Sword Art Online General Discussion/Q&A Thread #4

[Kaantantr]

You cannot remove incorrect information with a compromise. I recommend following up on the DLCs to see how powerless Tia truly is (compared to the claim of "She created Aincrad) and how Cardinal System still playing her around its fingers.

 

[CurrySenpai]

I don’t think it’s really incorrect information it’s just that there’s two interpretations which could be true which is why I proposed a compromise so that we can avoid needless arguing.

 

[CurrySenpai]

I'll check out the DLCs again though although I doubt I'll find much iirc from my past experiences playing them.

 

[Kaantantr]

What you'll see is that Tia is still pretty much powerless and is on the level of a traditional player, whereas Cardinal System is still pulling the reigns making her do stuff, and do stuff to her.

Cardinal System messing with NPCs is one of the staples of the series. An initiated quest must go on, regardless of what may have changed throughout the events.

 

[DMUA]

I don't really get this

Unless I'm misunderstanding your logic, the entire verse is 10-B because no one does anything without the cardinal system giving them skills an abilities to do specific things

The narrative is clearly presenting that she is doing it, the fact the cardinal system is allowing her doesn't mean she suddenly doesn't have any of the power she's clearly been given

 

[Kaantantr]

What I'm saying is, she is a quest NPC. She herself has no inherent power that is any different from rest of the players. And she is no ordinary NPC, she is an NPC actively being puppeted by the Cardinal System to reach specific quest flags so that Cardinal can delete Sword Art Origin. Cardinal has a forced, unorthodox agenda here to pursue unlike any other scenario.

If Kirito and Co hadn't stopped her, would you consider the deletion of SA:O to be "Tia's Power" as well, because she was the central NPC? The system isn't giving her the power, otherwise she would actually be able to utilize the power herself, which at no point can she do. And to further clarify, at no point does she ever go through a "depowering" phase as well to not be able to do such a thing. So if she ever had such a power, she should continue to have it. But she doesn't. She never did.

For example, in the case of Kizmel, the example of Cardinal adjusting the questline to accommodate for the new circumstances, Kizmel is not given extraordinary abilities. The only thing she is given is being bumped up in the language engine which has nothing to do with gameplay, so she can more adaptively converse with Kirito and Asuna to allow a flexible progression. She is a player, much like Tia (and Premiere) is. She levels up throughout with Kirito and Asuna, same as Tia and Premiere and that's her only power. She showcases her prowess and abilities consistently throughout because it is indeed her abilities and skills.

In comparison, if Tia was given a skill and never had it taken away, why does she have a single, massive outlier of power, rather than a consistent showcase, that is also a single exception to an entire lore, when it can be explained in a way that is consistent with the entire series?

That is my argument. If it is explained through established rules, why go out of your way to claim it is something else that does not fit in with the rest of the series? For something to be solidified as an exception, it has to be cited as such. Which is why I initially asked for a direct statement from Yui, rather than Kirito who always explains things in a casualized manner that does not reflect the technical reality. I can provide multiple dozens of him doing the exact same thing from Progressive novels alone, which is why I am objecting his claim. It's literally what he does, and never once has it gone the other way around.

 

[CurrySenpai]

I have returned and ultimately I am still going to push for 6-C Hollow Realization Kirito. As DMUA mentioned the game and narrative clearly state that Tia is the one who reforms Aincrad. To say that the Cardinal System does it is kind of like the arguments people make for the power level of characters in media which takes place in a game or digital world of sorts. To say it's the system that is doing it or the game itself implies that the other feats in a game don't really happen because it's simply just a game and the system of it is the one performing those actions (at least that's the argument I see people make most of the time)

I'm probably gonna make a CRT and let staff decide, besides this is probably gonna be my last SAO thing for a while cause I feel most bases have been covered on this series so until something interesting happens in UR I guess I'll wait.

 

[CurrySenpai]

Should I make a CRT or can we just call staff to this thread to see what they think?

