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The Ultra Series Discussion Thread: Unleash! The Power of Imagination!

Zero said that the one who sent him back in time to when he saved himself was the Guardian. Since he’s the one that can do pinpoint time travel/teleportation even as a spirit.

Shining would be at least 2x Ultimate which is at least 4x Base. So Shining would be 8x Base at the very least.

Also I should probably start updating the draft with these new changes from the novel. And I should also put all the chapters in one doc so it’s easier to reread in the future.
 
Ohh, nice. Yep, that's a good BFR.

Ah, right, just as I expected.

Alright. This is gonna make for some good upgrades. I'll also list in and figure out the new wording for Zero's time manipulation and resistance.
 
How's this for the Low 2-C revision? I'll work on the Zero ability and resistance stuff if you think this is fine.

Ultimate Force Zero ~Side Story~ Revisions

So basically I found Chinese translations of the novel for Zero's 10th anniversary and there's a bunch of stuff that are quite important in the novel.

And here's the English translation of the novel. Let's get started

Low 2-C

So as we all know in this thread the Super Dimension Eradication Bomb was accepted as at least 3-A, likely Low 2-C due to their not being enough evidence that it affected the timeline. However as it turns out this was mentioned in the Ultimate Force Zero novel.
He did not feel pain or any other sensation. There was simply a hole on the surface of Zero’s body. Perhaps the inside of the hole was golden, and a golden glow could be seen at the edge of the hole. The hole was not Zero’s body either, it seemed to lead to somewhere else.

“It seems like I have finally been summoned”

Zero looked toward his right hand abruptly, and stretched it into the hole. In the next instant, he had been sucked away by the hole in his abdomen and disappeared from this universe without a trace.
Click to expand...
The place they are in right now is the Waterfall of Time a place that exists outside of the universe.
"At that time, Zero completed the trial given by the guardian and returned to the waterfall. The guardian said to Zero:

“Since you have this power now, I have a favor to ask you.”

“A favor…?”

“I want you to bring my "body" back.”

According to the Guardian of Time’s explanation, not long ago (but from the timeline where Zero is currently in, it seems to be in the very distant future) someone triggered an explosion large enough to wipe out space-time, and the Waterfall of Time was also affected by the strong impact.

Fortunately, the collapse of the universe was stopped midway. However, the impact caused the Guardian of Time’s body to be separated from his spirit. His physical body was blown away to an unknown era, and there is no trace of it."
Click to expand...
Here it's stated that the bomb could destroy space-time and the entire universe had it not been stopped midway by Ultraman King. And not only that the effects of the bomb also affected the Waterfall of Time which exists outside of the universe so its range isn't limited to just the universe. They outright stated that the Super-Dimension Eradication Bomb blasted the Guardian's physical body to another era from the future. Which shows the bomb is indeed capable of affecting even the timeline of the past before the bomb itself was even created.
“Are you the one who summoned me here?”

Zero did not dare to drop his guard and raised his doubts.

“Precisely, no need to be so nervous. I will not harm you. Besides, even if I had that thought, I don't have a physical body that I could use to attack you.”

The owner of the voice sounded very calm.

“You can think of me as the guardian here. I have no name. And I have been here ever since I’ve become conscious. The only consciousness in my mind is to guard this place.”
Click to expand...
The Guardian of Time is somebody that exists in the Waterfall of time so his perception of time is different from Zero's which was why in the novel it said to the Guardian the events of Crisis Impact was not long ago but to Zero it was a long time later. The novel takes place after Ultra Zero Fight but before the New Generation Era even began which means this took place over 81 years before the events of Crisis Impact which supports the fact that to Zero this event hasn't happened yet and won't happen for a long time.

So I propose that instead of at least 3-A, likely Low 2-C. The Super-Dimension Eradication Bomb should be changed to at least Low 2-C, possibly higher as we now have undeniable proof that the bomb is capable of destroying the space-time, affecting even the past timeline before it was created, and affect places outside of the universe this means the bomb itself is somewhat above baseline Low 2-C and should get a possibly higher rating due to having range greater than one universe.

This would also make every character that currently scales to the bomb outright Low 2-C.
 
