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It's not ambiguous. We literally see only bits and pieces fly off not chunks or cleave marks in the manga. You need evidence from a primary source that proves it is undoubtedly not a contradiction.
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The Big Bleach Speed CRT
- Thread starter Damage3245
- Start date
- Status
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Still no reason to assume petal durability changes.
CloudStrife00T
They/Them- 313
- 66
can we use other feats like lightning feats or Yoruichi's feats and the calculate the speed for byakuya via byakuya's and yoruichi's flash step contest and through that figure out ichigo's speed and then chose the version of calc based on what is more consistent and decide if he swatter single layer or chunks ?
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- Thread starter
- #685
The things you're saying we have to assume... nobody is saying that but you guys. Who even mentioned the durability changing?
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Is it accepted that the Onmitsukido Corps are lightning timers.
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"You guys" is the majority.
But that doesn't matter does it.
Ant said it best when he said staff opinion is all that matters.
CloudStrife00T
They/Them- 313
- 66
Does Byakuya in anyway scales to them ?
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- Thread starter
- #689
Not currently as far as I'm aware.
Aren't we waiting for the novel to come out properly?
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Maybe? Isn't it novel 2?
I want to say the raws say Tokinada "reacted to the speed of lightning" in reference to fighting the assassins. So when that does come out, I believe that would put base Yoruichi massively faster than lightning if not sub-rel to rel.
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Where does anyone even assume different petal durability? If anything the difference would be how munch Byakuya bunches them together in offence compared to defence, which isn't much of an assumption, since we actually see him pulling them together to block, while he scatters them to attack.
CloudStrife00T
They/Them- 313
- 66
is the only thing that's accepted is that bleach is city level with hypersonic speed ?
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@Damage3245 If you'd like I'd be willing to postpone this debate, until the officials release, since if they confirm speed of lightning fodder assassins, this calc isn't needed. However, if we are waiting for that, I don't think we should be changing any Bleach speed ratings until such.
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I do not think it is accepted, if it was accepted we will not discussing this.
We have a barely sub-rel calc from Yourichi, accepted mathematically, but there should be a discussion for the lightning speed thing, since the calc is based on that.
CloudStrife00T
They/Them- 313
- 66
That is really the best course of action since this would go nowhere. Best is to wait for the 3rd official release and just use the calcs from that.
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- Thread starter
- #696
The current ratings would still need to be updated due to the change in Orihime's calc - and it doesn't make any sense to keep using a wrong calc - but I can agree with putting the rest of the Bleach speed revisions on hold until we have that cleared up.
CloudStrife00T
They/Them- 313
- 66
So, would that make espada hypersonic ?
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- Thread starter
- #698
Some of them would be Massively Hypersonic.
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"In other words, he either maneuvered himself by reacting to the speed of the lightning" ->CFYOW II in reference to the assassins btw. CFYOW II comes out this November so sure let's put this thread on hold, don't close it. Comes out Nov 3, might be best to not update anything Damage considering how we will likely have to update it again in 6 days.
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It can be closed and reopened in that case so everything can pick back up without any potential other conversations throwing it all off.
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Awesome let's do that then.
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I’m going to try to explain my point in a different way. @Arc, I think you’ve suggested that we (Damage, Shadow, and I) Believe that Ichigo “swatted” through all the layers of the petals at once even though he wasn’t able to do that earlier.
That isn’t true.
For arguments sake, say the wall of petals was 100 petals thick. What I believe you are saying is that Ichigo swatted away the petals 1 layer at a time as they rushed towards him until he deflected them away. (correct me if I’m wrong)
What We are suggesting is that purely as a consequence of swinging his blade, Ichigo would swat away layer 1 which would subsequently lead to him swatting away layer 2 and maybe layer 3 as his sword travels into the wall of petals until it’s eventually stopped by layer 4. He didn’t have to have swatted away all the petal layers at once, he would have, however, pushed into another layer of petals simply as a consequence of swinging his blade.