 

[Leafbladie]

Should I make a CRT or can we just call staff to this thread to see what they think?

I'd say just call staff. Kaantantr is the only one who disagrees with you. So it'd be best to just ask for evaluation and end this quickly.

 

[Antvasima]

Can each side of the argument here explain their points in easy to understand manners in single posts, so I can ask more staff members for input, please?

 

[CurrySenpai]

The best way I can describe my argument is that the tier of Hollow Realization characters should be 6-C because the character Tia recreates the whole of Aincrad using her powers. Later, Kirito and Crew defeat her so naturally, they would scale.

Tia does this by initiating The Great Separation herself an event that initially required both her and Premiere to activate but due to her determination, she initiates it herself.

We also have a direct statement from Kirito saying that Tia was able to lift the pieces of land off the grand to recreate Aincrad.

There is also a statement from Yui explicitly stating that she is the one causing Aincrad to fall from the sky and into Ainground.

That's pretty much my argument. If I need to be more clearer on things please just ask and I can try to explain.

 

[CurrySenpai]

What I'm saying is, she is a quest NPC. She herself has no inherent power that is any different from rest of the players. And she is no ordinary NPC, she is an NPC actively being puppeted by the Cardinal System to reach specific quest flags so that Cardinal can delete Sword Art Origin. Cardinal has a forced, unorthodox agenda here to pursue unlike any other scenario.

If Kirito and Co hadn't stopped her, would you consider the deletion of SA:O to be "Tia's Power" as well, because she was the central NPC? The system isn't giving her the power, otherwise she would actually be able to utilize the power herself, which at no point can she do. And to further clarify, at no point does she ever go through a "depowering" phase as well to not be able to do such a thing. So if she ever had such a power, she should continue to have it. But she doesn't. She never did.

For example, in the case of Kizmel, the example of Cardinal adjusting the questline to accommodate for the new circumstances, Kizmel is not given extraordinary abilities. The only thing she is given is being bumped up in the language engine which has nothing to do with gameplay, so she can more adaptively converse with Kirito and Asuna to allow a flexible progression. She is a player, much like Tia (and Premiere) is. She levels up throughout with Kirito and Asuna, same as Tia and Premiere and that's her only power. She showcases her prowess and abilities consistently throughout because it is indeed her abilities and skills.

In comparison, if Tia was given a skill and never had it taken away, why does she have a single, massive outlier of power, rather than a consistent showcase, that is also a single exception to an entire lore, when it can be explained in a way that is consistent with the entire series?

That is my argument. If it is explained through established rules, why go out of your way to claim it is something else that does not fit in with the rest of the series? For something to be solidified as an exception, it has to be cited as such. Which is why I initially asked for a direct statement from Yui, rather than Kirito who always explains things in a casualized manner that does not reflect the technical reality. I can provide multiple dozens of him doing the exact same thing from Progressive novels alone, which is why I am objecting his claim. It's literally what he does, and never once has it gone the other way around.

To save us time I believe this is Kaantantr's argument

 

[Antvasima]

Can each side of the argument here explain their points in easy to understand manners in single posts, so I can ask more staff members for input, please?

@Kaantantr

Is it fine if I quote the post cited by CurrySenpai right above when asking for further staff input?

 

[Kaantantr]

Yes, of course.

As I mentioned, it was not a power given to Premiere or Tia. It was the power of the "god" of the world requiring to go through a process to achieve a certain thing.

Tia (or Premiere) never showcase anything to prove it is their power, which is also why they cannot repeat the act either.