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Looks good. Do we still need to include the other explanation of a universe's structure? It looks like it already covers everything necessary, but who knows.
 
I think we can include the universe structure and its space-time thing in the Zero's countless x countless layers of time resistance thing. Which I should probably start writing now. Oh boy this is gonna be annoying to write.

Edit: Also thinking about it now should we try to propose at least Low 2-C or at least Low 2-C, possibly higher for the Super-Dimension Eradication Bomb. Like according to the novel it does have range beyond a single universe which means it should be more than just Low 2-C.
 
Alright then.

At least Low 2-C seems reasonable. But yeah, it does seem plausible for the bomb itself to have a potentially higher tier. If it does happen, how does the scaling work by then? Downscale, rather than scaling a full powered Belial directly to it?
 
Well in the bomb’s case even though it says it’s at least Low 2-C, possibly higher. It’s Low 2-C rating still merely upscales from Baseline. Full Power Belial was able to survive it so he would simply be downscaled to baseline Low 2-C.
 
Oh wait. Did we already agree on time manipulation itself is stronger than stuff like D4's dimension collapsing effect, which makes for a baseline space-time manipulation? Because since Zero overrode the Guardian's time manipulation, so that would mean his time powers would be 3-layered.
 
This is what I have for Zero right now. How is it?

Shining Zero Multiplier

And now we are on to Zero and oh boy there's quite a bit of upgrades. First off we have Shining Zero which actually has enough evidence of a multiplier now.

So first of all during the New Generation Era we've known that Future Cosmos is about 2x stronger than Ultimate Zero due to the scaling
Eclipse Mode Cosmos is 150x baseline 3-A due to being tens of (at least 20x) times stronger than Corona Mode Cosmos who is comparable to Base Ginga who is 7.5x baseline 3-A.

Ultimate Zero is 300x baseline 3-A due to being many (at least 4x) times stronger than Base Zero who scales above Dark Zagi who is 75x baseline 3-A due to being an order of magnitude (10x) stronger than Base Ginga lvl characters.

Future Mode Cosmos is 600x baseline 3-A due to being several (4x) stronger than Eclipse Mode Cosmos who is 150x baseline 3-A. We used the 4x high end of several because Future Mode Cosmos is comparable to Crusher Mode Justice who is stated to be many (at least 4x) times stronger than Standard Mode Justice who is comparable to Eclipse Mode Cosmos.

Shining Zero scales above Future Mode Cosmos due to his statement about being the strongest Ultra Warrior during the events of the Ginga S movie.
Click to expand...
And now in the novel even after the mindless physical body of the Guardian of Time singlehandedly defeated the entirety of Ultimate Force Zero.
Mirror Knight asked loudly in a trembling voice. No one answered yet, and a white light was emitted from the fragment of the “object”, triggering a chain of explosions. Zero and others were unable to escape, and they were all enveloped by the explosion one after the other.

The explosion ended and the dust settled. The five of them had lost consciousness in the explosion and fell to the ground.

“Da-Damn it…, You can do that…”
Click to expand...
Zero still believed that if he had Shining he could defeat it.
Zero tried to escape, but the damage caused by the explosion just now was too much, his body is unable to use any strength. When the “object’s” silver body was about to wrap around him, Zero suddenly thought.

“If-If only I could turn into that golden form—”
Click to expand...
And this was proven when the future Zero came to save him in Shining managed to injure it
Before the explosion, Zero saw the back of a man with a golden glow. They seemed to be coming to his rescue. The visitor fired a ray of light from his head, and the explosion blasted the silver "object" far, far away.
Click to expand...
When previously it required the combined power of Ultimate Zero and four other characters comparable to Base Zero to damage it.
“Since we can't ignore it, we should gamble with our maximum output while we still have the power. Besides, it doesn’t seem like we have time to hesitate.”

Hearing Zero say so, Mirror Knight looked up to see that the “object” had been slowly moving towards them.

“Seems like you’re right…”

“Come!!!”

