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Touhou: Amitabha controversy

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Schnee_One

Schnee_One

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I really don't know how to feel about Amitabha (Touhou Project) being a page on this site.

There is a single vague line of dialogue that gives this character these stats, and it results in multiple other characters getting scaled of of this. I have a problem with this for several reasons.

-It is a single vague line of dialogue that might not even refer to something like Amitabha existing.

-No other feat in the series is close to this.

-The characters who get scaling off of this don't a have the ability to do said feats, Amitabha gets this because of his supposed size, which the characters who scale do not have.

Should we really accept this?
 
You do make some good points. I would appreciate further community input.
 
Why are all the good usernames taken? rs said:
1. How is it Vague? She gave spefic measurements for him. That's like saying a detailed bio is vague.

2. Hes a God. Donso.

3. Exactly. His tier is because of his size.
Click to expand...
Measurements for what? How do we know it exists? Comparing a detailed Bio to a single line of dialogue is ridiculous.

2. And yet we scale it to others.

3. Then why are people scaled? I'm assuming you missed my point.

That should be removed then.
 
1. ?

2. This completely irrelevant to why others are scaled.

3. Again, irrelevant.
 
1. I was comparing two things with a to point out how calling something highly detailed vague is ludicrous.

2. I presume the others are scaled via being similar in power. Amitabha is gigantic, the energy required to say move an arm would be enormous. The beings scaled to Amitabha would have similar anounts of energy, despite the size diffrence.
 
Why are all the good usernames taken? rs said:
1. I was comparing two things with a to point out how calling something highly detailed vague is ludicrous.

2. I presume the others are scaled via being similar in power. Amitabha is gigantic, the energy required to say move an arm would be enormous. The beings scaled to Amitabha would have similar anounts of energy, despite the size diffrence.
Click to expand...
1. Because a single dialogue statement is far from "highly detailed"

2. You presume?
 
Yeah no, they shouldn't scale.

Hecatia has the strongest so far statement but that likely doesnt include Amitabha, the others are lunar gods and while they > Gensokyo we have no reason to believe they're a few way too many zeroes above universal.

Then we'd also need to scale Eirin, Kaguya, etc to be that tier.

Unless there's an explicit statement of them being on par it definitely should not scale.

Edit: Apparently it's because he's implied to be part of the lunar capital, not even confirmed
 
1. It gave spefic measurements and the such.

2. I am admittedly not a expert on the verse, i just played a few games. I didnt really pay attention to the power scaling. I just presumed that the reasons for certain characters > Amitabha were solid. Are they not?

If so you can toss out the scaling though Amitabha tier should still stay.
 
1. Hardly worth a mention.

2. They don't even say the characters are stronger, just comparable.

I'm about to leave, if someone can get some more input that'd be helpful
 
"Hey, Amitabha, who lives in Paradise, is 6×10^125 yojana tall, right? Just 'above the clouds' isn't even..."

"Umm, if that's the case, Amitabha's height is far greater than the scope of the universe, at least according to the Big Bang Theory. That's some ridiculous inflation."

This is literally as non-vague as you can possibly get.
 
Also,

"No other feat in the series is close to this."

This guy is a god-tier and the only people who scale to him are stronger than everyone else. "There's no feat close to it" is not a valid argument. It's like saying 3-A Goku is an outlier.
 
Goku actually has feats though, he's half the reason why 3-A is a thing.

Ya can still be stronger than most others and not be as strong as the literal god tier.
 
Where does it say that Hecatia and Tsukuyomi don't scale to/are weaker than Amitabha? ovo

Also, implication =/= confirmation.
 
@J-Man

The point is that "no other feat is close to this" isn't a valid reason when this guy scales to no one except for two characters who scale from being stronger than everyone.
 
I'm...gonna have to side with everyone else on this. Amitabha, as much as I hate him for being faster than Wally, is a legit profile, but the others scaling to him isn't...okay. Iirc, best feat for was like, below Frieza Saga characters. Them being ridiculously above 3-A because of a rarely mentioned thing isn't something we should take into consideration.
 
Amitabha is perfectly fine but scaling isn't, him being part of the lunar capital is neither confirmed or denied, id rather just say nah untill it is confirmed and even then I'd need a statement.

Plus if we do this Eirin would scale.
 
If you're not gonna read that thread...

Well I mean, the only reason Hecatia and Tsukuyomi get their "possibly 3-A" ratings is from an implication that Amitabha is one amongst the Lunar Pantheon, since he is one of "the highest and most noble" gods in an interview with ZUN. Popular gods like Bishamonten are Native (Earth) Gods, but Amitabha shouldn't be a part of the Earth pantheon given its status as 3-A, so as a higher god, it would most likely be part of the Lunar pantheon, which has no higher pantheons except Hell (and possibly Heaven). The relevant quote (by ZUN) being...

My thought is that the Lunar Capital is where the highest, noblest gods live. On the other hand, Gensokyo is where the more friendly, indigenous gods live. I figured that there are factions even among gods. Eirin is one of them, which is why she isn't interacting with the other humans after she moved to Gensokyo.
~ ZUN, Symposium of Post Mysticism​
And quoted from Saikou in that thread, about why Hecatia and Tsukuyomi should be 3-A:

Not only that, but it's more-or-less confirmed that even popular buddhist gods like Bishamontent lives on Earth. Indicating that they're below the Moon pantheon in status. Or at the very least, higher up gods like Amitabha are part of the Moon pantheon. Beside, there isn't any confirmed "higher level" above the Moon in term of God pantheon (Except Hell),and I doubt that Amitabha would live on his own.
~ Saikou the Lewd King​
Ech.

What do you guys think of setting the ratings of Hecatia and Tsukuyomi to "Possibly far higher" instead of "possibly 3-A"?
 
I did read the thread, quite a lot of people disagree or are neutral with scaling.
 
It reached a compromise that we would scale only Hecatia and Tsukuyomi to "possibly 3-A". All else, like 4-C Utsuho, went through.

@Gargoyle
 
Hmm... change the "possibly" to "likely" far higher?

Saikou said that he saw this thread, but he is entirely unwilling to respond... :/
 
1. Why do those two have High 4-C as their lowball, even if at bare minimum they're stronger than a bunch of 4-A/3-C people?

2. I'm sorry but I don't get why those two people scale to Amitabha. Is it because they're supposedly stronger than everyone on the Moon, and we're assuming Amitabha is on the moon?
 
@Ryu

More like Amitabha is possibly part of the Lunar Pantheon, which these two characters are the strongest of.
 
Why do those two have High 4-C as their lowball, even if at bare minimum they're stronger than a bunch of 4-A/3-C people?

PC-98 and Windows are of different continuities.

I'm sorry but I don't get why those two people scale to Amitabha. Is it because they're supposedly stronger than everyone on the Moon, and we're assuming Amitabha is on the moon?

Yar. Which, is an unclear and vague thing. What is vague is not Amitabha's size, but of where it lies. It's stated to live in "Paradise", but I don't really know what they mean by paradise.
 
Okay, so the conclusions are that Amitabha and the characters scaled from him should stay as they are?
 
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