An analogy would be;

There is a building. There is a person who is waiting to throw a water balloon from the window, but the person wants two people to walk to hit two birds with one stone. Me and my friend are told by his friend to walk that way to see what happens. We both look up and see he is scheming to throw the water balloon. My friend thus decides to not walk in front of the building, but me wanting to cool off in the summer heat decide to actually walk. The guy above sees that it is only I walking, and he still decides to throw it, only managing to get 50% of his objective accomplished. The entire plan transpired the way it did with my friend not deciding to participate, but me deciding to. Am I the one with the power of making water balloons rain from the sky because me walking put the act in motion? No, it's the guy on the window who threw the balloon. I do not magically command over the water balloons as the god of inflatable objects just because of the path the event was set out to transpire and adapted by its ultimate controller, the douchebag in the building.

Switching to our example.

There is a game. The controlling system (Cardinal) wants to create Aincrad so it can delete the game per its final command, but according to lore it wants to stick to, two priestesses must pray together to enact Great Separation. Both priestesses are informed of this, as well as how it will destroy their world. One decides not to do it because she does not want the world destroyed, but the other does. So she goes onto pray, and the Cardinal System known as the entity that adapts "broken" quests figures "Yo, I'll make do with this and still fit the lore" and creates an incomplete Aincrad instead because only one priestess prayed. The entire plan transpired the way it did because one priestess decided not to, while the other did. Is the priestess the one with the power of just ripping the earths crust to create a magical floating castles high up in the sky? No, it's the Cardinal System who was following the final order of its creator. The priestess does not magically command the surface of the earth as a true goddess just because of the path the event was set out to transpire and adapted by its ultimate controller, the douchebag system created by a genius.

Which is why the priestess does not have such a power, she does not command the game geometry, she cannot replicate the event no matter how much she wants to. It simply is not part of her abilities or her skillset.

 

[Leafbladie]

You can do this kind of downplay easily:

"Does Kirito have the ability to summon a large black spear of energy from the memory release of the Night Sky Sword? No, that's just the Cardinal System within the Underworld giving shape to his imagination."

Guess we better downgrade all the characters.

 

[CurrySenpai]

Yeah sadly your argument kinda falls flat when you apply this logic to other stuff in SAO. If it’s all just Cardinal giving out skills and doing all the work then what makes the rest of the series any different from this instance.

This more-so ties into wiki standards as we consider virtual worlds their own separate realities rather than as a world controlled by a computer. That’s why characters like Wreck-It-Ralph and Kirito have actually tiers cause otherwise it’s just the system doing it all and they’d just be Human Level

 

[Kaantantr]

There is a difference between a quest script, and an ability a character possesses.

It's not Cardinal System that's the cause of Kizmel being OP compared to other characters in Progressive. She actually has a high level along with high level equipment and fighting skills.

You need to understand the nuance between possessing the ability and a quest script. A character who possesses the power will be able to utilize said power consistently (or alternatively is given an actual explanation about temporarily receiving or losing their power). Kizmel, Yofilis, Bahroum, Myia, etc, all possess the prowess they do. They were actually granted the power by Cardinal. They showcase their power consistently at every corner. They utilize the same prowess, ability, skills that they showcase in scripted events, in free flowing non-scripted instances just as fine.

Downplaying what I said into "Well, it's a virtual world, you can say whatever you want then" is purposefully misconstruing or misunderstanding what is being said here. Tia did not control the Great Separation. Tia prayed and Cardinal did what it set out to do. That is the difference.

"Does Kirito have the ability to summon a large black spear of energy from the memory release of the Night Sky Sword? No, that's just the Cardinal System within the Underworld giving shape to his imagination."

This statement is particularly laughable for anyone who knows the bare fundamentals about the world, it does not even fit in with the argument of "Cardinal blessed them" because for a Perfect Weapon Control to be conducted, the user actually has to command the system with their Incarnation and materialize the memories hidden inside an object to begin with. So that is the epitome of "possessing the power".

 

[Leafbladie]

So your main argument for this feat just being a scripted event, over it being the Destructin Module enhancing Tia’s power or granting her greater authority over the system, is because this level of power is not consistently displayed throughout the game? Am I understanding your argument correctly?