Zero stretched out his left hand and transformed the bracelet into the Ultimate Aegis - Super Bow Mode. The remaining four also quickly circled around the Ultimate Aegis and Zero in a combat stance, injecting their own power into the Ultimate Aegis. The sand and dust around them were swirled up by the vortex and fluttered with the wind as the power of the five of them were concentrated into one. As the power gathered, the blue crystals embedded in the Ultimate Aegis were gradually lit up. The two crystals at the tip emitted orange and green in turn, the two on the left and right were red and white, and the middlemost showed a light blue glow. These rays represent the power of the five members of Ultimate Force Zero, and finally the Ultimate Aegis as a whole emits a strong glow.

“Final Ultimate Force Zero!!!!!”
Click to expand...
This is Ultimate Zero who is 4x Base Zero + the other 4 members of Ultimate Force Zero whom are all comparable to Base Zero. So in total this was 8x the power of Base Zero. So Shining Zero being at least 2x stronger than Ultimate Zero is actually pretty consistent.

Zero Abilities/Resistances

And as it turns out Zero also gained quite the ability and resistance upgrade from this novel.

In order to gain control of Shining form, the Guardian of Time gave Zero a trial to swim through the vortex that is concentration of all the flow of time in the Ultra Series Multiverse. And in the Ultra Series Multiverse there are Countless x Countless numbers of universes. The current known multiverse is already countless in number but there are still unexplored areas where countless other universes have branched off from the current multiverse long ago.
“Do not underestimate it. All the flow of time in this world is concentrated in that vortex. No matter how tough your physique is, if you are even slightly distracted, you will soon be wiped out.”
Click to expand...
We know that in this case the world is referring to the multiverse and not a single universe because the Waterfall of Time exist in a place outside of the universes. And it's been known for a while that in the Ultra Series each and every universe has its own flow of time.

Here in UGF1, Zero says he will can Rosso and Blu back to their own space-time. The correct translation here is space-time as they said 時空 Jikū and not 次元 Jigen which is dimension.

Here in UGF2, Zett says the same about how in this space-time there's another him.

And in the Taiga movie, Isami tells Katsumi how they couldn't detect Tregear was here because time moves differently on their Earth.

And in the GRF Voice Drama, Ribut says how it's possible for a universe to have a different history with Izana saying that might not be true for all which means it is possible for some to be completely different.

So this would mean Base Zero would have countless x countless layers of time manipulation as well as existence erasure resistance. As he straight up swam through the literal concentration of time that could wipe him out of existence.
In the time of not knowing whether it was an instant or an eternity, Zero gradually learned how to swim in the turbid current of time.

(It seems...... I can barely manage it......)
Click to expand...
Also in the novel they revealed that Shining Zero can indeed slow down the time of a target to the point where they have been stopped in time.
As he said that, the future Zero stood in front of Zero, and reached for the “object” with both hands, the same golden sphere that was used to restore the energy of Zero’s bracelet wrapped around the hoop-shaped “object”.

The “object” tries to fight against the power of the sphere and rotates counterclockwise again. After the future Zero injected more power, the rotation of the “object” in the sphere gradually slowed down - and finally came to a complete stop.
Click to expand...
So he should outright have Time Stop on his profile.
 
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Oh right this reminds me o forgot to mention the possibly High 3-A upgrade due to the universe being called infinite and boundless
 
Anyway how does this High 3-A draft look?

High 3-A

So it's been stated multiple times that the universe is infinite

From the perspective of the infinite universe, human is a really small existence, but in their heart there is light that surpasses that universe.

An infinite universe that has stirred the dreams of people since ancient times. A confrontation between two aliens unfolds there. The stage has shifted to Earth, and the two sides have finally come to blows...

コスモスワールドは無限大ですから！Because the Cosmos world is infinite. Too lazy to get a translation for the whole thing but this line from the interview outright says Cosmos’ world/universe is infinite.

And here in the novel they said this for
The boundless dark universe is dotted with stars. A shining meteor passed by, drawing a bright arc in the darkness. It was Zero’s body glowing brightly, moving at ultra-high speed.
Click to expand...
Boundless means having no boundaries and ends. And synonyms of the word includes endless and infinite. In the Chinese translation of the novel they also used the words 无垠. And in Japanese the closest word to that is 無限 Mugen which is infinite. I don't have the original Japanese novel as it seems to be locked behind Tsuburaya Imagination which requires a Japanese account so I don't know what the original Japanese text said about this part of the novel. But yeah this is just supporting evidence on the universes in the Ultra Series being infinite.