I’m not even suggesting that the petals knocked into each other in a chain reaction. Just that Ichigo would have knocked into more than one layer of petals at a time. So long as he did that some more times, the end result would still be that he swatted them all away.
Let’s return to that bowling analogy and say that instead of normal pins, what we have are super dense, not easily moving pins. Now, bowling pins are aligned in multiple layers. If you rolled a bowling ball into these super dense pins, imagine that the bowling ball knocks the pin of the first row down and have enough energy to go on and knock down a couple of pins in the second row but inevitably stops moving at the third row (remember, these are special pins that can’t be easily moved.) no pins knocked into each other in a chain reaction. The bowling ball still stopped moving, but it knocked down a couple rows of pins as a consequence of moving forward.
That isn’t true.
For arguments sake, say the wall of petals was 100 petals thick. What I believe you are saying is that Ichigo swatted away the petals 1 layer at a time as they rushed towards him until he deflected them away. (correct me if I’m wrong)
What We are suggesting is that purely as a consequence of swinging his blade, Ichigo would swat away layer 1 which would subsequently lead to him swatting away layer 2 and maybe layer 3 as his sword travels into the wall of petals until it’s eventually stopped by layer 4. He didn’t have to have swatted away all the petal layers at once, he would have, however, pushed into another layer of petals simply as a consequence of swinging his blade.
I’m not even suggesting that the petals knocked into each other in a chain reaction. Just that Ichigo would have knocked into more than one layer of petals at a time. So long as he did that some more times, the end result would still be that he swatted them all away.
Let’s return to that bowling analogy and say that instead of normal pins, what we have are super dense, not easily moving pins. Now, bowling pins are aligned in multiple layers. If you rolled a bowling ball into these super dense pins, imagine that the bowling ball knocks the pin of the first row down and have enough energy to go on and knock down a couple of pins in the second row but inevitably stops moving at the third row (remember, these are special pins that can’t be easily moved.) no pins knocked into each other in a chain reaction. The bowling ball still stopped moving, but it knocked down a couple rows of pins as a consequence of moving forward.
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- Thread starter
- #704
The original Orihime calc is still wrong.
We need to update the ratings affected by that.
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I mean sure, we just suggested keep it in your sandbox so you don't have to go through it all again in every profile in 6 days.
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I agree with that, but all the pre-time skip profiles are affected, it idoes not make much sense change everything, and then re-change everything if the official translations confimrs it in a couple of days.
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- Thread starter
- #707
That's okay, I don't mind the work.
Does anyone have any objections with just these updating ratings (ignoring any other calcs and feats which we will debate about).
Does anyone have any objections with just these updating ratings (ignoring any other calcs and feats which we will debate about).
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If y'all are suggesting this we would need to discuss what an accepted amount of layers would be, because my recalc assumes he goes through all layers.
Is the suggested amount of layers 2? 3? I'd compromise for 3 layers tbh.
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Didn't you agreed at least with the cross-section though?
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Bleach going back to 2015-2016 stats soon
CloudStrife00T
They/Them- 313
- 66
If we don't get anything substantial about fodder tiers from the official novel then it probably will. Espada's are going to be Hypersonic and massively hypersonic. -_- That is is just ****** up.
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CloudStrife00T
They/Them- 313
- 66
Which ulqui's calc ?
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A comment on this would be nice.
IIRC based on my calcs 3 layers would be ~half the pillar so I think that's a fair midway point between single layer shaving and whole cross-section cleaving.
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- Thread starter
- #717
I'm still curious to get DDM's and AKM's opinions on the other evidence from the anime.
But a middle ground calc between the two ends would be good to look at.
But a middle ground calc between the two ends would be good to look at.
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Middle ground calc between the two ends (using mid-ends) clocks Ichigo out at Mach 107.
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And what did I said earlier in the thread? C: To get a mid end, didn't I? But noooooo ovo
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I personally would not have a problem with the mid-end because it looks like nobody is changing anyone's mind.
I believe we spent like 4+ pages arguing the same thing
I believe we spent like 4+ pages arguing the same thing
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