been rewatching the Michael Bay Movies cause my siblings simply got the urge of rewaching them for some reason.

The 2007 Movie is better then I remember, 4/10

RotF is somehow worse then I remember, 3/10

Don't watch these movies, watch TF One '-'
 
Drite77 said:
Unrelated Note, I've been rewatching the Michael Bay Movies cause my siblings simply got the urge of rewaching them for some reason.

The 2007 Movie is better then I remember, 4/10

RotF is somehow worse then I remember, 3/10

Don't watch these movies, watch TF One '-'
Click to expand...
And yet TF One is flopping
 
ByAsura said:
It really is.

Imo, all post-DoTM movies are somehow even more painful than RotF.
Click to expand...
I remember it, I have seen them only once and I don't see myself revisting their soundtracks or their action scenes like RotF or DotM, they might be legitimate 2/10s... if I ever decide to watch them again '-'
 
DaReaperMan said:
What hurts more? Age of Extinction or The Last Knight?
Click to expand...
AoE is at least watchable, had decent fight scenes, and added some new energy and somewhat interesting concepts into the film series, like unaligned Transformers. Plus, it had some beautiful locations and colour saturation.

TLK was completely dry and boring, and also looked dry and boring 90% of the time.
 
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