So I propose that the current 3-As in the series should become at least 3-A, likely High 3-A due to the universes likely being infinite.

I'll just mention how Zero's has other forms of Time Manipulation and confirmed Time Stop on my other draft. But I don't know how to explain Zero's layered time manipulation so Mr.Cutlery can you write that up real quick?
 
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Ultimate Force Zero ~Side Story~ Revisions

So basically I found Chinese translations of the novel for Zero's 10th anniversary and there's a bunch of stuff that are quite important in the novel.

And here's the English translation of the novel. Let's get started

High 3-A

So it's been stated multiple times that the universe is infinite

From the perspective of the infinite universe, human is a really small existence, but in their heart there is light that surpasses that universe.

An infinite universe that has stirred the dreams of people since ancient times. A confrontation between two aliens unfolds there. The stage has shifted to Earth, and the two sides have finally come to blows...

コスモスワールドは無限大ですから！Because the Cosmos world is infinite. Too lazy to get a translation for the whole thing but this line from the interview outright says Cosmos’ world/universe is infinite.

And here in the novel they said this for
The boundless dark universe is dotted with stars. A shining meteor passed by, drawing a bright arc in the darkness. It was Zero’s body glowing brightly, moving at ultra-high speed.
Click to expand...
Boundless means having no boundaries and ends. And synonyms of the word includes endless and infinite. In the Chinese translation of the novel they also used the words 无垠. And in Japanese the closest word to that is 無限 Mugen which is infinite. I don't have the original Japanese novel as it seems to be locked behind Tsuburaya Imagination which requires a Japanese account so I don't know what the original Japanese text said about this part of the novel. But yeah this is just supporting evidence on the universes in the Ultra Series being infinite.

So I propose that the current 3-As in the series should become at least 3-A, likely High 3-A due to the universes likely being infinite.

Low 2-C

So as we all know in this thread the Super Dimension Eradication Bomb was accepted as at least 3-A, likely Low 2-C due to their not being enough evidence that it affected the timeline. However as it turns out this was mentioned in the Ultimate Force Zero novel.
He did not feel pain or any other sensation. There was simply a hole on the surface of Zero’s body. Perhaps the inside of the hole was golden, and a golden glow could be seen at the edge of the hole. The hole was not Zero’s body either, it seemed to lead to somewhere else.

“It seems like I have finally been summoned”

Zero looked toward his right hand abruptly, and stretched it into the hole. In the next instant, he had been sucked away by the hole in his abdomen and disappeared from this universe without a trace.
Click to expand...
The place they are in right now is the Waterfall of Time a place that exists outside of the universe.
"At that time, Zero completed the trial given by the guardian and returned to the waterfall. The guardian said to Zero:

“Since you have this power now, I have a favor to ask you.”

“A favor…?”

“I want you to bring my "body" back.”

According to the Guardian of Time’s explanation, not long ago (but from the timeline where Zero is currently in, it seems to be in the very distant future) someone triggered an explosion large enough to wipe out space-time, and the Waterfall of Time was also affected by the strong impact.

Fortunately, the collapse of the universe was stopped midway. However, the impact caused the Guardian of Time’s body to be separated from his spirit. His physical body was blown away to an unknown era, and there is no trace of it."
Click to expand...
Here it's stated that the bomb could destroy space-time and the entire universe had it not been stopped midway by Ultraman King. And not only that the effects of the bomb also affected the Waterfall of Time which exists outside of the universe so its range isn't limited to just the universe. They outright stated that the Super-Dimension Eradication Bomb blasted the Guardian's physical body to another era from the future. Which shows the bomb is indeed capable of affecting even the timeline of the past before the bomb itself was even created.
“Are you the one who summoned me here?”

Zero did not dare to drop his guard and raised his doubts.

