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The Big Bleach Speed CRT

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Shadowbokunohero said:
I personally would not have a problem with the mid-end because it looks like nobody is changing anyone's mind.

I believe we spent like 4+ pages arguing the same thing
Click to expand...
Same but to be fair this might all get invalidated if CFYOW II jumps fodder assassins up to speed of lightning, since we have people like Yoruichi blitz the snot out of them. It's a sub-rel+ calc for her.
 
If we get the middle ground calc evaluated and everyone is fine with that as a compromise, then I can update the sandbox with it before I update the profiles.
 
4th rank are fodders... are we seriously considering 4th seat fodders and Captains have the same speed ?
That is like saying Madara and a genin have the same speed.
Mui Goku and Earth Kami have the same speed.
Acnologia and 1st episode lucy have the same speed.

...

Doesn't anyone have a problem with that ?
 
Just entered soul society Ichigo could one shot Fodder tiers from 3rd seat to 20th seat that too in huge numbers.
The only one that gave him a bit of challenge was Ikkaku who could be compared to lieutenant.
There is a huge power gap in 4th seat and lieutenant and you cannot use the argument that maybe its just a AP difference because in bleach higher Ap grants you all round increase in stats.
Have a better defense, more speed, more power.

Above Ikkaku are people like Ranji who defeated Ichigo. The only reason Ichigo won was because he got a power up via resolve.
Above that is kenpachi and Shikai Byakuya
and even above that is Bankai Byakuya.

There are at least 4 major power gaps and are we really going to say that they have the same speed as the lowest one possible ?

This is not even an argument anymore. No sane person or one with good conscience argue or even suggest that.
This is just a blatant downgrade of verse with stupid logic and misuse of authority.
 
Damage3245 said:
If we get the middle ground calc evaluated and everyone is fine with that as a compromise, then I can update the sandbox with it before I update the profiles.
Click to expand...
vsbattles.fandom.com

Here we are again, middle-ground compromise time

vsbattles.fandom.com vsbattles.fandom.com
The methods are the same as the last calc, which you and Mitch accepted, the only difference being I incorporated the couple extra layers per swing. So there should be no issue with evaluation. I believe we agreed on the mid-end of the calc as well.
 
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idk seems like kubo is implying they also get a massive speed boost
 
Why the hell wouldn’t Gentei Kaijo increase speed? Even in the novel It increases Hisagi speed back to normal from his 20% limit.

“You underestimate me. Even without a Gentei Kaijo, the speed of my Shunpo isn’t decreased by much.”
Click to expand...

“Shinigami who have the strength of a vice captain and above, abide by a rule that seals a portion of their
power when heading towards the Human World.

This measure is taken in order to prevent those strong Reiatsus from exerting adverse effects on the
souls of the Human World, and even Hisagi who had no intention of engaging in combat in the first
place, had undergone such treatment.

As a result, Hisagi at present is in a state where his Reiatsu has dropped to as little as twenty percent,
immediately comprehending the implication behind Urahara’s question of whether he is able to release
that limiter, threads of mental strain coiled around Hisagi’s mind.

“Is it… an enemy? If there’s a dangerous opponent, I’ll request a Gentei Kaijo right away.”
Click to expand...
 
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Sigurd_Snake_in_The_Eye said:
I edited my post.
Click to expand...

> “You underestimate me. Even without a Gentei Kaijo, the speed of my Shunpo isn’t decreased by much.”

What's the context for this line? Because it sounds like he's saying that even with the limiter on him, his speed isn't decreased by much. I'd cosnider a drop to 20% to be significant.
 
That comes after the 2nd quote. There isn’t any context behind it. Just dialogue said towards Aura. He’s limited to 20% output until Urahara forcefully releases his seal.
 
That seems like a support for what I was saying.

Sure, the user's speed is decreased when they're limited to 20% Reiatsu output, but Hisagi states that even with his Reiatsu limited to 20% his speed is not decreased by much.

The Multipliers page states that multipliers don't necessarily affect all statistics equally just because somebody becomes X times more powerful.
 