 

[Kaantantr]

I think you do not understand what the "destruction module" is. It is Kayaba's final command to Cardinal System at the end of Sword Art Online. "Delete Aincrad". Since Sword Art: Origin was copied over from SAO's servers, the destruction module, aka the deletion command, leads to Cardinal doing stuff on its own within the lore it was given to fulfill that command; creating Aincrad so it can delete it. Tia does not have the destruction module. Tia and Premiere do not have any authority within the system. They are bog standard Player NPCs with an urge to pray, because Cardinal dictates "Aincrad will be created when two priestesses pray". They are flag checkers, nothing more. Once they pray, Cardinal commences the Great Separation (halfway due to only Tia deciding to) and continues its plan of deleting the game.

Great Separation is not an inherent ability of Tia and Premiere. They can pray in any other instance and nothing will occur, as there is no power given to them over the system to create such an event. Thus the "prayer" is not a skill they possess, it's Cardinal going through its own checklist.

 

[Leafbladie]

Okay, I think I need to go with you step by step.

1. Does the destruction module/cardinal system make Tia more powerful in combat than she regularly would be? I.e. is it a boon to Tia's fighting abilities?

A simple yes/no will suffice. Please do not go on another tangent.

 

[Kaantantr]

1. Does the destruction module/cardinal system make Tia more powerful in combat than she regularly would be?

No. The destruction module has no relation to Tia, aside from causing an urge to pray. Tia's combat prowess is completely tied to her sword skills and training.

Your misunderstandings are the reasons I have to go on tangents to explain things, because you keep bringing unrelated concepts into the mix.

 

[Leafbladie]

No. The destruction module has no relation to Tia, aside from causing an urge to pray. Tia's combat prowess is completely tied to her sword skills and training.

Your misunderstandings are the reasons I have to go on tangents to explain things, because you keep bringing unrelated concepts into the mix.

So when you're fighting Tia at the end of the game, and she has those levitating arms, you're saying that's an accurate representation of Tia's skills/abilities/fighting style on her own? Am I understanding you correctly?

 

[Kaantantr]

I was actually wanting to bring the topic over to that bit, how it would make more sense to look later into the game where Tia actually had an active role on her own, rather than wasting time on "creating Aincrad" debacle, but you never let me and wanted to stay fixated on the Great Separation.

Check what happens to Tia at the end leading up to the fight if you want to attribute actual abilities to her that she herself uses. As I covered before, characters can actually be given powers and then have them taken away.

 

[Leafbladie]

I was actually wanting to bring the topic over to that bit, how it would make more sense to look later into the game where Tia actually had an active role on her own, rather than wasting time on "creating Aincrad" debacle, but you never let me and wanted to stay fixated on the Great Separation.

Check what happens to Tia at the end leading up to the fight if you want to attribute actual abilities to her that she herself uses. As I covered before, characters can actually be given powers and then have them taken away.

So she can have abilities and powers given to her through the system. You agree with this, right?

But you disagree with the notion that the ability to move earth, or some greater power to move earth was given to her, but was instead just a "quest flag" event. And your reasoning for this is that you feel it is an inconsistent level of power for her to have compared to her other capabilities. Is there anything wrong with this description of your argument?

Don't want to be accused of strawmanning, but also don't want you walking it back later.

 

[Antvasima]

The best way I can describe my argument is that the tier of Hollow Realization characters should be 6-C because the character Tia recreates the whole of Aincrad using her powers. Later, Kirito and Crew defeat her so naturally, they would scale.

Tia does this by initiating The Great Separation herself an event that initially required both her and Premiere to activate but due to her determination, she initiates it herself.

We also have a direct statement from Kirito saying that Tia was able to lift the pieces of land off the grand to recreate Aincrad.

There is also a statement from Yui explicitly stating that she is the one causing Aincrad to fall from the sky and into Ainground.