“Precisely, no need to be so nervous. I will not harm you. Besides, even if I had that thought, I don't have a physical body that I could use to attack you.”

The owner of the voice sounded very calm.

“You can think of me as the guardian here. I have no name. And I have been here ever since I’ve become conscious. The only consciousness in my mind is to guard this place.”
Click to expand...
The Guardian of Time is somebody that exists in the Waterfall of time so his perception of time is different from Zero's which was why in the novel it said to the Guardian the events of Crisis Impact was not long ago but to Zero it was a long time later. The novel takes place after Ultra Zero Fight but before the New Generation Era even began which means this took place over 81 years before the events of Crisis Impact which supports the fact that to Zero this event hasn't happened yet and won't happen for a long time.

So I propose that instead of at least 3-A, likely Low 2-C. The Super-Dimension Eradication Bomb should be changed to at least Low 2-C, possibly higher as we now have undeniable proof that the bomb is capable of destroying the space-time, affecting even the past timeline before it was created, and affect places outside of the universe this means the bomb itself is somewhat above baseline Low 2-C and should get a possibly higher rating due to having range greater than one universe.

This would also make every character that currently scales to the bomb outright Low 2-C.

Shining Zero Multiplier

And now we are on to Zero and oh boy there's quite a bit of upgrades. First off we have Shining Zero which actually has enough evidence of a multiplier now.

So first of all during the New Generation Era we've known that Future Cosmos is about 2x stronger than Ultimate Zero due to the scaling
Eclipse Mode Cosmos is 150x baseline 3-A due to being tens of (at least 20x) times stronger than Corona Mode Cosmos who is comparable to Base Ginga who is 7.5x baseline 3-A.

Ultimate Zero is 300x baseline 3-A due to being many (at least 4x) times stronger than Base Zero who scales above Dark Zagi who is 75x baseline 3-A due to being an order of magnitude (10x) stronger than Base Ginga lvl characters.

Future Mode Cosmos is 600x baseline 3-A due to being several (4x) stronger than Eclipse Mode Cosmos who is 150x baseline 3-A. We used the 4x high end of several because Future Mode Cosmos is comparable to Crusher Mode Justice who is stated to be many (at least 4x) times stronger than Standard Mode Justice who is comparable to Eclipse Mode Cosmos.

Shining Zero scales above Future Mode Cosmos due to his statement about being the strongest Ultra Warrior during the events of the Ginga S movie.
Click to expand...
And now in the novel even after the mindless physical body of the Guardian of Time singlehandedly defeated the entirety of Ultimate Force Zero.
Mirror Knight asked loudly in a trembling voice. No one answered yet, and a white light was emitted from the fragment of the “object”, triggering a chain of explosions. Zero and others were unable to escape, and they were all enveloped by the explosion one after the other.

The explosion ended and the dust settled. The five of them had lost consciousness in the explosion and fell to the ground.

“Da-Damn it…, You can do that…”
Click to expand...
Zero still believed that if he had Shining he could defeat it.
Zero tried to escape, but the damage caused by the explosion just now was too much, his body is unable to use any strength. When the “object’s” silver body was about to wrap around him, Zero suddenly thought.

“If-If only I could turn into that golden form—”
Click to expand...
And this was proven when the future Zero came to save him in Shining managed to injure it
Before the explosion, Zero saw the back of a man with a golden glow. They seemed to be coming to his rescue. The visitor fired a ray of light from his head, and the explosion blasted the silver "object" far, far away.
Click to expand...
When previously it required the combined power of Ultimate Zero and four other characters comparable to Base Zero to damage it.
“Since we can't ignore it, we should gamble with our maximum output while we still have the power. Besides, it doesn’t seem like we have time to hesitate.”

Hearing Zero say so, Mirror Knight looked up to see that the “object” had been slowly moving towards them.

“Seems like you’re right…”

“Come!!!”