He’s just talking big and asking not be underestimated. He stood no chance against her. The limiter reduces the user to 20% of their normal capability. Just because Hisagi isn’t personally bothered doesn’t mean the seal doesn’t actually limit them in ever way to 20%.

Like the scans posted above it’s clearly a noticeable boost in speed. Shawlong and friends were literally stomping them and they were rendered helpless. Seal comes off and they literally blitz and one shot them with Rangiku specifically asking them to use the same speed as before just to display how fast she is normally... it’s crystal clear.
 
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But Amount of Reiatsu effects speed. Not only reaction speed but also attack and travel speed.
A ichigo who thought Renji was fast but after he increase his spiritual pressure with semi resolve he got fast (pre ss), He wasn't able to see Byakuya but after he went through training he was able to see and fight with him.
Though training he got experience and increase in strength. Does that mean because he just got an increase in strength he didn't get an increase in speed ?
Not only him. Pre SS arc renji coundn't even see byakuya's flash step after training he was able to.
Let alone there are plenty of example how Reiatsu affects speed.
Like Hollofication increases Rieatsu that also makes him faster.

The whole higher Reiatsu = Increase in all stats. Is the established fact about Bleach power system. No matter what you say. You cannot deny the power system to downgrade the verse.
 
@CloudStrife00T; nobody is denying any kind of power system... It's just not a fact that the stats have to increase proportionally.

If the majority of people want to accept this 5x multipler for the limit release, then that's fine. I'm just pointing out it isn't necessarily a fact.
 
CloudStrife00T said:
Can you point to any occasion where the stats did not increase proportionally ?
Click to expand...
I think you know that is a bit of a silly question. There is no way of proving it or disproving it without statements.

For the limiter placed on the Shinigami there isn't proof there speed was limited by the same amount. Hisagi's statement suggests that it isn't.

But I'm not interested in arguing this point any further. I just think you guys are being too quick in sweeping Hisagi's statement away.
 
What about the feat of Rangiku being blitzed by that hollow and after releasing limiter she started blitzing him ?
Or Ichigo Hollows feat via hollowfication ?
I am sure there must be plenty of other feats then just these if we actually looked.
You are not suggesting that we ignore all that over 1 statement right ?
 
@CloudStrife00T; of course not. I was just pointing out that just because a characters increases in speed from a power-up doesn't mean that increase is the exact same as their other stats.

I even said earlier that the limiter does clearly affect their speed.
 
You are making it unnecessarily more complicated. Unless you can come up with a calc. that shows they at that did not get an 5 times increase in speed like their AP.
 
CloudStrife00T said:
You are making it unnecessarily more complicated. Unless you can come up with a calc. that shows they at that did not get an 5 times increase in speed like their AP.
Click to expand...
Keep calm, you do not need to insists like that, he said he will not further discuss this.
Arc7Kuroi said:
vsbattles.fandom.com

Here we are again, middle-ground compromise time

vsbattles.fandom.com vsbattles.fandom.com
The methods are the same as the last calc, which you and Mitch accepted, the only difference being I incorporated the couple extra layers per swing. So there should be no issue with evaluation. I believe we agreed on the mid-end of the calc as well.
Click to expand...
@Damage What abou this? about the ends? other calc? we should get to a conclusion about the feat somehow.
 
@Tyri456; I believe the conclusion we came to was to use the middle end Mach 107 result.

So that will make Bankai Ichigo in the Soul Society arc baseline Massively Hypersonic, and Shikai Ichigo (Post-Bankai Training) will be scaled to Hypersonic+.
 
Arc7Kuroi said:
Are we scaling Shikai Ichigo to Bankai speed divided by 5? Since that's what we accept his multiplier to be right now, so I assume that's how we are doing it.
Click to expand...
I thought somebody said earlier in the thread that was what we were going to do.
 
@AppleLord; that hasn't been accepted. Personally I don't think it should be used because there's no telling that the two distances being used are equivalent.
 
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