That's pretty much my argument. If I need to be more clearer on things please just ask and I can try to explain.

What I'm saying is, she is a quest NPC. She herself has no inherent power that is any different from rest of the players. And she is no ordinary NPC, she is an NPC actively being puppeted by the Cardinal System to reach specific quest flags so that Cardinal can delete Sword Art Origin. Cardinal has a forced, unorthodox agenda here to pursue unlike any other scenario.

If Kirito and Co hadn't stopped her, would you consider the deletion of SA:O to be "Tia's Power" as well, because she was the central NPC? The system isn't giving her the power, otherwise she would actually be able to utilize the power herself, which at no point can she do. And to further clarify, at no point does she ever go through a "depowering" phase as well to not be able to do such a thing. So if she ever had such a power, she should continue to have it. But she doesn't. She never did.

For example, in the case of Kizmel, the example of Cardinal adjusting the questline to accommodate for the new circumstances, Kizmel is not given extraordinary abilities. The only thing she is given is being bumped up in the language engine which has nothing to do with gameplay, so she can more adaptively converse with Kirito and Asuna to allow a flexible progression. She is a player, much like Tia (and Premiere) is. She levels up throughout with Kirito and Asuna, same as Tia and Premiere and that's her only power. She showcases her prowess and abilities consistently throughout because it is indeed her abilities and skills.

In comparison, if Tia was given a skill and never had it taken away, why does she have a single, massive outlier of power, rather than a consistent showcase, that is also a single exception to an entire lore, when it can be explained in a way that is consistent with the entire series?

That is my argument. If it is explained through established rules, why go out of your way to claim it is something else that does not fit in with the rest of the series? For something to be solidified as an exception, it has to be cited as such. Which is why I initially asked for a direct statement from Yui, rather than Kirito who always explains things in a casualized manner that does not reflect the technical reality. I can provide multiple dozens of him doing the exact same thing from Progressive novels alone, which is why I am objecting his claim. It's literally what he does, and never once has it gone the other way around.

@SomebodyData @Mr._Bambu @CrimsonStarFallen @DMUA @DemonGodMitchAubin

Would you be willing to help out here please?

 

[Kaantantr]

So she can have abilities and powers given to her through the system. You agree with this, right?

But you disagree with the notion that the ability to move earth, or some greater power to move earth was given to her, but was instead just a "quest flag" event. And your reasoning for this is that you feel it is an inconsistent level of power for her to have compared to her other capabilities. Is there anything wrong with this description of your argument?

Don't want to be accused of strawmanning, but also don't want you walking it back later.

If you look back in the thread, I literally asked for a direct statement from Yui regarding whether Tia was actually granted an ability, or if it was just Cardinal doing its own thing. That was literally my first course of action when the claim first came up. I asked whether there was actually a statement to back up said claim from someone who can actually monitor the system, Yui. There was no such statement as far as Curry's research is concerned, which is exactly why it is a better endeavor to look at the later mech-like fight involving Tia to make something reasonable from.

As I said, your misunderstandings keep extending the conversation with tangents.

 

[Leafbladie]

If you look back in the thread, I literally asked for a direct statement from Yui regarding whether Tia was actually granted an ability, or if it was just Cardinal doing its own thing. That was literally my first course of action when the claim first came up. I asked whether there was actually a statement to back up said claim from someone who can actually monitor the system, Yui. There was no such statement as far as Curry's research is concerned, which is exactly why it is a better endeavor to look at the later mech-like fight involving Tia to make something reasonable from.

As I said, your misunderstandings keep extending the conversation with tangents.

You're the one going on a tangent here, I'm rather unconcerned with your desire to see a direct statement by Yui. That is just something that would emphatically and undeniably prove Curry's argument. It's absence does not prove Curry's claim incorrect though, it could easily just be something left unsaid.