Zero stretched out his left hand and transformed the bracelet into the Ultimate Aegis - Super Bow Mode. The remaining four also quickly circled around the Ultimate Aegis and Zero in a combat stance, injecting their own power into the Ultimate Aegis. The sand and dust around them were swirled up by the vortex and fluttered with the wind as the power of the five of them were concentrated into one. As the power gathered, the blue crystals embedded in the Ultimate Aegis were gradually lit up. The two crystals at the tip emitted orange and green in turn, the two on the left and right were red and white, and the middlemost showed a light blue glow. These rays represent the power of the five members of Ultimate Force Zero, and finally the Ultimate Aegis as a whole emits a strong glow.

“Final Ultimate Force Zero!!!!!”
Click to expand...
This is Ultimate Zero who is 4x Base Zero + the other 4 members of Ultimate Force Zero whom are all comparable to Base Zero. So in total this was 8x the power of Base Zero. So Shining Zero being at least 2x stronger than Ultimate Zero is actually pretty consistent.

Zero Abilities/Resistances

And as it turns out Zero also gained quite the ability and resistance upgrade from this novel.

In order to gain control of Shining form, the Guardian of Time gave Zero a trial to swim through the vortex that is concentration of all the flow of time in the Ultra Series Multiverse. And in the Ultra Series Multiverse there are Countless x Countless numbers of universes. The current known multiverse is already countless in number but there are still unexplored areas where countless other universes have branched off from the current multiverse long ago.
“Do not underestimate it. All the flow of time in this world is concentrated in that vortex. No matter how tough your physique is, if you are even slightly distracted, you will soon be wiped out.”
Click to expand...
We know that in this case the world is referring to the multiverse and not a single universe because the Waterfall of Time exist in a place outside of the universes. And it's been known for a while that in the Ultra Series each and every universe has its own flow of time.

Here in UGF1, Zero says he will can Rosso and Blu back to their own space-time. The correct translation here is space-time as they said 時空 Jikū and not 次元 Jigen which is dimension.

Here in UGF2, Zett says the same about how in this space-time there's another him.

And in the Taiga movie, Isami tells Katsumi how they couldn't detect Tregear was here because time moves differently on their Earth.

And in the GRF Voice Drama, Ribut says how it's possible for a universe to have a different history with Izana saying that might not be true for all which means it is possible for some to be completely different.

So this would mean Base Zero would have countless x countless layers of time manipulation as well as existence erasure resistance. As he straight up swam through the literal concentration of time that could wipe him out of existence.
In the time of not knowing whether it was an instant or an eternity, Zero gradually learned how to swim in the turbid current of time.

(It seems...... I can barely manage it......)
Click to expand...
Also in the novel they revealed that Shining Zero can indeed slow down the time of a target to the point where they have been stopped in time. Also his Time Manipulation was shown to override the Time Manipulation of the Guardian of Time's physical body.
“This guy… Could it be reversing time!?”

“Correct, and this is the moment I’ve been waiting for.”

As he said that, the future Zero stood in front of Zero, and reached for the “object” with both hands, the same golden sphere that was used to restore the energy of Zero’s bracelet wrapped around the hoop-shaped “object”.

The “object” tries to fight against the power of the sphere and rotates counterclockwise again. After the future Zero injected more power, the rotation of the “object” in the sphere gradually slowed down - and finally came to a complete stop.
Click to expand...
So Zero should outright have Time Stop on his profile and his Time Manipulation would be beyond basic Time Manipulation as he could overwrite the Time Manipulation of another character. Also its mentioned that Shining Zero's Time Manipulation is connected to the Waterfall of Time
“Are you talking about… my golden power?… I see, that silvery object was your body!”

“That is correct. The golden power that can manipulate time has a connection with this place. Looking at you now, you have probably seen it already.”
Click to expand...
Which means that his Shining Form's Time Manipulation is potentially also countless x countless layered as the Waterfall of Time is where the time of all universes converge in one. So this is what I propose to be Zero's new Time Manipulation description.

"Shining can create temporal fields that accelerates, decelerates, and even stop the time of whoever and whatever is caught in it. His time powers can override the Time Manipulation of the Guardian's physical body. It is also stated by the Guardian's conscious spirit that his powers are connected to the Waterfall of Time itself, where the time of all universes can be converged, hinting that Zero might be capable of the same level of feat."