So please stop sidetracking and stay on topic. I am asking about your arguments for your point of view. That an ability or power was not given to Tia in this instance, like we later see. When doing so would accomplish what is desired for the quest line. Is it because you feel it is inconsistent and an "outlier"? Therefore the interpretation of this feat as just a flag in the quest is the better one?

 

[Kaantantr]

Simple.

You got a claim, you have to prove it. Hence why I asked for a proof regarding Tia being granted an actual power, rather than the Cardinal System just doing its thing as it always does. You cannot "leave it unsaid" when you got a borderline sentient Cardinal System doing things on its own accord.

 

[Antvasima]

Is my help needed here, or is it fine if I unsubscribe from this thread?

 

[CurrySenpai]

I mean I proved my claim with a statement from Kirito and honestly that should suffice. The quote “With her power alone, Tia was only able to life half-crumbling handfuls of land” is pretty straightforward and simple and said by a reliable source.

 

[Leafbladie]

Simple.

You got a claim, you have to prove it. Hence why I asked for a proof regarding Tia being granted an actual power, rather than the Cardinal System just doing its thing as it always does. You cannot "leave it unsaid" when you got a borderline sentient Cardinal System doing things on its own accord.

Simple.

You got a claim, you have to prove it. Hence why I asked for a proof that Cardinal System is just doing its thing, rather than Tia being granted an actual power.

You don't get to assume your interpretation of events as the "natural one". No ******* shot am I letting you get away with that for a debate, that would be the stupidest advantage you could hand your opponent.

Are you going to stop dodging the question now? Have I misrepresented your consistency/outlier argument in any fashion? Yes/no, if no, please elaborate

 

[CurrySenpai]

Is my help needed here, or is it fine if I unsubscribe from this thread?

You should be good to go. Thanks for helping Ant.

 

[Antvasima]

No problem. Good luck with your discussion then.

 

[Kaantantr]

You got a claim, you have to prove it. Hence why I asked for a proof that Cardinal System is just doing its thing, rather than Tia being granted an actual power.

You don't get to assume your interpretation of events as the "natural one". No ******* shot am I letting you get away with that for a debate, that would be the stupidest advantage you could hand your opponent.

Oh boy, someone is getting heated here.

I have no claim here. I am not the one setting up for a CRT.

The claim is "Tia has the power of creating Aincrad". I asked for proof. Because Cardinal does act in its own accord, that is the baseline. The game literally begins with Cardinal System itself sending a message to Kirito just to mess with him and no other reason. If you take agency from the sentient system and try to attribute it to a lower NPC, you will need to prove the claim.

The statement from Kirito is not valid, as Kirito speaks out of his ass with assumptions literally all the time, which is why Kirito's statements about the system are never taken at face value anywhere and require validation from a capable source, usually Yui, Kayaba, Rinko, whoever can actually monitor systems and can provide info straight from source. This is particularly misleading in anything outside of the Light Novels, where he at least gets the benefit of inner monologues where he can state he is "just assuming stuff" just to prevent more impressionable readers from running wild thinking he speaks the word of the god.

And before you blame me for something again, I made the only relevant bit bold so you cannot miss it or get distracted by explanations.

Are you going to stop dodging the question now? Have I misrepresented your consistency/outlier argument in any fashion? Yes/no, if no, please elaborate

I mean, I answered your questions half a dozen times now, with explicit statements. They do not seem to be reaching you for whatever reason, if you feel the need to ask yet another one.

Yes, you keep misrepresenting my statements, because I honestly don't think you understand the simplest concepts.

I will only be replying to Curry on the topic from here onwards, I do not think it is worth the effort trying to communicate with you.

 

[Leafbladie]

I will only be replying to Curry on the topic from here onwards, I do not think it is worth the effort trying to communicate with you.

Cool, looking forward to you breaking that like last time. Your words are as empty as your arguments.

In comparison, if Tia was given a skill and never had it taken away, why does she have a single, massive outlier of power, rather than a consistent showcase, that is also a single exception to an entire lore, when it can be explained in a way that is consistent with the entire series?

Anyway, this was the point I was speaking on. Where Kaantantr mentions that this feat would be an outlier and not consistent with Tia's showcase of powers if it was granted as a skill to her. I hate this argument so much, and I hope that the mods here don't take it seriously at all if he bring it up again. Honestly I hope his hesitation to repeat this argument is because he realized it was stupid, and didn't want to bring it up again, but I can't discount the fact that he might've just been difficult for the sake of being difficult.

To give an example: If character A blows up a mountain with a beam attack, then later up a moon, then later after that blows up several islands. Such that the island feat is the most numerous feat performed by character A, and thus the most "consistent" showcase of their power, that doesn't mean the moon feat was an outlier. Pointing out that 1 feat seems much higher than all the other feats performed, and therefore an outlier to their other feats, is not an argument for that feat being counterfactual or wrong. To do that, you'd have to show why character A performing that feat doesn't make logical sense, often with anti-feats. Show that their maximum has to be less than that point, or else other points in the story wouldn't make sense.

 

[Mr. Bambu]

@SomebodyData @Mr._Bambu @CrimsonStarFallen @DMUA @DemonGodMitchAubin

Would you be willing to help out here please?

In as polite a way as possible, nah. I ain't this deep into the weebery, my knowledge comes from watching this back in 2015, long before my apotheosis.

 

[Kaantantr]

I really am trying to kindly break away from the discussion with you, but you really don't seem to get the message, much like other things like simple explanations or providing examples that do not hurt your own claim, as you progressively spiral into insults due to lack of arguments in an attempt to discredit...

I see you still do not understand the difference between "possessing a skill to begin with" and "using the skill you possess in higher potency".

If I try to hypnotize someone and they decide to play along, I do not suddenly possess the skill of hypnotizing people. It's that the other person just did what they personally wanted to do.

If your argument is "She possesses the skill and is just using it at a higher potency" as you tried to highlight with your example (I don't think you even understand your example literally digs your own hole further), then feel free to showcase Tia utilizing telekinetic abilities. Any telekinetic abilities. I will yield if you can show the smallest example possible in regards to telekinesis, it would at the very least prove that Tia does have such an ability indeed. You know, just trying to follow through based on the example you provided where a power was shown and then scaled up over time to become more powerful. The example makes sense, but it is irrelevant and inapplicable, unless you can show Tia possessing telekinetic abilities.

In general, I do recommend reading a bit up on the Progressive series, that Hollow Realization's base concepts build upon to familiarize yourself with Cardinal's self-agency. It will help with your lack of understanding on the basics. I know for people like you, it is hard to read more than a single cherry picked paragraph, but give it a try, they are good books. At this point, most people should be aware of how some of you love deceiving reviewers with your cherry picked paragraphs, thanks to Problem... Who has seemingly stumbled upon the thread and is trying to like every single comment that is a reply to me, not realizing all he does is remind people of how some people aim to deceive reviewers.

 

[CurrySenpai]

Look, I get that you guys don't like each other and that you have a history of butting heads but we gotta stop with these directed insults. It gets us nowhere and only serves to cause more conflict which further distracts us from the points we're trying to reach.

At the end of the day, this is basically a hobby for most of us and I feel as if it's also important to understand that people have different perspectives on things. That's the most important thing to remember as while we try to be as objective as possible on this wiki there are some things that are left up to interpretation.

Just try to be peaceful, please? And this goes out to everyone debating in this thread.

 

[CurrySenpai]

Anyways, I'll try and find a telepathy scan or something so gimme a bit to look I just woke up and there's some things i wanna do today so don't expect much till late today or tomorrow

 

[Leafbladie]

I’m back to my rise and grind 16 hour a work day schedule as of today, so I’m actually going to peace out for most of this CRT now. I just happened to get “lucky” with it being my day off from one of my jobs yesterday.