And this to be part of his Time Manipulation Resistance description
"To control Shining, Zero was forced to swim through the combined time flow of all universes, of which there are countless upon countless of in existence, and if he was to be distracted for even a moment he would be erased. He has also described the experience as grinding his body to dust."

Summary/TLDR

3-A characters becomes at least 3-A, likely High 3-A

At least 3-A, likely Low 2-C characters become outright Low 2-C

Super-Dimension Eradication Bomb becomes At least Low 2-C, possibly higher

Zero's Shining Form should be at least 2x stronger than Ultimate Form

Zero has a Countless x Countless layered Time Manipulation and Existence Erasure resistance as well as more forms of Time Manipulation as well as his Time Manipulation being two layered and potentially Countless x Countless layered due to being connected to the Waterfall of Time.

That should be about it. This is how it looks all compiled in one. Also when should I post it?

Oh right also here's the google docs with all the chapters of the novel.
docs.google.com

Ultra Series Novels

Ultra Series Novels Ultimate Force Zero ~Side Story~ Chapter 1 Chapter 2 Chapter 3 Chapter 4 Chapter 5 Chapter 6
docs.google.com docs.google.com
 
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The draft looks good.

As for Zero's own time manipulation, I'd word it like:

"Shining can create temporal fields that accelerates, decelerates, and even stop the time of whoever and whatever is caught in it. His time powers can even affect the Guardian's physical body, which could transform itself into a black hole without ill effects, as well as override its own time manipulation. Also stated by the Guardian's conscious spirit that his powers are connected to the Waterfall of Time itself, where the time of all universes can be converged, hinting that Zero might be capable of the same level of feat."

I'll try finding more cases where black holes are portrayed or stated as being space-time distortions, but just going with Dyna's finale we know it has that effect since it's apparently what allowed Dyna to end up in different universes in the first place. So, not only is the Guardian's body already capable of resisting the effects of turning itself into a black hole, Zero also bypassed that while countering its own time manipulation. As I've already written, oof. That's about 3-layers, if I'm doing it right.
 
I’ll add those onto the draft when you found more evidence for the black holes being space-time distortion. But man Zero’s gonna be pretty freaking haxxed at this rate.
 
Have you found more info regarding the black hole stuff? Cause if not I was thinking should I just add the proposed description onto the draft with just the current info?
 
Yeah, no. Only found like 2 instances in Dyna so far, only one direct statement while the other needs some correlation to make sense of. So I think just going through with the current info should be fine. It'd still leave Zero with a layered time manipulations because of him countering the Guardian's own, though.
 
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Yeah. And really, it's not that I hadn't found much else, more like those only two cases I remembered from Dyna seemed like they could be applied universally since we also apply a bunch of stuff universally to Ultras. Plus the fact black holes seem synonymous with wormholes in the verse, and that's also a form of space-time manipulation when we take Bullton into account.
 
I see well I have updated and added it onto the draft. How does it look now? If you think it's good should I post it now?
 
Yeah, it looks good now. It depends, I guess, though I suppose it does seem like a good time to do so.

Oh yeah, if you want, you could also put in the new wording I drafted for his resistance as well.

"To master Shining, Zero is forced to swim through the combined time flow of all universes, of which there are countless upon countless in existence, and if he was to be distracted for even a moment he would be erased. He has also described the experience as grinding his body to dust."
 
Added though I decided to change the word master to control as Zero didn’t actually master Shining at this time. He only learned to control and activate it.

And is that all?
 
Unless you'd also want to include the changes found through the databooks like Man's Ultra Attack Beam, Seven's psychokinesis, Jack's Fog Beam, etc.
 
I'll leave that for later. For now I think it's best we only add the things from the novel and stuff somewhat related to it like the infinite universe. Cause the revision is long enough as it is.
 
In that case, post it as you will I guess. I think that's as far as relevant to the whole tiering and Zero updates.
 
Also I should probably continue with the rescaling for 4-A characters. Put it on hiatus for a while due to the novel so I should probably start again while waiting for input on the CRT.
 
I don't think it actually directly stated anywhere, but something similar is written in the SCW. I can get the scan, but it's not exactly an ideal time since it's midnight here.
 
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